I'm sorry if this has been mentioned before, but it dawned on me today. Imperial and Stormcloak are both bad guys. Honestly, one wants to rid the world of cultural diversity and the other just wants to ignore it and bully it. I mean the Stormcloaks are racist assholes and the Imperial are conquering asshole...It's just a choice of the lesser of two evils.
I mean, in comparison the THIEVES GUILD is like the Church of Saints. Granted, I knew this information for a while...but it just dawned on me how either stupid or brilliant this is. Stupid because there's no real "good" faction for your character, but at the same time maybe there isn't suppose to be? Maybe the world is just cruel? Skyrim is just showing you that life sucks and you gotta deal with it.
Then again my life doesn't have dragons to slay...
Nah the Empire wants to kick the Thalmor out, they're just biding time and building up forces and some compromise has to be made so the Thalmor don't own them, and outlawing the worship of Talos is that compromise.
The Stormcloaks are just stupid, fighting against the Empire their god created? That's ridiculous like if Christians just decided to nuke the entire planet if Christianity got banned.
The Stormcloaks are just stupid, fighting against the Empire their god created? That's ridiculous like if Christians just decided to nuke the entire planet if Christianity got banned.
OT: I agree, but I ended up preferring the Empire. Their members were, on average, less asshole-ish, and they too hate the Thalmor. Basically, what @endtherapture said, biding time and building up forces, etc etc.
I'm not sure how the Imperials are "conquering" anything; Skyrim has been a vital part of the Empire for many, many years, even before the Jagar Tharn incident, which, if I remember correctly, happened in the second Era.
To me, the Empire is the faction to side with. The war is simply Ulfric's wish to gain power, and the Thalmor are using him to weaken the empire. He may be entitled to a place on the throne, insofar as he did beat High King Torygg in single combat, but the timing means that the Empire, already weakened by a drawn-out war with the Thalmor, have to a)send troops to deal with his racist nationalism bullshit and b)risk losing the province from which most of their best soldiers hailed from.
It's pretty obvious that the only reason the White Gold Concordat includes a ban on Talos Worship is to stir up trouble in Skyrim, made even more obvious by the dossier on Ulfric that the Thalmor have, where they imply that he has been leaking information to them, and that he was allowed to escape mainly because the Thalmor saw him as an asset to weakening the Empire.
Tullius may be a foreigner, and he may be pretty apathetic towards the customs of Skyrim, but he has no wish to kill any more Nords than necessary. The Empire needs Skyrim, and Skyrim needs the Empire; Ulfric never shows himself worthy or indeed very able to lead, made evident by how run down his hold is. If he managed to secede from the Empire, it is most likely that the few remaining soldiers he has will be overrun by the ruthless and tactically smart Thalmor.
All fair points, but at the same time...I find the Empire's judgement questionable from the start. "Oh...it looks like this prisoner isn't on the list." "Kill him anyways." "Alright, time to die for no reason."
That dragon SAVED your ass. Should you not worship Dragon kind then? I do agree that the Empire seems less-asshole ish but they're both in the wrong in my eyes. With the Empire, it's as if just because they're fighting the good fight, they can piss on anyone they want.
All fair points, but at the same time...I find the Empire's judgement questionable from the start. "Oh...it looks like this prisoner isn't on the list." "Kill him anyways." "Alright, time to die for no reason."
That dragon SAVED your ass. Should you not worship Dragon kind then? I do agree that the Empire seems less-asshole ish but they're both in the wrong in my eyes. With the Empire, it's as if just because they're fighting the good fight, they can piss on anyone they want.
Well, you seemed to miss a few points. For starters, you were some poor sod who happened to be near Ulfric Stormcloak's group when they attacked, so even if you weren't on the list, they were right to assume you had something to do with him. And that dragon didn't save your ass, he tried to kill everyone in Helgen, you just used the chaos to run the fuck away. So, captcha, what do you think the dragon would turn us into if he got the chance?
Well, the trying to execute thing is kind of a dick move. But, you were just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Also, for all this ban Talos worship, it is not enforced at all by the Empire. Whiterun has some crazy dude in front of Talos' shrine. Markarth has a Talos shrine. It's just something on paper, Ulfric just wanted an excuse to murder the high king.
Well, you seemed to miss a few points. For starters, you were some poor sod who happened to be near Ulfric Stormcloak's group when they attacked, so even if you weren't on the list, they were right to assume you had something to do with him. And that dragon didn't save your ass, he tried to kill everyone in Helgen, you just used the chaos to run the fuck away. So, captcha, what do you think the dragon would turn us into if he got the chance?
Besides, that's ONE slightly psychopathic Redguard woman (if I'm not mistaken) who's part of the imperial army, not "the Empire" that orders your execution. I don't know if you've played Morrowind, but the dunmer (90% of the inhabitants) didn't miss one opportunity to bully, insult, mug and try to kill you. And those were the people you were supposed to save. So + points for the empire there.
I'll have to agree with Jarl; despite the "rooting for the underdog"-effect the Stormcloaks create at the beginning, I soon got fed up with Ulfric. I'm not quite sure it's deliberate but he always sounds like a spoiled lazy undecisive **** to me: "Kill those guys", "destroy that city", "bring me my crown", "chew my steak for me, will'ya?"...
I actually just stopped doing the quest around the time I picked up the jagged crown and realised that it would look much better on me than Ulfric...
(that would be epic! A questline that enabled the player to become the new leader of Skyrim!)
I knew who I would side with after I did the DB questline, Titus Mede II was such a badass, and wasn't the "I'm gonna surrender everyone to the thalmor for the lulz" person The stormcloaks try to make him out to be.
All fair points, but at the same time...I find the Empire's judgement questionable from the start. "Oh...it looks like this prisoner isn't on the list." "Kill him anyways." "Alright, time to die for no reason."
That dragon SAVED your ass. Should you not worship Dragon kind then? I do agree that the Empire seems less-asshole ish but they're both in the wrong in my eyes. With the Empire, it's as if just because they're fighting the good fight, they can piss on anyone they want.
There's no doubt that there are assholes within the Imperial Legion, but one bloodthirsty Captain does not mean you have to condemn the entire faction. Suffice to say that Galmar, Ulfric's right hand, is possibly the most brutal and bloodthirsty person in the entire game.
No, you shouldn't worship dragons; Alduin came to Helgen because he sensed the Player, and he sacked it in the hopes of killing you. I don't think he knew that the player was a Dovahkiin, but he could certainly sense some kind of power. That's my interpretation, at least.
I'm not sure why you think that the Imperial Legion piss on people. It's a fact that they're at war, fighting in a foreign land, and the Stormcloaks are not above Guerilla warfare and hiding among the common populace, so it's only prudent of the Legion to suspect anyone not directly affiliated with them (and probably a fair good amount who are). However, if you consider the places either faction controls: The Legion has Solitude, which is probably the best kept city next to Whiterun. The Jarls of both Whiterun and Morthal are both supportive of the Empire (although they try to remain neutral, for fear of angering their peoples). All of these cities are the best kept and contain the happiest individuals, and have the least corruption. Sure, there are problems in all of the cities, but war does that. On the other hand you have Windhelm, which is home to the only ghetto in the game as well as the most openly racist and unpleasant people, you have Riften which is thoroughly seeped in corruption and run behind the scenes by Maven Black-briar
The Empire seeks stability in the province, and while I'll agree that some of them seem incredibly assholey, you still have someone like Legate Rikke. The truth is, I think, that the empire really don't care for messing with Nord culture. The whole war in Skyrim was basically started because they were forced to sign the White-Gold Concordat, which, as I mentioned, was tailor-made to cause dissent among the more nationalistic elements in Skrim. If Ulfric had any proper love for the Nord people, he would see that his rebellion is causing more harm than good, and that he could easily use any assistance to the empire against the thalmor as leverage for better conditions for his people when the war was won. As it is, Ulfric seems much more concerned with his own ego, status and power. As Tullius says during the Legion questline: "He has already proven his own strength. Now he seeks to prove that of his army."
Another interesting tidbid comes in the quest
to secure peace through the Greybeards:
Ulfric will ask for Markarth to be handed over to the Stormcloaks. While it may seem like a strategic place of importance, it's just as likely that he wants the city purely for the sake of getting revenge on Jarl Igmund who turned Ulfric over to the Thalmor after Ulfric came to the city's defense.
Well, you seemed to miss a few points. For starters, you were some poor sod who happened to be near Ulfric Stormcloak's group when they attacked, so even if you weren't on the list, they were right to assume you had something to do with him. And that dragon didn't save your ass, he tried to kill everyone in Helgen, you just used the chaos to run the fuck away. So, captcha, what do you think the dragon would turn us into if he got the chance?
Because Dragons aren't giant space robots ruled by a holographic child.
As for the subject at hand...yeah, with the opening of the game I thought "Well fuck yeah I'm gonna hook up with this Stormcloak guy! Fuck the Empire! The Stormcloaks is a badass faction name anyway!" Then you actually meet the guy and it's like "Holy shit...this guy's a power hungry asshole who'd probably slap his own mother in the mouth!" So yeah, I didn't like Ulfric's attitude and as such have never sided with the Stormcloaks.
If I was role playing as myself, I would probably side with the empire. Ulfric is a racist tool. But after doing the DB questline, the choice was clear.
Trying to execute me for no reason was one thing, but after they killed my family, I had to teach the Empire not to fuck with the Dark Brotherhood. And I just dramatically walked away during Ulfric's pompous little victory speech, the entire city in flames around me. My most badass scene in Skyrim
Isn't the Empire just trying to get on with their jobs while the Stormcloaks trying to cause havok?
After the White-Gold treaty thing (concor-something or other), the Empire seemed pretty politically stable. Talos just doesn't seem to be worth dying over.
Ummm...yeah...they are dragons...which is what I said wasn't it? In reference to the statement "But how do we not know that dragons killing you is their way of showing affection?" (which I translated to mean "But how do we know that dragons killing you isn't their way of showing affection?"), I made a joke comparing dragons to Reapers which apparently kill everything in the galaxy because they love us so much and want to preserve organic life.
Soooooooooo what exactly was the point of your comment? Perhaps you missed the word "aren't" in my original comment, so I bolded it for you.
Edit: As for your question, that truce only works if you haven't done the Civil War before you do the main questline. It becomes determined that to stop the greater threat that is the dragons, the civil war should be put on hold. It's not a truce, more of a cease-fire. Once you complete the main quest, the civil war is back on.
I personally went and joined the empire as a Breton becasue their views and pilicies seemed to be more liberal, which is the kind of guy I am. As oppose to the Stormcloaks which strike me as right-wing nationalists.
I can see you point and it is most likey that it was done one purpose to make the world seem more real as oppose to good guys vs bad guys as they both have moral grey areas.
On the bright side though the Thalmor are the bad guys, I thinkn they give you some one to hate as they benefit neither side of the civil war.
Actually The thalmor are not as "evil" as they seem.
You see the spirit Lorkhan tricked many other spirits into creating Mundus, the mortal realm, causing countless to die and those who remained to be stripped of most their power.
The Altmer seek to remove Talos, because Talos is Lorkhan reborn, and free themselves so they can regain thier original forms that were taken from them through deciet.
The hatred of man comes from the fact that Mankind are Lorkhans children, as long as they live so will Lorkhan, and as long as he lives they will be trapped by mortality.
they are still massive dicks, but they are technically just trying to take back what was stolen from them.
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
![Fr]anc[is](https://eg-forums-escapist-data.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/data/avatars/l/93/93202.jpg?1620797781){kind=avatar}
