It's About Characters, Stupid

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Eric Staples

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Aug 8, 2011
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You could very easily over analyze nearly any piece of fiction. Especially, when it comes to sci-fi or horror. Do you really take games so seriously that you can't appreciate them? Quit acting like it's supposed to be Shakespeare. I mean why are you even playing games if you're just going to be that cynical? When it comes to sci-fi and horror, the point of the story is never in the details.

In regards to your complaint about Superheroes. What would be the point if the villian didn't threaten the world or an entire city? How would they be "super" heroes if all they did was stop a simple mugging or something any normal cop could prevent? I mean you complain about certain kinds of fiction following a similar suit, when that suit is very well the point of said fiction.
 

Darth_Payn

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Aug 5, 2009
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Combine Rustler said:
I understand that someone might hate Batman, but it would seem that Yahtzee's entire family was torn limb from limb by the guy. Such seething hatred is rarely seen outside of... um... the Internet.
Nevermind.
Dude, did you just now watch Yahtzee's reviews of the Arkham games? He said he LOVED Batman, like everyone else on the Internet, possibly the most beloved fictional concept more than Firefly.

Frostbite3789 said:
Falseprophet said:
No, but the Joker's the exception to the rule. He's Batman's greatest nemesis, because Batman is all about an orderly, predictable universe where everything can be investigated and analyzed and he can have a plan for every situation. But the Joker is completely unpredictable and his motivations defy examination, so Batman can't really plan for him.
Oh...oh my god. Joker is the Assassins and Batman is the Templar. WE'VE BEEN ROOTING FOR THE WRONG SIDE ALL ALONG.
Good god, I hope not! The Assassin's are about freedom yeah, but Joker only cares about his own freedom. To kill. Batman could enforce order on everyone, but he doesn't. He believes in people's inherent goodness and willingness to do right. He does what he does so no one else suffers.
 

ThunderCavalier

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Nov 21, 2009
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Yathzee! Don't give people like DC ideas like that!

They have the potential to take extremely awesome ideas like the Legion of Doom and completely screw it up!
 

008Zulu_v1legacy

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Sep 6, 2009
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C'mon, you really think they will risk 150 million on anything less than a sure thing? It'll be an Avengers clone, poorly done. As poorly done as Green Lantern was a cheap clone of Iron Man (seriously, Green lantern syncs up with Iron Man in so many ways its almost scary).

What happened to the kind of villain that would convince the hero to switch sides with a well thought out, but simple speech. Make some of the good guys the villains.
 

BehattedWanderer

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Jun 24, 2009
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The Legion of Doom story sounds interesting. "The world is filling up with extraordinary people.", said Nick Fury, and sooner or later the ones on the other side are going to get together. Show these pseudogods just how human they are...

shrekfan246 said:
You may or may not be disappointed by the answer.
What...was that? I feel like that's something that would play on repeat, as some kind of pyschotropic torture propaganda film. One of those things psychotic leaders play to at dissenters, to make them obey. My eyes shifted focus, I couldn't see straight, and my vision blurred for everything except the video. It's insidiously in my head. If I were strapped to a chair, with this blaring in my eyes and ears, I don't think I am a strong enough person to defend against that. I'd be giving up the lives or secrets of the ones I hold most dear just for them to kill me and make it stop. Holy crap. You have to warn a guy about that stuff, man! I'm not lying about the eye parts, either. That actually happened.
 

shrekfan246

Not actually a Japanese pop star
May 26, 2011
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BehattedWanderer said:
The Legion of Doom story sounds interesting. "The world is filling up with extraordinary people.", said Nick Fury, and sooner or later the ones on the other side are going to get together. Show these pseudogods just how human they are...

shrekfan246 said:
You may or may not be disappointed by the answer.
What...was that? I feel like that's something that would play on repeat, as some kind of pyschotropic torture propaganda film. One of those things psychotic leaders play to at dissenters, to make them obey. My eyes shifted focus, I couldn't see straight, and my vision blurred for everything except the video. It's insidiously in my head. If I were strapped to a chair, with this blaring in my eyes and ears, I don't think I am a strong enough person to defend against that. I'd be giving up the lives or secrets of the ones I hold most dear just for them to kill me and make it stop. Holy crap. You have to warn a guy about that stuff, man! I'm not lying about the eye parts, either. That actually happened.
So, basically, you're saying it was this:

And there's a reason I have a gif from that music video as my avatar. :D

Her other music videos are just as wacky, too. It's pretty interesting, to tell the truth. Like I said in another thread earlier, I don't often listen to J-Pop, but when I do, it's Kyary Pamyu Pamyu. :D
 

BehattedWanderer

Fell off the Alligator.
Jun 24, 2009
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shrekfan246 said:
BehattedWanderer said:
The Legion of Doom story sounds interesting. "The world is filling up with extraordinary people.", said Nick Fury, and sooner or later the ones on the other side are going to get together. Show these pseudogods just how human they are...

shrekfan246 said:
You may or may not be disappointed by the answer.
What...was that? I feel like that's something that would play on repeat, as some kind of pyschotropic torture propaganda film. One of those things psychotic leaders play to at dissenters, to make them obey. My eyes shifted focus, I couldn't see straight, and my vision blurred for everything except the video. It's insidiously in my head. If I were strapped to a chair, with this blaring in my eyes and ears, I don't think I am a strong enough person to defend against that. I'd be giving up the lives or secrets of the ones I hold most dear just for them to kill me and make it stop. Holy crap. You have to warn a guy about that stuff, man! I'm not lying about the eye parts, either. That actually happened.
So, basically, you're saying it was this:

And there's a reason I have a gif from that music video as my avatar. :D

Her other music videos are just as wacky, too. It's pretty interesting, to tell the truth. Like I said in another thread earlier, I don't often listen to J-Pop, but when I do, it's Kyary Pamyu Pamyu. :D
Yes, but hers is worse, much more of an assault, rather than a suggestion. Though, admittedly, the Fashion monster one wasn't as bad. But it, candy candy, and Tsukematsukeru gave me one distinct feeling: I pity the Japanese Alice, for her Wonderland is a far stranger place than I should like to visit, and if this is what she felt when she went through hers, then I admire her bravery, for there was a young girl who would walk where I would dare not tread.

My consolation is that I don't find it all arousing, so there's a plus. That I wonder how far down this particular rabbit hole I could go, however, is another matter.
 

minderbinder8

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Oct 27, 2012
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"It's About Characters, Stupid"

Objection, your honor! The old RTS game Homeworld had a great story, and it didn't have a single actual character.
 

Azrael the Cat

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Dec 13, 2008
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If anyone here wants a limited series DC Comic where they actually DO exactly what Yahtzee is suggesting, get the 'Secret Six: Villains United' series. It starts off being set in the lead-up to Infinite Crisis, where you've got all the camp crappy 70s Batman villains (you know, the ones where all they have is some absurd gimmick, like Umbrella Man who goes around robbing banks with...um...Umbrellas, etc) who don't want to join the bad guys in their 'destroy the world' plan because they're too old for this crap / on parole and don't want to get jailed for missing their curfew checkin / sane enough to realise that they'll get annihilated in a fight between all the villains with actual superpowers vs all the heros with actual superpowers, and so they (a few get killed early, but the 6 end up being Catman - yes, the ultimate 'camp 70s batman villain - Deadshot, Chesire, Ragdoll #2, Scandal, the Fiddler and a random Parademon that's gone AWOL and doesn't know what to do now it doesn't have any orders).

Then they find out that Luthor's collection of supervillains have a policy of killing crappy 70s non-powered villains who turn down their 'invitation' to join, and start shitting themselves until they get a mysterious call from someone called 'Mockingbird' who promises he can keep them safe so long as they do some 'work' for him...

In the process they find out that they're being tracked down by the freaken superheros as well. Not just that, but this bunch of non-powered chumps find out that the 2 characters most intent on tracking them down are none other than the freaken BATMAN on one side and Deathstroke on the other (a major problem as they don't have anyone that can hurt him enough to stop him from just regenerating in a few seconds).

It's an awesome underdog series, with 'victories' like Catman finally getting his dignity back by training until he can fight Batman to a draw while the rest of the team break their captured teammates out of jail. Perhaps not quite an all-out 'villain' series, as the characters range from ones like Catman who acts semi-heroically and respects the non-powered heros like Batman and Green Arrow, but views the superheros as the equivalent of alien invaders imposing whatever 'justice' they feel like upon a helpless population (citing the Dr Light lobotomy as indicative of why he hates them), through to Deadshot who sets the team's rule of 'doesn't matter whether the job is for good or evil - as long as we get paid'.

Again, great idea for a film, particularly because they're limited edition stories so you can kill characters off and build proper character arcs without getting stuck with the 'endless sequels' problem. Would never get made though.
 

Mengkong

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Oct 30, 2012
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Good article, but there's something lacking...

Indeed, there's something lacking in nearly every extra punctuation entry since it's inception: namely the extra mother-loving punctuation!

When was the last time there was any punctuation around this place?!?

No ~tildes~? No em dashes--or rather, hardly any? Not even a single interrobang‽

How about let's title this content a bit more realistically: boring, bland, monkey-see-monkey-do punctuation.
 

TheHardcase

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Jun 7, 2011
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Completely disagree about DC vs. Marvel villains... DC often has villains based purely around elements. Like Flash's rogues. You basically have Batman's villains.. Superman's villains, other than Lex, are pretty meh. Darkseid is not as complex as Thanos. Thanos is simultaneously tragic and childish, trying to impress his girlfriend by flexing his big muscles. Darkseid is just evil incarnate, and I've never really read anything that explained his motives beyond him being the evil side of the new gods.

The greatest conflicts in Marvel, though, are between the heroes. Civil War was so amazing because -- aside from Mark Millar's brilliance -- there's always been tension between Marvel's characters.

For the record, Moon Knight is infinitely more interesting than Batman, and Bushman is EXACTLY the kind of villain you're referring to -- he's the brutally efficient killer that Spector adamantly denies being. There you go. Bushman isn't even the best Marvel villain.

Also, lots of Marvel villains aren't simply representative of the inverse of their hero, because a lot of villains have become distinct characters. Zemo is as complex as any hero, because he's been a protagonist.

You say Batman isn't interesting without his villains. I counter that his villains aren't interesting without him. That's why all the big events involve either a new villain (Anti-Monitor, the Black Lantern Corps) or a Superman villain (because a non-Superman villain is just going to LOSE TO SUPERMAN). Joker isn't just insignificant in large events because of his individualism and chaotic nature, but because he ONLY works as a character when put opposite Batman.

Also, you say that character-based stories suit DC more, but I'm not sure that's true. There are only a few characters in DC that I would like to see good character-driven movies from, and one of them is being accomplished by the show Arrow. John Constantine would actually probably be really good in a character-driven series.
 

Aitamen

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Dec 6, 2011
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As far as Marvel goes, I love the route they took with Iron Man 3 in Stark being broken by the events in The Avengers. As a multi-part story, I really like what they're doing with it... small stories leading up to bigger stories...

I'd love Legion of Doom, or Legion of Doom vs. The Avengers (Fuck, let both sides do what they do best).