It's my opinion man

[Robot Number V]

I'm gonna go ahead and agree with you about the rampant use of "IMO". If I say something subjective, I shouldn't have to clarify that it's a subjective statement, the statement itself should be evidence enough. For example, if I said "Blue is the best color", then OBVIOUSLY that's just my fucking opinion. I once got into an argument over DOGS AND CATS just because I said "Dogs are better than cats" without throwing in an "IMO". People just assumed that I thought dogs were QUANTIFIABLY better than cats. Again, it's a subjective statement! ANY thoughts are the matter are, by definition, just opinions!

"I'm of the opinion that the Earth is flat"
"I'm of the opinion that climate change is a myth"
"I'm of the opinion that homosexuality is a choice"
"I'm of the opinion that transgender people are just attention seeking people who like to play dress-up, and that there's no such thing as gender dysphoria"

Need I go on?

At least a couple of these "opinions" are regularly found on this very forum, despite being blatantly wrong.

Those aren't opinions they're beliefs.

Opinion refers to that which is subjective. If the thought in question is about something that can be objectively assessed, with a position that goes against the established facts considered a belief.

People who have those positions will often refer to them as opinions, but they're not.

Hmm. I feel compelled to offer my own take on this.

Obviously those statements are not opinions, as much as the people holding them might think otherwise. Opinions are subjective, and cannot be proven correct or incorrect. Once a concept IS proven as correct or incorrect, than you either accept it or you continue your ignorance. Stating your ignorance as an opinion does not make it so.

However, I don't think they would be "beliefs" either, since there's plenty of evidence to prove them as false. Opinions are just thoughts people have on subjects that are subjective. Beliefs can be the same thing, but they also cover thoughts people have that might be true, but can't be proven either way. The difference being that a favorite color will always be a a subjective issue, and thus will always be an opinion. The belief that the human race was intelligently designed (however unlikely) might be proven true someday, so it would be a belief.

The examples listed above are just falsehoods. They're not opinions or beliefs, they're just examples of ignorance. Which is basically what happens when a belief is proven to be false, and people keep on believing it anyway.

Basically, the thing to take away from this is that neither opinions OR beliefs can be proven wrong. If something CAN be proven wrong, than it's not an opinion or a belief (though the person holding it may ignorantly think otherwise) it's just an example of ignorance.

 

[Ieyke]

So here you are, typing away at that little box in whatever forum you visit, perhaps it's about why this movie is super flawed, or why Assassin's Creed Revelations is a failed abortion that should have stayed in the canned projects bin, and then you hit the post button in reply to the person who claims otherwise, and you get a reply.
''It's like my opinion man''.
How do you feel when this happen? to be honest I just can't stand this. It just defeats the point of a forum when all we are going to do is typing away and expecting no replies, we have blogs for that. When you post an opinion, expect it to be challenged, argued, debated, you name it. This is honestly the only place where I haven't gotten that type of comment. The more annoying one is when people need you to shove IMO IMO on everything so they get the message that's its bloody subjective. Did I ever suggest it isn't? no? then why do you think otherwise?

Okay went on a bit of a rant here, but what do you think of this dilemma we often see on the magical land of internet?

Opinions can be wrong, and quite frequently are.
All that is is admitting defeat of one's undefendable opinion.

 

[Vegosiux]

All that is is admitting defeat of one's undefendable opinion.

Defeat? I'd have thought learning something would be a victory.

But I guess it's still more important to "defeat" others in this combat of internet information than "share knowledge". Just goes to show people tend to "debate" just to feel superior to others, the selfish, despicable creatures that we are.

Oh, the... [http://www.wrestleenigma.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/oh_the_hue_manatee_by_wishermadeawishfall-d4kdo2x.jpg]

 

[TheMadDoctorsCat]

I've just been having an argument with someone who claims that vaccines cause autism, and when given evidence to the contrary he said he still just "believed" they did and they were dangerous "In his opinion". It's not about opinion you fuckwit, it's about fact, fuck you. I'm not going to "agree to disagree", you're demonstrably wrong. Fuck off.

I find that much more infuriating than people who use the opinion defense when it actually applies to opinion.

Agree with this, and I've come across that specific example as well.

As regards the original poster though... yeah, if you've gone to some pains to explain exactly WHY you hold a certain opinion, it is annoying as hell when people just post "I disagree" or "that's what you think" without offering any counter-argument. It suggests that they haven't even read your argument, or can't be bothered to take the time to understand what you're actually saying before posting a response to it.

It's the whole review scores thing again - some reviewers get "flamed" for posting "unpopular" scores, yet the people doing the flaming don't see to have even read the review beforehand.

 

[Vegosiux]

As regards the original poster though... yeah, if you've gone to some pains to explain exactly WHY you hold a certain opinion, it is annoying as hell when people just post "I disagree" or "that's what you think" without offering any counter-argument. It's the whole review scores thing again - some reviewers get "flamed" for posting "unpopular" scores, yet the people doing the flaming don't see to have even read the review beforehand.

And you know, that's okay, because entertainment is subjective. I mean, it's okay do disagree with the reviewer and not explain why you disagree. What's not okay is being an ass about it. "You gave it a 7/10? Huh, I'd give it a 9." is perfectly fine. You're the sole authority on the subject of "How much I enjoyed this game". Just don't be an ass about it.

Whether or not vaccines cause autism doesn't depend on the individual, however, so naturally that's where sourcing your claims needs to be done.

 

[King Aragorn]

I'm pretty sure I answered this in my post. It depends on the nature of the thread: not all forum threads are designed to be debates.

If, to re-use my unimaginative example, the thread simply asks "What is your favourite video game?" and you respond with your personal answer plus a little bit of explanation, there's no obligation or expectation to add more. In that case, what you gain from posting in that thread is "showing your colours," or identifying yourself as a fan of a particular game, and contributing to the overall picture of which games are popular or unpopular on that particular forum. Sometimes what you gain is the happiness of remembering and sharing a favourite thing or moment (sounds a bit wet I know, but I've had that experience before).

Obviously you are correct when the thread actually is designed to be a debate though, and if a serious political/religious/ethical discussion is underway. But when you're just saying that you like a piece of entertainment? Sure, you can debate that, but not everyone wants to.

I get that you like to debate and that's your primary reason for using forums, but please try to bear in mind that not everyone feels that way.

You show off your colors, you identify yourself as fan of that game and...that's it, I guess. There is nothing that anyone gains from that because in the end isn't it just sort of an isolated post from everything else which goes against the point of a socializing forum? I can definitely understand the happiness thing, but does it hurt to explain your opinion further and thus enriching the forum and the people that participate in it with your view point which gives a wider scope of opinions?
However I understand when things get right down to personal preference that there is no room for anything anymore. I admittedly sometimes have a hard time understanding it because a person just...not getting into something seems weird to me because to me *this sentence used to me twice* I always have some sort of reason, but I acknowledge it and that's where it just ends. But what I was talking about in the OP is more along the lines of the people who post something/start something and when you post something of opposition they just say ''my opinion'' and run away. Just...what was the point?

What did you benefit by posting your opinion if you don't want to explain it further or reply to those who may think differently or offer differing point of views? you say you don't care what others think and the like, but without discussion the point of a forum ceases.

"Not every" =/= "None at all".

And honestly, nothing's wrong with discussions, but I have a couple problems with them, as in, a) too often people think it's a contest; 2) too often people form prejudices on previous opinions; III) some topics are simply suited to a light-hearted exchange of tastes as opposed to a mind-bending exercise in philosophy.

Then again, Eamar's explained it really well already.

I'll just add that on a forum like this, nobody "owes" you anything, and to say other people are "wasting your time" by not adhering to your personal ruleset of talking over things is really conceited.

1) Don't really get what you mean by a contest.
2) Ehh fair enough that does happen sometimes.
3) When it's a topic like that sure, but most of the time this happens atleast to my experience is when it isn't, be it entertainment or something more serious like politics.
And of course, nobody owes me anything. I mean in the end I can't point a gun at them and force their typing fingers but it doesn't mean I necessarily like it when fruitful discussion is put to a halt.

 

[Vegosiux]

1) Don't really get what you mean by a contest.

You know, a contest. Some event in which your objective is to "defeat" the others.

And of course, nobody owes me anything. I mean in the end I can't point a gun at them and force their typing fingers but it doesn't mean I necessarily like it when fruitful discussion is put to a halt.

Discussions don't really get brought to a halt as long as there are people willing to discuss things. Sure, now and then some loudmouth will want to disrupt it by going "Hey, look at me not (or pretending not to be) giving a shit!" but those tend to remain largely ignored, and those who have things to say to each other (sometimes at each other, but that kind of makes discussions toxic) will continue to do so.

What I meant there is that nobody is here for your (or mine, or anyone else's) amusement and/or convenience. The effort to pick the wheat from the chaff, so to say, is something we all have to do.

 

[Eamar]

You show off your colors, you identify yourself as fan of that game and...that's it, I guess. There is nothing that anyone gains from that because in the end isn't it just sort of an isolated post from everything else which goes against the point of a socializing forum?

Actually, it can all contribute to the socialising side if you view the individual threads as part of a bigger picture. You're letting other people find out more about you and your interests, and you learn more about other users by reading their posts.

For example, I am a massive Tolkien fan. I mention this all the time on these forums, but I very rarely debate about it. However, several other users have picked up on this, and so when they see me in another thread where I am participating in the discussion more, they say "hey, I know you like Tolkien, what do you think of x, y and z?" or "do you think this applies to Tolkien?" or that sort of thing. I also get personal messages from other Tolkien fans and get into conversations with them there that wouldn't necessarily have a place on the general forums.

I'm sure I'm not alone in having this sort of experience, so just letting others know what your interests or preferences are without immediate discussion can still be social.

I can definitely understand the happiness thing, but does it hurt to explain your opinion further and thus enriching the forum and the people that participate in it with your view point which gives a wider scope of opinions?

Usually there'd be no "harm" in it, but frankly, sometimes you just don't want to. Maybe you're busy IRL. Maybe you're just not in the mood. Also bear in mind that it's really not uncommon for the person wanting further discussion to come across as quite confrontational or aggressive, even if they don't mean to. In that case, it's understandable that someone might want to nip a potential argument in the bud.

But what I was talking about in the OP is more along the lines of the people who post something/start something and when you post something of opposition they just say ''my opinion'' and run away. Just...what was the point?

If someone's deliberately started a discussion and then does that then sure, that's a cop-out and completely pointless. However, again you have to be aware of the wider context: perhaps the discussion has gone in a direction they don't like and they simply don't want to spend any more of their time on it. Perhaps they never intended to "start something", and your opposition wasn't intentionally invited. It's unfortunate that tone doesn't carry well over the internet, because it's quite easy for people to perceive something as an invitation to get into a big debate when really it was only ever meant to be a light-hearted comment or throw-away remark.

 

[Someone Depressing]

I'll feel annoyed. I'll explain that I was just disagreeing and giving my input. I really hate when people do that.