Jimquisition: Rape vs. Murder

[Something Amyss]

"Thou Shalt Not Kill" comes from a religion where women were property and attacks on women were treated as property crime. Rape was not treated with as much severity because the primary victims were women and women weren't treated as people.

It's interesting to see that phrase used here.

Then again, also keep in mind that the commandments given including honouring your parents, making graven images, and worshipping other gods. The priorities here might be a little off here.

What am I getting at? Well, the divide on whether rape or murder is worse is pretty big. A lot of people do think murder is worse. I don't. Nor do I think it trivialises murder.

Also, I do agree that we have to look at how something might be understood. I think a lot of these controversies can be summed up by "I don't get it." This is especially true on sites where the userbase is is strongly one group. Gamers tend to be male. As rape is not seen as a men's issue, men don't think about it much. Same goes with sexism in general.

You don't rape in self-defense.

Maybe YOU don't.

 

[mad825]

Also, there is a part of our brain that just enjoys violence. At the same time we have a conscience. Angel and devil on the shoulders.

What is a human? A huge mess of contradictions.

Freudian.

The Super ego, ego and id. I think you're taking the idea a little bit too far.

 

[Orinon]

this is all very true, in fact when it comes to morals, I don't ever promise I will never kill someone, I won't kill someone unless I think there's no other option, but I never wish to foll myself into thinking there will never be a situation where I might have to take another persons life. It's an unlikely situation and either me or someone important to me is in serious danger, but it could happen.
Rape on the other hand, I can promise I'll never do, because there's no situation where it can be justified, no situation where I can claim I'm doing more good than harm.
Now the actual concept of rape could be addressed, but it must be in a proper way, as an example it shouldn't be an option, they don't let you kill kids in Skyrim, they don't let you be racist in fallout 3 (to other people not to other ghouls), and you can't murder random civilians in the citadel in Mass effect 2. There are reasons for this, these actions weren't part of the experience. Now to be chasing a Rapist is fine because the game is likely insisting your supposed to despise the Rapist, heck I think in some of the silent hill games your character might have raped someone, but you never do it in game, because silent hill is tormenting you for it.

My point is Rape is not the same is murder, and I personally find it disgusting, any game that was designed for you to rape someone is a bad game and this I would complain about.

 

[bullet_sandw1ch]

If I'm playing a game and another character actually rapes me, it means the other player has to actively continue doing things to me, and I have to sit there and watch it happen, or else try to resist.

i may be a bad person for this, but i just pictured a fellow player walking up to you, and in the family guy character herberts voice say: "hey there young fella, you want a cold popsicle to cool you down? the one who swallows the most tylenol pm's wins!" and your character shouts "i need an adult! i need an adult!"

 

[Grahav]

Also, there is a part of our brain that just enjoys violence. At the same time we have a conscience. Angel and devil on the shoulders.

What is a human? A huge mess of contradictions.

Release of endorphins, you see. We're all just twisted enough to get excited about strangest things.

Freudian.

The Super ego, ego and id. I think you're taking the idea a little bit too far.

Yep, those naughty ids and their endorfines of crazy...

 

[Suicidejim]

You don't rape in self-defense.

So that's why I got kicked out of that self-defence class . . .

That's a pretty fuckin' inappropriate joke, mate. And I just made a joke about kicking a dead cat into a ditch this morning on the phone (after having kicked a dead cat into a ditch).

Which seems far more disrespectful to me, since it had a real-life basis. But fair enough. To be honest, I'm mildly surprised that it went unchallenged for 9 pages.

 

[Ghonzor]

I was actually a bit afraid to watch this video but I'm glad it tastefully coincides with The R-Word article on here as well. This has all needed to be said and I'm glad the Escapist (and Jim of course) have decided to do so.

 

[aattss]

So, porn is legal but rape in the gaming industry isn't?

So what if someone is selling a product you personally don't like? Are you trying to impose your beliefs on others?

Besides, the thing is that murder can be justified. You're killing a bad person, and if you don't, you'll get killed. The military is allowed to kill (some) people, but we don't have a branch for raping people. Raping innocent people is only a little worse than killing innocent people. There is no situation in which raping is more morally justifiable than killing. At least killing someone doesn't scar them for life. Also, there's intent. Most people who want to commit rape have a bad intent, and you don't even get any material gains, but killing can be more of a socioeconomic decision (even if it's a bad one).

 

[CardinalPiggles]

Well in all seriousness, no, no rape is not as bad as killing, ever. I thought everyone knew this? Physically and mentally victimising someone, leaving them traumatised for the rest of their life, potentially giving them STD's and/or making them pregnant is worse than stabbing them in the head.

I would take the stab in the head over that other shit any day.

And yet if someone murdered you. People who were close to you would be traumatised for the rest of their life.

And yet if someone did murder me, my family and friends wouldn't have felt victimised and they wouldn't have had to worry about STD's and or pregnancy either. Murder is the lesser of two evils.

STD's (If not viral) and pregnancy isn't really too bad and would come under psychological trauma. Modern medicine knows a thing or two around this.

None of these acts should be committed in the first place and in fact over sympathising for rape may just seem a little gender bias and perhaps an over reaction? Granted, it's by far from pleasant but at least you can seek redemption ("justice")? You won't be defeated by an immoral act? You still can grow, change and be happy. There is a way back unlike death.

Death is a binary state and know one knows life beyond death. Isn't that what all animals, all humans fear the most? isn't our ultimate duty to survive no matter the odds?

I think humans are past the point of being totally ruled by our animal instincts by now.

Just now thinking about it, maybe it comes down to how optimistic you are. See I'm a pessimist, I give up way too easily, and therefore see death as a way out. An optimist however would see death as a point of missed opportunity, a point of no return. So death would be worse for an optimist.

Or maybe I'm just spouting bullshit and need to go to sleep, heh.

 

[Don Savik]

All of you rape apologists confuse me. Yes society glorifies violence to some degree, but WHY would you possibly want to make rape just as popular? What do we gain from having rape commonplace as killing people in video games?

I guess I shouldn't expect anything special from a forum of mostly 20ish and under males to be honest. I think a few people here are incapable of imagining the mindset of the victim. If your reasoning is essentially "well if your dead your dead, but rape victims still get to live herp derp" it just shows you how seriously people are actually taking the subject.

good video Jim

 

[Frission]

I'm flabbergasted. This was actually done in a way that wasn't completely offensive. There's also no flame war to be seen in such a long topic. (Then again what kind of person would defend rape of all things?)

 

[Loethlin]

Yep, those naughty ids and their endorfines of crazy...

I'm a Jungian and I resent that.
SCIENCE says it releases endorphins, not Freud.

 

[Mikejames]

He stated the case very well, my respect for Mr. Sterling has gone up.

 

[Fox Lee]

Jim pretty much nailed it. I'm surprised that this is even a thing; as nasty as killing is, it's well-recognised that there are justifiable reasons to do it. You can kill in self-defence, you can kill to hasten a slower and more painful death, you can kill to protect others, you can kill for the sake of your country... somehow "rape" does not work in any of those sentences.

Sure, killing in video games can often be distasteful, even crass and cheap, but it's typically being done for one of these justifiable reasons (with obvious exceptions like GTA). There is no justifiable rape, no matter how hard a bad webcomic may try to convince you.

 

[lord.jeff]

It's kind of surreal seeing this many people just casually accept violence and killing as are standard for what's okay to show in a video game, as long as you can justify that it's more tasteful then spreading someones brain matter across the wall it's a okay. I'm completely okay with violent games but I can't be the only one to find it a little weird at how much of a non issue it is?

 

[The_Lost_King]

I disagree. If you ban rape and rape discussions and somehow remove it from life entirely, why not do the same for dentistry, dentists, everything to do with teeth? I mean, it's pretty traumatic, painful, everybody hates it... Or paper-cuts. Man, those hurt.
Death on the other hand is a final full stop, a big ending, there is nothing (as far as I know) beyond death. There are no chances to heal yourself emotionally and physically.

Tl;dr: Death-end, rape-pain, thus saying rape is NONO while death is ok is hypocrisy.

Why would you need to heal your self after you died you are in a better place or you are gone. Either way you don't need healing and don't have to live with the consequences of dying. In heaven you aren't going to cry in a corner about dying. If there is nothing after death then you can't feel anything so you don't need to be healed. I don't quite see your logic.

It's kind of surreal seeing this many people just casually accept violence and killing as are standard for what's okay to show in a video game, as long as you can justify that it's more tasteful then spreading someones brain matter across the wall it's a okay. I'm completely okay with violent games but I can't be the only one to find it a little weird at how much of a non issue it is?

Why should killing be an issue in games? It has been easily portrayed in other mediums with no problem. Sure rape has but there has never been a move or book about rape(unless it is to halp a victim). Now there have been plenty of movies with killing. Some of them way more grotesque than you will see in video games(ala Saw).