Jimquisition: Rape vs. Murder

[lacktheknack]

Yes, I agree with you 100% on every point.

All that being said though, I'm still looking forward to the new Tomb Raider. If any game looks like it could handle the subject matter well it's that one.

...but it won't. Crystal Dynamics have been very, VERY clear on that, no matter what their idiot of a PR agent says.

 

[Mikeyfell]

Yes, I agree with you 100% on every point.

All that being said though, I'm still looking forward to the new Tomb Raider. If any game looks like it could handle the subject matter well it's that one.

...but it won't. Crystal Dynamics have been very, VERY clear on that, no matter what their idiot of a PR agent says.

Alright, so If the new Tomb Raider wont feature any rapists I guess it'll be a huge win for the LGBTQ community as the first game featuring the largest population of homosexual pirates.
Seriously, what the fuck.

That's very disappointing, I mean seriously out of ALL the E3 coverage I read I can't even find 3 games that look like they might be worth playing.

How the fuck are they... why did they... fuck. Yeah, see what I care if they want to give their dark gritty Tomb Raider reboot some Disney fuck villains.
Sorry, I'm back to being cynical now. Thanks for warning me before I got my hopes up or anything.

 

[Bevin Warren]

I hate the idea of rape...
however comming at it from a purely intellectual stand point its good to see society has moved away from Rape as being a given right of conquest - hence the term Rape and Pillage... counquring armies had the right to rape its population before they were allowed to loot - its good to know this is no longer the case but maybe we need to be reimded of what used to be considered right is not the case... should rape be in games ... maybe in extreme circumstances...certainly it shouldn't be used to entertain but educate maybe...

Who knows maybe a game in which the main character is raped and the rest of the game is them seeking retribution or acceptance might be a socially successful thing...

just stating now Im not a fan or rape and only looked at it from an intellectual view point - My wife was raped before she ever met me and if I ever bump into the guy that did that to her in a dark alley,m he will quickly find he might soon lose the ability to do that ever again.

 

[lacktheknack]

Yes, I agree with you 100% on every point.

All that being said though, I'm still looking forward to the new Tomb Raider. If any game looks like it could handle the subject matter well it's that one.

...but it won't. Crystal Dynamics have been very, VERY clear on that, no matter what their idiot of a PR agent says.

Alright, so If the new Tomb Raider wont feature any rapists I guess it'll be a huge win for the LGBTQ community as the first game featuring the largest population of homosexual pirates.
Seriously, what the fuck.

That's very disappointing, I mean seriously out of ALL the E3 coverage I read I can't even find 3 games that look like they might be worth playing.

How the fuck are they... why did they... fuck. Yeah, see what I care if they want to give their dark gritty Tomb Raider reboot some Disney fuck villains.
Sorry, I'm back to being cynical now. Thanks for warning me before I got my hopes up or anything.

One of them does try to rape her. You see all one attempt of it in the freaking E3 trailer. It's an unfailable sequence, the fight afterwards is failable through death only.

You're doing waaaay too much projection here. For all you know, Lara never remains in their hands for long enough for anything else to happen. For all you know, they're religious psychos who intend to sacrifice them (see the hanging-upside-down part). For all you know, they're deliciously evil except they don't rape people because that would be an atrocious idea at this point.

(Also, if they WERE all homosexual, then the other male survivors we see in the trailer have a problem now, don't they?)

 

[Negatempest]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

 

[axlryder]

To Jim's point, there are a LOT of games where you simply kill innocent people who have done nothing wrong. You can take their lives without a second thought. That is every bit as vile as rape in my eyes. If someone just came up and shot my mother in the head and walked away, well, you can't tell me "at least he didn't rape her and leave her alive". There are games that allow you to do that sort of killing.

My point is, I don't think people should justify all killing as somehow being "better" than rape. I realize that's not what Jim was trying to do, and that there is a grey area with killing, but needless killing of the innocent far surpasses that grey area. That said, I don't think these games should be censored. Just as I don't think games about rape should be censored. People SHOULD be able to have their Rapelays. Just because we as a culture collectively view it as vile and disgusting act doesn't mean that we suddenly should have the right to say what forms of entertainment people can and can't have (as long as it's not directly endangering someone else). Imo anyway.

 

[psijac]

In AvP for PC you could play as an Alien face hugger. Isn't that a form of rape game play mechanic?

 

[punipunipyo]

well said, "victim" factor is kinda the key, but the murder games with "victim" in it would totally defeat that one (skyrim;Evil characters/missions/choices, or remember MassEffect3 when you shot Merdin in the back to keep Genealfauge?) Need more solid stuff, this alone, you would still be attacked... but over all, a VERY NICE, and well done Vid... May I ask Why this subject? just out of curiosity...

 

[axlryder]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

"afterlife" is a very narrow way of looking at all religious perspectives, and some people's religious beliefs are genuinely rooted deeper than "self denial" (the most solid example would be through various manifestations of miraculous/spiritual experiences). I'm not trying to start a religious debate here, I'm just say that's a rather presumptuous statement you made.

 

[Negatempest]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

"afterlife" is a very narrow way of looking at all religious perspectives, and some people's religious beliefs are genuinely rooted deeper than "self denial" (the most solid example would be through various manifestations of miraculous/spiritual experiences). I'm not trying to start a religious debate here, I'm just say that's a rather presumptuous statement you made.

Oh I agree. But you already know how much more detail I would have to go to include every single point of view of what happens after death. That could be a whole blog on it's own. Point being, most of us would really like to believe there is something after death...even though there is no evidence of such a possibility. aka denial. Quite a harsh word it is. I personally have no idea what to expect because I have never seen the afterlife. So I can't say one way or another.

It's like...when we want to believe the Devil is punishing the sinners instead of celebrating with them since they are...sinners...I don't know. It's not such an easy thing to accept that maybe that serial killer, once dead, may have a parade waiting for him by the demons.

 

[Something Amyss]

Don't kill dates back to Hammurabi, way before Christianity or Jesus were a thing.

Yes, and I'm sure Jim was quoting Hammurabi and not the (Hebrew, I might add) Ten Commandments.

 

[axlryder]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

"afterlife" is a very narrow way of looking at all religious perspectives, and some people's religious beliefs are genuinely rooted deeper than "self denial" (the most solid example would be through various manifestations of miraculous/spiritual experiences). I'm not trying to start a religious debate here, I'm just say that's a rather presumptuous statement you made.

Oh I agree. But you already know how much more detail I would have to go to include every single point of view of what happens after death. That could be a whole blog on it's own. Point being, most of us would really like to believe there is something after death...even though there is no evidence of such a possibility. aka denial. Quite a harsh word it is. I personally have no idea what to expect because I have never seen the afterlife. So I can't say one way or another.

It's like...when we want to believe the Devil is punishing the sinners instead of celebrating with them since they are...sinners...I don't know. It's not such an easy thing to accept that maybe that serial killer, once dead, may have a parade waiting for him by the demons.

I feel like you're assuming that evidence must be peer reviewed in order for it to be valid. I don't find that's really the case. It simply means it can't be scientifically validated. Denial (at least if you're using it in the Freudian sense) is more about refusing to accept something that is apparent. If a person sees or experiences something that might make them question the "life sucks and then you die" model of thinking, well they're really not in denial in questioning/refuting that model. Perhaps they're crazy or simply making assumptions (speculating on that would just be conjecture), but that doesn't mean they're necessarily in denial. Also, since you acknowledged you generalizing about the whole "afterlife" thing, cool I guess.

 

[Nouw]

What was the game at 0:53?

 

[Dimitriov]

Thank God for Jim.

But seriously that sums up all my thoughts very neatly. I have never understood why anyone would consider murder worse than rape.

 

[Negatempest]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

"afterlife" is a very narrow way of looking at all religious perspectives, and some people's religious beliefs are genuinely rooted deeper than "self denial" (the most solid example would be through various manifestations of miraculous/spiritual experiences). I'm not trying to start a religious debate here, I'm just say that's a rather presumptuous statement you made.

Oh I agree. But you already know how much more detail I would have to go to include every single point of view of what happens after death. That could be a whole blog on it's own. Point being, most of us would really like to believe there is something after death...even though there is no evidence of such a possibility. aka denial. Quite a harsh word it is. I personally have no idea what to expect because I have never seen the afterlife. So I can't say one way or another.

It's like...when we want to believe the Devil is punishing the sinners instead of celebrating with them since they are...sinners...I don't know. It's not such an easy thing to accept that maybe that serial killer, once dead, may have a parade waiting for him by the demons.

You're assuming that evidence must be peer reviewed in order for it to be valid. That's really not the case. It simply means it can't be scientifically validated. Denial is more about refusing to accept something that is apparent. If a person sees or experiences something that might make them question the "life sucks and then you die" model of thinking, well they're really not denying anything. Again, miracles. Also, as long as you can accept that you were generalizing about the whole "afterlife" thing, whatever.

Your partly right about the denial part. When people really want to believe something happens after death, it is the denial of believing that blankness happens after death. Either could be right, but they don't want to believe that blankness is an option. Miracles.....can be left to chance. It's both lucky and a miracle that people can survive certain car crashes. ....Why are we derailing this thread XD.

 

[axlryder]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

"afterlife" is a very narrow way of looking at all religious perspectives, and some people's religious beliefs are genuinely rooted deeper than "self denial" (the most solid example would be through various manifestations of miraculous/spiritual experiences). I'm not trying to start a religious debate here, I'm just say that's a rather presumptuous statement you made.

Oh I agree. But you already know how much more detail I would have to go to include every single point of view of what happens after death. That could be a whole blog on it's own. Point being, most of us would really like to believe there is something after death...even though there is no evidence of such a possibility. aka denial. Quite a harsh word it is. I personally have no idea what to expect because I have never seen the afterlife. So I can't say one way or another.

It's like...when we want to believe the Devil is punishing the sinners instead of celebrating with them since they are...sinners...I don't know. It's not such an easy thing to accept that maybe that serial killer, once dead, may have a parade waiting for him by the demons.

You're assuming that evidence must be peer reviewed in order for it to be valid. That's really not the case. It simply means it can't be scientifically validated. Denial is more about refusing to accept something that is apparent. If a person sees or experiences something that might make them question the "life sucks and then you die" model of thinking, well they're really not denying anything. Again, miracles. Also, as long as you can accept that you were generalizing about the whole "afterlife" thing, whatever.

Your partly right about the denial part. When people really want to believe something happens after death, it is the denial of believing that blankness happens after death. Either could be right, but they don't want to believe that blankness is an option. Miracles.....can be left to chance. It's both lucky and a miracle that people can survive certain car crashes. ....Why are we derailing this thread XD.

Ah, I'm sorry, I misunderstood your use of denial. My bad. Though, I think it's fair to say that they may actually want to believe in the blankness option. The prospect of an afterlife isn't necessarily welcoming to everyone. Also, as to miracles, there have been reports of miracles that are far more convincing than miraculous car crash survivals...at least if you believe they happened. I've witnessed a couple myself. Though, despite that, I still tend to veer towards a nihilistic perspective lol.

but yeah, rape is bad and stuff.

 

[Negatempest]

So wait, Torture is more okay than rape?...even though both are exactly the same thing in the form of the whole "Power" argument you were making? True I would find neither rape or murder okay. Also men do not just rape because of media influence. They were either traumatized or psychologically messed up already.

The true common sense comes from playing "influential" games but knowing better than to do any of it. Though Rape is a societal issue, not a moral one. Also, murder is not always equal on both sides. Most of the time the victims never see it coming and/or are never prepared. Sure it's "quick", but the fact is that once murder does happen...that victim no longer exists in any physical form we know of. Sure "religion" is an excuse to believe there is something to look forward to, but that is just self-denial until proven of the afterlives existence...which is a pretty scary thought for some people.

"afterlife" is a very narrow way of looking at all religious perspectives, and some people's religious beliefs are genuinely rooted deeper than "self denial" (the most solid example would be through various manifestations of miraculous/spiritual experiences). I'm not trying to start a religious debate here, I'm just say that's a rather presumptuous statement you made.

Oh I agree. But you already know how much more detail I would have to go to include every single point of view of what happens after death. That could be a whole blog on it's own. Point being, most of us would really like to believe there is something after death...even though there is no evidence of such a possibility. aka denial. Quite a harsh word it is. I personally have no idea what to expect because I have never seen the afterlife. So I can't say one way or another.

It's like...when we want to believe the Devil is punishing the sinners instead of celebrating with them since they are...sinners...I don't know. It's not such an easy thing to accept that maybe that serial killer, once dead, may have a parade waiting for him by the demons.

You're assuming that evidence must be peer reviewed in order for it to be valid. That's really not the case. It simply means it can't be scientifically validated. Denial is more about refusing to accept something that is apparent. If a person sees or experiences something that might make them question the "life sucks and then you die" model of thinking, well they're really not denying anything. Again, miracles. Also, as long as you can accept that you were generalizing about the whole "afterlife" thing, whatever.

Your partly right about the denial part. When people really want to believe something happens after death, it is the denial of believing that blankness happens after death. Either could be right, but they don't want to believe that blankness is an option. Miracles.....can be left to chance. It's both lucky and a miracle that people can survive certain car crashes. ....Why are we derailing this thread XD.

Ah, I'm sorry, I misunderstood your use of denial. My bad. Though, I think it's fair to say that they may actually want to believe in the blankness option. The prospect of an afterlife isn't necessarily welcoming to everyone. Also, as to miracles, there have been reports of miracles that are far more convincing than miraculous car crash survivals...at least if you believe they happened. I've witnessed a couple myself. Though, despite that, I still tend to veer towards a nihilistic perspective lol.

but yeah, rape is bad and stuff.

XD. Car crash just an example. To me a "miracle" is such intense luck that to believe it to be pure "chance" would seem ridiculous. Also I really don't like the word "miracle" because it usually comes in the form of believing to be favored by some form of "God". Which tends to put some people in a bit of a high XD.

p.s. Good night, going to bed.

 

[Harbinger_]

Continue with videos like this and I'll continue to watch them.

 

[GonzoGamer]

The sad part is, people have to be reminded not to rape. Kinda tells you somthin aboot humans doesn't it?

You mean about our tendency to ignore the obvious?

What I wonder about these games is do they depict realistic rape or "rape fantasies?" I have nothing against what people do in their own time provided they have a clear safeword but anyone who wants to play a game that simulates real rape should probably get some free medication with their pre-order.