Exactly, if he stays or leaves is decided by his traffic numbers. Those don't lie.Baneat said:
Jimquisition: Too Cool To Be Cool
- Thread starter Jimothy Sterling
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I'v always known that Jim was making a direct attempt at trying to be an ironic idiot that wasn't supposed to be taken seriously and that he hoped everyone would love.
I've also always known he was an complete and blithering idiot, who had no idea how to pull it off right.
It seems that the Escapist too thinks a British accent is all it takes to get a little recognition these days. 'Oh don't be riddiculous, why on Earth do we need to find someone TALENTED? This guy's BRITISH! That'll MORE than make up for any stupid level of actual SKILL, you simple fools...'
What Jim obviously fails to realise is that Duke IS a parody of cool. They simply made the entire WORLD of Duke Nukem a parody of sorts on cool. And also that what made Dante cool in his 3rd game was actually playing things aloof, essentually meaning that Dante was not taking what he was doing seriously. It was as Dante said, all 'one hell of a party' to him.
Jim also fails to realise that in his attempted description of himself, he also ended up describing another particular game blogger, who, despite having not done himself justice in the last several months, is still more entertaining and educational to watch than this buffoon.
I've also always known he was an complete and blithering idiot, who had no idea how to pull it off right.
It seems that the Escapist too thinks a British accent is all it takes to get a little recognition these days. 'Oh don't be riddiculous, why on Earth do we need to find someone TALENTED? This guy's BRITISH! That'll MORE than make up for any stupid level of actual SKILL, you simple fools...'
What Jim obviously fails to realise is that Duke IS a parody of cool. They simply made the entire WORLD of Duke Nukem a parody of sorts on cool. And also that what made Dante cool in his 3rd game was actually playing things aloof, essentually meaning that Dante was not taking what he was doing seriously. It was as Dante said, all 'one hell of a party' to him.
Jim also fails to realise that in his attempted description of himself, he also ended up describing another particular game blogger, who, despite having not done himself justice in the last several months, is still more entertaining and educational to watch than this buffoon.
I think what Jim is missing is that there are differant styles of humor. What's funny about Duke is that it's taken seriously within the context of his game world. We as the people get to snicker at how preposterous it all is. It's a differant style than having characters within the game world take him down a peg, rather it's funny because they don't, and I think all the humor out there with the over the top he-man getting taken down, or one-upped constantly by the female co-role, or whatever is exactly what helps to make this funny.
It's not just in the Jimquisition, but in the media in general, that I've noticed this tendency to claim that Duke Nukem is being presented as some kind of icon. Truthfully, I have never gotten that impression, he's presented as being pretty bloody absurd.
I will also be honest in saying that the whole "too cool for school" thing isn't something that was the product of a bygone decade, after all that whole attitude was just as absurd then as it is now. Today people point back to the 00s and 90s, in the 90s people pointed back to the 80s, and in the 80s they pointed back to the 70s... and well mass media culture of the type we're dealing with doesn't go back much futher than that in the context we're talking about, at least in examples I could clearly point to. What we're dealing with is something that is "corny", and to be honest the things that are truely corny were never taken seriously in any decade. Certain properties however manage to make something corny, really cool at the same time (and you can replace corny with campy on other subjects where the reality is simple), of course that kind of corny-cool tends to lose something when it's beaten into the ground too much... which is what happened with Sonic The Hedgehog. Duke Nukem goes for a differant style than Sonic, but it's the same basic argurment, but with Duke it's been so long between actualy games that he hasn't worn out his welcome.
If you want to look at an example of what Duke Nukem is going for, think of the old "Buckaroo Banzai" movie, which managed to become a cult success. Buckaroo Banzai was basically the same schtick as Duke Nukem, albiet without the explicit sexuality (although by definition all the women in that universe were madly in love with our hero). Buckaroo Banzai basically could do anything, and was an expert in every field of human endeavor, he had friends and allies to the four corners of the earth, he had his own worldwide secret society to boot. His enemies were equally absurd world threatening aliens. Fans of that cult classic had been clamouring to actually make the promised sequel, but at the same time if they had actually delivered on turning that into a franchise, it would have gone the way of Sonic.
With Dante, they were actually trying to go for a comic-book type thing from what little I've read on the subject. Dante's antics were inspired by those comic book fights where you occasionally see a hero or villain so in control of a fight against someone that they outclass that they do something absurd with their powers to make that point and humiliate their opponent. Sometimes this is combined with an artist showing off what kind of cool things an artist can do with sequential art as a medium, sometimes simplistically. I could give an exhaustive list, but I'm sure any comic reader has occasionaly gone "he just did what?" from that kind of situation. The thing is that Dante overdid it. If some bad guy attacks, and gets KOed by The Flash, but then you find that in between the bad guy launching his first blow, and him being put down The Flash also took the time to do all the housework, cook a four course meal, and check his sidekick's homework on the other side of the planet, that's funny as an occasional thing, and as a humorous reminder of how fast he actually is (capable of bending time to literally be in multiple places at once) but if he does it every single fight it goes from being cool, to just being stupid.
To be honest I think people are decrying the macho-nature of Duke, and inentionally claiming to not "get" the style of humor (and yes, it is humor, not intended to be taken seriously) due to the pressure the games industry is getting. It's kind of frightening when I see guys like Yahtzee going on about the media going too far with violence, and guys like Jim with the same basic platform (as to the amount of views they can get) going off about Duke. To me it seems like an attempt to compromise. Games are getting mainstream attention, and thus need to start conforming with what the mainstream deems acceptable for content. The kind of humor at the root of duke, or the extreme over the top gore of Mortal Combat, are basically no-nos in the sphere of political correctness. The humor coming from Macho men has to come from watching them be cut down to size, as opposed to watching them get away with it and have everything go their way and simply chuckling at the absurdity of it... basically it being funny because it's so wrong, and the guy isn't getting cut down to size like we'd expect from like 99.9% of the rest of the humor media out there.
Right now is the point where video games need to have their extreme content, and irreverant concepts defended. Video games need to be put into society as they are, not made to adapt to the same norms they have spent decades fighting against. If this battle is won, it can also be a major springboard for other forms of media to break free from the contraints we're seeing.
When I listen to Jim here, I basically get the impression that what he wants to see is another generic sitcom, you know where the man comes home starts to act stereotypically manly, and gets cut right back down to meterosexual size by his spouse or girlfriend. That is a TYPE of humor, and the most politically correct take on gender roles, but it's not the ONLY type of humor. Granted the kind of Absurdity inherant in Duke Nukem is akin to the jokes in a Men's Locker room... but hey, it's never been making any pretensions about that. Old school Andrew "Dice" Clay with a gun and an alien invasion is a valid approach, even if some want to belittle it.
Personally I defend Duke because I like variety and right now there isn't anything quite like him out there. I'm not a big shooter fan, and probably won't be getting his game until it's on a STEAM sale or something. Make whatever judgements you want about me for defending this kind of thing, but I think it's something that should be embraced, rather than basically going after it specifically for NOT being politically correct and going along with all of the other stuff out there. "The Dice Man" was never one of my favorite Comedians, but for all the criticism, I think the comedy landscape was better for his prescence when he was at his politically incorrect worst. I also don't think you can judge people who find the politically incorrect funny, as long as they understand fantasy from reality and try and take it seriously out into the street.
It's not just in the Jimquisition, but in the media in general, that I've noticed this tendency to claim that Duke Nukem is being presented as some kind of icon. Truthfully, I have never gotten that impression, he's presented as being pretty bloody absurd.
I will also be honest in saying that the whole "too cool for school" thing isn't something that was the product of a bygone decade, after all that whole attitude was just as absurd then as it is now. Today people point back to the 00s and 90s, in the 90s people pointed back to the 80s, and in the 80s they pointed back to the 70s... and well mass media culture of the type we're dealing with doesn't go back much futher than that in the context we're talking about, at least in examples I could clearly point to. What we're dealing with is something that is "corny", and to be honest the things that are truely corny were never taken seriously in any decade. Certain properties however manage to make something corny, really cool at the same time (and you can replace corny with campy on other subjects where the reality is simple), of course that kind of corny-cool tends to lose something when it's beaten into the ground too much... which is what happened with Sonic The Hedgehog. Duke Nukem goes for a differant style than Sonic, but it's the same basic argurment, but with Duke it's been so long between actualy games that he hasn't worn out his welcome.
If you want to look at an example of what Duke Nukem is going for, think of the old "Buckaroo Banzai" movie, which managed to become a cult success. Buckaroo Banzai was basically the same schtick as Duke Nukem, albiet without the explicit sexuality (although by definition all the women in that universe were madly in love with our hero). Buckaroo Banzai basically could do anything, and was an expert in every field of human endeavor, he had friends and allies to the four corners of the earth, he had his own worldwide secret society to boot. His enemies were equally absurd world threatening aliens. Fans of that cult classic had been clamouring to actually make the promised sequel, but at the same time if they had actually delivered on turning that into a franchise, it would have gone the way of Sonic.
With Dante, they were actually trying to go for a comic-book type thing from what little I've read on the subject. Dante's antics were inspired by those comic book fights where you occasionally see a hero or villain so in control of a fight against someone that they outclass that they do something absurd with their powers to make that point and humiliate their opponent. Sometimes this is combined with an artist showing off what kind of cool things an artist can do with sequential art as a medium, sometimes simplistically. I could give an exhaustive list, but I'm sure any comic reader has occasionaly gone "he just did what?" from that kind of situation. The thing is that Dante overdid it. If some bad guy attacks, and gets KOed by The Flash, but then you find that in between the bad guy launching his first blow, and him being put down The Flash also took the time to do all the housework, cook a four course meal, and check his sidekick's homework on the other side of the planet, that's funny as an occasional thing, and as a humorous reminder of how fast he actually is (capable of bending time to literally be in multiple places at once) but if he does it every single fight it goes from being cool, to just being stupid.
To be honest I think people are decrying the macho-nature of Duke, and inentionally claiming to not "get" the style of humor (and yes, it is humor, not intended to be taken seriously) due to the pressure the games industry is getting. It's kind of frightening when I see guys like Yahtzee going on about the media going too far with violence, and guys like Jim with the same basic platform (as to the amount of views they can get) going off about Duke. To me it seems like an attempt to compromise. Games are getting mainstream attention, and thus need to start conforming with what the mainstream deems acceptable for content. The kind of humor at the root of duke, or the extreme over the top gore of Mortal Combat, are basically no-nos in the sphere of political correctness. The humor coming from Macho men has to come from watching them be cut down to size, as opposed to watching them get away with it and have everything go their way and simply chuckling at the absurdity of it... basically it being funny because it's so wrong, and the guy isn't getting cut down to size like we'd expect from like 99.9% of the rest of the humor media out there.
Right now is the point where video games need to have their extreme content, and irreverant concepts defended. Video games need to be put into society as they are, not made to adapt to the same norms they have spent decades fighting against. If this battle is won, it can also be a major springboard for other forms of media to break free from the contraints we're seeing.
When I listen to Jim here, I basically get the impression that what he wants to see is another generic sitcom, you know where the man comes home starts to act stereotypically manly, and gets cut right back down to meterosexual size by his spouse or girlfriend. That is a TYPE of humor, and the most politically correct take on gender roles, but it's not the ONLY type of humor. Granted the kind of Absurdity inherant in Duke Nukem is akin to the jokes in a Men's Locker room... but hey, it's never been making any pretensions about that. Old school Andrew "Dice" Clay with a gun and an alien invasion is a valid approach, even if some want to belittle it.
Personally I defend Duke because I like variety and right now there isn't anything quite like him out there. I'm not a big shooter fan, and probably won't be getting his game until it's on a STEAM sale or something. Make whatever judgements you want about me for defending this kind of thing, but I think it's something that should be embraced, rather than basically going after it specifically for NOT being politically correct and going along with all of the other stuff out there. "The Dice Man" was never one of my favorite Comedians, but for all the criticism, I think the comedy landscape was better for his prescence when he was at his politically incorrect worst. I also don't think you can judge people who find the politically incorrect funny, as long as they understand fantasy from reality and try and take it seriously out into the street.
Anyone want a really good example of a 'cool' character played for laughs the way Jim described it in this video?
Have a cookie if you looked at that and immediately thought I was going to say 'Jim'. Because you're absolutely right. He's like Duke Nukem, but taken less seriously and without the guns.
Have a cookie if you looked at that and immediately thought I was going to say 'Jim'. Because you're absolutely right. He's like Duke Nukem, but taken less seriously and without the guns.
Great episode Jim.
To some of the escapist readers: Stop being such a bunch of whining idiots please, it is making me sick.
To some of the escapist readers: Stop being such a bunch of whining idiots please, it is making me sick.
School... Of... Cool...
I KNEW I recognized you from somewhere! Class of 2001, baby! I believe you were called Jimea, the "mostly" female hermaphrodite then. Glad to see you got a good surgeon to perform the partial re-assignment surgery. You may not recognize me by my internet monicker, but back then I was called "Dictator." I was the one who walked around with a hollowed-out potato as a codpiece, you know, back BEFORE it was fashionable. Well, at least until the "accident." To answer your next question, NO, I never did find the potato with my penis in it. Still looking, though...
Anywho, how have you been? Are ya happy with just a dick now?
I KNEW I recognized you from somewhere! Class of 2001, baby! I believe you were called Jimea, the "mostly" female hermaphrodite then. Glad to see you got a good surgeon to perform the partial re-assignment surgery. You may not recognize me by my internet monicker, but back then I was called "Dictator." I was the one who walked around with a hollowed-out potato as a codpiece, you know, back BEFORE it was fashionable. Well, at least until the "accident." To answer your next question, NO, I never did find the potato with my penis in it. Still looking, though...
Anywho, how have you been? Are ya happy with just a dick now?
Firstly: When it's a possibility to make everyone happy simply by having said 'majority' stop going out of their way to watch something they DON'T LIKE, then yes, that solution should be sought. Secondly, show me what our alternatives are. What is being deprived that's better? Show me a: You can either have This or This option, then I'll think that your opinion isn't completely baseless.ShadowKatt said:
Anyhow, he made some decent points on some things, even though I don't agree with a large portion of it.
Though Duke Nukem is absolutely disgusting, I do think in a way it expects you to realise that. It doesn't need to hold your hand for you to think it's funny. Characters that take themselves seriously are often quite entertaining to me, more so than those who purposely try to be funny. That being said, the way he acts is no way to idolise, I'm not bothered about what people do in the confinements of their dusty homes, but no one should attempt to act like him.
Unless the like the feeling of being emasculated. Permanently.
People need to stop taking this so seriously, I get the impression when he 'agrees' with your opinion is all dandy, then when he conflicts it or 'disagrees' then it's hater rage. He's no comical genius, but by now I'm hoping you are aware that you don't like the show. So go sit in the haters-gonna-hate corner and spare 6-7 minutes of your life, and 1-2 of mine having to see the whining.
You can't be extremely ironic, self-aware and do social commentary if you're trying to mix legitimate opinions of your own in there. Or at least some valid points. It doesn't work. We can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not because there's no indication of what you truly believe in. After watching your videos five times, you might finally understand that your sarcastic comment was ironic but that irony was supposed to reflect ironic sarcasm only to sarcastically state your irony of the ironic statement, but it's not very funny by that time.
Either that or you're just being a pathetic troll.
Either that or you're just being a pathetic troll.
Yet we watch every week. Hes either a genius or im retarded. And dont just go with the obvious one..Espsychologist said:
Incidently Its because I dont like what he says 90% of the time that has me coming back. Its complicated.
I just like to watch people botch up their presentations and draw completely outrageous conclusions. It is the same thing as watching teenage creationists argue that the bible is *the* truth about how this universe of ours came into being.ForensicYOYO said:
See, the problem here is that Jim doesn't get it. Even if we ignore the fact that he is flat out wrong about Duke Nuke'em as a serious character (Duke is a stealth parody, Sam is satire on the stealth parody, go figure) we are still left with one hard to escape fact:
People like over the top awesome characters. Just about every action movie ever made relies on the fact that the audience wants to see the totally awesome hero kick ass and get the girl. Games are no different, most people want to play a ridiculously awesome hero, save the chick and the world and hear how awesome they are.
Those of us who prefer more down to earth heroes (or flawed heroes) are a pretty vocal minority. But make no mistake, the people like me and Jim who want more 'nuanced' characters are quite vastly outnumbered.
I'm sorry but did Jim just try to play off his persona as a joke?
no no no no no no no, you're a little too much of a dickhead to be playing that card at this point, and the fact your written reviews are of the same ailment only serves to reinforce the whole 'non-fabricated' feel to the reviews.
The ironic part is that you criticize the other characters in the review for not pulling this off when you yourself cant do it justice.
no no no no no no no, you're a little too much of a dickhead to be playing that card at this point, and the fact your written reviews are of the same ailment only serves to reinforce the whole 'non-fabricated' feel to the reviews.
The ironic part is that you criticize the other characters in the review for not pulling this off when you yourself cant do it justice.
lol I gotta say, good job on calling out all of the haters (myself included).
That said, it was actually a decent episode with some grat points and it really spelt out exactly what I find unappealing about DNF.
As for Jim himself, once he drops the over-acted self-righteousness part he's a pretty good speaker, but every time he goes back to that parody act he just becomes droning again. Maybe it's just me, but the whole self-righteous act he does for his videos is just a bit painful, kinda like watching Duke Nuken expecting to be taken seriously.
That said, it was actually a decent episode with some grat points and it really spelt out exactly what I find unappealing about DNF.
As for Jim himself, once he drops the over-acted self-righteousness part he's a pretty good speaker, but every time he goes back to that parody act he just becomes droning again. Maybe it's just me, but the whole self-righteous act he does for his videos is just a bit painful, kinda like watching Duke Nuken expecting to be taken seriously.
Ya know what...
It truly saddens me that I have to add this to what would otherwise be a mockingly-and-frankly-FUN-post, but here it goes:
THERE IS NOTHING (and I mean NOTHING) IN THIS WORLD SO SERIOUS THAT IT CAN'T BE LAUGHED AT. And, YES, games fall into that category - ALL OF THEM! Seriously, are you all a bunch of Jihad-ists willing to forgo your humanity over a cartoon? (<--too soon? If so, let me know!) Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww... fuck it. Bring on the flameburger!
It truly saddens me that I have to add this to what would otherwise be a mockingly-and-frankly-FUN-post, but here it goes:
THERE IS NOTHING (and I mean NOTHING) IN THIS WORLD SO SERIOUS THAT IT CAN'T BE LAUGHED AT. And, YES, games fall into that category - ALL OF THEM! Seriously, are you all a bunch of Jihad-ists willing to forgo your humanity over a cartoon? (<--too soon? If so, let me know!) Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww... fuck it. Bring on the flameburger!
Darn, I was ready to give up on you and then you come up with a clever, thought provoking point and vastly improve the aural attractiveness of your videos.
So awesome job.
I even actually agree, except maybe Dante went too far in the one direction with DMC4 and I think there is a small hint of irony with the new Duke as he's been presented in promo so far. Just not quite enough. I think it's a really interesting take on Sonic too
So awesome job.
I even actually agree, except maybe Dante went too far in the one direction with DMC4 and I think there is a small hint of irony with the new Duke as he's been presented in promo so far. Just not quite enough. I think it's a really interesting take on Sonic too
