Jimquisition: Xbox 360 and PS3 Are Just Very Crap PCs

[Epona]

Why is the whole PC vs Console thing played out like we can't have both?

How do I decide which system to buy games for? Simple. Whichever system allows me to play with my friends.

Thats it. Why people waste time fighting over which one is "better" is beyond me. Each thing has its pros and cons and at the end of the day is subjective based on the player and who he/she wants to play with (if anyone).

You also choose one over the other and you are posting in this thread. People care and argue about which is better because like everything else, you want the best experience. Everytime you make a decision you are choosing one thing over the other.

I think you misunderstood what I'm saying. What I'm referring to is that people say things like "im a pc/console gamer" as if you cant game on both things and then proceed to make fun of and verbally attack people who "side" with the other camp. The "Best" experience is not determined by what anyone else but the player themself says. It is something subjective.

I am a gamer, period. I play games on my Xbox, my PC, my Phone, and my Tablet.

I play games on my PC and all my consoles and handhelds (though the 360 no longer interests me) but I still admit that PC gaming is superior. Aside from exclusives, I can play most games on my PC with better graphics, faster loading and I can usually hook up a 360 controller and plug the PC into my HDTV via HDMI. What's not superior about that?

My 360 may throw ads at me but my PC won't.

If you are trying to convince me into saying that PC gaming is superior then you are definitely missing my point.

Graphics, faster loading and the ability to plug into an HDTV (I don't have one and dont care to get one anyways) does not make one system superior to the others in my mind. Thats why its subjective.

My "superior" system depends on the game I'm playing, when I want to play it, and who I want to play it with.

You are describing superiority in what you in your mind value to be the most important things. So to you PCs are the superior platform. Thats great, good for you.

Again what I'm saying is that all platforms have their pros and cons and at the end of the day it is up to the consumer to decide which one suits their wants better for any particular game.

My point is that the people saying PC is superior, aren't just people who don't play on consoles.

Take the same game with the same controls but better graphics and faster loading and I think anyone, aside from you, would consider that superior. Two pros and no cons = superior.

 

[I Max95]

Spoiler

i can think of a benefit to console gaming, simplicity, every time i've ever played a game on PC i've had to tweak the settings, go through the installation process (which sometimes does not work for older titles) and hope to god it works.

the details for buying a new computer are endlessly complex same thing with graphics cards and if i play a game with incredibly toned down settings it's rendered unplayable not just through graphics but lag and frame rate.

plus all of my computers are pretty much piss poor, because i'm not at all well off with money. i work minimum wage and my parents don't have much in the way of disposable income, they bought me an xbox and a ps3 only because they were on sale at the time and i didn't already have either of them, but with computers if they were on sale i would'nt even know which computer to buy because of all the complicated details like graphical quality and processing power

and don't tell me my computer can handle it if i tone the setting down, no it fucking can't, i toned the graphics down COMEPLETELY for the free copy of Mass Effect 2 i got through some deal bioware had, and not only did it not work, it didn't even start, the game crashed before it made it to the main menu

with consoles you buy it and you know what it does, it plays games, you put a game in there and it WILL work, because that is specifically what the console was designed to do, there isn't a single chance it won't because all games created for it were designed with it's limitations in mind

You just validated Jim's point: that consoles are no longer JUST gaming devices, and are trying to become more like do-it-all computers and failing in the process.

i didn't say that at all, i was actually saying that the biggest benefit of console gaming is that it doesn't try very hard to be anything more than a gaming console, sure it has a DVD player in it but it never gets in the way of the gaming aspect of the technology

with computers, no, they have other functions than just gaming and odds are when a company makes a computer they don't entirely have gaming in mind and as such the gaming aspects of the rig suffer for it, there are gaming rigs but even those still have to deal with the keyboard, a device clearly not designed for gaming (the mouse works just fine, i just hate that i have to use the keyboard for everything else) and i haven't the slightest clue how to hook a controller up to my computer and i've been trying to for a while now

 

[Danial]

I don't know how the fudge you mod anything, I barely know what debug means, I am not qualified to fix hardware and much less software, which involved programming. I SUCK at programming.

I have been in PC gaming with a surprisingly low knowledge on PCs. I didn't even build my own, I paid for it.

That's great am I'm happy for you, but that still does nothing to defend your original angry rant (and i noticed cut out 90% of my counter), my point was not that its too hard to PC game without the know how, my point was some of us don't want too/care too.

You CAN PC game with low knowledge, you CAN do well with a prebuilt machine you never upgrade, you can get by fixing issues with guides and how too's, But some of us don't want too, don't need too and don't massively care either way. With better PC know how it gets much easier, but that i effort I don't want to add into my time sink with pretty colours.

Some of us should really have gone to bed 1 hour ago (me) but still.


TLDR PART 2: This time in Paris :- People have other reasons to console game over PC for the majority.

 

[Bigeyez]

My point is that the people saying PC is superior, aren't just people who don't play on consoles.

Take the same game with the same controls but better graphics and faster loading and I think anyone, aside from you, would consider that superior. Two pros and no cons = superior.

Alright let me try this one last time before I move on.

You have 2 cars. Same color, same wieght, same extras, roughly the same price. One accelerates from 1-60 faster and has a slightly higher top speed. Do those metrics make it superior and will every single person on the planet who drives cars say that the faster accelerating, higher top speed car is superior? No of course not, because thats where subjectivity comes in. Once person may like the feel of the slower car better. Or how it handles. Or the ease of use. Or that their friends all have one. Or that it uses less gas. Or that it looks cooler. Or that it feels nicer to ride in. Or that their girlfriend can drive it. etc, etc, etc. Its all subjective man.

You CANNOT point at a metric like graphics and say "see this clearly proves this is superior!!!".

I mean just look at what you are saying as your "proof" that PCs are superior. Graphics and faster loading times. To some people those are major differences to others, like me (and there are many like me) those are things that DON'T matter. Certainly not enough that I would miss out on playing with friends to get them.

Compare a Mcdonalds McRib sandwich and a 5 star restaurants ribs. The differences there are not just that one has better looking sauce and is cooked faster....

To me the arugment that one thing is better then the other is a moot point. Once again all the platforms, consoles, mobiles, tablets, pcs, etc suit their purpose and will be used by me on a game by game basis.

 

[T_ConX]

I just built my first gaming PC two weeks ago. It took me four hours to put together, plus another two hours for installing Windows/drivers/Steam/Skyrim.

And then Skyrim went ahead and recommended Ultra High Quality visual settings, and even after a few graphical upgrade mods it's still flying at 60FPS.

 

[cyvaris]

Bravo Jim, bravo.

As a semi-recent convert to PC gaming (two years) I can safely say that anyone who says PC gaming is too expensive is talking out of their ass. I spent $800 for everything, monitor included. Sure I have had a few bugs, both technical and mechanical and you know what? I LOVE it when my rig breaks. It forces me to learn a new skill and use my brain to figure out what the heck happened.

Also comparing my current build to the leaked specs for the next console generation its clear that I am still ahead set up wise and should be for some time. For $800 two years ago, I should be fine into the next generation of consoles. If you want to build a system do some googling on how to build, go to Newegg and buy your parts it's that simple. Plus Steam...especially the Humble Indie Bundles!

PC gaming is overall cheaper, the communities are better, modding is better, and the entire experience is much more enjoyable.

 

[Epona]

I just built my first gaming PC two weeks ago. It took me four hours to put together, plus another two hours for installing Windows/drivers/Steam/Skyrim.

And then Skyrim went ahead and recommended Ultra High Quality visual settings, and even after a few graphical upgrade mods it's still flying at 60FPS.

Ultra High = Medium for consoles. That does not make the PC superior according to one poster with large peepers.

 

[Aesir23]

Can you honestly repeat what you said after looking through those two lists?

That was possibly the greatest post on here.
Top games for 360: cod, halo, gears
Top games for PC: The Sims, Half life, Minecraft. Also surprised to see Guild Wars up there, which is my current favorite rpg.

The numbers speak for themselves. Console gamers like their simple, mindless run and gun (not meant as an insult, I happen to enjoy simple, mindless run and gun too). PC gamers like story and gameplay (bf2 is not run and gun just fyi)

Nice generalizing there. I'm sorry but not every console gamer is as you claim nor is very PC gamer. To pretend that one platform is better than another over a perceived generalization is pretty weak.

OT: This whole "X platform is better than Y platform" pisses me off quite honestly. Why not just appreciate each platform for its own merits? Computers have more power and versatility but consoles are cheaper and easier to use. Stop acting as if one or the other is bringing Gaming as we know it to an end.

 

[Epona]

Spoiler

i can think of a benefit to console gaming, simplicity, every time i've ever played a game on PC i've had to tweak the settings, go through the installation process (which sometimes does not work for older titles) and hope to god it works.

the details for buying a new computer are endlessly complex same thing with graphics cards and if i play a game with incredibly toned down settings it's rendered unplayable not just through graphics but lag and frame rate.

plus all of my computers are pretty much piss poor, because i'm not at all well off with money. i work minimum wage and my parents don't have much in the way of disposable income, they bought me an xbox and a ps3 only because they were on sale at the time and i didn't already have either of them, but with computers if they were on sale i would'nt even know which computer to buy because of all the complicated details like graphical quality and processing power

and don't tell me my computer can handle it if i tone the setting down, no it fucking can't, i toned the graphics down COMEPLETELY for the free copy of Mass Effect 2 i got through some deal bioware had, and not only did it not work, it didn't even start, the game crashed before it made it to the main menu

with consoles you buy it and you know what it does, it plays games, you put a game in there and it WILL work, because that is specifically what the console was designed to do, there isn't a single chance it won't because all games created for it were designed with it's limitations in mind

You just validated Jim's point: that consoles are no longer JUST gaming devices, and are trying to become more like do-it-all computers and failing in the process.

i didn't say that at all, i was actually saying that the biggest benefit of console gaming is that it doesn't try very hard to be anything more than a gaming console, sure it has a DVD player in it but it never gets in the way of the gaming aspect of the technology

with computers, no, they have other functions than just gaming and odds are when a company makes a computer they don't entirely have gaming in mind and as such the gaming aspects of the rig suffer for it, there are gaming rigs but even those still have to deal with the keyboard, a device clearly not designed for gaming (the mouse works just fine, i just hate that i have to use the keyboard for everything else) and i haven't the slightest clue how to hook a controller up to my computer and i've been trying to for a while now

Maybe you have missed the 360 becoming an ad supported cable box? Maybe you missed the dashboard being changed to suit the ads and tv shows to the detriment of games?

I have to use the search function to find games on the Marketplace now but if I want to see an ad or watch something, that's easy to find.

LOL, this is a joke right? You hook a controller up via USB, the same way wired controllers work on the 360 and the same way the PS3 controllers work. I call BS on this, you know how to plug in a controller.

 

[Riddle78]

I do believe Donnel Udina has a relevant quote for this thread in a meta sense...

But,back on track,I am fully in Jim's favour here. Consoles use vastly inferior hardware compared to up-to-date PC's and as far as software and drivers are concerned,like DirectX,consoles are also behind the curve. Coupled with vastly diminished peer support potential and the total removal of modding,you have what is essentially a $300.00 CDN investment...That will only last you about 7-10 years,at most. In contrast,to keep up with gaming,all you need to do is replace a single part of the computer every similar timespan for about $150.00 CDN each time. That part is the video card.

PC games also hold much greater potential than console games,by sole virtue of the modding community. Minecraft,Cortex Command,and literally ANYTHING Bethesda puts out are all wildly successful,and have an incredibly powerful modding scene. Those are just three examples that I know of that allow you to mod the game without making the devs/publishers hate your guts. Mods allow an old game to stay fresh,by adding a new excperience or dynamic to the game. Finally,a half-way decent gaming PC has faster load times and less lag than a console,because of better hardware.

 

[Kyogissun]

EDIT: Fuck EVERYTHING I just said, THIS guy is right:

Why is the whole PC vs Console thing played out like we can't have both?

How do I decide which system to buy games for? Simple. Whichever system allows me to play with my friends.

Thats it. Why people waste time fighting over which one is "better" is beyond me. Each thing has its pros and cons and at the end of the day is subjective based on the player and who he/she wants to play with (if anyone).

I've got nothing more to add. Fuck this stupid and pointless debate over which is better, it's a matter of preference, it's a debate that is applicable to more than just where you play your games. You can use it for series preferences, MMORPG preferences and more.

Everyone can spew all the facts they want and at the end of the day, it's still going to be the most retarded argument ever. I'll take both sides and play with everyone and anyone.

 

[Weaver]

As mainly a PC gamer I really loved this episode. Preach it, Jim!

 

[T_ConX]

Ultra High = Medium for consoles. That does not make the PC superior according to one poster with large peepers.

Medium? Console users don't even get graphical options. Besides, when compared side by side, PC still gets best in show...


Also, we get stuff like this:

 

[Griffolion]

PC gamers care more about graphics and physics than the actual game....these things are not important. Making the graphics better with a mod dont make the game better. The game is what it is, the story etc can not be changed. Each to their own i guess. Just buy the games you love to play and you will be fine.

That really isn't true, there are a ton of games available for PC that in no way make the graphics/physics the focus of the games selling point. Biggest case in point, Minecraft. A few extra's, Braid, Bastion, Limbo. Yes, all available on console, but all also having been brilliantly received on the PC platform and Minecraft only ever making it to console because of the immense popularity it gained on PC.

Just because we CAN have better graphics and physics than the console crowd, doesn't mean that's the ONLY thing we care about. Case in point, the original Deus Ex. Even for its time, it looked like ass. But it's renowned as one of the worlds best games ever.

 

[jthm]

I never worry that a virus is going to turn my game console into a brick.
I never worry that the software won't be compatible with my console.
My xbox doesn't need the latest DirectX whatever to play.
My ps3 is backwards compatible with my ps2 and 1 library (I know, this isn't applicable to everyone).
I don't like playing on a keyboard mouse set up, and I know that mouse users will always be more accurate than me at anything competitive. On a console we all have the same handicap.

When I have friends over, consoles are a good splitscreen medium where we can all have fun together. PC's are a bit lonelier. Not that it isn't possible, but it's more difficult to play a multiplayer game in a local setting. If you have friends who aren't pc gamers, LAN parties become problematic.

 

[tautologico]

Alright, I stand corrected. Maybe it's just because I live in a little town in the middle of nowhere where everything is more expensive than it would be on a big city. But still, I have a below average vaio laptop that I bought online from Sao Paulo for R$3000 less than 6 months ago (and it was a promotion, the thing was almost R$4000 when I checked a couple of months later), and an Xbox360 that cost me around R$1000 two years ago, plus around R$280 for a second controller and a hard drive. And yeah, my laptop runs stuff like Portal 2 on medium settings without many problems, but I put Witcher 2 on windowed mode in the lowest resolution and lowest graphical settings, so it occupied about a fifth of my screen, and it still ran with about 10 fps.

Yes, unfortunately laptops are too expensive and they're not good for games, with rare exceptions. The cheapest way is to build your own PC but that requires some research to see what are the best parts that fit your budget and so on. But it's possible to find well-built PCs with a discrete graphics board for about R$1000, at least where I live (which is not one of the big cities in the South/Southwest). If you do decide to try and build a gaming PC, there will be lots of help available, for instance in the Escapist's own PC Gaming group:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/Escapist-PC-Gamers

 

[Type 90]

Can you honestly repeat what you said after looking through those two lists?

That was possibly the greatest post on here.
Top games for 360: cod, halo, gears
Top games for PC: The Sims, Half life, Minecraft. Also surprised to see Guild Wars up there, which is my current favorite rpg.

The numbers speak for themselves. Console gamers like their simple, mindless run and gun (not meant as an insult, I happen to enjoy simple, mindless run and gun too). PC gamers like story and gameplay (bf2 is not run and gun just fyi)

Nice generalizing there. I'm sorry but not every console gamer is as you claim nor is very PC gamer. To pretend that one platform is better than another over a perceived generalization is pretty weak.

OT: This whole "X platform is better than Y platform" pisses me off quite honestly. Why not just appreciate each platform for its own merits? Computers have more power and versatility but consoles are cheaper and easier to use. Stop acting as if one or the other is bringing Gaming as we know it to an end.

I couldn't agree with you more friend. I always thought that you should judge PC and Consoles by how much fun (something completely subjective) you have, but no apparently fun has no place in gaming, it's all about stupid arguments and fan wank. So with fun taking a backseat in the gaming world I guess all these arguments are good for the community, I can't think of anything less fun than this. So let's band together and move gaming forward by slinging mud like bloody 8 year olds, YAY TEAM.

 

[gring]

Hey, consolers: Why don't you spend some time looking at the steam sales coming up on the 12th?

You might understand where the value starts to kick in.

I use all systems but its just the simple truth: PC > all

 

[the doom cannon]

Can you honestly repeat what you said after looking through those two lists?

That was possibly the greatest post on here.
Top games for 360: cod, halo, gears
Top games for PC: The Sims, Half life, Minecraft. Also surprised to see Guild Wars up there, which is my current favorite rpg.

The numbers speak for themselves. Console gamers like their simple, mindless run and gun (not meant as an insult, I happen to enjoy simple, mindless run and gun too). PC gamers like story and gameplay (bf2 is not run and gun just fyi)

Nice generalizing there. I'm sorry but not every console gamer is as you claim nor is very PC gamer. To pretend that one platform is better than another over a perceived generalization is pretty weak.

OT: This whole "X platform is better than Y platform" pisses me off quite honestly. Why not just appreciate each platform for its own merits? Computers have more power and versatility but consoles are cheaper and easier to use. Stop acting as if one or the other is bringing Gaming as we know it to an end.

Considering that consoles are the reason we don't see large graphical improvements on pc games, I think we DO have the right to say that PCs are better and we SHOULD be pushing for better consoles. Ones that play GAMES, not play movies, browse the internet, and all that extra fluff that nobody uses and is a huge money sink. We have computers for all that other stuff