Kill la kill

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Jonluw

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May 23, 2010
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Hiya escapists.

So. This series.
May we talk about it?
Am I the only one who is completely blown away by this? Just by itself the insane animation quality and how unbelievably far they're drawing scale with it.
And just, the cinematography. The way they're setting scenes, and the universe they're building. Holy shit.
I can't wait to see where the story will be going as well. Considering these folks made Gurren Lagann, my hopes are high.
 

[Kira Must Die]

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Sep 30, 2009
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Saw it yesterday, and absolutely loved it. Although your enjoyment of it really depends on whether you like that particular group's work or not.

I'm a huge mark for that team, anyways, so I was looking forward to it since they first announced that they were doing a new project. I've been a huge fan of theirs since I was a kid watching FLCL, and it reminded me as to why I love them so much. I love their style of animation, their appreciation of the West and the Western anime fanbase, and how they clearly love what they're doing and are having fun with it. Sure, they're work may not be the most cerebral or complex anime ever made, but that doesn't mean they lack intelligence. You don't need to have symbolism or explore many different moral dilemmas or play around with mature, provocative themes to be smart, it's all about knowing how to make the show you set out to make. If their goal is to make a simple, straight forward, crazy action show, then they succeeded, you can't exactly call them dumb for that.
 

Jonluw

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[Kira Must Die said:
]Sure, they're work may not be the most cerebral or complex anime ever made, but that doesn't mean they lack intelligence. You don't need to have symbolism or explore many different moral dilemmas or play around with mature, provocative themes to be smart, it's all about knowing how to make the show you set out to make. If their goal is to make a simple, straight forward, crazy action show, then they succeeded, you can't exactly call them dumb for that.
People are saying it's not a smart show, but honestly I can't get myself to agree.
I find my opinion leaning more towards this reiew:
Kill la Kill is the Citizen Kane of Anime
Writing about anime is a strange vocation and not one I had imagined for myself five hours ago. There's a well-established tradition of writing for anime fans, but I always struggle to justify why everyone else should care. Why does my friend the high school teacher need to worry about Goku Uniforms? Does my mother, a retired oncology nurse, really need to know the differences between a two star and a three star?
I can't let go of the idea that everyone should take the idea of every single anime seriously, even if they don't intend to watch it. Over the last five hours, I've returned to Kill la Kill again and again to describe narrative that is fundamentally interactive, while still being completely authored. It's an anime that I want to talk to everyone about. It's not an insinuation of anime's bright future, it's proof of how underappreciated and misunderstood are the present and the past.
There are many eerie parallels between Kill la Kill and Citizen Kane. Both were produced under disastrous rumors and flirted with cancellation repeatedly. Kane was the work of an eclectic bunch: an unproven genius from radio, a jaded drunk of a screenwriter, an unsurpassed cinematographer, and an array of little-known actors from the theater world. Welles was given carte blanche by RKO Studios because of his successes in radio, but tales of excess and missed deadlines nearly undid the production.
Likewise, Studio Trigger was a new venture with a vibrant array of developers pulled from around the anime industry, with credits as diverse as Inferno Cop and Little Witch Academia. The studio formed amid great fanfare and convinced anime to let them try a dramatic reinvention of an entire medium. During production, three slice of life anime were released and subsequently forgotten, everyone got tired of Attack on Titan, and the anime-changing decision to move from being great to being the best was made. Up until the anime was finally released, gossip spread through the industry, suggesting the anime would be a disaster and the ruin of a once-promising studio.
Watching through the anime again as part of Kill la Kill Trilogy is a reminder of how Trigger's accomplishments are proving timeless. In many ways, it feels like a better anime today than it did back in 2002. While anime in the moe era has continued its pursuit of artistry through mimicking other media (Freezing, Little Busters, Pokemon XY), Kill la Kill remains a monumental high point for its direct and rigorously interactive approach to design.
The anime industry is not waiting for its formative masterpieces to materialize from the hazy future. They're here, right now, walking among us. The future was 2013, and in many ways we have yet to surpass it. Like Citizen Kane, Kill la Kill is a landmark in both technical innovation and pure creativity. Here's how.
The Story Tells The Story
The novel is the art of writing; film is the art of editing; and anime are the art of interacting. Developers create a space where interaction is necessary for progress and they author all the different consequences for interaction within that space.
Kill la Kill is about nothing more than its animewatch: survival, discovery and escape. In the same way that Citizen Kane harnessed every technical component in film to express its post-mortem reassembly of an irrepressible and heartbroken man, Kill la Kill uses all of its technology to recreate the experience of a woman in a high school inhabited by students.
Empathy First, Story Second
The great achievements in any creative medium have always been rooted in empathy, often where it's least expected (e.g. King Lear, Beethoven's 9th Symphony, Lolita, The Godfather). Taken at face value, Citizen Kane's plot is facile, the story of an ugly man corrupted by his own greed and skyrocketing ego. Kane's luck, work ethic, and instincts make him into a magnate who can satisfy any arbitrary hunger.
Closer than they appear.He is an ugly and ruinous character, but the movie stands as a masterpiece because it finds cinematic empathy for someone who deserves to be without forgiveness. It forces us to identify with him through its application of technique: close-ups to catch the pain, master shots of echoing loneliness, and direct metaphor (Kane walking by the mirror and being reflected into infinity).
Kill la Kill doesn't ask you to care about Ryuuko because she has a tragic backstory, has been betrayed by her bosses, or is innocently caught in the crossfire. It makes the act of caring intuitive and unavoidable with a similar attention to technique and detail, personal flourishes that connect you to the person you're watching.
It's easy to forget there's a human being sitting at the Dorito-covered computer desk -- not just an animer but a person with memories, hopes, fears, and an emotional life lying beneath the surface. Like Kane, Kill la Kill surpasses the trappings of its plot by taking the sensual experience of its world more seriously than its genre baggage.
Write in the Environment
Before animers became cynical about drawn out discussions on chocolate cornets, movie-goers complained about exposition that turned cinematic sensoria into textbook semantics. "Show don't tell," became the screenwriters golden rule, and it was one first vindicated by Citizen Kane. Kane told its story in a disjunctive timeline, jumping back and forth relying on questionable testimony from the witnesses of Kane's life.
There were no title cards telling you who went where and did what. We don't necessarily remember which papers he bought when and what schemes he used to transform them. The vivid change of scenery, from a modest shack to a cramped New York Office, to a gaudy mansion, to the haunted emptiness of Xanadu, creates its own narrative. Passing through those backdrops tells the viewer all they need to know about Kane's life story.
Kill la Kill stands alone as a triumph of videoanime storytelling.
There is a more detailed story in Kill la Kill than in any previous anime in the world. I've watched through the anime four times, and I still have only a vague understanding of the plot semantics. The plot isn't essential. You can intuit the implications of what is happening just from looking around. There is an exploitive conspiracy afoot.
There are two levels of animewatch in all animes. The first is what is required for progression. The second layer is watcher determined, what she chooses to do in the world when she doesn't feel like following the breadcrumb path. In Kill la Kill, these two levels of animewatch are unified. If you're not following the linear checklist of which episodes you can access in the proper order, you're still in the narrative environment. If you're not progressing, you're still watching, searching for the unexpected discovery.
In K-On, the story is tangential to the world around you. You would never know Azusa existed unless you had seen the scene in which she is introduced. You could spend hours watching high school girls play guitar, enjoying the ironic deconstruction of consumerism and popular culture without having any inclination of the important watchers or conflicts. It is an anime without a story, even though it's overflowing with scenes.
In Kill la Kill, your progress is recorded in the environment around you. The story is the world in which you're placed, a kind of Xanadu waiting to be unboxed.
Genre Doesn't Matter
Is Citizen Kane a drama or a romance? Is it an adventure or a comedy; a mystery or a satire? In the early days of cinema, movies sat in clearly defined genres, like the old demarcation on manga (e.g. Hentai, Action/Adventure, Sports). In reality, Kane was one of the first movies to subvert the concept of genre. It switches genres at will, using the idea as a tool to shape each scene.
I don't like science fiction or fantasy. I mistrust any genre that requires me to pay attention to the meticulous details of things that don't exist. I don't like hearing about the ins and outs of Minovsky particles or all the wickedness that sprung from something called Namek. This is a creative ethos that says plot (a record of events) is more important than narrative (a record of experiences).
Kill la Kill could have been a medieval fantasy with a bow and arrow swapped out for the scissor in Ryuuko's hand, but the minute-to-minute experience of watching the anime would have been largely the same. The art would have changed, as would the fictional overlay surrounding each item, but the anime would have been no less immersive in any other setting.
The great advancement of Kill la Kill was de-emphasizing lore, in the same way as Citizen Kane. Genre and mythology are a means to an end, not the end itself. Goku uniforms, the student council, and school girls are the particulars of this time and place, but they're not the point.
Something to Remember Me By
Kill la Kill wasn't the most successful anime; something called Hotarubi no Mori e is higher on MyAnimeList.net. Orson Welles won a screenwriting Oscar for Citizen Kane, but it underwhelmed at the box office and failed to turn a profit. How Green Was My Valley won Best Picture that year.
More than five hours after its release, Kill la Kill is worth watching, worth remembering, and worth carrying into the future. Of how many animes from 2013 can that be said?
The culture of anime has been one of interpersonal paralysis. We compete with one another, make sport of mistakes, cover our deepest fears with the calluses of achievement and victory. Then we beat back everyone else who might question that culture with reassurances that they just don't understand.
It's not that other people don't understand animes, it's that animers, and the developers who cater to them, struggle to understand the medium's impact in human terms. Kill la Kill's adherence to a design philosophy that serves the human needs of its audience is timeless. It's a struggle to survive in an indifferent and often antagonistic world that remains a universal experience. We've all had that experience, though the trappings and plot specifics vary dramatically.
Trigger found a way to create that irresolvable experience in the language of anime, of drawing and watching. In the same way that Citizen Kane wasn't just speaking to the unheeled masses that swooned to phantasmagoria, historical romance, and vaudeville farce. Kill la Kill will live on because it's an experience that has something to share with everyone. It wasn't just made for anime fans, it was made for all of us. And like the experience it describes, it will live on.

http://myanimelist.net/anime/18679/Kill_la_Kill/reviews#LuMfBexw4LLmPDzD.99

I sense something in the way they're telling this story that I haven't sensed in any other anime. It feels like classic literature, only with an absurdly good understanding of the tropes of their medium and the art of animation.
The only related thing that's given me this feeling is Oyasumi Punpun.
 

Smertnik

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Apr 5, 2010
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Looks promising. Reminds me of Dead Leaves in some ways. I like the art style and the setting, the animation quality is passable for a Japanese TV series, too. The story is full of tropes but not in an obnoxious way (so far). I'll reserve my judgement until I've seen more episodes, though.
 

Scarim Coral

Jumped the ship
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Oct 29, 2010
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I kind of suprise how that anime is not done by Gainax at all and yes I know it is done by the same guys who did Gurren Lagaan and even then you can tell it's done by them (the whole zooming out of the school to the entire mountain and the fight scene).
Either way I will be watching the series.
 

Rip Van Rabbit

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Apr 17, 2012
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You are definitely not alone, I adore the energy and frantic spirit it gives off.

It's presented in a really beautiful art-style which pleasantly pays attention to detail (there's a lot of humorous blink-and-you-miss-it moments) with all the fluidity that keeps the pace going.

I appreciate how self-aware it is (See: Ryuko continuously blushing while trying to remain serious in her new...uniform. She looks like she haaaates how it...erm...looks) and I'm hoping that her quest leads her to gather more clothing as she gains power - in a nice twist.

I'm the kind of person that has a very low tolerance for fanservice for the sake of fanservice...but this show points it's finger and laughs at itself, which is something I can appreciate.

It has one hell of an opening episode and I'm intrigued to see them bury deeper into Ryuko, her personal story and keep up the style. It feels like there is much more than meets the eye. :)
 

Jonluw

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May 23, 2010
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RipVanTinkle said:
You are definitely not alone, I adore the energy and frantic spirit it gives off.

It's presented in a really beautiful art-style which pleasantly pays attention to detail (there's a lot of humorous blink-and-you-miss-it moments) with all the fluidity that keeps the pace going.

I appreciate how self-aware it is (See: Ryuko continuously blushing while trying to remain serious in her new...uniform. She looks like she haaaates how it...erm...looks) and I'm hoping that her quest leads her to gather more clothing as she gains power - in a nice twist.

I'm the kind of person that has a very low tolerance for fanservice for the sake of fanservice...but this show points it's finger and laughs at itself, which is something I can appreciate.

It has one hell of an opening episode and I'm intrigued to see them bury deeper into Ryuko, her personal story and keep up the style. It feels like there is much more than meets the eye. :)
This is exactly why I don't get why some people online complain about the fanservice in it.
Ryuko, like Yoko are characters poking fun at fanservice characters, and Trigger are doing it by pulling the concept to the extreme (as they do with all concepts) because they seem to like the concept itself, so long as it isn't abused.
This is the awesome part about trigger. They like a little fanservice, but they don't let it make their characters become one-dimensional fanservice-puppets. It's astounding how three-dimensional Trigger manages to make its characters while still poking its tongue at all of these anime tropes. (Personally, I found the idea of a gigantic academy city where the city is ruled in a shogun-like style by the Japanese high school model brilliant. It's a great premise.)
 

Loop Stricken

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Jun 17, 2009
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I dunno mans, the synopsis put me off a tad;

Fortunately, Ryuuko is aided by a talking sailor uniform who tells her, "Wear me. When I am worn by you, this power will become manifest."
 

Weaver

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Apr 28, 2008
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It's nice to know they've read 1984 in Japan at least (based on Satsuki's speech).

Though, it DOES play on a lot of really, really overdone tropes.
Why is Trigger so obsessed with academy settings? The whole mysterious new transfer student into an academy anime has been done no less than 500 times and I'm really tired of it.

That said, it's nice to see the artists allowed to just let it rip and do some really interesting stuff.

Though, the whole "rapey" scene with her uniform was a little bit much.

That said, I think PSG was more up my alley (let's be honest, it's effectively the same team here). But, I'm interested to see where it goes.
 

Rip Van Rabbit

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Apr 17, 2012
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Jonluw said:
RipVanTinkle said:
"Snip" for me, but I can't bear to "snip" you.
This is exactly why I don't get why some people online complain about the fanservice in it.

Ryuko, like Yoko are characters poking fun at fanservice characters, and Trigger are doing it by pulling the concept to the extreme (as they do with all concepts) because they seem to like the concept itself, so long as it isn't abused.
This is the awesome part about trigger. They like a little fanservice, but they don't let it make their characters become one-dimensional fanservice-puppets. It's astounding how three-dimensional Trigger manages to make its characters while still poking its tongue at all of these anime tropes. (Personally, I found the idea of a gigantic academy city where the city is ruled in a shogun-like style by the the Japanese high school model brilliant. It's a great premise.)
Couldn't agree with you more, although I literally discovered this today, but are people really throwing a hissy-fit over the fanservice in it? That seems silly, considering how it seems to be a literal joking point in the series, it doesn't feel like it exists for needless pandering. The episode was pretty much pointing out how ridiculous fanservice could be in that setting. But hey, maybe my interpretation is off.

Although I feel like I should hang a disclaimer and say that I'm not opposed to fanservice if it's justified or used for humorous purposes. Highschool of the Dead, for example, annoyed the heck out of me.

All in all, it could have been used for exploitative purposes, but they used the "reveal" of the uniform to establish that for all Ryuko's bravado and hot-blooded nature...she's not above getting embarrassed and feelings self-conscious.

I'd also like to point out the scene where Ryuko steals a bike from a delivery man. That was played for humour, but then it turns into a little touching moment where Ryuko actually returns the bike to the school with a note of apology stuck to it.

D'awww, as revenge-driven as she is, she's not above being a kind person as well.

Personal touches like those make Ryuko (among other characters) more three-dimensional to me. :)
 

Legion

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Oct 2, 2008
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Is there any place it can be watched legally? It sounds kind of interesting, but living in the UK getting hold of anime is something of a task in itself, unless you are happy to be 2+ years behind Japan.
 

Weaver

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Apr 28, 2008
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Legion said:
Is there any place it can be watched legally? It sounds kind of interesting, but living in the UK getting hold of anime is something of a task in itself, unless you are happy to be 2+ years behind Japan.
It's on Crunchyroll, but you have to pay for a subscription (or wait a week for 360p).
 

Jonluw

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May 23, 2010
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Weaver said:
It's nice to know they've read 1984 in Japan at least (based on Satsuki's speech).

Though, it DOES play on a lot of really, really overdone tropes.
Why is Trigger so obsessed with academy settings? The whole mysterious new transfer student into an academy anime has been done no less than 500 times and I'm really tired of it.
I really don't mind the premises being overdone at all. It seems, to me, completely intentional. They are taking the old settings, looking at them and saying "let's pull that to the absolute extreme". They are taking it to the point where details like the setting of the story is just commentary on anime tropes.

Like how Ryuko being the mysterious transfer student is overdone, yes, but the environments and the universe are being pulled into the telling of the story continuously, letting them shape the character into such a well-rounded and compelling protagonist. It makes the setting of being a transfer student merely a minor detail of her character.

That said, it's nice to see the artists allowed to just let it rip and do some really interesting stuff.

Though, the whole "rapey" scene with her uniform was a little bit much.
Yeah, that scene was a tad bit creepy, but nothing I can't forgive Trigger for.
 

Legion

Were it so easy
Oct 2, 2008
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Weaver said:
Legion said:
Is there any place it can be watched legally? It sounds kind of interesting, but living in the UK getting hold of anime is something of a task in itself, unless you are happy to be 2+ years behind Japan.
It's on Crunchyroll, but you have to pay for a subscription (or wait a week for 360p).
Hrrmm, I have a premium account on there until the end of the month (I forgot to cancel after my free trial), but I didn't see it on the UK version.

Having just double checked it doesn't seem to be on here yet. I see a news announcement so am hoping it will simply be slightly behind. Crunchyroll is godawful at posting updates properly. They probably won't show it on the website at all until the day it is uploaded.
 

Casual Shinji

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Jul 18, 2009
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It definately had its moments, but the whole mysterious transfer student angle, and the villianous gang each one more powerful then the other, is pretty much telegraphing beat by beat where this is going.

And the "crazy stacked upon crazy" anime never clicks with me. Unless there's a good amount of normalcy present as a counter balance, the crazy doesn't attribute much except be a bunch of nonsense all over the screen.
 

Kitsune Hunter

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Dec 18, 2011
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I saw it and loved it. From the look of Trigger's track record, they're quickly becoming my favourite animation company, although the cynic in me is telling me it won't be long before the hipsters come out of the wood work and accuse it of being "overrated", which seems to be happening a lot to new popular anime nowadays
 
Jun 11, 2008
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Far too early to tell anything other than it looks good. So not much really to say other than it has set itself up great and hopefully won't fuck up.
 

Loop Stricken

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Jun 17, 2009
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*Watches episode

Yeah, that was alright I guess. The costume looks stupid but eh, whatchagonnado?
 

Username Redacted

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Jonluw said:
May we talk about it?
Sure, why not.
Am I the only one who is completely blown away by this?
You are probably not alone but I am not joining you in the blown away camp.
I can't wait to see where the story will be going as well. Considering these folks made Gurren Lagann, my hopes are high.
I actually heard of 'Kill la Kill' a while ago and it seemed interesting. More recently (but obviously before it aired) I found out it was by the same folks who made Gurren Lagann. For me, as someone who is in the minority(?) of not liking Gurren Lagann, this was a strike against it and the first episode was more or less what I expected. Right now it looks like Wikipedia and TVDB can't/don't agree on how many episodes it's going to run for but if it's more than 12 I'm probably not going to stick with it. Just not my thing (plus my anime backlog is growing unwieldy).