KotOR: II

[WillSimplyBe]

Hiya I saw this debate come up in another thread just recently, but it wasn't really the place for the whole discussion to take place, so I wanted to make a thread here and see what people really thought of Star Wars, Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords.

I personally liked KotOR2 a bit more than KoTOR, because the storyline seemed a lot deeper and darker, and the characters were more rounded compared to the more cardboard cutout feeling I got from KotOR... Sure the ending wasn't as good, but pulling out that whole "Surprise! you WERE the bad guy!"(I'm not going spoiler tag it... The game came out years ago.) thing could only shock people once, so something similar would just be stupid in number 2... I enjoyed II better up until the very end, where it sort of unravels, but I still look at it as 9 parts great, 1 part suck.

I remember the personalities of the characters from number 2 much better, and found the characters more endearing. I mean, who can honestly say they never once thought of ditching Mission and her wookie?(Hmm... I know I must be spelling that wrong, but I really dont want to look it up right now, also, I didnt like II's wookie any better, and I would prefer Vao's fluffball if I had to choose.)

Okay, so what do my fellow escapists think? Is KotOR 2 just a wretched abortion? Is it a game with potential that could have been even better than it was? Was it a good game when not looking at it behind the shadow of its older sibling?

Let me just saythat this thread isnt "Which is better? KotOR or KotOR2?" I just am wondering what you feel about the Sequel to a very great game.

Also, Visas Marr <3 for the win.

 

[issacization]

KoTOR 2 was good but KoTOR imo was so much better, it had the best plot twist of all time.

 

[are.you.the.god.its.me.vader]

I like it, lots of good stuff, and ill agree with you...

Visas Marr <3

 

[Bigeyez]

Most of the hate for KOTOR II comes from the fact that it was rushed. The games ending is the perfect evidence of that fact. The enormous amount of bugs it has also show that. The game had huge potential and in many aspects, at least in my mind, it was better then KOTOR I. The game being rushed out practically incomplete and a bugg ridden mess however stops it from being that great.

 

[Sev72]

I really enjoyed both for different reasons, so I have to say that they were both excellent games. Kind of a general answer I know, but I loved both.

 

[Irridium]

I do believe the first one was better, but the second was also pretty damn good.

Krea is possably the best character in the series.

If only your conversations with her went somewhere, it would have been so much better. Plus with how you can influence your followers and turn most of them into jedi or sith, it was a great game.

It also had a better menu system I thought.

That and I liked the look of the jedi robes and clothes/armors more than the first, but I'm probably the only person who notices and likes that so whatever...

 

[ZeroMachine]

I had too many game-ruining bugs and glitches to enjoy the game. I once set a girl free, then Kreia and the apprentice (I think) started accusing me of murder and psychotic acts. Then, after that, it said I lost influence with the handmaiden.

Who was impossible to have on my team since she doesn't join you if you're a chick. *sigh*

It's a real shame, too, the game has sooooooooooooooo much potential, but it all gets squashed under the rush to release the game. I can't wait until Team Gizka finally finishes refurbishing it.

 

[Ren3004]

I wasn't disappointes by Kotor II, especially because it was the first one I played.When I did play the first game I thought that the story was much better (even though I already knew about the plot twist)and the gameplay didn't evolve much in the 2nd game.

The 2nd game also has some better characters (Visas). The problem with the game is that it feels badly unfinished. There's two gameplay sequences near the end that don't get resolved, and we reach the ending wondering what happened to those characters.

They did improve a bit in terms of annoying levels, reducing the 'moving slowly in a wierd suit' part to a small walk, instead of an entire level.

And BTW... I'm eagerly awaiting for Kotor III.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

You're right, KOTOR II had a lot of good stuff going for it, but that ending was just crap. I loved that feater where you could equip 2 sets of weapons and switch btwn them with the press of a button, that was great!

 

[Jedoro]

KOTOR I had a better story, but II did have better characters.

Dammit, I just realized someone still has my copy of I.

 

[UsefulPlayer 1]

Ahh!!! Spoiler!

I wish you would at least put "(I'm not going spoiler tag it... The game came out years ago.)" before the spoiler.

I came here to figure out whether I should get Kotor one or two and got an unpleasant surprise.

But maybe now I should just get two since I already now know what happens in one. : /

 

[Normalguyinthehouse]

I liked the fact that in the second game you weren't really that incredibly special just kinda like a coincidence or something. I'm still hoping that Team Gizka will finish the restoration.

 

[Kilo24]

I agree with most of your comments, though I might shift it to 4 parts great, 1 part suck. Quite a bit of it was unpolished, especially the ending. They had to cut a good amount out for the release date, cut you off from your party members, put a load of cookie cutter Sith enemies in the final level, and more.
The majority of the characters were interesting (Mira and Bao-Dur less so) and the influence system to get them to talk to you more was excellent. It was better than the KotoR companions' time-release bit of backstory with little bearing on the current storyline (Carth somewhat excepted, but still far away from KotoR 2's best.)
The NPCs, especially Kreia, are enough to make me really like the game.

 

[WillSimplyBe]

If only your conversations with her went somewhere, it would have been so much better. Plus with how you can influence your followers and turn most of them into jedi or sith, it was a great game.



That and I liked the look of the jedi robes and clothes/armors more than the first, but I'm probably the only person who notices and likes that so whatever...

Oh yeah! I totally forgot to talk about the whole "Sphere of Influence" system in the second one, that was great, and it even altered the character's actual looks. It was amazing what that influence system did for certain characters, like Rand, Mira, or Visas Marr <3 and how much it affected things.

Also number 2 just made Canderous Ordo more badass by becoming the Mandalore! He became the most badass thing since Urdnot Wrex (and vice versa)

And I agree with you, the robes were nicer in Number 2, and you didn't feel like you were wasting your time wearing them because they made them so much better.

 

[WillSimplyBe]

Ahh!!! Spoiler!

I wish you would at least put "(I'm not going spoiler tag it... The game came out years ago.)" before the spoiler.

I came here to figure out whether I should get Kotor one or two and got an unpleasant surprise.

But maybe now I should just get two since I already now know what happens in one. : /

NUUU! Im sorry, lol. T_T

But I do commend you for going this long without playing a game you wanted to get and staying clueless as to one of the biggest plot twists ever, so big you could say "Pulling a KoTOR"

I hope a cookie will make up for it. *Gives UsefulPlayer1 a cookie*

 

[Avatar Roku]

I loved KotOR II, but the ending just killed it, and the fact that they kept building up towards content that was cut (HK Factory, Droid Planet) really annoyed me. That said, the rest of the game was amazing. Characters were less standard and much deeper, especially Kreia, who is honestly the only cryptic-as-hell character I've seen pulled off well (it's funny how they tried to copy her with Theresa in Fable II but failed, which is a shame because she was interesting in Fable I). The thing I really loved, though, was how it tried to champion Gray Morality.

 

[zirnitra]

I loved it. although it was a difficult decision though picking good or evil you could ether go evil and get those few brilliant feel good moments in dialogue(like using mind tricks to make the two muggers on Nar Shaddaa to make one of them throw themselves off the side of the street to plummet miles to their death, while the other clenches his head screaming that you "'get out of my mind'" but then your stuck with a shitty ending.

 

[Woodsey]

You really shouldn't of started me off on this one

The second suffered from a rushed development, WORSE characters, a story that felt disconnected and poorly explained. The story when you look at it is very good - you're the last of the Jedi (except your bloody not which sort of annoyed me), you've been screwed over by the council and you're an outcast.

The graphics were in fact worse in my opinion (especially the FMVs) - the textures on many items were very poor and anything that did match up to the original certainly weren't better (with a few exceptions).

The characters were dull compared to the first game - Canderous (aka Mandalore) is stupidly underplayed and yet you spend quite a time doing missions for him, HK-47 loses much of his charm. T3-M4 (the character who was debatably the most vital to the overall plot) was barely used and not used well; the Handmaiden was no Bastila and Visas Marr was no Handmaiden. Atton Rand was a decent character and he admittedly had an interesting back story and view on the Jedi/Sith. Kreia, whilst an interesting character, is too cryptic to gather plot points between the 2 games without looking it up. The Wookie (I forget the name) was no Zaalbar and Mira (the bounty hunter) was supposed to be a hard nut rogue, but couldn't match the charm of Mission Vao (who was a bit annoying I admit). The influence system felt tacked on also, and was unneeded since it was already in place in KotOR, and they didn't give you pop ups to tell you, so it left the relationships feel more natural.

Then there was the planet recycling, which was simply dull - it worked Ok for Dantooine, but Korriban didn't need to be used again and was a stupidly small part of the game considering it was a fifth of the main objective.

Darth Sion was a good enemy but in some ways a bit too familiar to Malak. Nihilus (whilst the whole concept of him wiping out the entire populace of a planet to live is cool) was not explained - you know next to nothing of him, who he was before or his motives other than the fact that he's hungry basically.

They should of ditched one/two bad guys, and made the focus either on Kreia and learning about Revan, or Nihilus and then finding about Revan. More doesn't always equal better.

What I did like about the game was the way they presented the galaxy - it did feel like it was ravaged and beaten down by a war.

The second game simply couldn't match moments in the first either. The first time you get a lightsaber in the first, it's great, you feel like you've been awarded it. In the second, it's an overblown and frankly annoying objective to collect the right parts - the game then ridiculously lets you find lightsabers everywhere. I understand you've got to have some spares, but there's making them scarce and then there's contradiction. I've just spent hours scavenging on a planet as if the parts are impossible to find and only for the elite, and yet I've just found 3 in one bloody room.

Then of course the big reveal, which was delivered perfectly. It wasn't made stupidly obvious either (like revealing you were a sith in a cutscene, i.e. what they did with Kreia)but with subtle hints so some might guess but many didn't have a clue (I've read plenty of comments from people who didn't guess it and I sure as shit didn't).

I enjoyed the second, but it really wasn't a patch on the first in any way. And for people who inevitably say that it had more force powers/feats - that doesn't suddenly make a game better.

EDIT: WOW - I apologise I seriously didn't know I'd written so much. I'd also like to say that I did enjoy the second game, I just REALLY REALLY LOVED the first game. The main problem was Lucas Arts, who pushed Obsidian for an early release so they couldn't release the game in a finished and polished state.