Left handed....

[Fappy]

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Not on about controls. Didnt mention them once except my second post about the fact that the DS is a pain in the ass if you need the D-pad and the pen. I have no problem gaming right handed. I cant honestly see the difference. It makes none to me. What I was talking about was the fact that all these characters that are supposed to be me not being left handed. I reiterate. On some games I can see why you wouldnt. Like KOTOR, that had scripted fight interactions even though its was "real time" and as a result youd have basically had to reanimate all the player fight animations again as well as a whole series of new animations for enemies, but on games like Skyrim all it would have taken was the ability to equip a shield in the other hand and shot a bow the other hand. Any game where there are no scripted interactions just require a flip of existing animations (most mmo's for example).

Also, I physically cant cut with some right handed scissors, the angle of cut is just.....Wrong.

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As I say its the sort of thing I will just suddenly notice. It doesn't matter on most games but in a game like Skyrim for example it does really bug me.

Just use hand-to-hand combat. No one will ever be able to guess what hand you favor

Speak for yourself, idk about you but I flip my entire stance compared to most when I fight
Its caught more than one person off guard.

I haven't done any kind of formal martial arts since I was 10 years old so I never even considered fighting stances relating to left-handedness. Well, I think you'd be okay in Oblivion since the fighting stance is so poorly animated you can hardly tell anyway lol

 

[Stalydan]

I hate when there's no left-handed option, but not in the way you mean. I hate when there's no left-handed option in a DS game that needs it. A couple of games I just couldn't play because I'm left-handed.

Really? I'm left handed and I'm not limited to the games that are available to play. Being left handed doesn't seem to effect me in gaming.
You know what's weird? I play Guitar Hero like a right hander as my left hand is moving the fret board. I find it easier to press the buttons that way.

This.

DS games that are right handed only prevent me from playing them because I can't hold anything pencil or pencil shaped with my right hand*. However, I have never had any problem with gaming any other way, Wii or M+K or with the swords and shields on opposite sides of the screen. I don't really see how it's a big problem?

*This might also be a very big reason why I have little interest in the 3DS. If a game comes out that requires you to use the analog stick and touch screen, I couldn't possibly play it.

Kid Icarus - Uprising... my enemy. As a left handed person (and coincidentally being friends with a rather large number of left handed people ), I have been unfortunate enough to try and play that game at a 3DS Demo show >_< I find it the hardest game to play ever because, unlike the DS, the game relies on the fact that you're either right-handed or ambidextrous so you can use the thumbstick and touchscreen with little effort.

 

[Stalydan]

Yeah, I do find it strange that most RPGs don't have left-handed playable characters. It would be a good option, don't know if it is that necessary though.
What does come to mind is Resident Evil 5 (Sheva is left-handed so I guess that is good for left-handed people).
The World Ends With You was great for left handed people too because the ABXY did the same thing as arrows during combat.

Ahhhh TWEWY... that game handled like a dream for me. It was the perfect way to adapt a touchscreen based game for anyone to be able to play with ease.

 

[Daget Sparrow]

Not on about controls. Didnt mention them once except my second post about the fact that the DS is a pain in the ass if you need the D-pad and the pen. I have no problem gaming right handed. I cant honestly see the difference. It makes none to me. What I was talking about was the fact that all these characters that are supposed to be me not being left handed. I reiterate. On some games I can see why you wouldnt. Like KOTOR, that had scripted fight interactions even though its was "real time" and as a result youd have basically had to reanimate all the player fight animations again as well as a whole series of new animations for enemies, but on games like Skyrim all it would have taken was the ability to equip a shield in the other hand and shot a bow the other hand. Any game where there are no scripted interactions just require a flip of existing animations (most mmo's for example).

Ah, my apologies. Well in that case, I assume it's simply because most of the world's population is right handed, so it's easier to create a character model that the majority of people can relate to. I guess...Gears of War again? The character models are apparently ambidextrous and swap hands over depending on what direction they're facing in cover. A very, very small step, but...uh...

...

 

[ejb626]

Hell, yes, Southpaw here. Getting sick of the oppression heaped upon us by our right-handed overlords. I really don't know why developers don't give left-handed options in games and I don't just mean RPGs, I mean all you have to do is flip the right-handed model. Who cares if he's holding a right-handed gun left-handed or something, plenty of games have just that, but flipped (left-handed guns being held right-handed). Also I'm not even a Zelda fan and Link's change of handedness annoys me, mostly because he was like the only famous left-handed video game character, and now he's right-handed! Freaking right-handed game developers!

 

[Talshere]

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Even in something simple like karate, the base martial art, simply standing with your left foot forward rather than your right foot changes how people need to attack you in order to actually hurt you. Suddenly their usually power kick is the one they are trying to aim through you defences at the front rather than at your back, while their quick kick hits your back and doesn't really do anything. This affects the left hander as well obviously but when that is your fighting norm you kinda just forget about it (Though watching a lefty suddenly realise they are against another lefty can be entertaining). Also this stops being a problem in the higher belts because they can use either stance regardless of their default.

 

[Fappy]

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Even in something simple like karate, the base martial art, simply standing with your left foot forward rather than your right foot changes how people need to attack you in order to actually hurt you. Suddenly their usually power kick is the one they are trying to aim through you defences at the front rather than at your back, while their quick kick hits your back and doesn't really do anything. This affects the left hander as well obviously but when that is your fighting norm you kinda just forget about it (Though watching a lefty suddenly realise they are against another lefty can be entertaining). Also this stops being a problem in the higher belts because they can use either stance regardless of their default.

Huh, that's pretty neat. I never really considered how your stance can have such a big impact. Makes perfect sense though.

 

[Talshere]

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Now imagine a 100% grapple based martial art like judo. How your opponent attacks you is EVERYTHING.

 

[Fappy]

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Now imagine a 100% grapple based martial art like judo. How your opponent attacks you is EVERYTHING.

I do know this for I have read many a silver age Captain America comic! Haha! What do I know of judo? Balance is important! That's about all I know >.>

 

[Pandabearparade]

It's too much work for too little return, as it would require all of the main character animations to be redone.

Human bodies are symmetrical, couldn't you just copy/paste/reverse the animation from one arm to the other?

 

[Talshere]

Well, not an RPG, but I noticed that in Warcraft 3, nearly all the units are left-handed.

I'm right-handed myself so I guess I probably shouldn't be here.
*Backs out of thread*

About half I think.

 

[simple64]

The whole point of these games is the immersion and people playing these games "are" the character.

If you need to be left handed to be "immersed," you're doing it wrong.

I'm beginning to think "immersive" means "as unimaginative as possible." I guess that's why people confuse "immersion" and "realism."

How little do you need in order to become immersed? How much do you need to imagine in order to become immersed?

I don't mind characters in games being left handed. I do mind games that focus on handiness...without the left handed option. I'm looking at you, Wii. Too many times do I see players saying some crap like "no other controller has a different control scheme, why would the Wii?". Becuase, hypothetical numbnuts, no other controller has MOTION CONTROL, making it vastly different by default. It's irritating that Nintendo wouldn't prepare for something so obvious. Somy or Microsoft doesn't have these issues, since they are static, unchanging controllers (with more control options, might I add), and even the Move & Kinect are optional. The Wii's sole control is motion, I have no other option, and they took the lazy way out.

 

[Talshere]

It's too much work for too little return, as it would require all of the main character animations to be redone.

Human bodies are symmetrical, couldn't you just copy/paste/reverse the animal from one arm to the other?

Consider KOTOR where the combat interactions were scripted, in that instance you would need to flip your player animations then literally produce double the quantity of combat interaction animations. It actually becomes quad if you make henchmen left and right handed. Right-Right, Left-Left, Left-Right and Right-Left.

In some circumstances that is a perfectly valid argument I think

 

[Talshere]

The whole point of these games is the immersion and people playing these games "are" the character.

If you need to be left handed to be "immersed," you're doing it wrong.

I'm beginning to think "immersive" means "as unimaginative as possible." I guess that's why people confuse "immersion" and "realism."

How little do you need in order to become immersed? How much do you need to imagine in order to become immersed?

I don't mind characters in games being left handed. I do mind games that focus on handiness...without the left handed option. I'm looking at you, Wii. Too many times do I see players saying some crap like "no other controller has a different control scheme, why would the Wii?". Becuase, hypothetical numbnuts, no other controller has MOTION CONTROL, making it vastly different by default. It's irritating that Nintendo wouldn't prepare for something so obvious. Somy or Microsoft doesn't have these issues, since they are static, unchanging controllers (with more control options, might I add), and even the Move & Kinect are optional. The Wii's sole control is motion, I have no other option, and they took the lazy way out.

Its the little things. As I said in the post one up from this, I can see that sometimes its a valid point having uni handed animations. For conversations gestures are largely ambiguous and vary largely depending on where in relation to you the person is your talking to/about so probably wouldn't need to be changed. Shacking hands is always done right handed due to convention so that doesn't need to change, even accepting an item would largely depend on how it was handed to you. If its handed to you on you right you'll take it with your right unless its an object that is exclusively used in your other hand such as a weapon, a sword for example where you might reach across yourself to take it..."might".

This basically just leaves player character animations and in most games does boil largely down to how you hold a weapon and where you would wear it (Though in organised army's all equipment is standardised so everyone can use it, you HAVE to use them right handed, though from some small experience my accuracy goes up 10 fold if I shoot left-handed). Unless they have you doing something weird like playing an instrument virtually every other movement is ambiguous. I suppose if I were climbing a ladder I would probably lead with my right foot (you strong foot is usually the opposite to your strong hand) but even thinking about it now its not something I could say for sure so I'm fairly sure you could just ignore that.

 

[spartan231490]

Doesn't make sense to me either. Especially a game like Skyrim, why can't you just select to put the shield in your right hand?? You already can hold a sword/whatever in the left hand. It's such a small thing to change.

I think they wanted to avoid people using 2 shields. But it would seem that left handed would be pretty easy. Not that I know anything about coding. It probably has to due with the fact that only 4% of people are left-handed. It's just not a big enough user base to care about over other things. Still a little irritating.

 

[bindelt]

Im also left-handed. lol

 

[Something Amyss]

No I meant immersion,

Then you're doing it wrong, as I said.

anything which I suddenly notice which breaks, I look at something thinking "im boss" then something happens and I suddenly notice thats not how I would do it. A really easy example of something small that I notice. On SWTOR when you hit 14 you get a buff to move at 35% increased speed. If your sabre is out you do a classic samurai style run with sword behind you in your RIGHT hand which holding your left hand forward. Its all the little things. Dont even tell me thats smal and petty, it no different than wanting a run animation to be a realistic as possible. There was nothing "wrong" with ridged movements from a technical standpoint.

Well hell, I've got news for you. They ALWAYS train samurai to work the blade right handed, so your immersion should already be ruined. It's sooooo unrealistic! I mean, your immersion may not be broken, but now mine is (as a practitioner)!

Geez.

Seriously, if you're noticing nitpicky little things about your self-insert fantasy, your immersion was already broken.

It really would be nice if people would stop using "it breaks my immersion" as a crutch. You want left-handed options. That's fine. You want left-handed options because you want a self-insert in your escapist fantasy. That's also fine. But it breaks your immersion? No. No it doesn't. If your character needs to be left-handed for you to be "immersed," you're not actually talking immersion.

I tried learning a few instruments when I was young but invariably gave up because noone would teach me to do it left handed because it was "wrong" (My god music is very medieval in some ways, count the number of left handed people in any orchestra, statistically there should be 10-15, youd never tell)

Making lefty instruments used to be rather expensive. Given the price of left-handed guitars these days, I'd imagine this has changed for all instruments, but there's a solid reason that you're getting taught right-handed for instruments.

As it is I now play guitar hero right handed just because its awkward to hold left handed but naturally I still pick up any instrument left handed. Ive decided when I've left uni and have money I will learn violin even if I have to go to the end of the earth to find someone who will teach me left handed -.-

I injured my left shoulder and for two years picking up an instrument left handed sent pain up my shoulder and neck into my skull. It's not a recommended way of changing the habit, though.

Kinda wish there were lefty pianos, though that would be incredibly expensive. Also, I still get tingling and numbness down the left side of my left hand from the shoulder injury, so it might not work in the long run. But it'd be more comfortable for me.

Guitar Hero's "Lefty Flip" always struck me as horrible because most of the models aren't actually strapped for it. It's inconvenient and uncomfortable. I don't mind the controls being in different locations and such, but I do mind my fake guitar trying to "correct" itself. But since I already play geetar righty, it seemed like I should just continue the trend anyway.

Though I do AIR GUITAR left-handed. Been doing that since before I picked up an ax though.

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Now imagine a 100% grapple based martial art like judo. How your opponent attacks you is EVERYTHING.

I've never actually taken Judo, but I'm pretty sure they teach everyone right-handed. That doesn't mean quite the dynamic shift you seem to expect from a left-handed opponent. I'm an Aiki Jujutsu practitioner and they do teach everyone right handed, at least in a traditional dojo.

Believe it or not, the moves are remarkably similar no matter which hand you're grabbed by.

Sure, it affects whether you step to the outside or inside, but you're really not thinking "Oh dear, I need to place my left hand here and take his right hand...."

I may not be the best practitioner in the world, or even close, but handedness has nothing to do with whether or not you hit me. Just your speed, my reaction time, and how much experience I have with the situation. Technically, how much experience you've had, too, but the point remains.

Regardless, this kind of matters little in video games that rarely take into account actual human physiology.

How little do you need in order to become immersed? How much do you need to imagine in order to become immersed?

Well, by the definitions tossed around here, I am NEVER immersed.

I mean, if we're using any sort of practical definition, "immersion" would be the point at which you start to miss these exact qualities people are complaining about. But "immersion" is being dropped like crazy because it's a buzzword. It's like "edgy" or "innovation."

Really, in terms of actual immersion, you shouldn't be paying attention to which hand someone uses. In that, it takes little imagination for me to be immersed. And I maintain a lot of people lack even that.

But honestly, before "immersion" became a buzzword last year, did we have large bodies of people complaining about lefty Link? "Omg, this breaks the flow of the game, I can't play a left-handed character!" I don't think most people cared, honestly. This generation, it's now an "immersion breaker" all of a sudden.

I do mind games that focus on handiness...without the left handed option. I'm looking at you, Wii.

Now this I agree with.

 

[Talshere]

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If you wouldn't call it immersion what would you call it? Its something that all of a suggen Ill just notice and this "oww " now a big thing, certainly not enough to ruin a game. But its one of those things that ever since I started gaming 18 or 19 or so years ago kinda bugged me.

While we are taught various techniques "right handed" because that is what the master is, the truth of it is that when I actually spar or just practice I flip them to sart with just because it feels more natural. Ive never done a weapon based martial art but I know now that learning right handed would be annoying as hell. Im all for tradition but the ease of learning left handed greatly outweighs the pointless tradition of only right handed. At least in the army where having left handed guns means only you can use them makes sense. A sword is bi-handed. The blade doesn't have a camber, as it were.

Yeah, the thing about the straps is exactly what I mean Also I wouldn't be buying a right handed violin to play left handed, Id get a left-handed one. Again, the tradition of right handedness is pointless now. For whatever reason it did exist in the first place (which I suspect is nothing to do with cost and more to do with the fact you used to be caned for being left handed).

 

[HigherTomorrow]

Really? I'm left handed and I'm not limited to the games that are available to play. Being left handed doesn't seem to effect me in gaming.
You know what's weird? I play Guitar Hero like a right hander as my left hand is moving the fret board. I find it easier to press the buttons that way.

Same here, I play both Guitar Hero and real guitar righty even though I'm lefty. But that's because there were no teachers I could find that could teach me to play left-handed.