Let's talk about achievements!

[mjc0961]

They don't enhance your experience in the least bit

They do if the achievement lists are done properly instead of being uninspired drivel like one for each level completion.

Besides, getting 100% in a game that doesn't have achievements is just as "useless" as getting 100% in a game that does have achievements. Last time I checked, I got just as much reward for getting all the power stars in Super Mario Galaxy 2 or 100% in Kirby's Epic Yarn as I did for getting 1,000/1,000 in Mass Effect or the Platinum Trophy in Red Dead Redemption: Not a god damn thing aside from personal satisfaction. So I don't see any good reason to make achievements out as the devil.

EDIT: I would show you a checklist from my trophy card, but apperently I can't do that now at PS3trophies.org anymore. lame.

You never could. Best you can do is this: http://www.ps3trophies.org/profile/3100/ (and to find it, you have to find one of your forum posts and get the link from that, unless you already know what # your member ID is)

But if you click any of the games, you get YOUR progress (or just the normal list), not my progress.

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

Obsessive Compulsive Disorder.. Perfectionism.. Call it what you will, it's like that for me. I like having things completed 100%.

You know, I'm ok with that to an extent... I've got all but, like, 2 achievements in Portal 2, and intend to get them sometime, but I got them easily the first time I played the game. If I want to get the last 2, I just have to play through the game again. Also, my main point for starting this thread was to kind of rant about the fact that games have so many achievements that require you to do a lot of stuff that is mostly irrelevant to the rest of the game. I just would like to see a game where you had extra little things you could do in games that didn't force you to play the game long after you finished the actual game.

 

[suitepee7]

Getting them only lets you brag to your friends that you wasted your life on a few video games. They don't enhance your experience in the least bit and keep you sitting there on you ass playing the same game over and over until you can say "Well, I've finished this game completely and there is finally nothing left for me to do."


So what do you, the escapist community, think could be done to satisfy the achievement hoarders without wasting their lives with one game.

1 - so, because you have a different opinion, means that they are wasting their life on video games? thats retarded, considering you only see it as wasting your life because they aren't playing other games. just sounds like you're pissed that they're playing a different game to you.

2 - i don't see why being able to say "Well, I've finished this game completely and there is finally nothing left for me to do." is a bad thing. it is the best way to guarantee that you have got everything you can out of the game (and therefore value for money), and if you enjoy the process, why is it a problem?

3 - 'They don't enhance your experience in the least bit' purely subjective. i would not have tried some things in certain games without achievements. take the no skillshot bulletstorm achievement, i spent a while doing it, and it meant i had to play the game in a very different way, and i enjoyed it.

so, as part of the escapist community, i say nothing should be done. if you don't like achievements, then don't pay attention to them. however if others enjoy them, why should you strive to take it away from them. makes you sound like a complete asshole who thinks people should only enjoy what you do.

tl;dr do nothing, they won't go away, and some of us like them

 

[WorldFree55]

I'm probably in the miniority but i like achievements. To me, their a sense of accomplishment. I like that for example in La Noire i found all 50 of the golden films and got the achievement for it. But what's complicated (well for me anyway) is that i could care less if i kept it. It would be nice but actually reaching to that goal of whatever goal that maybe (in this case achievements), and the journey to it is pretty sweet.

Just my 2 cents on it.

 

[Swifty714]

I"m not gonna lie, i love achievement hunting. the reason for achievements is basically their name. Their a hallmark to something you have achieved. Whether it be 'Beat Torch&corkscrew on expert' or 'Kill 100000 enemies. Not all achievements are all that great , but they still convey a sensation of accomplishment. And lets face it, after playing for three hours on an airport landing strip, trying to barrel row three times in a row and finally getting the achievement doesn't satisfy you, maybe you should find a new hobby.

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

They don't enhance your experience in the least bit

They do if the achievement lists are done properly instead of being uninspired drivel like one for each level completion.

Besides, getting 100% in a game that doesn't have achievements is just as "useless" as getting 100% in a game that does have achievements. Last time I checked, I got just as much reward for getting all the power stars in Super Mario Galaxy 2 or 100% in Kirby's Epic Yarn as I did for getting 1,000/1,000 in Mass Effect or the Platinum Trophy in Red Dead Redemption: Not a god damn thing aside from personal satisfaction. So I don't see any good reason to make achievements out as the devil.

Well, I have no idea how Mario games are these days, as the most recent mario I've played was the first few hours of Mario Galaxy 1, but if you look back at 64 and, I think even Sunshine, there were special endings for finishing the game with 100% completion, and it didn't require you doing the exact same thing over and over again. Mario 64, you got 120 power stars by doing each of the unique(mostly) missions and exploring the castle, and as a reward, you got a slightly different ending... I forget what Sunshine did but I think it was somewhere along the same lines. This, I'm ok with. When you get rewarded with something other than just a higher number next to your profile.

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

1 - so, because you have a different opinion, means that they are wasting their life on video games? thats retarded, considering you only see it as wasting your life because they aren't playing other games. just sounds like you're pissed that they're playing a different game to you.

2 - i don't see why being able to say "Well, I've finished this game completely and there is finally nothing left for me to do." is a bad thing. it is the best way to guarantee that you have got everything you can out of the game (and therefore value for money), and if you enjoy the process, why is it a problem?

3 - 'They don't enhance your experience in the least bit' purely subjective. i would not have tried some things in certain games without achievements. take the no skillshot bulletstorm achievement, i spent a while doing it, and it meant i had to play the game in a very different way, and i enjoyed it.

so, as part of the escapist community, i say nothing should be done. if you don't like achievements, then don't pay attention to them. however if others enjoy them, why should you strive to take it away from them. makes you sound like a complete asshole who thinks people should only enjoy what you do.

tl;dr do nothing, they won't go away, and some of us like them

I really think the majority of you people are misunderstanding me. I'm not really saying "Bah, I hate achievements and anyone who likes them can go to hell!" I'm just saying that I think achievements aren't done well, and are simply a minor part of a game. People who play sports might have a room where they keep trophies, and people who come visit can see these trophies and say "Hey, that's pretty cool." but it's one little room in the whole house, but I just think games try too hard to make that little room what keeps people playing. Continuing to play a game should be about more than getting points and a shiny medal. This is all my opinion, and as I can see, there are plenty who disagree with me.

 

[mjc0961]

Well, I have no idea how Mario games are these days, as the most recent mario I've played was the first few hours of Mario Galaxy 1, but if you look back at 64 and, I think even Sunshine, there were special endings for finishing the game with 100% completion, and it didn't require you doing the exact same thing over and over again. Mario 64, you got 120 power stars by doing each of the unique(mostly) missions and exploring the castle, and as a reward, you got a slightly different ending... I forget what Sunshine did but I think it was somewhere along the same lines. This, I'm ok with. When you get rewarded with something other than just a higher number next to your profile.

Mario 64 is a really poor example. The "special ending" is only about a few extra seconds. It's nowhere near special enough to be considered some awesome reward for completing the game whereas achievements are shit as you seem to think. Honestly, it seems like you're really grasping at straws, trying to backpedal out of this now that you see there's no difference in getting 100% with or without achievements most of the time.

I really think the majority of you people are misunderstanding me. I'm not really saying "Bah, I hate achievements and anyone who likes them can go to hell!" I'm just saying that I think achievements aren't done well, and are simply a minor part of a game.

If we're "misunderstanding" you, it's because you're failing to communicate properly. What you said in that post is far different from what you said in the OP:

Getting them only lets you brag to your friends that you wasted your life on a few video games. They don't enhance your experience in the least bit and keep you sitting there on you ass playing the same game over and over until you can say "Well, I've finished this game completely and there is finally nothing left for me to do."

That is clearly not saying you think they aren't done well, that is you saying that achievements are worthless and anyone who gets them is wasting their life, which isn't really that far off from "I hate achievements and anyone who likes them can go to hell!" as you put it.

 

[lobster1077]

Eh... Maybe I am being a bit too hard, it just seems frustrating to be dealing with someone who completely ignores so many games just so the achievement page is completely cleared.

Look into the first Crackdown. It's the only game I've played where the achievements weren't generic or arbitrary and actually added an injection of fun into the game. The achievements in it are actually really fun to get ie. They mainly consist of throwing cars and skips at people.

 

[FallenRainbows]

My 61000+ GS speaks for itself. I will play a over again for the sake of achievements for one reason, that it's fun. If I don't want to root for collectables on Crysis II I wont, but damn you I will play Supersoldier first run though and have it done in about... ~9 hours (yes that'd what I just did).

Achievements are whored because doing so is fun, games may be art, but they are fun first. Painting may be art, but it is beauty first.

People who hate on them need something better to do, they are not mandatory to progress, ignore them. They add an edge to some, let us be.

 

[6_Qubed]

Here's what I hate about achievements;

Online/multiplayer achievements, which I group together because they've become almost synonymous nowadays. I have an XBox 360. I don't have XBox live. I also don't have any friends, offline friends, anyway. So I have several games for which I will never get all the achievements, achievements that I could very well get by just opening up the multiplayer maps and jumping around for a few minutes on my own with the second controller plugged in.

On a lesser note, racing achievements. You know, "get from point A to point B within this psychotically short time limit"? Now, I love Prototype. I love spending a good half-hour just running and jumping around without eating one person. I hate the racing minigames. It's kind of like how something is fun until you have to do it.

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

[quote="mjc0961" post="9.289984.11500422"Mario 64 is a really poor example. The "special ending" is only about a few extra seconds. It's nowhere near special enough to be considered some awesome reward for completing the game whereas achievements are shit as you seem to think. Honestly, it seems like you're really grasping at straws, trying to backpedal out of this now that you see there's no difference in getting 100% with or without achievements most of the time.

If we're "misunderstanding" you, it's because you're failing to communicate properly. What you said in that post is far different from what you said in the OP:

That is clearly not saying you think they aren't done well, that is you saying that achievements are worthless and anyone who gets them is wasting their life, which isn't really that far off from "I hate achievements and anyone who likes them can go to hell!" as you put it.[/quote]

Yes, Mario 64 is a poor example, but you cited Mario, so I went back to a Mario game I remember well.

I know, I don't always say exactly what I think and feel originally. Usually during my first post I haven't thought everything through to fully understand why I feel the way I do, and as time progresses, I begin to say what I really think. I don't think achievements are worthless and anyone who gets them is wasting their life. I just think that achievements should be more than just a higher gamer score. I like it when the big awesome actions I do have some effect on the world, or enrich my game experience some way. Sure, some of them do. Some achievements you get for learning how to pull off something amazing or mastering an aspect of a game.

You know what it all really boils down to for me? I just don't like seeing people only playing one game and ignoring the whole wide world of games out there. It reminds me of the people I met during my WoW days who WoW was the only game they had ever played. Sure, I played WoW to the point that I barely even ate because I couldn't tear myself away, but I still made time for other amazing games, or long awaited sequels, because I just can't see ignoring all of the other amazing stuff out there. To me it's like drinking a never ending bottle of water. Sure, it goes on forever, but eventually it gets warm and then starts tasting weird.

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

Here's what I hate about achievements;

Online/multiplayer achievements, which I group together because they've become almost synonymous nowadays. I have an XBox 360. I don't have XBox live. I also don't have any friends, offline friends, anyway. So I have several games for which I will never get all the achievements, achievements that I could very well get by just opening up the multiplayer maps and jumping around for a few minutes on my own with the second controller plugged in.

On a lesser note, racing achievements. You know, "get from point A to point B within this psychotically short time limit"? Now, I love Prototype. I love spending a good half-hour just running and jumping around without eating one person. I hate the racing minigames. It's kind of like how something is fun until you have to do it.

With the Point A to point B thing, I think those things are alright, and can even be fun, as long as they're optional. Something to do on the side if you get bored, or annoyed. During my brief time trying out DC Universe Online, I enjoyed the agility challenges and did a lot of them. I didn't have to, I could have completely ignored them, but I thought it could be fun to figure out how to traverse the city as fast as possible, especially since you can't exactly "fly" as agility. And those kind of things have their own place, but shouldn't be something mandatory.

 

[PunkRawkSoldier]

Well done, OP. You got an achievement! But anyway, I just say leave your friend to get her achievements, it's harmless fun. If she's really obsessed, she'll get all the achievements soon.

Awesome. In any case, I agree that some achievements are pointless. *cough* multiplayer *cough* That said, I enjoy the hunt and when I get sick of a particular game, I move on. I may come back to it later but, in the end, isn't gaming about personal enjoyment? Let her be and she will eventually move on...unless it's Call of Duty as those fanboys never stop.

 

[silversnake4133]

It may seem pointless to you OP, but I can see where your friend is coming from. While in some cases achievements can be pointless and can make a game seem more like work than it needs to be, they do have a purpose in the game. Therefore, I'd applaud your friend rather than degrade her. Yes it's true some people are really obsessive over these things. In most (not all) cases, collecting all of the achievements means that the gamer in question can revel in the satisfaction of having accomplished what the developers put forth for the gamer folk to do.

In a way, collecting each and every achievement is like getting a 100% on a really hard test, or winning the championships in a sport or competition, or even placing first in a spelling bee/academic challenge. I think that too many people are viewing collectors of achievements in a bad or harsh light. We're really not bad people, we just want to see a game through to the very end so we can reassure the developers that all that time, money, and hard work was well worth it in the end.

Plus you get really awesome games like these:

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/474371

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/553791

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

Awesome. In any case, I agree that some achievements are pointless. *cough* multiplayer *cough* That said, I enjoy the hunt and when I get sick of a particular game, I move on. I may come back to it later but, in the end, isn't gaming about personal enjoyment? Let her be and she will eventually move on...unless it's Call of Duty as those fanboys never stop.

Hey! I am... Er... Was... A Call of Duty fanboy. But yeah, I've since given activision the big middle finger, and I never could understand the point of being 10th prestige or whatever... I spent my time online unlocking all of the weapons and camos once, I don't want to do it all over again so I can have a shiny new medal next to my name. I only played the game with friends because it's fun to group up and kick another team's ass, or at least ***** about the cheaters.

 

[silversnake4133]

It's the difference between playing a game, and "gotta catch 'em all."

As soon as it tips over from being fun, to feeling like work .. well .. actually .. you can get more achievement points by picking up the next game.

So there's nothing wrong with achievements, yo.

That's all well and good, but when it gets to the point that you feel like you can't play any other game until you've gotten every achievement in one game. That just gets to me...

Hmm, maybe you should talk to an artist then, they can tell you all about how when they get inspiration for a project, they can't stand to do anything else (even eat, sleep, or bathe) until they finish something. Besides, have you considered that perhaps your badgering of her over a silly motivation (gaming achievements), and being called obsessive or other rather harsh words may be getting to her? Possibly even hurting her feelings? I can understand that there should be a limit to playtime for a game, but perhaps it's just something that makes her happy and allows her to feel a sense of accomplishment when she's finally achieved 100%. Granted, I don't want to sound preachy, but perhaps you should give her some space if it really bothers you. She'll come around eventually. :3

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

It may seem pointless to you OP, but I can see where your friend is coming from. While in some cases achievements can be pointless and can make a game seem more like work than it needs to be, they do have a purpose in the game. Therefore, I'd applaud your friend rather than degrade her. Yes it's true some people are really obsessive over these things. In most (not all) cases, collecting all of the achievements means that the gamer in question can revel in the satisfaction of having accomplished what the developers put forth for the gamer folk to do.

In a way, collecting each and every achievement is like getting a 100% on a really hard test, or winning the championships in a sport or competition, or even placing first in a spelling bee/academic challenge. I think that too many people are viewing collectors of achievements in a bad or harsh light. We're really not bad people, we just want to see a game through to the very end so we can reassure the developers that all that time, money, and hard work was well worth it in the end.

Plus you get really awesome games like these:

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/474371

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/553791

Well, I think you touched on a big part of this for me. I gave up on getting 100% on tests halfway through highschool and just settled for whatever I got. I've never cared much for sports and there's few competitions I could win at. And striving for first for anything seems pointless to me because no matter how good you are at something, there's always someone else better than you out there.

(Also, I do have to say, those achievement unlocked games are pretty awesome!)

 

[Jonathan Wingo]

Hmm, maybe you should talk to an artist then, they can tell you all about how when they get inspiration for a project, they can't stand to do anything else (even eat, sleep, or bathe) until they finish something. Besides, have you considered that perhaps your badgering of her over a silly motivation (gaming achievements), and being called obsessive or other rather harsh words may be getting to her? Possibly even hurting her feelings? I can understand that there should be a limit to playtime for a game, but perhaps it's just something that makes her happy and allows her to feel a sense of accomplishment when she's finally achieved 100%. Granted, I don't want to sound preachy, but perhaps you should give her some space if it really bothers you. She'll come around eventually. :3

Perhaps... It's just that this is one of the few things that really gets on my nerves.

But, you get double credits for having Fluttershy as your profile pic.