Life sentence alternatives in the UK?

[Elurindel]

After taking a look at the thread below, involving Goth's being kicked to death, then the murders appealing six months after, I wonder at our own justice system. Something needs to be done, but what exactly? People demand prisons, yet they don't want prisons near them. Catch 22
Does anybody have an alternative to prisons, then?
My own suggestion would be lifetime unpaid military service. Send them off to military camp, shaved-headed, with the sort of drill sergeant who can crack a skull by yelling at it, no luxuries, and then stick them in the front line to the nearest warzone. Any deserters of course, punished by execution.

It would be a far more effective deterrent than being sent off to overcrowded, hotel-like prisons, and it might give them a chance to actually give something back to their country, as well as sorting out housing problems, and the fact that decent soldiers are dying in Iraq.

Community service is definitely not working, and some people seem to regard ASBOs as a badge of honour. Is this an effective deterrent, or too much? Any other ideas?

 

[Johnn Johnston]

That is one of the most sensible alternatives I've heard. The prisons are overcrowded (which is one of the reason why so many people are getting off with short sentences), so why not send them off to the other side of the world? Of course, there would need to be a strict screening program before you let criminals hold machine guns.

 

[Elurindel]

Either that, or set up a British leader like the Russian Comissar, specifically for the penal regiments.

 

[GyroCaptain]

Capital punishment, when reasonably swiftly enacted, does wonders for cleaning up prisons. If you kill your serial rapists, multiple murderers, and so on then you're left with a bias toward petty criminals in your jails; less shivving in other words. Also, your recidivism is lower when prison is less of a Training Camp of Evil and more of an actual penitentiary in the original sense.

 

[TheDean]

After taking a look at the thread below, involving Goth's being kicked to death, then the murders appealing six months after, I wonder at our own justice system. Something needs to be done, but what exactly? People demand prisons, yet they don't want prisons near them. Catch 22
Does anybody have an alternative to prisons, then?
My own suggestion would be lifetime unpaid military service. Send them off to military camp, shaved-headed, with the sort of drill sergeant who can crack a skull by yelling at it, no luxuries, and then stick them in the front line to the nearest warzone. Any deserters of course, punished by execution.

It would be a far more effective deterrent than being sent off to overcrowded, hotel-like prisons, and it might give them a chance to actually give something back to their country, as well as sorting out housing problems, and the fact that decent soldiers are dying in Iraq.

Community service is definitely not working, and some people seem to regard ASBOs as a badge of honour. Is this an effective deterrent, or too much? Any other ideas?

just a couple of problems with the OP: no matter what, we cannot execute anyone. NO MATTER WHAT.
second, they should not have to give anything back to their country EVER
lastly, they should not do military service, because that implies some form of patriotism, also, just for the record: no on in the army should have their head shaved. that is unfair. everyone should have the right to have an unshaved head if they want.

 

[Elurindel]

After taking a look at the thread below, involving Goth's being kicked to death, then the murders appealing six months after, I wonder at our own justice system. Something needs to be done, but what exactly? People demand prisons, yet they don't want prisons near them. Catch 22
Does anybody have an alternative to prisons, then?
My own suggestion would be lifetime unpaid military service. Send them off to military camp, shaved-headed, with the sort of drill sergeant who can crack a skull by yelling at it, no luxuries, and then stick them in the front line to the nearest warzone. Any deserters of course, punished by execution.

It would be a far more effective deterrent than being sent off to overcrowded, hotel-like prisons, and it might give them a chance to actually give something back to their country, as well as sorting out housing problems, and the fact that decent soldiers are dying in Iraq.

Community service is definitely not working, and some people seem to regard ASBOs as a badge of honour. Is this an effective deterrent, or too much? Any other ideas?

just a couple of problems with the OP: no matter what, we cannot execute anyone. NO MATTER WHAT.
second, they should not have to give anything back to their country EVER
lastly, they should not do military service, because that implies some form of patriotism, also, just for the record: no on in the army should have their head shaved. that is unfair. everyone should have the right to have an unshaved head if they want.

I wonder if you're actually joking...Could you back that up at all? What if one of them tries to turn their gun on the drill sergeant? It's the sergeant or the criminal.
And why shouldn't they have anything to give back/ They took from their country, so they should give to their country in return.
Also you don't need to be a patriot to fight in the army. Ever seen Lads Army? I bet half the chavs and layabouts they make serve military service don't give a shit about their countries.
And having a shaved head is basically mandatory, but also symbolic. It symbolises that they are in the army now, the shaved head just as imoprtant as the uniform.

 

[Duskwaith]

Either that, or set up a British leader like the Russian Comissar, specifically for the penal regiments.

That actually sounds like a good plan, you kill or break the law kick them off to combat to beat some discipline and PTSD into them,might kill a few off aswell.

But more realisticly would cost less to have captial punishment, though i think the scum arent even worth the bullet to be brutaly honest never mind millions on "Rehabilitaion"

 

[BallPtPenTheif]

Any small rural town that doesn't want a prison next to them is led by dumb politicians. The jobs that a prison provides could almost sustain a small town's economy on it's own.

 

[Elurindel]

Either that, or set up a British leader like the Russian Comissar, specifically for the penal regiments.

That actually sounds like a good plan, you kill or break the law kick them off to combat to beat some discipline and PTSD into them,might kill a few off aswell.

But more realisticly would cost less to have captial punishment, though i think the scum arent even worth the bullet to be brutaly honest never mind millions on "Rehabilitaion"

So execute them by sword instead. Problem solved.

 

[Arbitrary Imposition]

If you kill your serial rapists, multiple murderers, and so on

This is most likely what I would do.
But I'm not sure, on the whole, whether or not I'd be a particularly well-rounded leader.

 

[BallPtPenTheif]

My Grandfather always believed in his idea of a "1 Man Prison Cell". If somebody breaks the law you stick them in there. If another person breaks a law you kill the previous dweller and insert the new prisoner.

He was a really angry man.

 

[Smokescreen]

Putting people who do not want to be in the military in the military leads to an ineffective military. Those who volunteer to serve deserve better than to have criminals at their backs.

Would you want to join a team where everyone had been convicted of a violent crime?

The problem is most likely the kinds of crimes people are being punished for.

I don't know about the UK, but in America an absurd amount of people go to jail for drug-related (but non-violent) offenses. They do not get treatment (for the most part) and in prison the generally learn how to be better criminals, rather than rehabilitated people who can be given a second chance.

I would argue that 'white collar' crimes are also punished ineffectively. Why send an embezzler to prison? Simply take away everything s/he owns, and make them start over from something low-income modest.

 

[Elurindel]

My Grandfather always believed in his idea of a "1 Man Prison Cell". If somebody breaks the law you stick them in there. If another person breaks a law you kill the previous dweller and insert the new prisoner.

He was a really angry man.

You'd need a lot more than just one of those, that's for sure.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

My Grandfather always believed in his idea of a "1 Man Prison Cell". If somebody breaks the law you stick them in there. If another person breaks a law you kill the previous dweller and insert the new prisoner.

He was a really angry man.

You'd need a lot more than just one of those, that's for sure.

Not really...just a lot more graves.

 

[Smokescreen]

And for those of you suggesting murder to solve the problem of prison overcrowding; you are using a permanent solution to fix what ought to be a temporary problem.

Use your brains, not your fists.

 

[BallPtPenTheif]

My Grandfather always believed in his idea of a "1 Man Prison Cell". If somebody breaks the law you stick them in there. If another person breaks a law you kill the previous dweller and insert the new prisoner.

He was a really angry man.

You'd need a lot more than just one of those, that's for sure.

Not really...just a lot more graves.

Or just one big one.

 

[NeedAUserName]

I'm up for locking them in 3 meter by 3 meter cells for the rest of their lives, never seeing daylight again, and given nothing sharp. But thats only for psycho killers. Manslaughter should be longer but not life.

 

[beddo]

The trouble with this is that military service isn't necessarily a good thing.

I think that all minor criminals should be forced to build roads and do other community service 10 hours a day with breaks. This way they are earning their keep.

I think that a lot of criminals have unused potential. We should educate them to at least A-Level standards. Teach them trade skills and have a series of less punitive prisons where they can work until they are rehabilitated. Any slip ups and they go back X number of levels.

For major criminals I think that we may be dealing with a lost cause. I think that we should use high-tech, high-security prisons. These stories about people getting mobile phones in are ridiculous!

There was a design for a prison where the inmates could not tell how many staff were working there. Here's my spin on that:

Have a circular block of prisons that form a massive arch kept in the middle of nowhere with miles of barbed wired and tank proofed terrain before enormous walls with cylinders atop.

You arrive from a sealed van, into a system that directs you to your room. From there the door is shut for the duration of you punishment. A system with no physical human contact.

The room would be monitored at all times. The room would be sound proofed and wireless communications blocked. A monitor would provide educational reading material accessible during the day. Remote counselling would be mandatory. Life signs would be monitored in the room by a machine with an on-call doctor.

The room would have a moulded plastic bed, shower area and toilet. The shower would come on at a certain point every day for 3 minutes. The lights would be handled automatically. The wall would be rubber to stop injury there would be no framework to tie anything to anything.

It would be quite large, 15 meters long for each cell so there would be space to exercise. A window would be supplied for natural lighting during the day.

Clothes would be made of paper to be folded and dropped into a shoot and recycled automatically. New clothes would be delivered by machine made from the old ones.

The rooms would be cleaned weekly by a short power burst of water from the ceiling.

Any good?

 

[beddo]

accidental dup

 

[zirnitra]

Just a thought, how about we rehabilitate?