Little things about Western culture that annoy you.

[LilithSlave]

I love you.
On serious note;
USA, please stop trying to be the important guys in movies and video games. If you are the last Empire on Earth, it does not mean that you are the center of universe. Life still goes on in countries without American corporations leeching them, or American heroes providing humanitarian help to poor African villages, or American soldiers coming in and protecting people from tyrants.

What is this warm sensation in my heart?

Thank you. Yes, definitely agree.

I understand how people are getting the criticism that "yes, they are mostly American heroes because . People relate to their own nationality".

While that's true to a degree, people also relate universally to all humans on some level. Or should, and media of all origins benefits from an amount of diversity. Asia has made European tales and the "West"(using that in quotations now) has made Eastern tales.

Americans don't have a hard enough time relating to Harry Potter, though he is a Westerner too. And if real differences between Easterners and Westerners are so weak, then certainly it makes sense to make plenty of protagonists and/or members of a cast non-Western. I'm not holding a double standard here, I'm not only expecting more diversity out of the West, I think it's great to see diversity out of the East as well.

It's hard to shake the suspicion that you are trolling or a weeaboo in denial. For all of these "problems" you've listed with western culture, I wouldn't say East Asia is doing any better. Arguably worse, for most of them. Some of your rationalization for why westerners do these terrible things is also pretty hilarious.

Again with this, it's not okay for me to criticize and rant about little things in Western culture without being considered to have some kind of bias for the East or Japan? I don't like this logic that if you criticize the West, you're a "weeaboo" or "Asiaphile" or something like that, and that's bad. But if you criticize the East, you're a cultural imperialist pushing your values onto other cultures. It's okay to criticize your own culture and like some aspects of other cultures better. It's just as okay as criticizing another culture and liking some aspects of your own culture better.

I did try to mention a lot aspects of Asian culture in contrast to the West, but not because I am an Asia focused person or think that the East is better than the West. I did run into a few things that might be universal or exist in the West just as much, I was personally trying to balance a rant about things I don't like about the West, that might be universal, or things that might could actually be contrasted to another. I apologize for a lack of consistency. I only mentioned Asia because it allows contrast, it allows me to say I don't like about the West without encountering an absolute "but that's universal" rebuttal. And I suppose I sort of let a few possible universals in there, because I didn't want to seem like I was fixated on the East.

If I brainstormed, and ranted on even more, I would have surely ran into many examples in African culture that I wouldn't probably think more highly of than Western culture. For instance, certain African cultures seem to have a more healthy level of sexualization of the human body than some Westerners. For instance, African cultures where it is fine for women to go around topless without threat of hypersexualition and sexual violence(I would hope), but in the West such a thing is often seen as an "excuse for rape" or disgustingly indecent. Not that rape isn't a problem in Africa, it certain is a major problem. On the other hand, their policies on women's toplessness and body sexualization in some cultures may be a little bit better. We certainly aren't superior to those topless African tribes, and could probably learn from their example in how they treat the exposed body.

I don't know why I would be trolling. I certainly don't mean to offend, and I do stick by what I say. And if you do disagree with my points, I welcome you to try to argue why they are wrong. If it's hilariously "wrong" to you, or even worthy of being called "rationalizing", I'm certainly curious as to why you would think that, and would appreciate a real rebuttal.

I do agree that the treatment of workers in Asia certainly needs work. Though I never argued that wasn't the case. I merely said I didn't like how many Asians have been othered as Communists.

 

[GigaHz]

Snippity snip

God that is a lot of text. I'll try to give a short an sweet answer for as much as I can.

Tea: Agree with you on this point, but I could argue that Tea has a greater importance in Eastern cultures. Here (at least in North America) it's just something nice to have every so often. I would say we put a greater emphasis on importing coffee.

Cute: This is one thing I am thankful for. The way that East Asian countries do cute is beyond obnoxious. Maybe if they toned it down several notches, I might actually find it tolerable enough to envy. The west does do cute, it's just that they aren't as in your face about it for the most part.

Christianity: Maybe it's like that in the states. Canada and most of Europe is far more secular.

Worker politics: Kind of 50/50 on this one and not going to get too into it. I believe that the average worker would be better off without unions, at least from my experience working and negotiating with them. It's the only thing I would outright label as communist... also because it works more in theory than it does in practice.

Cartoons: I agree with you here as well. I think the greatest Western cartoon I've ever experienced was Batman: The Animated Series and possibly Samurai Jack as a close second. I'm sure there are plenty of other good ones out there, but the bulk of my cartoon watching was more comedy focused.

Dolls: Look no further than the influence of Barbie. The brand sold very well for decades so why would they change a proven formula? Just bastardize it a bit, change the name, add a hat and some accessories and BAM, new brand!

More Christianity: Sounds terrible. You can always move.

Being Loud in Public: Again, more of an American thing. I don't know why some Americans insist on being so loud all the time.

Music: As a musician, I could talk about how I feel about the music business for days and days. The quick and dirty is, Pop Music is big business. The big name juggernauts are always going to be overplayed because they have a major label backing them up. It has nothing to do with talent, it has everything to do with marketability. And once an artist is fortunate enough to get in such a position, legions of people will ensure their success. Not going to change until the artist is no longer marketable. Sad reality but there is always the independent scene.

Animation: I think this has more to do with personal preference. I'm more connected emotionally to the ridiculously out of proportioned characters like The Simpsons, Ren and Stimpy, Beavis and Butthead, Spongebob and the like. To each their own.

Hollywood: Another thing that will probably never change for the better. Much like music, expose yourself to more Independent/Film Festival stuff for a good fix. Excellent hidden gems out there.

Game Genres: As with many of the things on this list: marketing and over-saturation. Call of Duty sells well, so companies are going to sell you COD clones until you never want to see a gun again. The moment some other freak success that isn't an FPS hits the market, the same thing will happen. It happened with platformers, now it's happening with FPS games.

Androgyny: If you can think of a way to fit androgyny into a western game without it becoming gimmicky, more power to you. I'm not against it, I just don't think having an androgynous character fits into any western game I have played.

Character Design: Don't really have an opinion on this.

Commercials: If you look at commercials from 10 or 20 years ago, most have made a big improvement, and I mean big. I'm not saying it's perfect, but at least they are showing signs that they are heading in a more positive direction. Commercials are better written, better produced, and sometimes more entertaining than the program they are advertising for. Not all, but a fair amount.

Enemy: As much as I hate to defend this point in the West's favour, someone needs to become the enemy and they need to be believable as well. I would love an Inuit uprising as much as the next guy, but nothing historically suggests it would ever happen. Even if it did, no one would take it seriously. And so, the US has to gravedig up old enemies from years past and villianize them for modern audiences. Until we make contact with aliens or the creator decides to invent their own fictional nation, this is going to happen so long as there are war games based in reality.

 

[thebobmaster_v1legacy]

Cartoons: I agree with you here as well. I think the greatest Western cartoon I've ever experienced was Batman: The Animated Series and possibly Samurai Jack as a close second. I'm sure there are plenty of other good ones out there, but the bulk of my cartoon watching was more comedy focused.

I'd recommend checking out Avatar: The Last Airbender, as well as Teen Titans.

Still, Batman: TAS will be the best, now and forever. But the two I mentioned aren't bad, IMO.

 

[DexterNorgam]

Of course again with the weeaboo query... I mean you do nothing but complain about the west ignoring anything good, and hold up the east as some shining example ignoring all the bad... what do you expect people to say to that??

As one of those gawd-awful hated Americans I wish more countries DIDNT need us to not starve. I wish more people would stand up for their own freedoms without our intervention. I would like nothing more than for us to get out of everyone else's business and let them sink or swim because we've got plenty of things here to better our own situation I'd rather see us sink our considerable resources into instead of constantly throwing them at the world in the hopes that the people that we feed wont hate us...

Because the honest truth is that its the people that we help, and the people that we feed who end up hating us the worst, I dunno if its just because they cant stand that they would starve without us, but yea there's nothing more awesome than having your city attacked in a cowardly terrorist attack in repayment for helping someone prevent themselves from being steamrolled by the USSR back in the day.

 

[Shadowkire]

It's hard to shake the suspicion that you are trolling or a weeaboo in denial. For all of these "problems" you've listed with western culture, I wouldn't say East Asia is doing any better. Arguably worse, for most of them. Some of your rationalization for why westerners do these terrible things is also pretty hilarious.

Again with this, it's not okay for me to criticize and rant about little things in Western culture without being considered to have some kind of bias for the East or Japan? I don't like this logic that if you criticize the West, you're a "weeaboo" or "Asiaphile" or something like that, and that's bad. But if you criticize the East, you're a cultural imperialist pushing your values onto other cultures. It's okay to criticize your own culture and like some aspects of other cultures better. It's just as okay as criticizing another culture and liking some aspects of your own culture better.

The reason people get the impression you hold eastern cultures in higher esteem is because in your 17 part rant against western(American) culture you made direct comparisons in parts 1, 2, 4, 12, 13, 14 and 17. After the impression is made the rest of the rant can read like a comparison to the east.

 

[Dango]

A complete lack of originality, creativity, and the ability to tolerate others.

 

[LilithSlave]

I mean you do nothing but complain about the west ignoring anything good

That's because that's what the topic is about! All of the "little"(see: insignificant, for the most part) things you dislike about a culture. This topic isn't called "little things about Western culture that please you", or "little things about Eastern culture that annoy you". Believe me, I would have no trouble creating a topic about those.

what do you expect people to say to that??

To not rush to the defense of something that isn't being attacked, like I stated in the preface. Or at least I would hope as much. Seems I've been let down, though.

One could make a topic saying "little things about New York that annoy you", without thinking New York isn't a bad place. These sorts of topics also commonly exist by people who are living in Asia.

Criticism isn't attacking. Finding something negative doesn't mean you don't find anything positive about it. I love the West. But that doesn't mean I don't have thing I dislike about it. In fact the name of the topic should imply the things I don't like are small.

I don't have to like every single, insignificant little thing about the West to like the West. The West can take a little bit of criticism and still be good, can it not?

Also this has nothing to do with culture, great start!

Well, it's an insignificant, little part of culture. But I would say it's still a part of culture. The topic is called "little" for a reason. These aren't meant to be big criticisms most of the time, though I accidentally brought up religion...

2)I have no idea what you mean about the west hating cuteness. Most people will gush over a napping puppy, and those who "hate" on the puppy are in the hated minority(known as a$$holes).

I don't know, I guess it just seems understated.

charities and good works Christianity is responsible for.

I do not like mainstream Christianity, no. While enjoying some aspects of Christian mythology, indeed, I do not care for mainstream Christianity as a cultural aspect. I also find that religion in the West has done more harm than good. Christianity has given us a lot of interesting fiction, but as a moral guideline it has done a lot of bad for the West.

4)You do realize that in most places the people who claim "caring about works is communism" only account for half of the political spectrum right?

I would still say that we have a dangerous view of some things like this generally and it has leaded to a lot of "yellow peril".

5)The west has some good animated shows(I like Adventure Time myself), even ones with semi-adult content(Adventure Time, seriously).

Oh, I certainly agree. There is a great deal of Western animation and comic books alike that I enjoy. Both Eastern and Western comics and animation are worthy of both praise and criticisms.

What I am not liking is this trend towards what I find to be poor shows such as Fairly Oddparents. When we need more shows like Jonny Quest. Sorry, this statement might have been closer to the "universal" thing in some aspects. I can't contrast every little thing about the West I don't like to somewhere else.

6)I see your "western bronze skinned shopaholic dolls" and raise you an "eastern used-panty vending machine."

I don't understand the comparison and what you're raising me. Bratz are aimed at little girls, panty vending machines are aimed at adult men.

10)When did western pop ever have good composers? And you don't have a leg to stand on with this point, because I have heard a number of "Jpop" and "Kpop" songs and they are just as bad/good.

Popular Western music used to be art music. I am not calling Asian pop better than Western pop. Asian pop is merely a localized version of Western pop. That's why I compared it to like a cancer. In a globalist world, what people are making are not classically inspired feats, they're autotuned drivel. We need to appreciate and spread the love of instrumental music more, instead of spreading our pop music to the Eastern world, to the point where they make their own copy-pop drivel.

 

[LilithSlave]

After the impression is made the rest of the rant can read like a comparison to the east.

Well, what else can the West be compared to, Africa? How much weight would my complaints about Western culture if they were all universals in human culture and nothing to contrast to in other cultures?

I'm sorry for not making more African examples. The East was much easier than Africa.

 

[Konaerix]

When people call a katana a "samurai sword". I know it's kinda petty, but it still gets under my skin for some people.

Also when people laugh at the cultural traditions of others just because it's "different" and "odd".

The first part of your comment confuses me, a Katana IS a Samurai sword.
Calling it as such is a valid description, especially when held up to mainstream culture calling it a "ninja sword".

Other then that, I agree with the second part.

 

[Shadowkire]

After the impression is made the rest of the rant can read like a comparison to the east.

Well, what else can the West be compared to, Africa? How much weight would my complaints about Western culture if they were all universals in human culture and nothing to contrast to in other cultures?

I'm sorry for not making more African examples. The East was much easier than Africa.

I understand that making comparisons is easier to write, but instead of making comparisons between cultures you should have made simple criticisms. Then you could defend your criticisms with examples from cultures across the entire globe, thus saving you from being called a weeaboo(I don't know what it means)[nor do I care].

 

[Chemical Alia]

Again with this, it's not okay for me to criticize and rant about little things in Western culture without being considered to have some kind of bias for the East or Japan? I don't like this logic that if you criticize the West, you're a "weeaboo" or "Asiaphile" or something like that, and that's bad.

The logic is you're bringing up stupid, inane things like cartoons and cutesy shit and girly video game characters in the context of how western culture is inferior to the east in these ways even when the east its own dumbass problems with all of those issues. That's what makes you a weeaboo. You have no perspective on any of these things, and you sound childish as a result.

 

[StrawHat]

I'm reminded of a Tom Baker Dr Who episode where the doctor says he likes individual humans, just not when they're in big groups.

I think the same goes for both western and eastern cultures.

I agree that japanese are addicted to cute and it completely overpowered the koreans and chinese to the extent there are k-pop idols and c-pop idols.

American animation is never going to reach the abilities of the japanese. TV stations, commercial time and E/I regulation will create nothing more than dora the explorer, spongebob and squidbillies.

I feel that same corporate buyout has also made game makers to make too many fps games and note enough rpgs. I love FF titles but FF13 felt like being forced on one path with no deviation and then forced to fight those endless battles. Not that morrowwind was any better. The supplementary guide was thicker than a phone book and no ever explained how to not kill someone in the same guild as me. But look at what the corporate need for endless profits has done. Nintendo seem to release the same zelda over and over again and bungie is making halo 4 and a halo 1 redo.

Now the west does toot the democracy horn too much. And in my mind the athenians were correct with "real" democracy not the sham representational democracy we have. However china invented legalism and to my knowledge never had any kind of democracy at all. Even though the chinese had inventions that turned the european world over like the printing press and gunpowder.

Do this mean I hate the west? Well I do get pissed when fox goes rabid over the last 6% of u.s. union jobs destroying the entire economy especially when we see how well outsourcing companies treated the other 94%. This doesn't mean chinese are clean either, putting poison in baby food so it looks like it has more protein. In a country can only have one kid? Let's just say greedy business men are a-holes in any country.

Now as far as china not being our enemy. Whenever america does a joint military demonstration with taiwan. China says our relations will be irrevocably changed and we are interfering with an internal matter. My butt, I say put a military base on taiwan and have a hundred multiheaded nukes put there aimed at beijing and declare taiwan independent. The chinese also had the nerve to tell the us president to not meet the dalai lama. I say we free tibet and get our hands on those rare earth elements that come from mongolia that china refuses to sell us. But so far it's backfiring. The japanese figured out to recycle at least 80% of rare earth elements from used electronics and the price is so high a mine in california wants to open up again.

Also look at the bbc they have articles on brazil, africa and palestine where clothes makers are going out of business because of cheap chinese copies. According to the bbc only one brazilian bikini maker is left and in palestine the traditional palestinian headscarf is only made by one family company now. African clothes makers are seeing chinese copy traditional designs and putting them out of business. I'm not one for cheaper is better, especially when it puts your own country men out of business. $40 for a shirt on sale from pakistan and one of the seems has a hole because it wasn't sewed correctly. B.S.! I might start my own line of big and tall clothes with better quality materials, american workers and be just a few dollars more.

Blue laws, hate them too. Voted to get ride of them in my state. Truthfully I see nothing in the constitution that gives the federal government the right to regulate of tax liquor. Of course I also think most states didn't have any laws prior to 1929 and the power should rightfully be left with the people.

A chinese co-worker from taiwan told me how dirty chinese people are. That at disney china, they don't know what waiting in line is and cut people off all the time. How chinese mothers don't take their children to the restroom to urinate and just have them urinate anywhere on the park. Also how the chinese would just throw garbage anywhere and not put it in trash cans.

Also I remember wearing a green or yellow sweatband once to work and another chinese co-worker told me how in china wearing that color head band means your wife was cheating on you. I think I responded it's just the color green dude. So chinese and I'm sure other easterners have weird superstitions to westerners. I'm sure I could go on about the number 4 and 3 toed frogs but I'll stop.

I'm still dying to find a good char siu bao place in my town.

 

[LilithSlave]

thus saving you from being called a weeaboo(I don't know what it means)[nor do I care].

If it's this easy, I don't see why I should care. Since it's been turned into a meaningless word.

inane things

The topic says "little things" for a reason. These aren't supposed to be important parts of culture, and this isn't a bashing of Western culture.

east its own dumbass problems with all of those issues.

I'm not sure which issues we're talking about, but I'm sure that's true. Though I'd like you to specify what you're talking about instead of calling my claims ridiculous in some form or fashion and call me names.

And if you're going to throw that word around that easily, then I have no reason to give it any weight or hold it with any negative regard.

 

[Stublore]

I'm totally onboard with the "Christianity is more fun when it isn't really Christianity" bit, but the rest of it... meh.

Though I do get tired of shooting Russians and Germans.

Lol, true, but I never get tired if being a German shooting Americans or Brits, go figure!

 

[Stublore]

Hey, the East ain't so hot(well actually it is, but you get my point :

http://www.weirdasianews.com/2009/08/30/japanese-men-give-meaning-pillow-talk/
A new video game subculture has been flourishing in Japan: men who are so obsessed with pubescent, female, Anime figures they form ?relationships? with body pillows covered with the girl's image.



In this world known as Moe, the rising popularity of so-called "2-D Lovers" has spawned its own thriving industry among some men.

If a guy can't "get the girl" for real, virtual world fanatics figure, he gets a girl pillow. Within Japan?s widespread otaku culture ? the obsessive fan base of anime, manga and video games -more is what the Moe men want.

The female characters and the Moe men who love them - some more innocently than others - are 10 to 12 years old.

 

[Hagi]

This idea that, as the OP seems to think, Western culture [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_culture] = American culture...

Quite a few things you mention aren't Western culture, they're just Americans being Americans.

 

[funguy2121]

snip

I may go back later on and address these one by one, but for now, I'll address the Christianity thing and the Pony thing and the tea thing.

"Tea." Not a huge deal here. And I love my mother's cup of tea, ultrasweetened with excess sugar and gratuitous cream. But really? I guess it's like complaining that you can't get good Mexican food in the northern states (you can't, not even Tex-Mex).

Christianity. Christianity, in all its various permutations, including Islam, is not by any stretch exclusive to the Western world.

(I suppose I should indicate that I'm talking about the numerous books they share in common before I stir up a kerfuffle.)

(what a wonderful word!)

Anywho, Christianity is spreading rapidly in Africa and in the East. When's the last time you met a first- or second-generation American of Asian descent who practiced Shinto? Again, maybe it's different over there - atheists aren't assumed to be cynical nihilists, at least not quite as much as in the States.

Ponies, and more to the point, Bronies. First of all, you said that America doesn't like "cute." Shall we do a list? Let's do a list.

Barney
The Care Bears
Ewoks
Jar-Jar Binks
R2D2
Wall-e
Mars needs Moms
Bolt
Ellen Page
Shrek
Strawberry Shortcake
Shirley Temple
the Olsen Twins
Ann Coulter's Adam's apple
The Incredibles
Shark Town
Punky Brewster
Hey Gabba Gabba! (or "Yo, Gabba Gabba." Whatever)
The Boggles
Halo fans
Power Puff Girls (don't tell me it's the same creator, it's not)
Chunk (from The Goonies)
...while we're at it, the cast, crew and whole production of Goonies
Short Round (yes, Indiana Jones' sidekick)
The half of Super 8 that wasn't about aliens

...So, y'see there, looking especially at the last 4 examples, we don't just do "cute," we also do "sweet and endearing." Now, onto the bigger question, which is...

...why do people make fun of you for watching My Little Pony? Let me preface this by saying that I don't believe you. I don't disbelieve you, absolutely, but my default position when speaking to a Bronie is that I don't believe him. I watched it start out as a "Hey, look at me, I'm saying "LOL"/"bacon"/"flying spaghetti monster/"cthulu" on the internet too!" thing and then I witnessed a bunch of people en mass go, "No, er, I do like it! Isn't that weird! Try and figure me out! Man, am I complex!" And then its voracious new fans started talking about it as thought it were friggin' Shakespeare, or Christopher Nolan. And they always said (and still say) the same thing. This is just my perspective. I could be wrong, but I expect that the exceptions are far outnumbered by the examples.

So, why do people make fun of Bronies? For one, it seems to the majority of us (if the consensus I've heard is correct) that it's a cutesy-ploy. For another, it's a show for little girls. I had a neighbor who watched Olsen twins movies, all of 'em. He had every last one. The guy was 58. Believe me when I say, he was in no way a pedophile, but he was just a big kid. Barely took care of himself, and never did anything. Very simple, very disordered. Not normal.

And here's how I feel about normal, since I think of myself as a lovable weirdo. I could care less about it. But you've probably met someone who tries way too hard to be "punk rock" or "hip hop" (or both, Kid Rock, you no-talent ass clown who's never heard and recognized either in your life. Loser). Aren't they obnoxious? I don't mean people who are loud about who they are, similar or different. I mean people who scream for attention instead of screaming because they love living their life. Bloody annoying.

But if you really do just love the show, cool! Just don't talk about it all the time, or post threads that read "why all the Pony hate?" (you think you're stealthy) I love Batman but I don't talk about Batman all day, and I don't post things like "why don't people like dark? Batman is dark, and people (feasibly, somewhere) don't like Batman, therefore people don't like dark."

Hope that wasn't too offensive. G'night.

 

[Images]

Vacuous, empty-headed fools who gather a hodge podge of philosophies from across the world in some half-baked idea of new age philosophy, often with completely conflicting ideas usually obtained on some pretentious 6 month mission abroad to find themselves. Rather than appreciating the beauty and difference of each and every worldview they create their own monster-mashed version that they use to judge others from a self-appointed pulpit, mocking those who differ for being conservative simply because they simply do not agree with them, be it on dietary habits, religion, sexuality or social order. Likewise I hate the classical western view of sneering at the rest of the world for not being like them but its the former that really gets my goat for the air of faux superiority it entails.

 

[ChickenZombie]

Just because you don't believe in Christianity doesn't give you the right to scrutinize it. Just let it be. People will be religious, and you won't convert people out of religion by disrespecting them. Leave religion to people who believe in it and stop letting it bother you. People have been/always will be religious, there's no way you will stop that from happening. Complaining about all this stuff will get you nowhere, it will just cause arguments.