Look out! It's a Nice Guy! DESTROY HIM!
- Thread starter Grahav
- Start date
Recommended Videos
I love how she brings up the fact that girls can be friendzoned. It seems so many people forget that. And her example happens, the girl gets sympathy. One of my best friends in high school had a crush on me, I didn't return those feelings. She was a great friend, I didn't want to risk that by going into a relationship. When she finally asked me and I kindly declined she stopped texting and talking to me. She even told her friends and several of them started to ignore me as well. Made the last few weeks of highschool hell.
My attention span isn't long enough to get past her second argument, but that story really made me think of how many women actually do that.
My attention span isn't long enough to get past her second argument, but that story really made me think of how many women actually do that.
I likes that woman, I haven't seen that video though.
When ever "nice guy" gets said on the net people automatically assume "nice guys just feel entitled to sex", which is just the polar opposite of what they want ... which is funny considering the "douchbag assholes" they always choose to go out with are the ones just after sex.
The argument seems to go that he is only being nice to guilt trip you into having sex, the "nice guy" is actually thinking "maybe if I am super nice, always there for her, etc then she will realize I am grade A boyfriend material" sex is a product of the relationship but not the primary goal.
When ever "nice guy" gets said on the net people automatically assume "nice guys just feel entitled to sex", which is just the polar opposite of what they want ... which is funny considering the "douchbag assholes" they always choose to go out with are the ones just after sex.
The argument seems to go that he is only being nice to guilt trip you into having sex, the "nice guy" is actually thinking "maybe if I am super nice, always there for her, etc then she will realize I am grade A boyfriend material" sex is a product of the relationship but not the primary goal.
Oh dear, I better bring my helmet for this one.
But my simple question here is, relating to what omega616 said, can't a guy just be nice without everyone assuming he has a sleazy hidden agenda? Can't a guy just lament rejection for a moment without being called a selfish sexist asshole?
"Oh damn, something unpleasant has happened to me, now the internet demands that I feel bad about feeling bad about it"
But my simple question here is, relating to what omega616 said, can't a guy just be nice without everyone assuming he has a sleazy hidden agenda? Can't a guy just lament rejection for a moment without being called a selfish sexist asshole?
"Oh damn, something unpleasant has happened to me, now the internet demands that I feel bad about feeling bad about it"
She makes some good points but I only made it half way through before her patronising the viewer got too much.
From my point of view, women seem to be able to get into a relationship easier than men because (possibly) have less standards when it comes to finding a lover.
I don't know what it is, but society seems to have given us a feeling of "gurl, men should be falling at your feet. Here's 20 make-up tips to snag your boy!"
Maybe it's even the age-old tradition that a man has to do all the running and the work, so when presented with a woman who has been friendzoned we react like "BUT SHE HAS A VAGINA?! Why aren't you falling over your feet?! Poor girl!" forgetting that it can happen to both genders.
Or maybe even the "If a woman is single, she's a spinster with 40 cats, if a man is single he's cool and awesome and gets to do what he wants cos he's a bachelor" storyline that so many films have.
You can't throw blanket terms around when it comes to this because each individual who has been 'friendzoned' reacts differently.
Some people completely understand and can manage to move on, get over it and all is well in the long run.
Others will go out of their way to make the person who rejected them feel like shit for having the audacity to not return their feelings.
I understand unrequited love sucks, I've been there so many times. But so is anger or desperation towards the person, they can't control their feelings just as much as the person in love can't.
I know I "villainfy" those who can't react to it like a grown adult. The ones who seem hurt but leave it at that, I feel much sympathy for, man or woman.
There are people out there who think romance should work out for them just the way they want it and act like a child who has been denied a toy when they don't get it by insulting the whole gender and that persons S.O for example.
As a story, I had an old best friend who admitted to liking me years ago. I turned her down, and was hesitant for a while but we seemed to have moved past it and became good friends. I never used her and she never used me, she was more willing to spend more on me for my birthday because she was quite well off, but I always refused any huge gifts. There was never any awkward tension, she had partners and so did I so I assumed her feelings for me had gone as she didn't bring it up again. Just one of those teenage crushes.
Fast forward about five years, I came out of a long term relationship and spent most of 2012 single. She invited me out to cheer me up and she suggested we start dating.
All I could draw from that is she kept me around for all those years in the hope I would change my mind.
Again I turned her down, which I was very hard to do. After that she more or less cut me from her life despite all the support I had given her regarding her sex change.
After all the laughs, all the memories, all the times I went to hers when she was going through a break up I was just disposable because I didn't want to date her.
I think she hurt me more than I hurt her by turning her down.
As a side note, "Nice guys" are not so much so, if they're only nice to pretty girls they want to date. Treat everyone with the same amount of respect and you have my gratitude. Treat the attractive person of your dreams like a God and you come across as a sleaze ball.
Girls who take advantage of the man's feelings are terrible people, but that's not on par with us who think the friendzone is a crock of old shit and dislike the attitude some men have after they've "been put in it."
From my point of view, women seem to be able to get into a relationship easier than men because (possibly) have less standards when it comes to finding a lover.
I don't know what it is, but society seems to have given us a feeling of "gurl, men should be falling at your feet. Here's 20 make-up tips to snag your boy!"
Maybe it's even the age-old tradition that a man has to do all the running and the work, so when presented with a woman who has been friendzoned we react like "BUT SHE HAS A VAGINA?! Why aren't you falling over your feet?! Poor girl!" forgetting that it can happen to both genders.
Or maybe even the "If a woman is single, she's a spinster with 40 cats, if a man is single he's cool and awesome and gets to do what he wants cos he's a bachelor" storyline that so many films have.
You can't throw blanket terms around when it comes to this because each individual who has been 'friendzoned' reacts differently.
Some people completely understand and can manage to move on, get over it and all is well in the long run.
Others will go out of their way to make the person who rejected them feel like shit for having the audacity to not return their feelings.
I understand unrequited love sucks, I've been there so many times. But so is anger or desperation towards the person, they can't control their feelings just as much as the person in love can't.
I know I "villainfy" those who can't react to it like a grown adult. The ones who seem hurt but leave it at that, I feel much sympathy for, man or woman.
There are people out there who think romance should work out for them just the way they want it and act like a child who has been denied a toy when they don't get it by insulting the whole gender and that persons S.O for example.
As a story, I had an old best friend who admitted to liking me years ago. I turned her down, and was hesitant for a while but we seemed to have moved past it and became good friends. I never used her and she never used me, she was more willing to spend more on me for my birthday because she was quite well off, but I always refused any huge gifts. There was never any awkward tension, she had partners and so did I so I assumed her feelings for me had gone as she didn't bring it up again. Just one of those teenage crushes.
Fast forward about five years, I came out of a long term relationship and spent most of 2012 single. She invited me out to cheer me up and she suggested we start dating.
All I could draw from that is she kept me around for all those years in the hope I would change my mind.
Again I turned her down, which I was very hard to do. After that she more or less cut me from her life despite all the support I had given her regarding her sex change.
After all the laughs, all the memories, all the times I went to hers when she was going through a break up I was just disposable because I didn't want to date her.
I think she hurt me more than I hurt her by turning her down.
As a side note, "Nice guys" are not so much so, if they're only nice to pretty girls they want to date. Treat everyone with the same amount of respect and you have my gratitude. Treat the attractive person of your dreams like a God and you come across as a sleaze ball.
Girls who take advantage of the man's feelings are terrible people, but that's not on par with us who think the friendzone is a crock of old shit and dislike the attitude some men have after they've "been put in it."
But how do you (the reader) know whether or not a guy has anAxolotl said:
Well, again, many seem to see "Dang, I'd hoped that would have turned out differently...and now I'm a bit sad about it" as "being a selfish sexist asshole".
So for all your glib snarkiness, unless you've got intimate knowledge of the mind of the guy in question, I don't see how anything you said answers my questions.
Yeah, that's the internet for you. I think we can all agree that it doesn't exactly bring out peoples reasonable side. Just remember that while stuff like this might seem to be a common, it propably really isn't. If you looked outside of certain corners of the internet, i would guess most people wouldn't even know about the negative meaning of "nice guy".Vegosiux said:
Well here's the thing I wasn't talking from the point of view of a reader, I was talking from the point of view of someone being nice, because I try and be nice I don't always succeed and I can be a dck but overall I try to make an effort and you know what? Nobody has ever complained or accused me of anything, so when you ask if you can be nice without people assuming your sleazy then I know you can and I know how, so I told you.Vegosiux said:
However you've changed the senario. If there is a reader then then I presume you mean the "nice guy" is complaining on the internet. In which case as a reader it's pretty easy to work out if they're being genuinely nice or not. Because genuinely nice people don't feel the need to ***** about how nice they are online.
Examples?
I didn't realise there was a "guy in question" in your questions. I assumed they were both genuine questions about how to be a good person.
Not the person who said it, but in my experience, there's a difference in the presentation. "I'd hoped that would have turned out differently...and now I'm a bit sad about it" is great - and everyone says that at some point (unless you're astonishingly lucky in every facet of your life). But that's different from the guys who say "But I'm a nice guy! Why do I keep getting friendzoned?"Vegosiux said:
Obviously I can't know about people online (and I've seen a few people post in other threads that they use "friendzone" as a shorthand for the neutral version), but IRL when I see the "nice guys" they're virtually always either sleazy or else setting themselves up for it.
The sleazy ones see a hot girl and pretend to be friends and then they rage when the girl only wants friendship. And yeah, nothing wrong with being friendly to see if something comes of it, but the fakeness is where the sleaze comes in - be friendly, don't fake a friendship, y'know?
The other ones I feel a little sorry for, because they tend to be guys who have something else going on in the background - my best example of this is a guy I know from school who's overall a decent guy but who's not too bright and not too successful but talks like he's both. Eventually he gets dumped (usually within a few months, but once this guy kept a hot and smart girl for 2 years! We all sat around wondering what was going on there...) and then goes around ranting that all females are superficial. But if you don't want to be brushed off by someone for being a little dumb and a little boring you need to put that out front. Yeah, some people will care - but if you don't hide the flaws you're not going to weed those ones out.
Well, not exactly. "The reader" refers to the fact that this particular conversation is taking place on the internet, and I'll have a hard time getting an answer from someone if they don't see my question. It was basically just thrown in to state I'm not referring to you personally.Axolotl said:
But yes, I do see such stuff on the internet a whole lot more than I see it offline, even if I still see it offline. It doesn't even have to be "a nice guy complaining", it can also be a girl's girlfriends telling her "he was only nice because he wanted to have sex with you", without knowing anything about the guy other than he was a nice chap and seemed a bit put down after she told him she's not go for a drink with him.
Enough to confirm that it does happen commonly enough for me to notice.
Nah, they were genuine questions about why people like to assume stuff just so that they can feel they're better than whoever they're assuming stuff about.
I don't represent every case of nice guys and I never claimed to. I just said I knew how to not be assumed to have a hiden agenda and it's by not having a hidden agenda. Nobody "calls me on it" because frankly if there's something to call me on then I'm not being nice. To expand beyond just myself , I've known plenty of relly nice, friendly people and you know what? Nobody ever accused them of having hidden agenda, they were just friends with prety much everybody.omega 616 said:
The point I was trying to get across (obliquely I'll admit) was that by and large people don't get attacked for being nice. The term "nice guy" isn't an insult because everybody hates it when people are firendly and caring, it's an insult because it'soverwhelmingly self applied by whining, self-entitled misogynists.
Again, you grab at the shitty end of the stick and proclaim it to be the clean end. Just look at the language you chose to use at the end, "self-entitled misogynists" I'll assume you meant self-entitled to sex and misogynists, "the hatred or dislike of women or girls" .. curious, the complain about the lack of sex they feel they deserve from people they hate or dislike, begs the question why they want to have sex with them.Axolotl said:
As for the self entitled, that comes from "hey, why is she dating the guy that she knows cheats, lies, breaks the law etc when I don't do any of that ... isn't that what girls want, a nice guy?" ... also coupled with nice guys finish last, as in "nice guys are the last to get dates".
The actual clean end the stick isn't covered in cynicism, it is guys who lack confidence struggling to interact with girls in a romantic way, they aren't the kind of guys who can walk up to a girl and immediately put forward that they are interested in a relationship. The only way they can comfortably interact with them is to be a stereotypical nice guy, in the hope the girl will think "maybe this is the guy I am looking for".
Some guys can go up to a girl they like and say "hi, can I buy you a drink?" or some cheesy chat up line but a "nice guys" version of that is listening and doing stuff for her.
How is "there, there" any more deceitful, sleazy or whatever other derogatory words you can think of than "can I buy you a drink?". All it's doing is prompting the female to do the asking out, as opposed to the guy.
Hell, you could even make the argument that it is empowering women to be the ones to ask guys out.
There is a difference between being stung and expressing that hurt and being stung and turning on all women for a solid week. The worst part of the internet in that situation is it never forgets and those negative, sexist views that were spouted will somehow come back to haunt you.TizzytheTormentor said:
I've yet to be accused to be called a selfish sexist dick over feeling bad about rejection. Both sides have to deal with rejection.