Major Changes In Youtube Involving Let's Players
- Thread starter Emaruse
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I'd hope that to be the case, because it was ArchmageMelek's Let's Play of Minecraft that got me to buy the game, and I've had countless hours of fun with it since then. If I hadn't seen an LP of Minecraft, would I have bought it? It's tough to say, but I'm leaning towards "no". This also harms folks who put a lot of work into tutorials or how-tos, like Wrel's awesome Planetside 2 videos.neonsword13-ops said:
I've done a fair amount of gameplay videos and a couple of Let's Plays, but it's only ever been a hobby to me. I'd just rather not see a lot of people who've made a lot of entertaining videos basically shown the door because of overbearing copyright enforcement. And those of you who say "well, so long as it gets rid of PewDiePie"... get over yourselves, seriously. Or at least direct your complaints towards the guy who apparently puts a gun to your head and makes you watch PDP's videos.
AngryJoe's content is one of the most legit kinds of gaming content on youtube. The main attraction there is him. He produces high quality content that doesn't rely on in-game footage. He can easily defend with fair use.
I'm not sure how this crisis will play out and how affiliates will be affected. From what I've heard, they will have to jump through more hoops, but major networks have license from publishers. It's the fact, that youtube will have to review the content anyway that, pisses them off. It takes time and makes it inconvenient. They have to upload videos in advance.
And for all of the people who wish for PDP to disappear... Are you that stupid? Do you want his primary audience to migrate to the channels you watch? Do you want them to influence content creators you like? He caters to his audience. Let him do that. It looks like really stupid envy. Let him deal with kids.
I'm not sure how this crisis will play out and how affiliates will be affected. From what I've heard, they will have to jump through more hoops, but major networks have license from publishers. It's the fact, that youtube will have to review the content anyway that, pisses them off. It takes time and makes it inconvenient. They have to upload videos in advance.
And for all of the people who wish for PDP to disappear... Are you that stupid? Do you want his primary audience to migrate to the channels you watch? Do you want them to influence content creators you like? He caters to his audience. Let him do that. It looks like really stupid envy. Let him deal with kids.
What's greedy about it? Making quality content consumes both time and money, and we're talking both direct costs like good recording equipment and opportunity costs like being unable to work/sleep in order to get it finished. As soon as someone becomes even a little bit popular, people start flooding them with demands for more content or different types of content, and if they don't get it they tend to move on quickly.TehCookie said:
Point being that it very quickly becomes as demanding as a full-time job, only one that has no guaranteed income, no job security in the form of union support or industry agreements/regulations, no direct pathways to other employment opportunities if everything dries up all of a sudden, etc, etc. Ad revenue is basically their livelihood, and calling them greedy for what they do is just ridiculous.
This is all bull. The reason people watch Let's Plays isn't for the games (Not primarily anyway), it's for the personality of the LP'er. They basically sell themselves, not the game. Not to mention all the editing time that goes into a (proper) Let's Play and shit...
The difference is that music is meant to be listened to, movies are meant to be watched, and games are meant to be played. Watching a video of someone else playing a game isn't the same as playing the game unless the game doesn't have much gameplay (Or at least multiple solutions, a game like Professor Layton is a game that probably loses worth when LPed because then you see the solutions). The reason people like this LPer over that LPer is because of who is doing the LP. It's personality of the person playing the game and their commentary that make a LP good or bad, I can watch someone play a great game and a bad game and still enjoy both of them so long as the person makes good commentary.Rancid0ffspring said:
An LPer doesn't get followers or money because of the game, they get money by being charismatic or funny or what have you. The game is just the backdrop to the LPer.
This is honestly really sad. I like google as a company but whoever is in charge of Youtube really needs to be sacked, they seem to be trying their hardest to ruin the site right now.
People don't just watch raw game footage on Youtube, all of the most popular Youtubers add an entertainment factor or provide information themselves. A video of some skateboarders showing off their skills wouldn't be asked to pay the manufacturers of the boards they are using. The video adds value to the brand through free advertisement - it makes more sense for the brand to sponsor the Youtubers. In essence this is like hiring a marketing firm to advertise your product but asking them to pay you for the privilege of working for you.
From a legal standpoint I expect there will be change in the next few years. There are too many cases of companies inserting legally and morally questionable things into EULAs. It seems to be that more and more companies are treating EULAs as a way to trick their customers into signing extremely one-sided contracts against their knowledge. At the end of the day sticking things such as waivers for the right to conduct class-action lawsuits in a EULA that nobody reads doesn't hold up in court - in fact in many part of the world it is illegal.
As far as monetization is concerned game developers would be silly to fuss about it, although I expect many of the documents are just there to cover themselves. I have bought games purely because it looked fun in a let's play - the money devs get from people like me is far greater than what any youtuber will make.
People don't just watch raw game footage on Youtube, all of the most popular Youtubers add an entertainment factor or provide information themselves. A video of some skateboarders showing off their skills wouldn't be asked to pay the manufacturers of the boards they are using. The video adds value to the brand through free advertisement - it makes more sense for the brand to sponsor the Youtubers. In essence this is like hiring a marketing firm to advertise your product but asking them to pay you for the privilege of working for you.
From a legal standpoint I expect there will be change in the next few years. There are too many cases of companies inserting legally and morally questionable things into EULAs. It seems to be that more and more companies are treating EULAs as a way to trick their customers into signing extremely one-sided contracts against their knowledge. At the end of the day sticking things such as waivers for the right to conduct class-action lawsuits in a EULA that nobody reads doesn't hold up in court - in fact in many part of the world it is illegal.
As far as monetization is concerned game developers would be silly to fuss about it, although I expect many of the documents are just there to cover themselves. I have bought games purely because it looked fun in a let's play - the money devs get from people like me is far greater than what any youtuber will make.
I agree that this is all kinds of bullshit. Particularly since this is going to basically be put a stop to for the smaller guys, but if you're big enough or affiliated with the right people it's okay? Fuck that. Copyright law is broken and needs to be changed to account for things like LP's being legitimate transformative works.Neronium said:
But until then I wholeheartedly support you and anyone else leaving Youtube to go somewhere else. Youtube needs to be taken down a few pegs, so let's get the ball rolling on that. As it is, they're far too content to simultaneously throw their weight around, while doing nothing to stand up for the content creators that keep them running.
Youtube has turned into all kinds of wrong the more and more Google(don't be evil my ass) has been taking direct control, unfortunatley there are no equally powerful and well known competitors to flee to, monopoly sucks.
As long as the lets players bought the games legally they should be able to do whatever they want with it. Most Lets players earn their advert money by being entertainers, not by just setting up a cam to record, I'd argue the games could be viewed as props and not the main focus of the videos.
As long as the lets players bought the games legally they should be able to do whatever they want with it. Most Lets players earn their advert money by being entertainers, not by just setting up a cam to record, I'd argue the games could be viewed as props and not the main focus of the videos.
YouTube has been dead to me a while now, when I premiere my 4K resolution Star Citizen Space Opera machinima, it will be on Vimeo.
They both are motivated by money. If corporations wanting money is evil then so are the LPers who want it as well. Or neither is evil, and I like that view more.Zachary Amaranth said:
You mean like how LPers muscles in on game content to make a profit? I don't support what the corporations are doing but I hate it when they're innately evil for wanting to make money, that is what the LPers want too. Now if you want to call them out on being dicks about it that's fine.the hidden eagle said:
I think we should stop music from being a job entirely, so that bastard Justin Beiber stops getting paid.Genocidicles said:
Nice to know, that 0.0024% of people in the world is also the majority. In the USA and EU roughly 70% of all people play video games on any device, i'd guess it's about the same for many asian countries too. So his 17million subscribers pale even infront of the "gamer community".Tenmar said:
His fandom is a minorty.
Personally i think he's hit/miss. More miss than hit, but he has some funny videos. But as always with the interwebz stuff get's blown out of proportion. I mean i really loved Gangnam style but nearly 2 billion views? Really?
Not particularly surprised. But most people who are "professional" LPs are already signed up with companies like Machinima so they should be fine. If anything it'll just make becoming a Let Play channel more difficult, but there's plenty out there already so I figure culling the dead weight will be alright.Emaruse said:
Nope.
Yeah, it probably could have happened a few years back, as for my feelings I'm indifferent. I see both sides of the argument as being valid in one way or another.
HA! No, this isn't going to crush the industry. People who are partnered will be fine (which is like nearly every LP).
90% of all current LPs will be fine.
If this is only going to effect Lets Players than it really isn't a massive pile of crap, it's more like culling of the useless channels. This isn't publishers trying to get more money, this is them trying to protect their assets (which is legal). Yes some probably want to go full on 1984 and have it so that they control everything, but this seems to only effect Lets Plays, you know those videos that don't actually review a game, they just play it all the way through and then say, "AWW DAT WUZ GUD/BAID". Reviewers will still be unaffected, and they can post footage of the game so if they find something worth noting they are allowed to show it. Let's admit it, we've all watched at least one Lets Play where initially we were going to purchase the game, but after it ended never felt the need to do so because we know how it ends.
This opinion is gonna be un-popular but hey, that's life, there's always conflicting ideas.
If I sound like that you may need to listen to yourself. You do know there's a difference between paying to enjoy something yourself and paying for something and using someone elses content to make a profit right? That's what the whole fair use and copyright thing is about.the hidden eagle said:
Maybe the publishers realised people are sick of hearing them whine about how piracy is destroying the industry for the n-th year in a row and they figured they might as well find another thing to blame for not making eleventy trillion dollars per game? Although in reality it's probably that they see people making money and decided that that money should be theirs because money.Emaruse said:
It's really weird though, because apparently the only people who have a problem with it are the multimillion dollar studios with commercial success under their belt (and Sega). They are getting advertisement for their games and someone else is paying the people doing the work.
It's like Google don't want gamers to use YouTube any more, although since they're forcing Google- down peoples throats they've already shown that they don't want anyone using the site.
I hate to see that this will affect the good LPers and hobbyists who just want to share what they do with people who like Let's Plays. Myself, I've actually bought a few games I would have otherwise ignored because of them. But at least in the U.S., copyright and trademark laws are a pair of odd ducks. They were intended to help the small business owner, the artist, etc. They don't anymore, usually due to good lawyers finding legal loopholes in the language. That's the nature of the world we live in. Plus, laws based on internet content are still somewhat fuzzy as there are few rules around what constitutes theft or inappropriate use in digital media. That too will change in time. For now this is a draconian measure by a corporation that still has time to influence law because the law doesn't yet understand the medium.
Are there good LPers? Yes. Are there bad ones? Of course. Myself, I just ignore the ones I don't like. Should they all be shut down, the ones who make money and are successful at this, even do it as their job, will simply find another way to do this and make money without much interference. What bothers me is that we may lose people who really have something to add, or to say about the hobby they enjoy and the medium involved, or who are making art from games. As an artist and author myself, would I like to see someone ripping off my work directly, taking what I worked hard at to make money for themselves, or scrub my name from it and claim the work as theirs? Hell no. But that's not much what is happening here. Quite a number of the good LP's have much more: extra video production, good narrative, opinions, extra voice work, comedy, etc. It's a whole new medium to make art (video in this case), and guess what folks, all art doesn't just come from nowhere - it's built on the shoulders of those who created other forms of art (in this case, digital). I'd love to LP myself someday, when I have the money to massively upgrade my PC and get all the associated programs and goodies to do better quality shows, which I do not have right now. Why? Because I enjoy gaming as a hobby and I see much artistic potential with the Let's Play. I'm sure there are others who also see it this way and will be harmed. Others still who couldn't are less I'm sure, but oh well. It's too bad really, such potential wasted. And Youtube is still the biggest site on the web for Let's Plays, therefore the one most likely to have new LPers get views from the general public, and that is not going to change for some time I think. And it's the general public's support, not the niche enthusiasts (unless they are large enough a group), that LPers need.
But then for Youtube it's not about art. It's about lawsuits and revenue loss.
Are there good LPers? Yes. Are there bad ones? Of course. Myself, I just ignore the ones I don't like. Should they all be shut down, the ones who make money and are successful at this, even do it as their job, will simply find another way to do this and make money without much interference. What bothers me is that we may lose people who really have something to add, or to say about the hobby they enjoy and the medium involved, or who are making art from games. As an artist and author myself, would I like to see someone ripping off my work directly, taking what I worked hard at to make money for themselves, or scrub my name from it and claim the work as theirs? Hell no. But that's not much what is happening here. Quite a number of the good LP's have much more: extra video production, good narrative, opinions, extra voice work, comedy, etc. It's a whole new medium to make art (video in this case), and guess what folks, all art doesn't just come from nowhere - it's built on the shoulders of those who created other forms of art (in this case, digital). I'd love to LP myself someday, when I have the money to massively upgrade my PC and get all the associated programs and goodies to do better quality shows, which I do not have right now. Why? Because I enjoy gaming as a hobby and I see much artistic potential with the Let's Play. I'm sure there are others who also see it this way and will be harmed. Others still who couldn't are less I'm sure, but oh well. It's too bad really, such potential wasted. And Youtube is still the biggest site on the web for Let's Plays, therefore the one most likely to have new LPers get views from the general public, and that is not going to change for some time I think. And it's the general public's support, not the niche enthusiasts (unless they are large enough a group), that LPers need.
But then for Youtube it's not about art. It's about lawsuits and revenue loss.
