Ending was so horrible for me it's undone not only ME3 but whole ME universe.
and "it's not about end it's about journey" is just a matter of opinion and preference. I actually value ending more than the "road". So yeah Me3 sucks hard in my opinion.
This is why people like choices and consequences - not just choices. It's easy to give the player a bunch of possible choices, but the mark of a well-written CRPG is that those choices actually mean something.
If I want to play Mass Effect for the story, I'll... I'll never want to play it for the story.
Shitting on shit does not make it exponentially shittier. The game is just fun, that's the only real draw for me. Also, more than half of the characters are well written, but that's about all the praise for the story that Bioware deserves.
Yes, Yes ME3 is a great game; with one of the most fucked up lazy endings to grace the ending of a major budget game. I enjoyed the game up until earth. After that it was just ham fisted and dull.
Hell, people would have raged left if after selecting one of the rainbow color endings the text "YOU ARE A WINNER!" flashed across the screen.
Edit: The end speech with Garrus was nice, but then again, anything dealing with Garrus was done with near perfection.
The problem is most people don't play Mass Effect for the gameplay. They play for the decisions, story, and how the two interact. The ending basically says "LAWL all your decisions are pointless only this last one matters!" Furthermore, you are dooming the entire galaxy in the end anyways. It takes months, even years, to travel between star clusters with just FTL drives. Without the relays every fleet in the galaxy is trapped in our solar system. Let me repeat that: Every single fleet in the galaxy is trapped around a post-apocalyptic Earth without enough food, fuel, or supplies to get home. The Quarians live on the other side of the effing galaxy, that will take decades to cross.
To many people who enjoy the series replaying it becomes pointless. Why should I replay the game when the galaxy is screwed anyways? Why should I care if the Quarians get destroyed by the Geth or not they are going to die in the end anyways? Why does curing the Genophage matter if the Krogan are going to be isolated and starve to death even as the breed like gerbils?
I could almost stomach the ending if it wasn't for that single glaring flaw. I could take the whole "Synthetics destroying organics so they don't make synthetics to destroy organics" crap. I could tolerate the whole explosion of the mass relays, an event with the same power as a supernova. I could even accept the merge organics and synthetics into reaper children 2.0.
This is why people like choices and consequences - not just choices. It's easy to give the player a bunch of possible choices, but the mark of a well-written CRPG is that those choices actually mean something.
Indeed. I would say however that there is an added dimension, information. choices only really work if we have some information as to what the consequences of our choices will be. We don't need to be all knowing, unexpected things can (and occasionally should) happen but generally we have to at least understand the expected result.
This is why people like choices and consequences - not just choices. It's easy to give the player a bunch of possible choices, but the mark of a well-written CRPG is that those choices actually mean something.
I suppose my real question is... how? What exactly makes the games unplayable now? I've seen the ending, I hate it...but the first thing I did was go back to mass effect 1 and start a brand new playthrough... I guess I just don't understand the reasoning here...
Because the ending pushes fatalism so far down your throat and so suddenly that you start to retch. In a nutshell, the ending did a spectacular job of robbing your choices of the impact the rest of the series promised they would have. No matter what you do: Villains dictate that you end the story on their terms, Mass Relays are destroyed, Victory Fleet trapped around a devestated planet, Normandy crashes on some unknown planet which they'll likely never get off of. Galactic Civilization dies with your final decision, and so too does the meat of your decisions...actually, I think I've made this argument somewhere before...ah, here it is.
In stories like this everything is building up to the ultimate payoff: The climax and its resolution, which should be the high point of the series. That's why plot diagrams show the climax at the peak. It is in that moment that everything you've been working towards is at its head, when all the cards are on the table and you're all in, waiting on that final card to be revealed. All conflicts at this point are at their worst, the battle is right at the gate and the audience's emotional investment is at its peak. Essentially, the climax and its aftermath are the most important parts of the story (which is hardlyunknownintheindustry), both because it represents the ultimate payoff that everything preceding it has been leading up to, and because it is the single moment that you will either captivate or alienate your audience, to say nothing of the fact that it effectively acts as the final impression your work leaves on the audience, which can and often does affect their overall opinion of the series.
In this case, there's a general perception of poor quality in the ending, which might have been forgivible if they'd included a denoument allowing for cathasis[footnote]of either the good or ill variety[/footnote] and closure, but that too is denied to the audience leaving them walking away from the series with a feeling of disappointment compounded by the outright nihilisitic undertones[footnote]Which is problematic in its own right, as that message runs in direct opposition to the general thrust of the series in both the in-universe and meta-sense, with the former being embodied by the series' mantra about unity triumphing over seemingly impossible odds (perhaps most triuphantly exhibited in the climax of Mass Effect 2, though it is repeatedly referenced throughout the games and acts as the main reason you assemble the Victory Fleet in the first place) and the latter embodied by the core gameplay mechanics of choice and consequence[/footnote] that effectively serves to ruin the very act of decision making throughout the series in the first place[footnote]Let's look at cause and effect
for a moment here:
You saved the Rachni in the first game? You do realize how much of a gamble that is, right? As the Turian on the council so succinctly put it, if you were wrong in your judgment then more than one generation will suffer for it...Nah, just kidding. There's no way for them to affect the rest of the galaxy after the Relays are destroyed, and they're probably going to all be dead within a year anyway. Sol can't support an intergalactic armada on its own. You reclaimed Rannoch for the Quarians? Congratulations, now they can finally return to their home and...oh wait, yeah, the Migrant Fleet's in the Sol system and Rannoch's in another arm of the galaxy...without the Relays no Quarian will ever see it again...especially considering that they and the Turians can't eat anything from our side of the galaxy...er...congratulations, they're screwed no matter what you did? Did you preserve the collector base? Well, rest assured that no matter what you did there, the results won't be any differnt in the end, as without the Omega-4 Relay nobody can even reach it. Incidentally, what happened to the council? Not that I care, I mean the relays where what allowed Galactic Civilization to exist in the first place. And what about that Genophage? Meh, either way it's not like they can affect the galaxy anymore anyways...
Effectively, the last few minutes of the game neuter the very thing that made Mass Effect's choice system so interesting: it removes the long-term ramifications of your actions[/footnote]. And unfortunately this conclusion colors the perception of the preceding events. This is hardly unheard of, mind you. How to put it...Have you ever seen the Sixth Sense? If yes, have you ever watched it again? If so, I expect your second viewing was very different from the first due to the way your knowledge of the ultimate reveal affected the way you viewed the scenes leading up to it. The same thing happens with Fight Club: You start looking at the movie differently because of what you know about the conclusion. Mind you, while these may have some of the clearest examples, the general sentiment applies to far more works than just these two. Applied in this case, what we see is the satisfaction of your initial choices being supplanted by the inevitable irrelevance they are given by the conclusion, ultimately (and unfortunately) making the use of a priorly beloved core gameplay mechanic feel hollow.
^ That. Read it. All of it. (Including the stuff below this) I don't think this can be explained any better.
There are much better 3rd person shooters out there with better mechanics if you want that. Holding Mass Effect 3 up for any narrative that came before the ending is futile because the ending destroys that too. All you have to really hold up is the gameplay/gunplay and there are games out there that do 3rd person shooters better. The narrative of everything prior to the ending was made hollow due to the ending ripping the guts out of it. The series is now a hollow shell.
I do think Mass Effect 3 is a really good game. As with the rest of the series. I just think that Bioware dropped the ball when it came to the last five or so minutes of the game. If Bioware made it so that it provided better closure according to my choices, I'd be happy overall with the final product.
Mass Effect 3 was a game about buildup. It wasn't one of those games where the journey is more important then the conclusion, the entire game was about mobilizing an army to fight the Reapers. I was expecting a strong ending where all of the fleets that I gathered participated in a massive battle that ended the Reapers for good. No Gods from the machine, no Chekhov's guns, just the army that I put together over 3 games vs the most powerful starships in history. But then the ending comes crashing through the door and proceeds to tell me that everything I've done over the past 3 games really doesn't matter and proceeds to shove 3 different colored endings that all screw over the galaxy to an equally horrifying extent into my face.
Mass Effect was not a game about magic and deity-like beings (and I wouldn't call the Reapers deity like because they can be destroyed conventionally). Mass Effect was always firmly grounded in (futuristic) reality, and now the only explanation for the endings is a God-Child did it. And the main reason I'm pissed isn't because I wanted a happy ending (which I still would've wanted and deserved after everything I've done), but it's because Shepard simply wasn't acting as himself. There's no way in fuck that Shepard would just give up and accept the B.S God-Child was feeding him. Shepard would turn right around and say right in that god damn little kids face, "I think the peace I've created between the Quarians and Geth is enough reason for me to not take what you're saying with a grain of sand. This conversation is over, just like your 'children'".
I returned Mass Effect 3 last week. I just can't bring myself to play another second knowing what lies at the end. All the friends I've made, all the people I've saved, all of the alliances I've formed, have all been shattered. The Mass Relay's exploding has effectively ended galactic civilization and has brought the world of Mass Effect backwards rather than expanding it. Goodbye, Mass Effect. I'm afraid I won't ever expose myself to anything Mass Effect related in the future, because such sights may reopen the hole in my heart that Mass Effect 3 has caused me.
Mass Effect 3 is NOT a great game and no, I'm not just referring to the abysmal ending.
EA, being the delightfull people that they are, decided it was a good idea to place an extremely tight chokehold on ME3's budget. Even though they KNEW it was going to be successfull, they decided to cheap out in order to get more profit, this results in a lot of cut corners which are very evident througout the game:
- The dialogue in the game has been "streamlined", which is a fancy way of saying carved into with a butchers knife. They basicly removed the 3rd neutral option in conversations since making extra speech would cost more money. You might say that you didn't use the neutral option much anyway (although I did) but this is supposed to be a ROLE PLAY game, the option should be there whether you use it or not.
- The dialogue is also less frequent, instead your treated to extremely long, uninterupted speech. Important lines will be given without the usual cinematic scene. Again this is to save time and money.
- Less Characters. Far less that the amazing ME2 selection. Far less interesting ones too. You might try make the excuse that they were off "doing their own thing" but they could easily have written them into the permanent cast if they wanted to. I believe you have 5 characters to choose from (less if they died on the suicide run. And no, the prothean does not count since you need to pay for him)
- A BROKEN QUEST SYSTEM IN AN RPG GAME. This is one of the deadly sins when it comes to gaming and is absolutely unforgivable. You are never told when your quest was completed. You are never told if you are even still eligable to finish the quest. Quests are mostly given through overhearing conversations (again, less dialogue scenes to save money)
- This might just count as bitching but I'm going to list it anyway. Tali's face. 6years I spent, invested in Tali's character. I wanted to know as much as I could about her, her people, her future with the Quarian fleet. Tali was the one that I chose to develop the romance with and to finally see her face and find out it was a poorly done photoshop on the most random stock photo I ever saw was a total slap in the face. It wasn't even a good photoshop image, they fucked up the hand, giving her an oposable thumb.
- The ending speaks for itself. This was again, done for financial purposes. Give it a few weeks and EAware will try to hock "they real ending" as DLC.
I could easily go on, but the fact that they cheaped out so much just shows how little respect EA has for it's own products. And yes, I say EA and not Bioware because Bioware was constantly asking for extra funding and time, to which EA obviously said "fuck no".
I'm by no means saying the game is terrible. But I fear people are overlooking it's other flaws simply due to the ending taking all the attention. It's good, but has a ton of problems that nobody ever seems to mention.
I did not think the ending was bad, but it did not make sense. I wish my choices meant something, but I have no clue how to interpret what happened. I just assume that there will be DLC and another future title to clarify, otherwise I suspend judgment. Other than the ending, I think the combat system is much better, the graphics and cutscenes are amazing, and the story is appropriately stressful and touching throughout. The other parts of the game are so well-concieved that I am playing through it again. The first time I did not import files, but this time I imported a file played through the first two games to see how my decisions in the earlier games affect those in the third. So far I am pleased with the world I created through my decisions. For those that thought the game was ruined by the ending, I ask would any ending live up to your expectations even if you did have to work for it?
I suppose my real question is... how? What exactly makes the games unplayable now? I've seen the ending, I hate it...but the first thing I did was go back to mass effect 1 and start a brand new playthrough... I guess I just don't understand the reasoning here...
Because you enjoy the games?
I've put over 20 playthroughs added up between Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2. That number will continue to rise, and I'll be replaying Mass Effect 3 just as much (I'll just quit when the big laser hits me from now on).
A big part of the enjoyment of the ME series was knowing or at least feeling like your play through was unique to you. That all the choices were your choices. That's the issue many are having, that you simply do not understand. No shame on you, people enjoy different things for different reasons, but at least attempt to understand other people's viewpoints.
- This might just count as bitching but I'm going to list it anyway. Tali's face. 6years I spent, invested in Tali's character. I wanted to know as much as I could about her, her people, her future with the Quarian fleet. Tali was the one that I chose to develop the romance with and to finally see her face and find out it was a poorly done photoshop on the most random stock photo I ever saw was a total slap in the face. It wasn't even a good photoshop image, they fucked up the hand, giving her an oposable thumb.
Haha Tali's face was hilarious. In a way picking a random stock photo is an even better troll than making her look like actually alien, because designing a weird alien would take effort. My favorite part about is that she's apparently unhelmeted on a planet.
The ending didn't show it, but you did cure the genophage. Or you didn't.
You did save both the Quarians and the Geth, or you didn't.
You did save all your crew member in ME2, or you didn't.
You don't need an ending to give you satisfaction for saving the Krogan. Did you even listen to the female Krogan? Did you hear Wrex saying that she's already pregnant? That was enough for me. I knew my choice did matter. I knew I saved a whole race from destruction.
When the Geth Prime came to me and offered their assistance to the Quarians, that feeling... I felt happy, no. Happy is to weak to describe it... I knew I did something good. I knew my choice was a good one. I almost cried because of happiness.
I don't care if the ending showed me if my choices mattered. I know, I felt, I saw that my choices mattered. I don't need a 3 minute long cut scene confirm that. I have 100+ hours of gameplay that confirm that and will always do.
Life=/=Game, but the game you play is part of your life. I don't just play the game. I live it. I enjoy it, I feel it. That's why an ending like the ME3 will never be able to leave scratch on my ME universe. Because I've seen my actions making the difference. Maybe not at the end, but surely during my gameplay.
And this isn't about what the game promised. It's about what it delivered and how the delivered part can ruin something that you already enjoyed.
And no, the whole idea wasn't to see how your choices make the difference.
The whole idea was to enjoy your choices.
-blahblah spoilers dont know how to do spoilertags yet-
So you are enjoying your choice of taking Wrex with you to Earth and never letting him see his children or the possible revitalization of his people?
Do you enjoy your choice of every organic race in your Fleet are stranded in a ruined system with and that they will never see their families or friends in the various hideouts around the galaxy because even with the traditional FTL drives it will take CENTURIES or MILLENIA to reach them?
- A BROKEN QUEST SYSTEM IN AN RPG GAME. This is one of the deadly sins when it comes to gaming and is absolutely unforgivable. You are never told when your quest was completed. You are never told if you are even still eligable to finish the quest. Quests are mostly given through overhearing conversations (again, less dialogue scenes to save money)
My lord this. I honestly think that this is perhaps the most baffling as it is the most obviously wrong. How did they fuck this up? Why didn't anyone say "Your quest system doesn't work"
Gosh, It just irritates me. I hope they patch it. They won't but I hope they do.
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