Medieval II Total War strategy help

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direkiller

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Rylot said:
How do you use archers effectively? Especially in sieges I try and get them to start hitting units on the walls but when I look at the end stat screen they only get a few paltry kills.
Archers are best used out in front to try and get the enemy to charge into your spear/pikes or to pick on a flank so you can crush there line easier for the wheel.

Shields can not be used while moving, so have them shoot moving units or units without shields.
If they only have shielded units pick packs of enemy's or units with smaller shields,even if they are more heavy armored.
 

Clowndoe

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direkiller said:
Shields can not be used while moving, so have them shoot moving units or units without shields.
If they only have shielded units pick packs of enemy's or units with smaller shields,even if they are more heavy armored.
That is incorrect, the unit remains shielded in front regardless of what the animation would have you think.
 

Adaephon

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For the economy side of things:

Take as many coastal cities as possible and develop their ports and wharfs quickly, sea trade is far more lucrative than land trade and it can't be blocked by brigands squatting on your roads.

Lower taxes as soon as you can afford to, it may seem counter intuitive but the population growth bonus from lower taxes (and the population boom bonus that can bring) will make more money in the long run than just having high taxes. It also allows you to leave smaller garrisons to keep order which will lower your upkeep costs.

Keep farms fairly well developed, don't bankrupt yourself on this but the money + the population bonus can add up over the game.

Loot every town (other than the smallest hamlets0 that you capture, the gold you get vastly outweighs the small population loss. Only occupy or exterminate a town if you're really trying to buff a general's chivalry or dread.

Ensure that your governors are top quality, and try and have as much chivalry as possible (easiest way is to go on crusades/jihads, usually gives about +5 or 6 chivalry) in your governors as that increases growth and order.

Don't try and make every town or castle do everything. There are plenty of areas where you will find a cluster of settlements within a days march from one another, for all intents and purposes these should be viewed as one mega city. have one castle in each of these clusters for infantry, one for cavalry, one for archers (of course some factions don't have much of all three unit types, so you could just have 3 infantry or 3 cavalry or whatever). Cities are the same way, some will be strictly economic, others will be developed for military (most of the best high-end units like musketeers or demi lancers can only be recruited from cities with maxed out barracks in the late game.) Not every city needs to be able to train every agent or unit, so don't waste your money pouring it into useless infrastructure until you've conquered half the world and can afford to spend anything you want.

Ensure high population growth through farms, low taxes, good governors and city halls, but make sure that you're not growing so fast that your cities become too unhappy too fast and revolt.
 

direkiller

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Clowndoe said:
direkiller said:
Shields can not be used while moving, so have them shoot moving units or units without shields.
If they only have shielded units pick packs of enemy's or units with smaller shields,even if they are more heavy armored.
That is incorrect, the unit remains shielded in front regardless of what the animation would have you think.
it's not the animation
Block chance is reduced on run/move command. Just like anti charge bonuses on spears and pikes.
Depending on the shield it can be reduced to nothing(Pavise shields).
It's also reduced when you hit the right side of a unit(missile or melee).
 

Chris Tian

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direkiller said:
Clowndoe said:
direkiller said:
Shields can not be used while moving, so have them shoot moving units or units without shields.
If they only have shielded units pick packs of enemy's or units with smaller shields,even if they are more heavy armored.
That is incorrect, the unit remains shielded in front regardless of what the animation would have you think.
it's not the animation
Block chance is reduced on run/move command. Just like anti charge bonuses on spears and pikes.
Depending on the shield it can be reduced to nothing(Pavise shields).
It's also reduced when you hit the right side of a unit(missile or melee).
You could both be right, it depends wich version we are talking about. The whole shield-bonuses-thing were pretty messed up in some versions and very rebalanced with vastly different outcomes between several versions. For instance the thing where shields only work on the shield side was bugged at one time and made exploiting the unshielded side of shield bearers impossible.

On the whole I think one should not think to much about shields or no shields when deciding which units to shoot at. Its far more important which unit you would rather not meet in melee.
 

Angelowl

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As a huge fan of the game that has loads of problems of time I will just mention the stuff I noticed myself as others have already given general tips.

I am a fan of the east roman faction (byzantines), the thing is that they happen to be one of the most difficult factions to play with enemies in all directions, close proximity to mongols and lack of hard counters to knights. I have a large contempt for the venicians who have nothing better to do but send armies in my direction with better spearmen, heavy crossbowmen and knights.

1. Send diplomats in all directions, try to make alliances with everyone possible. Your reputation gets ruined by prolonged warfare, but this is countered with stable alliances. You do not want to end up in a situation where everyone hates you, it is a lot easier if you can focus on one faction at a time. If you are catholic then an alliance with the Papal State is invaluable, due to increased popularity and the ability to call for crusades.

2. Merchants have zero upkeep and generate money, the result is fairly obvious. Check around the map for high value trade resources. After blitzing through Anatolia and capturing Antioch I realized that I had monopoly of all resources in Asia Minor and Egypt, that equals thousands of florens. Go for the trade nodes that no one is using, no need to manage and a garanteed boost to your economy.

3. Mercenaries, costs a lot but are often helpful. For the byzantines they are vital until you get access to proper infantry and heavy cavalry. Recruit them when you are fairly certain of a battle or seige. Use them to carry the rams and ladders during the seige and feel free to put them in the first line during battles. After major victories you should seriously consider disbanding them, 4-5 mercenary units have quite the upkeep.

4. Militia should be used to bolster the numbers and a lot times that is enough to turn the odds big time. Massing up a full stack of units and going on a raiding spree through a neighbour's country right after they declared war upon you will grant you loads of money and a peace treaty. Also helps when you need to occupy foreign lands as you don't have to spare any professional troops as garrisons.

5. Regarding battle tactics, learn the basics and keep them in mind at all times. Ranged attacks negate melee defense skill, attacks from the rear negate shields and armour piercing attacks halves all armour. This makes mounted archers and crossbowmen extremely lethal if you use them right. A basic cavalry archer with and ranged attack value of 6 will kill anything not in plate armour if you shoot them in the rear (even the pesky Dismounted Feudal Knights). Crossbows makes pikemen and halberdiers pretty useless imo as they will just massacre them (Which makes the Armoured Sergeants one of the most reliable infantry units in the game).
A note about the "Hold" command, it will cause the unit to hold formation regardless of events. Use this with spearmen or cost-effective swordsmen to recreate romanesque field tactics. Heavy spearmen in hold formation is a pretty darn good way to stopping heavy cavalry. Likewise an army with large amounts of Byzantine Infantry makes for a pretty reliable force all around. Nice to have in the important cities.

6. On army management consider veterancy. Keeping the units alive and retraining them will raise their experience, upgrade their armour and they will do very well in battle. Also consider cost-effectivity and versatility. Cost-efficiency combined with large quantities is what wins wars. Norse Archers is a unit that with upgraded armour is the equivalent of Norse Swordsmen, while still having a pretty decent bow. Most mid-range cavalry archers can be very flexible and difficult to counter at times. Militia Crossbowmen is a unit that is dirt cheap but with a fairly decent ranged armour piercing attack. Seriously consider using Mounted Sergeants or equivalent to support your knights, costs a fraction of the nobles while still being able to do a lot while flanking (in my first game ever my Mounted Sergeants got more kills than equivalent number of Mailed Knights).

A final note on settlements, with small towns it is usually far more profitable in the long run to have low taxes as it increases population growth.
 

Rylot

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I do appreciate all the advice. Things are making a lot more sense now. I see the usefulness in a balanced army and how to manage diplomacy and cities.

Few more questions I do have: How do you keep squalor down in your cities? Increase trading lanes?

Chris Tian said:
Recruit merchants and send them as far away as possible and station them at valuable resources. There are four very valuable silk "spots" around constantinople and a lot of valuable spices, slaves and ivory "spots" in north africa.
Don't get frustrated if they get taken out by opposing merchants just recruit new ones whenever you can. They can bring in thousands of gold each round.
Yeah it's taking a little while to figure merchants out. Will they just sit on a resource spot and generate that much gold per turn?

BloatedGuppy said:
EDIT: I see Tethalaki recommended Stainless Steel. I do as well. It's basically Medieval 2.5. You're getting basically the same experience, just...better. Like Jagged Alliance 2 1.13, it's one of those mods there is absolutely no reason not to have.
I'm very new to PC gaming. I only got into it because of some steam sales and to play some older games I missed out on (hence Medieval 2) and I downloaded SS6.3 from the site and ss6.4. It seemed like everything installed right but when I go to click on Stainless Steel 6.4 on the desktop I get the loading screen of a Templar Knight about to swing down and then it just goes right back to the desktop. No error messages or anything. The last thing I did with the loader was select which IA I wanted and what time period and a few other things. I've been looking through TWcenter's forums on the subject but before I go and start renaming my whole steam library does anyone know what could be the problem. I've got a fairly new HP laptop running Windows 7 (yay... :/)

So do all of the other factions come with the stainless steel mod? because people are talking about factions that I can't play with. From the vanilla grand campaign the only factions I can pick are: England, France, Venice, Holy Roman, and Spain. I've been playing the Kingdom's expansion Brittania campaign and having fun with Scotland (well until I have to go against Norway) but I only get the British Isles to fight on.

Anyway thanks for the advice guys!
 

Hades

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You can unlock other factions either by personally wiping them out or by completing the campaign.
 

Rylot

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Hades said:
You can unlock other factions either by personally wiping them out or by completing the campaign.
So if I win with Scotland they'll be playable in the main game?
 

Chris Tian

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Rylot said:
Yeah it's taking a little while to figure merchants out. Will they just sit on a resource spot and generate that much gold per turn?
Merchants, like all agents, have a skill level, higher skill level means more gold per round and a higher chance to buy out by other merchants/withstand the try to be bought out by them. The skill level rises from buying out other merchants or from sitting at a recourse.
The best way is to use them just let them sit at a valuable resource and only buy out other merchants if they are close by and the chances of sucess are really high.

When you have several high level Merchants sitting on valuable resources, they will SIGNIFICANTLY bolster your income.

Another tip is to recruit all your merchants, like all your other agents all at the same city. Recruting several agents of the same type in one city will result in the corosponding guild to offer you a guildhouse in that city. These guild houses will have positive effects on your city or even your whole faction and the agents you recruit in that city will start with a higher skilllevel.
 

Chris Tian

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Rylot said:
Hades said:
You can unlock other factions either by personally wiping them out or by completing the campaign.
So if I win with Scotland they'll be playable in the main game?
If you win a grand capmaign with any faction, all other factions are unlocked. You can unlock single factions by wiping them out in a grand capmaign, from that moment on they are playable without the need to win the whole campaign.
 

Nickolai77

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Rylot said:
How do I keep my faction profitable? I spend a lot my first few turns on roads for most cities and better units at my capital and a trade and population growth things. I try and leave a few thousand (whatever currency) in my treasury but then every turn after that it keeps dwindling.
It's not really the total amount of money in your treasury at a given turn you need to be concerned with, it is rather your overall income per term (revenues minus expenses) you need to be looking at on the finance screen and ensuring they generally stay positive.

If you need to increase revenues, build farms, ports, markets and upgrade roads and make trade agreements with other factions. If you need to cut on costs, disband unnecessary army and naval units. You can also convert castles into cities which will generate more revenue but not the unique units castles can train. As one poster said, if you play as a faction like England, you only need one castle on mainland Britain, so convert any you capture to cities.


How do you use archers effectively? Especially in sieges I try and get them to start hitting units on the walls but when I look at the end stat screen they only get a few paltry kills.
Yeah, archers arn't very effective against defenders holed up on a high castle wall, but if you're up against an enemy hiding behind a little palisade wall then archers can be quite effective for an attacker, just keep an eye out for sentry towers shooting at your archers and position them accordingly. When defending, archers are bloody invaluable of course, just don't expose them to meele combat on the walls.

As for archers in the field- I like to position them just in front of my main line of infantry and let them rain a few arrows down on the advancing attackers before having them withdraw behind my main line. This tactic tends to cause the enemy cavalry to charge at the archers though, so you need to be careful, but more often than not this is the enemy general. If you're clever, you can use this to your advantage and lure the enemy general into a trap.


Is it even worth taking cities and forts in the early game? Should I wait till I have some artillery? I usually try and take out a few rebel cities and I usually can but I loose so many units that it isn't really worth it.
It most certainly is worth sweeping up all the rebel settlements you can early in the game, they will in the long run add to your factions income significantly. If you're losing too many casualties taking these rebel settlements then reconsider and adapt your strategy and tactics in the field, it is not to do with your lack of artillery. The enemy AI, on normal difficulty, isn't that difficult to outmanoeuvre. In every battle and every siege, try to think how you can outflank the enemy, that's the best way to win.

Good luck and enjoy the game!
 

Clowndoe

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direkiller said:
it's not the animation
Block chance is reduced on run/move command. Just like anti charge bonuses on spears and pikes.
Depending on the shield it can be reduced to nothing(Pavise shields).
It's also reduced when you hit the right side of a unit(missile or melee).
Game's code disagrees with you, but for an easier look up you can see FAUST's unit guide.

Units do get a defensive debuff on the move, but it's not 0 shield. The shield is also 50% effective whether you hit them on the left or on the right.
 

direkiller

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Clowndoe said:
direkiller said:
it's not the animation
Block chance is reduced on run/move command. Just like anti charge bonuses on spears and pikes.
Depending on the shield it can be reduced to nothing(Pavise shields).
It's also reduced when you hit the right side of a unit(missile or melee).
Game's code disagrees with you, but for an easier look up you can see FAUST's unit guide.

Units do get a defensive debuff on the move, but it's not 0 shield. The shield is also 50% effective whether you hit them on the left or on the right.
read what I said again
at no point did I say the debuff was 0 shield, except for the Pavise shield.

Faust guide is out of date as far as the steam is conserned. Originally yes it was even on all sides, but that bug was fixed. Every Total war game excpet for shogun(which has no shields) gives you a debuff for getting hit on the right.
Rome 2 had a similar bug for a time at launch.
 

Clowndoe

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direkiller said:
Read what I said again
at no point did I say the debuff was 0 shield, except for the Pavise shield.
Oh, well I guess I started an argument for nothing. Good day.
 

BloatedGuppy

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Rylot said:
I'm very new to PC gaming. I only got into it because of some steam sales and to play some older games I missed out on (hence Medieval 2) and I downloaded SS6.3 from the site and ss6.4. It seemed like everything installed right but when I go to click on Stainless Steel 6.4 on the desktop I get the loading screen of a Templar Knight about to swing down and then it just goes right back to the desktop. No error messages or anything. The last thing I did with the loader was select which IA I wanted and what time period and a few other things. I've been looking through TWcenter's forums on the subject but before I go and start renaming my whole steam library does anyone know what could be the problem. I've got a fairly new HP laptop running Windows 7 (yay... :/)
Huh. Well, that's no good. You can try an earlier version of the mod, and/or try checking the forums for the mod as you've been doing to see if you can root out the problem there. Do believe me when I say the mod is well worth the effort of getting it working. I think it elevates Medieval 2 from a decent game to an all time classic.

Rylot said:
So do all of the other factions come with the stainless steel mod? because people are talking about factions that I can't play with.
Generally you unlock factions through combat, but with SS they'll all be unlocked.