Most Tragic Villain

[Outcast107]

Hello everyone. Today I was watching Nostalgia critic latest video about the top 11 batman episode. While watching it there name two (well mostly all of them, but I just want to talk about these two at the moment.) character that seem the most tragic out of all the villains.

The first one is Mr.Freeze. The second which I'm going to talk about is baby doll. Now I don't remember much about this character as she only had one episode but damn it was one hell of a episode. Though its mostly at the end that really makes this villain tragic.

Spoilers ahead.

Now baby doll is a woman who has a disease that won't let her grow up. So she mostly look like she five or six years old when she really 30ish. She was a huge star back in her 20ies when she was on a corny tv series about her being in a family while she was the youngest daughter. After the rating were going down she decide that she wanted to play bigger and better roles. Though she was a good actress, people didn't want her due to her appearance. So when she try to get back her old show it was to late and everyone move on. Though not baby doll.

Her entire life was in that show, that was her only role she could probably play in that made her feel right. So she gets a idea to kidnap the old crew and relive the show. So of course batman goes and save the day and here what happen at the end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUtLTxBYZHw

Anyways even though this character was mostly a one time villain it really spoke volumes of how she was tormented inside all her life due to her appearance. Anyways who do you think is the most tragic villain in any medium. That could be comic, book, TV shows, movies or games.

 

[Flailing Escapist]

Andrew Ryan. Everyday.

So much for wanting your own peaceful, capitalistic utopia.... Under the ocean

 

[AzureRaven]

As much as I hate to say it, because his attitude really bugs me...Porky from Mother 2 and 3 comes to mind. Didn't have the best childhood to be sure.

Though, I refuse to leave off with a character I dislike. So instead I'll say Duke from Tales of Vesperia. He did so much for humanity, only to have them betray him and slaughter his own friend. Just because they were afraid of them.

EDIT: I'd go into more detail...but 1) I'm lazy 2) Spoilers.

 

[StarStruckStrumpets]

Quite possibly Victor Delacroix from Chaos Legion.

He relentlessly pursued his best friend for killing his fiancee, so blinded by rage he couldn't recall the true events that took place. Only in his dying moments, about to release the world's greatest evil did he see that, while possessed by the very evil he was about to release, he attacked his best friend, and his fiancee saved his life by jumping in front of the blade.

Realizing this, he tosses himself from the platform, committing suicide, having just unleashed an unstoppable evil.

Edit: I forgot to mention, the reason he's releasing this being is because he believes it can resurrect his fiancee.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

The portrayal of Doc Ock in Spiderman 2 was pretty tragic.

Although there is also Golem from Lord of the Rings. Even at his most evil you can't help but pity him.

 

[weker]

the Homunculus from Full metal alchemist brotherhood, they are made with one emotion in mind and are bent to its cruel will.

Spoiler: FMA brotherhood spoilers

Each of their deaths was insanely sad and cruel gluttony sobbing wondering confused, but fin hell envy ripping her own heart out due to being alone and weak was heart ripping for me and I dont get effected by much

 

[Hawk of Battle]

I recently started the Horus Heresy novels, so I'm gona go with the Primarch Fulgrim. Man that dude had a raw fucking deal.

Spoiler

Slowly corrupted and made insane by a Chaos Deamon of Slaanesh, tricked into turning against his father and killing his closest brother, then right after, realsiing what he's done and begging the deamon for oblivion. Instead the deamon takes complete control of his body and shoves Fulgrims consciousness to the back of their shared mind, leaving him trapped inside his own body, fully aware and sane, forced to watch for 10,000 years as the deamon rapes, tortures and brutalises half a galaxy for its own sadistic pleasure and drawing even more pleasure from Fulgrims constant screaming.

And nobody else knows what's happened to him, the rest of the galaxy just thinks Fulgrim turned evil, they have no idea he still exists, trapped inside his own head.

Talk about a fate worse than death.

 

[DEAD34345]

Wow... that video really was depressing. I recently watched Dr. Horrible, and that was kinda tragic. I think most villains have those tragic back-stories, but it would be hard to top that video.

Andrew Ryan. Everyday.

So much for wanting your own peaceful, capitalistic utopia.... Under the ocean

Uh... no, actually. He only created Rapture for his own ends, and his ideals were not capitalist, he was into objectivism. From what I gather, that basically means your only goal in life is to serve yourself and no-one else. He was a douchebag who cared about nothing but his own interests, and he got what was coming to him when that all collapsed around him.

Someone who follows objectivism would never create a society for like-minded objectivists (not sure if that's a real word) to live in, because doing something for other people is exactly what that philosophy opposes.

 

[Azaez]

The Joker..it should be obvious that the Joker had some messed up things happen to him cause the dude is a lunatic...plus his face is disfigured and has paint on it all the time...then he gets punched and thrown around by Batman...

 

[Lono Shrugged]

Darth Vader, y'know before the prequels came out and made him look like a gullible idiot. (I still kinda like the prequels though)

It's weird, I was replaying Arkham Asylum earlier and was thinking about how many of Batman's enemies have tragic enough backstories, Freeze, Poison Ivy, Two-Face, Ra's al Ghul even Joker if you believe Alan Moore. It can really make a cool villain if it is done well and if you take any awesome three dimensional rounded villan they usually have an understandable motivation. Neil Gaiman even managed to make the Devil into an anti-hero and I highly recommend the Sandman comics (Season of Mists for what I'm talking about.)

edit: Oh and Mordred from the Dark Tower series. If you read it you know what I mean, if you haven't then I'm not spoiling it.

man I could go on and on with this, I love a good villain.

 

[Flailing Escapist]

Andrew Ryan. Everyday.

So much for wanting your own peaceful, capitalistic utopia.... Under the ocean

Uh... no, actually. He only created Rapture for his own ends, and his ideals were not capitalist, he was into objectivism. From what I gather, that basically means your only goal in life is to serve yourself and no-one else. He was a douchebag who cared about nothing but his own interests, and he got what was coming to him when that all collapsed around him.

Someone who follows objectivism would never create a society for like-minded objectivists (not sure if that's a real word) to live in, because doing something for other people is exactly what that philosophy opposes.

Thats kinda why I struck it out.

He was trying to create a world free of the oppressions of goverment and religion. And even tho he failed at that and became the villain a villain he was still, in my mind one of the most tragic villains I could think of. Because hey, who doesn't want to live free of the restrictive straps of the "enlightened" man?

Yeah, he probably got what was coming to him when his world collapsed around him. But isn't that the tragedy?

 

[Snowblindblitz]

Wiegraf from FFT. I felt bad with everything Ramza causes to happen to him. In the end, he consumes himself.

 

[Angryranter101]

Joker. Imagine this, you lose your wife and baby, you have no job, no hope and still have to do a job for the mob or you'll be killed. You watch your companions die in a hail of bullets, get shot at yourself and then a giant demonic Bat is sent to punish you so you jump into acidic water to escape, scarring yourself permanently both physically and mentally. Now your so afraid of this Bat you have to kill it but you so want to die, to be free, that you try your very best to get him to kill you, laughing to block the tears all the way. You only want to make people laugh and you don't understand why your not a star and why everyone isn't laughing with you, but you try and you try but to no avail. You plead your case to him and you get nothing back and are faced with the idea that maybe, just maybe, you were the only one who broke, that all this is due to your weakness not mankind's inherent flaws and the madness of the world.

Then you kill him, your one chance to be free is here, you find a girl, a job, plan to get married and move away. The nightmares of an evil clown cutting your face and a giant bat coming to punish you persist though and you almost strike your fiancée. You leave, you try and eventually you decide to move away only to draw out a paper by accident with one thing on the cover. The Bat, the nightmare, the punishment you've been running from all your adult life is on the cover with two words "He's back" and then it comes back, to face it down to protect you until its finally done, the clown cuts his way out again. In the heat of the moment you remember, just for a second and tell it, the beast that's stalked you for so long, that he'll never take her from you again. Then you forget and fall back into giggles and tears.

Penguin gets a shout out for being bullied, constantly and totally all his life until one day his only comfort, his birds, either are taken from him by the bullies when he finally stands up for himself or he kills them when one of them pecks him. He wakes up from the blind rage and sobs apologies but their gone OR he's now forever being laughed at and bullied unless he strikes first, and so goes his only chances of peace. Then he finds someone, a slave he buys and truly loves until she calls him a monster as he begs her not to after finding out who he really is. He sells her back into slavery, despite loving her, and resumes his old life where the women he's with mean nothing and his possessions and wealth even less. All he has is running from the bullies and striking them down first whenever he can.

Final mention to Buddy from the Incredibles "Fly home Buddy, I work alone" are the words that tore him apart. He only ever wanted to help him and in the end, he was right, he was only respected then because he was a threat. He learnt from Mr Incredibles abuse not to trust anyone, especially your heroes.

 

[CrashBang]

The Joker..it should be obvious that the Joker had some messed up things happen to him cause the dude is a lunatic...plus his face is disfigured and has paint on it all the time...then he gets punched and thrown around by Batman...

The basic idea of Joker is that he's the representation of lunacy and insanity. He doesn't think logically and so is capable of anything. It makes him the perfect yin to Batman's yang.
However, in the 80s, Alan Moore established a backstory for him in The Killing Joke. Joker was a failed comedian who was unable to support his family. He decided to join a small-time criminal group and help them steal something from his old workplace. A young Batman stops him and he falls into a vat of chemicals. Boom, Joker born.
So yeah, his backstory is sad but I don't feel for him.

OT: Bane is pretty horrific. Born and raised in prison to live out his fathers sentence.
Both Sephiroth and Kuja from the FF games are pretty sad cases too. Unnatural births, feel like they don't belong, hate the world because of it. Sucks to be them.

 

[Sinclair Solutions]

Wow... that video really was depressing. I recently watched Dr. Horrible, and that was kinda tragic. I think most villains have those tragic back-stories, but it would be hard to top that video.

Andrew Ryan. Everyday.

So much for wanting your own peaceful, capitalistic utopia.... Under the ocean

Uh... no, actually. He only created Rapture for his own ends, and his ideals were not capitalist, he was into objectivism. From what I gather, that basically means your only goal in life is to serve yourself and no-one else. He was a douchebag who cared about nothing but his own interests, and he got what was coming to him when that all collapsed around him.

Someone who follows objectivism would never create a society for like-minded objectivists (not sure if that's a real word) to live in, because doing something for other people is exactly what that philosophy opposes.

I think you are oversimplifying him. Ryan was a ruthless business man who loved money and such, but he would not spend his fortune creating a city just so he could milk the money out of people. That's more of Fontaine's thing.

Ryan is very similar to John Galt, the character from Rand's Atlas Shrugged. Both follow the ideals of objectivism but wish to create a society to allow the gifted to persist, like Rapture was. But Ryan is tragic because he becomes the way you describe him. In Rapture's creation, Ryan was the ideal objectivist: working for his own ends, but allowing his genius and business sense to flourish and benefit the world around him. Tenenbaum is probably a good example of this as well. Working without the restrictions of society, she not only benefits her career by making fantastical discoveries, but these discoveries benefit society as well. That is what objectivism is (in a very generalized sense): working for yourself without the restrictions of others, but allowing your work to benefit society. As time went on, Ryan and his ideals became more severe and radical, to the point where he viewed any sense of help or compassion as communism and slavery.

But I agree with the original poster here, seeing a man whose city is reduced to chaos, whose values are corrupted and radicalized, and

Spoiler

whose brainwashed son eventually beats him to death

is a good example of tragedy. He is a man who went from hero to villain. From free man to tyrant. All because fate and the people around him working against him ("The Great Chain is being pulled away from me. Perhaps I should give it a tug.")


OT: My suggestion would be the Joker from the Killing Joke. The way Moore explained the "one bad day," it seems somewhat reasonable that the Joker becomes insane.

 

[DEAD34345]

Thats kinda why I struck it out.

He was trying to create a world free of the oppressions of goverment and religion. And even tho he failed at that and became the villain a villain he was still, in my mind one of the most tragic villains I could think of. Because hey, who doesn't want to live free of the restrictive straps of the "enlightened" man?

Yeah, he probably got what was coming to him when his world collapsed around him. But isn't that the tragedy?

Well, what I was trying to say is that he wasn't trying to create a world free of oppressions, he was simply trying to further his own goals. He just wanted to be the boss of his own society, and as soon as things started to turn against him he started making laws for his supposedly "free" society in order to maintain control. Really, he was just a dictator, and his society was free of laws and regulations until the moment that stopped working in his favour.

I don't think it was tragic, mainly because his motivations were all selfish and he was dick right from the start. He didn't want to be "free of the restrictive straps of the "enlightened" man", he wanted to be that man.

 

[Airsoftslayer93]

Snape, not truly a villain, but definaitly fits.

 

[Snowblindblitz]

Joker. Imagine this, you lose your wife and baby, you have no job, no hope and still have to do a job for the mob or you'll be killed. You watch your companions die in a hail of bullets, get shot at yourself and then a giant demonic Bat is sent to punish you so you jump into acidic water to escape, scarring yourself permanently both physically and mentally. Now your so afraid of this Bat you have to kill it but you so want to die, to be free, that you try your very best to get him to kill you, laughing to block the tears all the way. You only want to make people laugh and you don't understand why your not a star and why everyone isn't laughing with you, but you try and you try but to no avail. You plead your case to him and you get nothing back and are faced with the idea that maybe, just maybe, you were the only one who broke, that all this is due to your weakness not mankind's inherent flaws and the madness of the world.

Then you kill him, your one chance to be free is here, you find a girl, a job, plan to get married and move away. The nightmares of an evil clown cutting your face and a giant bat coming to punish you persist though and you almost strike your fiancée. You leave, you try and eventually you decide to move away only to draw out a paper by accident with one thing on the cover. The Bat, the nightmare, the punishment you've been running from all your adult life is on the cover with two words "He's back" and then it comes back, to face it down to protect you until its finally done, the clown cuts his way out again. In the heat of the moment you remember, just for a second and tell it, the beast that's stalked you for so long, that he'll never take her from you again. Then you forget and fall back into giggles and tears.

Penguin gets a shout out for being bullied, constantly and totally all his life until one day his only comfort, his birds, either are taken from him by the bullies when he finally stands up for himself or he kills them when one of them pecks him. He wakes up from the blind rage and sobs apologies but their gone OR he's now forever being laughed at and bullied unless he strikes first, and so goes his only chances of peace. Then he finds someone, a slave he buys and truly loves until she calls him a monster as he begs her not to after finding out who he really is. He sells her back into slavery, despite loving her, and resumes his old life where the women he's with mean nothing and his possessions and wealth even less. All he has is running from the bullies and striking them down first whenever he can.

Final mention to Buddy from the Incredibles "Fly home Buddy, I work alone" are the words that tore him apart. He only ever wanted to help him and in the end, he was right, he was only respected then because he was a threat. He learnt from Mr Incredibles abuse not to trust anyone, especially your heroes.

Alan Moore never meant his story as definitive: merely a version in the Joker's fragmented mind.

I still don't know, for sure, how tragic the joker is. He himself admits to enjoying having a multiple choice memory of events. Buddy was a good point too though. His character really personified a big issue in comics, mainly, the one you state.

 

[Monkestful]

Saren Arterius.

The guy was just trying to help, then got brainwashed, then kept trying to help in his own new brainwashed way.