My thoughts for improving MMORPGs(specifically WOW)

[spartan231490]

So, a lot of people are leaving wow, most often complaining that:
A) It's too easy, and it's not about skill or learning to play the game better, it's just about how much time you throw at the game.
B) It's all about gearscore, not about skill
C) All of the players are Idiots

So, I had a thought on how to at least help alleviate these problems, and I wondered what the esteemed gamers here at the escapist thought.

I will address B because it is the easiest to talk about. I don't think you can fix this directly, players need some objective way of judging each other, so either you need to introduce some sort of skill rating into the game, which sounds almost impossible, or the players will judge each-other by gear. The only way to alleviate this IMO, is to make gear harder to get, by fixing A.

A) Rewarding players for skill is very infeasable in an MMO, with the amount of time many players sink in, they will get that reward no matter how unskilled they are. You don't need to be a sniper to hit the target if he stand still while you fire 200 rounds. So, rewarding players for skill is just not enough, you need to also penalize them for lack of skill.

I was thinking, that if every time you died you lost a huge chunck of exp, say 25%-50%, and you then made dying a real possibility, then only players with skill will be able to reach the highest levels. You also need to make dying a real possibility, and I think the best way to do this is to prevent players from getting exp from something with no challenge, like killing boars in the forest until level 80. Wow already does this, but it should be even more so. You shouldn't get any exp from killing monsters or completing quests that are below your level, and quests/monsters of your level and maybe even your level +1 should only reward you half.

Also, to clarify, I don't think this loss of exp should make you lose levels, it should just bestow -exp, so that you have to regain the lost experience, on top of getting the exp to level, and all without dying again and pushing the goal even further away. I feel like this would add a real feeling of accomplishment to a level, not just: oh cool new abilities.

WOW also shouldn't give such good gear just as rewards for quests. You should either have to keep running dungeons long enough to get the random drops, or go on equipment quests that give no exp but instead reward you with gear.

Again, this would give a real feeling of accomplishment for having good gear. and the feeling of accomplishment is what keeps players playing.

You could take it one step further and not give gameplay rewards for any of the professions, just RP/style rewards. Like, instead of allowing Blacksmiths to make armor and get more jewel slots, instead they can reforge armor and weapons so that you get the exact same stats but you can change the appearance to match any armor/weapon in the same class that you have the pattern for. Same with tailoring and leather-working. I don't personally suggest this, but it could be done.

C) Sorry folks, but you can't fix stupid. But hopefully these changes would at least keep the stupidity in the lower levels or force them to at least learn enough about their classes to not be a burden to the group.

so, tell what you think, would this make it any more entertaining, or is it all just a waste of time.

 

[ankensam]

so make the level up system like call of duty

 

[spartan231490]

so make the level up system like call of duty

How is that anything like what I posted? Or is that your idea? and if so what do you mean by it?

 

[Blindrooster]

Sounds a little hardcore. the exp loss and making the game harder would cause you to lose alot of casual gamers.

 

[ankensam]

i realized how it would work base leveling up on kill death ratio that way bad players get punished and good players get rewarded

 

[Tanakh]

A) It's too easy, and it's not about skill or learning to play the game better, it's just about how much time you throw at the game.
B) It's all about gearscore, not about skill

I keep hearing this, and it quite frankly makes me sad.

Sorry to say this, but to be top 10 in arena/rated BG's or to be at a top 100 raiding guild you need to be good; and no, it doesn't require that much time, in WotLK it took me a lot of time to learn to arena and find a good partner, after that you can get the points and the glad title playing 2-4 hours a week, in Cata it took a big push to ensure a raid spot at a top 500 USA guild, after that I played around 8 hours a week.

If you suck at WoW, just try to get better or quit! I am quite average at SFIV, worse, subpar, but work a little every week to improve.

 

[Rawne1980]

While I do think some of your ideas sound good (especially the XP loss, most of us have played games like that in the past) I think there is one problem that no one can fix.

The players.

You make the game hard, you tell people you will be making it hard, you tell people you will have harsh punishments for death and then it will begin.

Even though they already know all these things the forums and your mailbox will be full of whining that it's too difficult and that the punishment is too harsh.

Then will come the word I hate the most (but only just beating "noob", seriously? people actually still believe "noob" is an insult? morons) that word is "nerf". As soon as something requires using an actual thought process in a game it becomes too difficult for some poeople but thats not their fault, oh no, it's yours. So the cries for nerfs will be long and loud until it's so simple you could put your cat on your keyboard while you go for a piss and it will clear a dungeon for you.

While the fix for stupidity is a long way off, until it arrives, we're stuck with games that will only get more simplified as more and more knuckle dragging, drooling, howl at moon halfwits get access to PC's and consoles. Then they will grow up and maybe breed spawning more semi intelligent troglodytes that will want to game aswell.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

Losing xp for dying?

No. A thousand, thousand times NO.

Wow is popular because its easy to get to the level cap.

Also, people are leaving because the game is easy? People are leaving because the game is too difficult for them.

Seriously, have you played at all?

EDIT:

Seriously, rereading this, it sounds like you got all your info about WoW from the South Park episode.

 

[viranimus]

Honestly It sounds like you want WoW to become Everquest. Seriously, xp loss Death penalty? Less instant gratification rewards. Related to wows game experience? Seriously your basically describing everquest. Not that its a bad thing for WoW to aspire to. Hell considering they stole everything else from EQ they might as well steal that too.

Ok if those 3 points are the problem heres some alternative fixes.

1: Create content that is extremely challenging but limited to single player interaction (such as Race/class specific quests) that must be completed solo in instance. Also make the rewards from those solo trials be practically prerequisite gear for raid content (such as epic weapon/gear and along with it, key/flag system for unlocking high end dungeons). This helps to ensure that the player in question has compulsory prerequisite knowledge that is essential for doing higher end content. This effects both the difficulty of the game, as well as the players are idiots.

2: Make it impossible to inspect any players equipment and allow for "dress" gear. Actually there is no reason why other players need to know what gear/skill you have. More often than not you will find idiots in the shiniest gear, and the best actual players will be wearing junk held together by duct tape and willful determination by comparison. If you need a case example of this, look at FFXI. It is the pinnacle of instant player judgment. Before you even get a group you WILL be inspected for gear as well as job/sub job combination, and in most cases you will need to provide a CV of what sub skills you have and what food/drink your carrying... Just to get a group. If you remove the ability for other players to "inspect" then you force players to be more open and experimental with who they interact with and you move away from "avatar resumes"

Honestly thats two of the easiest and most efficient fixes right there. those two things would help alleviate a lot of the community based problems within MMOs leaving the most of any lingering problems repairable on dev/content level.

Other thought: Development side.. one massive thing that needs to change with MMOs is the notion that in order to be "good" you need to be ranked. Removal of ranking measures needs to be implemented immediately. Its useless information that only has negative effects on the game and the community, especially because it rarely if ever has any representation of actual skill as much as it is representative of social networking and having people hand you shit. Get rid of the ePeen tools, this isnt call of duty were talking about.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

ignore this Post, the site hicupped.

 

[Doctor Glocktor]

2: Make it impossible to inspect any players equipment and allow for "dress" gear. Actually there is no reason why other players need to know what gear/skill you have. More often than not you will find idiots in the shiniest gear, and the best actual players will be wearing junk held together by duct tape and willful determination by comparison. If you need a case example of this, look at FFXI. It is the pinnacle of instant player judgment. Before you even get a group you WILL be inspected for gear as well as job/sub job combination, and in most cases you will need to provide a CV of what sub skills you have and what food/drink your carrying... Just to get a group. If you remove the ability for other players to "inspect" then you force players to be more open and experimental with who they interact with and you move away from "avatar resumes"

Thats a legitimately awful idea.

If were talking about WoW, like the OP then you need skill AND gear in order to do advanced content. By not being able to check out what the other players have done and how strong their gear is, you're shooting yourself in the foot, especially when it comes to the more difficult raids and higher level PvP.

 

[Instant K4rma]

Actually, there is quite a bit of skill required in an MMO. Have you ever tried main healing an end game raid (or a difficult heroic, for that matter)? Not a very easy task.

As for gearscore, it has to be implemented to some degree. You can't have a fresh 85 in lv 82 greens queuing up to tank the new Firelands raid. as good of a tank he might be aggro management wise, he just does not have the gear to keep himself sustained in that high of a raid. It just doesn't work.

Unfortunately, I stopped reading at point C. When you insult an entire group of people's intelligence based off of what games they decide to play, it really goes a long way in the validation of the point you are making.

 

[Lucyfer86]

Gearscore? It's been dead since end of WotLK.

I have such high hopes on Guild Wars 2 to be perfect MMORPG(fanboi talk!), so i don't have anything to contribute on this thread tho. I agree that something should be done to WoW, keeps getting worse. Revert servers back to TBC or Vanilla and everything will fine.

 

[SecretsOfMoon]

Sounds like the OP is missing the good ol' days of vanilla, and I kind of sympathise as to me atleast since then the game got less and less fun with each expansion. Also back then shamans were totally OP.

 

[jumjalalabash]

Exp loss does nothing but annoy players into quitting before high levels because their is no good reason for it. Keeping players from getting all the content is not fun.

Honestly It sounds like you want WoW to become Everquest. Seriously, xp loss Death penalty? Less instant gratification rewards. Related to wows game experience? Seriously your basically describing everquest. Not that its a bad thing for WoW to aspire to. Hell considering they stole everything else from EQ they might as well steal that too.

Ok if those 3 points are the problem heres some alternative fixes.

1: Create content that is extremely challenging but limited to single player interaction (such as Race/class specific quests) that must be completed solo in instance. Also make the rewards from those solo trials be practically prerequisite gear for raid content (such as epic weapon/gear and along with it, key/flag system for unlocking high end dungeons). This helps to ensure that the player in question has compulsory prerequisite knowledge that is essential for doing higher end content. This effects both the difficulty of the game, as well as the players are idiots.

2: Make it impossible to inspect any players equipment and allow for "dress" gear. Actually there is no reason why other players need to know what gear/skill you have. More often than not you will find idiots in the shiniest gear, and the best actual players will be wearing junk held together by duct tape and willful determination by comparison. If you need a case example of this, look at FFXI. It is the pinnacle of instant player judgment. Before you even get a group you WILL be inspected for gear as well as job/sub job combination, and in most cases you will need to provide a CV of what sub skills you have and what food/drink your carrying... Just to get a group. If you remove the ability for other players to "inspect" then you force players to be more open and experimental with who they interact with and you move away from "avatar resumes"

Honestly thats two of the easiest and most efficient fixes right there. those two things would help alleviate a lot of the community based problems within MMOs leaving the most of any lingering problems repairable on dev/content level.

Other thought: Development side.. one massive thing that needs to change with MMOs is the notion that in order to be "good" you need to be ranked. Removal of ranking measures needs to be implemented immediately. Its useless information that only has negative effects on the game and the community, especially because it rarely if ever has any representation of actual skill as much as it is representative of social networking and having people hand you shit. Get rid of the ePeen tools, this isnt call of duty were talking about.

Those is nothing but horrible worthless ideas.

1) Make solo only content for a MMO, that kind of misses the whole point of being an MMO if you don't have to worry about other people bothering you while questing. Also if you knew anything about WoW key/attunement systems to unlock dungeons are nothing but obnoxious pain in the asses of players. Also doing solo content to unlock raids for 10/25 people is again contrary to what is an MMO is suppose to be.

2) Don't ever make an MMO for this is an idea that would basically ruin any form of player interaction based content. Making people risk dealing with idiots who don't have the needed gear to go into content on the batshit notion that lower gear = higher skill is mind numbing for me to even think about. That will do nothing but make players isolate themselves more so to smaller groups of people knowing that to try new people means they have to risk dealing with ill equipped morons.

Those ideas are deal breakers on any long term subscribers. To say those would help community problems when those are riot inducing concepts is just stupid.

Also remove ranking? Why? Try that with something like Starcraft 2 PvP. To make everyone have a fair chance of getting into a fight with anyone is just going to result in new players not bothering because of the fear of getting curb stomped by pros, and make pros annoyed to shit when they have to waste their time fighting people who can't even touch them.

Never get into making online games. Ever.

 

[queek]

well my opion is to please blizzard do something with the boring places that are just sitting there and you havent changed anything also get new fishing and cooking dalies the ones we have are getting boring more changes to get orbs especially

 

[Lucyfer86]

Gearscore? It's been dead since end of WotLK.

I have such high hopes on Guild Wars 2 to be perfect MMORPG(fanboi talk!), so i don't have anything to contribute on this thread tho. I agree that something should be done to WoW, keeps getting worse. Revert servers back to TBC and everything will fine.

Not the new Star Wars MMO? Sorry, but your avatar kind of suggests you love Bioware games...

Anyhow, thinking about it, it isnt that long until that games being released and it looks like very little people are looking forward to it.

I wont play it because I no longer like MMOs, but eh. Will be interesting to see it blow up/flop.

Well i love some Bioware games yes, but i don't care that much about Star Wars universe (tho movies are great, yeah). And i've decided that i'm not gonna play another montly sub based mmo after WoW. So apart from many reasons, that is the one why i'm so hyped about Guild Wars, being able to play free after initial buying.

 

[MrPop]

I haven't played since WotLK but I think the levelling was fine.

You wouldn't have to be skilled to avoid death penalties since you don't die much levelling unless you're over-ambitious with your pulls.

The end-content is the only thing that should be tweaked assuming WoW is now too easy (although I've heard the heroics etc are quite challenging).

I have a dream that one day on the red hills of Westfall, the sons of former 'noobs' and the sons of former 'leet players' will be able to sit down together at the table of brotherhood.