Nintendo is kiddy, yet most of their franchises are very neutral

[V8 Ninja]

A Useful Tip; People like to exaggerate and simplify facts. Also, it doesn't really help that lots of those series have fairly long hiatuses, especially compared to Nintendo's more family-friendly franchises.

 

[floppylobster]

You know what's 'kiddy'? Calling things 'kiddy'.

It's like when people call other people 'brainy'. Couldn't think of the word intelligent? That's just being a dumby.

 

[Something Amyss]

Where do people get this weird idea that because something is made for kids adults can't enjoy it.

Well, gaming (both a lot of the industry and a lot of the fans) crave legitimacy, and you don't get that by making things kids can enjoy. Remember, a good chunk of nerd culture is berated for facination with things aimed at kids. It's not the only defining trait of the nerd, but it's why we have bronies who yell about a show aimed at kids not catering to them.

Sorry, bronies, you were the only group I could think of. No offense.

We don't just act this way about things made for kids, but also things with similar elements. Anime is considered childish because cartoons. Games are some sort of weird Shrodinger's media, where people seem to think that it's both kiddy and child-like (as opposed to childish) and mature, gory and sexual.

I swear, I think a lot of people believe Mario and Call of Duty are the same franchise.

And, if I might tangent a little, there's a lot of "everything but" examples. A lot of people are like "I don't like kids movies, but [Pixar movie here]..." or "I don't like children's books, but Harry Potter...." Like they have to preface this stuff to remain legit.

But then, I don't buy into it myself, so whatever. I've never got stuck in a child's vehicle, but then, I was usually too big for kid's stuff as a kid (since I'm now 6'5", you can extrapolate backwards). I do, however, have a sonic screwdriver sitting about six inches from my left hand. Mario games are still fun, no matter the audience, bright colours can be pretty, and if a product is good, it doesn't matter if it's aimed at kids.

But I think part of the problem is that kids' media has become patronising in a way it didn't used to be. Oh, it was never particularly 'mature', but I think a good chunk of it has been downgraded. In a way, it's sort of like the 'dumbed down' argument people make about gaming.

 

[Something Amyss]

Honestly, I cant believe people even use the word 'kiddy' as an adjective. It sounds almost like a slur.

Which is the only reason people care. "Your media is kiddy. It's for little kids. You must be a baby!"

Nobody would give a damn if it weren't for the negative connotation.

 

[PoolCleaningRobot]

I apologize, looks like I got things mixed up in my head with some other post before I decided to send a reply. I do agree with what you said. I consider that Nintendo makes many "mature" games, they're just that kind of mature topics (family friendly some say) that can be discussed in front the whole family. As you said, that grants the company the "for kids" label coming from some boobies-hardcore gamers, which is funny and sad at the same time.

I should apologize for flying off the handle a bit. I've seen a lot people make the argument that anything can be presented in a way thats "family friendly" and thus Nintendo games aren't "missing anything" which I think is bullshit. Its also hard to describe what I'm trying to talk about because "family-friendly" and "mature" can have wildly different connotations. I simply wish Nintendo would make more games for an "adult" audience like they used to. Its not that I think they're family friendly games are bad, I just want more than that.

Anyway please accept this gif of a cat riding a turtle as my apology

Spoiler

I'm curious, what does this game you mentioned to show that was is bad for everybody? Sounds like it has a much more solid than... certain others.

Spec Ops the Line starts off like most military fps's, 'Murica gonna save the day bla, bla, but subtle changes are introduced into the gameplay and story that make it different. Its a bit more fun to play it for yourself but if don't want to, then just click this spoiler block

Spoiler

The most infamous part is the "White Phosphorus scene". Things have already taken a turn for the worse but this scene could be seen as a jumping off point into fucked up war land. You control white phosphorus bombs (basically fire bombs) and attack an enemy base. You guide the bombs to targets using a thermal camera where all the heat signals from people show up as white blobs. Eventually you hit an area with a huge number soldiers in it to take out the base... Except you didn't. As you walk through the field with burnt soldiers laying on the ground in agony, you get to the bunker which was actually filled with civilians. The games then shows you all their steaming corpses with most of their flesh melted off in positions of agony. The camera does quick close ups of the corpse of woman holding her child and all their flesh is missing. Its scary, but intense stuff

 

[TehCookie]

Where do people get this weird idea that because something is made for kids adults can't enjoy it.

Well, gaming (both a lot of the industry and a lot of the fans) crave legitimacy, and you don't get that by making things kids can enjoy. Remember, a good chunk of nerd culture is berated for facination with things aimed at kids. It's not the only defining trait of the nerd, but it's why we have bronies who yell about a show aimed at kids not catering to them.

Sorry, bronies, you were the only group I could think of. No offense.

We don't just act this way about things made for kids, but also things with similar elements. Anime is considered childish because cartoons. Games are some sort of weird Shrodinger's media, where people seem to think that it's both kiddy and child-like (as opposed to childish) and mature, gory and sexual.

I swear, I think a lot of people believe Mario and Call of Duty are the same franchise.

And, if I might tangent a little, there's a lot of "everything but" examples. A lot of people are like "I don't like kids movies, but [Pixar movie here]..." or "I don't like children's books, but Harry Potter...." Like they have to preface this stuff to remain legit.

But then, I don't buy into it myself, so whatever. I've never got stuck in a child's vehicle, but then, I was usually too big for kid's stuff as a kid (since I'm now 6'5", you can extrapolate backwards). I do, however, have a sonic screwdriver sitting about six inches from my left hand. Mario games are still fun, no matter the audience, bright colours can be pretty, and if a product is good, it doesn't matter if it's aimed at kids.

But I think part of the problem is that kids' media has become patronising in a way it didn't used to be. Oh, it was never particularly 'mature', but I think a good chunk of it has been downgraded. In a way, it's sort of like the 'dumbed down' argument people make about gaming.

If people want legitimacy just kidnap someone's kids and say you're playing/watching/doing it for them. I'm not watching this for me, but my baby nephew wanted it. Or perhaps I hang out with too many old people they always tell me life's to short to care what people think (usually followed by doing something embarrassing). I find it more childish to pretend to dislike something because it's not cool.

I don't think the new kids' media is the problem though. Even if kids will be entertained by anything but adults still want quality. They'll just ignore the bad shows and want to enjoy the good ones, that's how My Little Pony became popular. It's a kids show but it's also well written and I love the art style myself (though I do hate bronies for being sick minded horsefuckers).

Though I think family friendly would be a better and more accurate term, though I still call them kiddie out of habit.

 

[Something Amyss]

I don't think the new kids' media is the problem though. Even if kids will be entertained by anything but adults still want quality. They'll just ignore the bad shows and want to enjoy the good ones, that's how My Little Pony became popular. It's a kids show but it's also well written and I love the art style myself (though I do hate bronies for being sick minded horsefuckers).

Though I think family friendly would be a better and more accurate term, though I still call them kiddie out of habit.

There are always exceptions, though. My father is to this day a huge fan of the Galaxy Rangers, a show that was on when I was a kid. Galaxy Rangers was well-written and contained a lot of themes that I'm surprised they got away with. When ReBoot came on, it was big with a lot of adults. The Transformers shows done by the same people, as well. MLP may or may not be well written, but it falls into my prior token example sort of thing.

Granted, there seems to possibly be a rebound from the pandering. I've noticed Nicktoons is starting to be less pandering. And I'm not just saying that because Avatar was one of the best cartoons, period. Voltron Force is weirdly darker than the original, where they had to edit out people getting killed (Lotor dies as often as Kenny). Iron Man: Scooby Doo edition wasn't the most mature version of the franchise, but it certainly didn't treat its viewers like morons.

On the other point, people really shouldn't be so tied up by what other people think.

Then again, I just listed off a ton of Nicktoons I'm a fan of, so maybe I'm biased.

 

[TehCookie]

I don't think the new kids' media is the problem though. Even if kids will be entertained by anything but adults still want quality. They'll just ignore the bad shows and want to enjoy the good ones, that's how My Little Pony became popular. It's a kids show but it's also well written and I love the art style myself (though I do hate bronies for being sick minded horsefuckers).

Though I think family friendly would be a better and more accurate term, though I still call them kiddie out of habit.

There are always exceptions, though. My father is to this day a huge fan of the Galaxy Rangers, a show that was on when I was a kid. Galaxy Rangers was well-written and contained a lot of themes that I'm surprised they got away with. When ReBoot came on, it was big with a lot of adults. The Transformers shows done by the same people, as well. MLP may or may not be well written, but it falls into my prior token example sort of thing.

Granted, there seems to possibly be a rebound from the pandering. I've noticed Nicktoons is starting to be less pandering. And I'm not just saying that because Avatar was one of the best cartoons, period. Voltron Force is weirdly darker than the original, where they had to edit out people getting killed (Lotor dies as often as Kenny). Iron Man: Scooby Doo edition wasn't the most mature version of the franchise, but it certainly didn't treat its viewers like morons.

On the other point, people really shouldn't be so tied up by what other people think.

Then again, I just listed off a ton of Nicktoons I'm a fan of, so maybe I'm biased.

The exception would be having shit taste, not liking good shows during a bad era. I haven't watched much TV since my dad screwed up this thing [http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n95/blackkittycat15/pictures/05-1239205794L.jpg], but having more bad kid shows doesn't change adults still like good ones.

Or you could just admit you like shit. I'm that way with anime because I'll watch almost anything, good or bad.