Non-American gamers
- Thread starter AC Medina
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It doesn't really bother me with games. What pisses me off is how all other forms of entertainment seemingly have to be set in America.AC Medina said:
Adapting a book set in England into a movie? Move it to the USA!
Remaking a movie set in France? We can't have that, lets relocate it to New York!
Found a foreign TV show that you love? Instead of broadcasting it in America, why not remake it with American actors? Its bound to be an improvement!
It gets really aggravating after a while, especially when something truly fantastic like Hellblazer gets turned into something terrible like Constantine. They changed just about everything about the character, and then had him played by Keanu Reeves. Just...why?
I think the important aspect of the setting of a game is how real it FEELS. If anything, visiting Washington DC then playing Fallout 3 would detach me from the feeling in the game.AC Medina said:
A fictitious setting has alot of power over how it presents itself, and a really GOOD game FEELS real. And by real I mean that you feel a connection with the place, characters, and plot. Movies are a much better example, it's the reason the original StarWars films were so popular, same with StarTrek, Lord of the Rings. Even films like the watchmen are also good examples, you know it's a film, but it feels real, because the director or writer hasn't tried to explain every last detail, just enough so that you don't feel lost.
I felt that the best film to portray this realism is "Primer" - a film about the first time machine. It doesn't explain everything, it treats the audience as an observer. It does not answer questions, it shows you what is happening, and the characters FEEL real.
In a game the difference is that you can observe and interact with what is going on, and how limited you are in interacting is down to the game you're playing.
If you care about the characters, events, and setting, and if it feels like you are part of a larger world things just click together. The important thing is to not over do it, it's one reason why some stuff in halo, gears of war, or other "super space marine who kicks ass" type of games. They use the story as a means to justify the game-play and frame it, not using the game-play as a tool to convey the story. You don't feel like you are master chief, you feel like you are clearing room after room, with cutscenes to show you what is happening. But then again, typically you play an FPS for the gameplay, there's a reason I still play quake3, but I digress ^^
I'm from the UK and if I was playing a game set in a city or place I had been to, I would be inclined to pick out the flaws, rather than suspend dis-belief. The same with characters, if you can believe in their realism, then they become more compelling characters - bad British accents just distract you from the character if you're used to hearing real accents.
Most irish accents either sound like lucky from lucky charms or a pirate.but..Furburt said:
OT: as an american it isn't really that bad when you see american cities in ruins.It is cool to know what the landmarks are.But really i think a lot of other countries would make good gaming backdrops.
Killzone is Dutch, but it's in another world, so no connection there.
one of the main characters IS named Jan, which is the dutch version of the names John, Jean and Juan
one of the main characters IS named Jan, which is the dutch version of the names John, Jean and Juan
I'd say you're forgetting about your friend to the north. Canada has been pretty successful with it's companies and regional branches (I consider them their own companies because they make different games) and more and more people are migrating to the North to make found their own gaming companies or join one of the already growing ones. After all, Ubisoft montreal gave us the Assassin's Creed seriesAC Medina said:
First off, thanks to you and some other people who have posted for the education on international game developers. I'll admit I was thinking of publishers (which I still think makes my point fairly relevant, since I would venture to guess that for the game to be "picked up" and released, the publishers must feel it caters to most of the game-buying public) and mixed up my language, but there are still far more non-U.S. developers than I thought, and I'm not above admitting when I'm wrong.Sir John The Net Knight said:
However, Sir John, I think you missed the entire point of my post. It wasn't about saying "I don't want more stupid pro-American games!" That's not true. It was about wondering how not being American affects my experience in games where --it would seem to me, at least-- having some sort of sense of patriotism, or emotional attachment to a particular setting, or etc. etc. might play some sort of role and change my appreciation of the gameplay or story or what have you.
I'm sorry if that feels like a "superficial point" to you. I thought it was an interesting one, myself. But I suppose we can agree to disagree.
edit: Oh, and my thanks to those of you who actually got the point I was trying to make and gave some valuable insight -- though the entire thread has been interesting and informative, even when it veered off in slightly different directions.
The only time it really annoyed me was playing Killzone 2 because it was such a stereotypically American take on the whole situation. I don't mind defending American soil or interests in most games. I do object to being forced to play as some brainless soldier and his combat buddies making wisecracks about all the people they're about to/just have killed in the stereotypical brash American way. Also, Altair in Assassin's Creed having an American accent really grated on me.
But by and large I don't mind it, though I don't play many Earth based FPS games, and those are the ones generally most guilty of overhyping the US.
But by and large I don't mind it, though I don't play many Earth based FPS games, and those are the ones generally most guilty of overhyping the US.
well I think I can't say that there weren't any american Games based on wars in Germany, but still some new locations would be nice...
This is the problem. I know you meant no offence, but this is the kind of elitist attitude I often see from Americans. I DO NOT identify with yanks. Hell, the hysteria from the healthcare proposition is completely alien to me (I'm from Scandinavia, so people whining about welfare seems a bit silly to me). Not to be a political troll, but this is just an example of the very different mindsets of yanks and Europeans.Gethsemani said:
It seems that Americans often think "everyone measures up their culture to ours" and therefore think US settings are general for the western world. Honestly, It'd be just as easy for me to identify with an Aussie setting.
Ok, maybe I make it sound worse than it is. I do like games with an American setting, it's just too bad that so few are made with an European setting. We have lots of creepy old buildings, we have a lot of odd ancient customs, loads of borders and international tension. Of course, I'm biased, but I think there is much more material for interesting games in Europe than in the ol' US of A.
Check my profile, we are practically neighbours. I am from Sweden myself, so I find it hard to imagine I'd have an american elitist attitude.TheBlobThing said:
I don't identify with americans either (at least not to the same degree as Swedes, Scandinavians or Europeans. But compared to say Arabs or Africans I identify more with americans) but whatever we like it or not, America has come to represent western culture. This is probably much in due to the fact that most (western) movies are made in America and most (western) music is also produced there. Many places in America also has such widespread fame that placing a game there will make most gamers in both American and Europe recognise them (New York, Washington, Las Vegas and Los Angeles all spring to mind).
I am not saying their culture, political system or anything else is better than what we have (au contraire...) but on a country to country basis, far more people can recognise and embrace american culture and cultural icons as opposed to Swedish or Danish for example.
I mostly agree with what both of you guys have been saying. I also agree that, as many others have pointed out, if the gameplay is good (especially for certain types of games like FPS, etc.) the setting and/or related storyline don't even matter.Gethsemani said:Check my profile, we are practically neighbours. I am from Sweden myself, so I find it hard to imagine I'd have an american elitist attitude.TheBlobThing said:
I don't identify with americans either (at least not to the same degree as Swedes, Scandinavians or Europeans. But compared to say Arabs or Africans I identify more with americans) but whatever we like it or not, America has come to represent western culture. This is probably much in due to the fact that most (western) movies are made in America and most (western) music is also produced there. Many places in America also has such widespread fame that placing a game there will make most gamers in both American and Europe recognise them (New York, Washington, Las Vegas and Los Angeles all spring to mind).
I am not saying their culture, political system or anything else is better than what we have (au contraire...) but on a country to country basis, far more people can recognise and embrace american culture and cultural icons as opposed to Swedish or Danish for example.
Which is why I think games have a unique opportunity to portray and explore places, scenarios, storylines (both historical and imaginary) that depart from the American "mainstream" and to familiarize gamers with those places. Most people may not want to watch a movie set in Scandinavia, but give me a rocking game in which you're, I dunno, chasing somebody through the fjords or something, and not only will I enjoy something cool and decidedly different, but I'll come away with a new (or renewed) appreciation for a place/culture/etc. that I maybe wouldn't have encountered, otherwise.
I totally agree with you on that one. The basic "USA = world" -point of view in games and a lot more often seen in movies does bother at times. More or less.TheBlobThing said:
OT: Naturally only some genres and games require that it has to based to a real country (usually with a noticeable military forces), but now only talking about the games that have that requirement:
The American setting is something that you've gotten so used to, that it can't ruin a game, but you can't identify with the American stuff (like OP stated). It is such a default setting to have USA under a whatever threat, and you need to fight it. It does flatten the atmosphere a certain amount. I would sometimes rather play a game with a, let's say Russian setting (if it has to be a grand nation). As it's something more fresh and not so overused in gaming. I think Europe especially would offer the greatest setting possibilities.
It's always nice to see your own country in a game if it is such a rare occasion. I can only think of Hearts Of Iron III, as it has Finland and quite specific WWII-time details about it.
There should be a (optional) RPG-like feature in such games that you could choose the country of origin for your character and you were sent to nation * as a top class professional of your trade. Or something similar. Particularly that is a bit RPG'ish, but such small possibilities of customization would add a tremendous amount of (emotional) attachments to a game.