Official Discussion about the new Forum Rules

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quiet_samurai

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Apr 24, 2009
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I always thought that those were the general rules anyway. Until I kept reading the "no negativity for negativity sake" comment over and over. First off, this website is riddled with negativity in just about every facet. This includes some things said by mods, staff, members, and even review videos... so saying no negativity seems a little... silly, and ignorant, and futile. We are all people with independant minds, so negativity and conflict are going to be around no matter what, and people are going to say shit some people don't like, that's part of being human... deal.

Besides, without a little negativity you would never appreciate the positive.

But as far as being an internet forum, this is probably the easiest site to get along with people. I don't understand where the idea of them being unpleasant comes from.
 

Internet Kraken

Animalia Mollusca Cephalopada
Mar 18, 2009
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Virgil said:
Negativity encourages others to be negative, which we don't want on our site.
Then why do you publish content that is intended to foster feelings of negativity? It's quite silly to enforce such harsh rules on forum members when the content they are responding to violates these rules. Again, please explain why people like Movie Bob are allowed to infringe upon pretty much every single one of these rules without fear of repercussion. If you don't want negativity on this site, then you can't post content that generates it.

Further more, it's pretty pathetic that a site can't stand any form of negativity to the point where it will quiet anyone that dislikes the sites content and is vocal about it.

Here's an example [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.244165-Metroid-represents-everything-wrong-about-our-treatment-of-the-enviornment] that highlights my problem with this new policy. In the end, that thread is just a jab at Movie Bob and the topic of the first episode of his show "The Big Picture". Now, because that thread criticizes his show but doesn't offer any constructive criticism, the impression I'm getting that a mod would be perfectly justified in deleting that thread. As a member of the community, I find that to be insulting. This new rule seems to have been made for the sole purpose of making Escapist content look better, and it silences the community in the process. Saying we're not allowed to be vocal about our dislike for this site's content is ridiculous.

Kuliani said:
Q: Why do we need new rules?

A: Because the forums had been slowly becoming a less inviting place to be. The new rules are in place to provide tools to the mods to allow them to get rid of the jerks and keep you nice people!
If this was honestly your objective with these new rules, I'd say you have failed. Because this site looks far less friendly now that I know mods can delete posts and ban people just because they express dislike for certain content on this site. Draconian rules do not create a friendly and happy community.
 

Nerf Ninja

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Dec 20, 2008
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Just a quick question regarding being reported.

How are the reports themselves being policed?

There are groups of forum members that use the report function as a way to in essence "grief" other forum members with usergroups dedicated to this practice.

Whilst I am not saying this particular group is doing such a thing, I find it slightly unnerving that groups like the spanish inquisition exist in the first place.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/The-Spanish-Inquisition
 

Sassafrass

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Nerf Ninja said:
Just a quick question regarding being reported.

How are the reports themselves being policed?

There are groups of forum members that use the report function as a way to in essence "grief" other forum members with usergroups dedicated to this practice.

Whilst I am not saying this particular group is doing such a thing, I find it slightly unnerving that groups like the spanish inquisition exist in the first place.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/The-Spanish-Inquisition
From my understanding with a couple of chats with Mods in the past, the reports are put into a queue for the Mods to look at after someone two separate reports have been filed. Also, you can only report each post once, so that in essence stops any griefing/spamming of the report system and if a user is spamming the report function, I think they are either warned or suspended.
 

Nerf Ninja

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Sassafrass said:
From my understanding with a couple of chats with Mods in the past, the reports are put into a queue for the Mods to look at after someone two separate reports have been filed. Also, you can only report each post once, so that in essence stops any griefing/spamming of the report system and if a user is spamming the report function, I think they are either warned or suspended.
Oh yeah I know that a single user can't grief a report but when you have a large group of organised people doing it, I believe that to be against the spirit of the rules.
 

Twilight_guy

Sight, Sound, and Mind
Nov 24, 2008
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From what I read, the number one rule is still: don't be a dick. I really don't see how this differs from the old rules, but it can't hurt to reiterate.
 

Empireth

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Oct 24, 2009
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Having looked forward to this re-working of the rules since I found out it was being planned, I am somewhat disappointed. I shall explain:

1. The clarity. The new rules Code of Conduct has been written in a much more vague manner. As someone who wishes to state my opinion but not disrupt the community or the mods while doing so, I am concerned. I understand much of the moderation is subjective and dependant on the context, however, some clear, defined rules are always nice. It's good to have a line that you know should normally not be crossed, though, again, context is key.

2. The presentation. The old Posting Guidelines were presented in a thread-like manner. Yes, this new way is more professional, but in a way, that is what I fear may become the problem. With the old Posting Guidelines, it was clear when there was an update, as the thread was stickied. When you saw there was an update, you clicked the thread and read, happy as a clam. However with this setup, you click the thread only to have to redirect yourself to another location to view the updates.

In a sense, the presentation was, yes, more concise, but also more difficult to read. Perhaps this was simply the effects of too much stress and not enough sleep this past week, but it took me two re-readings (thus, three readings) to find where within Ad Blockers were mentioned. (Not because I dislike the rule in any way and wanted it gone, merely, because I know how much of a big deal it is to the site and was quite honestly shocked that I didn't see it there on first read.)

3. Omittance of old rules (which may or may not be still in effect). For one, as can be seen by the reaction within this thread, the rule about low-content posts. By simply asking users to take "just a little time to make their posts as readable as possible and keep their responses on topic," you are not directly addressing in any way single word posts. One would hope, though, that new users would read that and realize that that means, roughly translated "ONE WORD POSTS = MODDAGE" alas, not everyone thinks that way. It must be clearly stated for future users.

For another, the big question about repeat threads/necro'ing. From the old Posting Guidelines, it was unclear, and in this Code of Conduct, it was not mentioned at all. I recall asking multiple people about this and I got different opinions from them. Some people thought all necro'ing was bad, yet I had been told that it was better to necro a thread that was dead for a month than to repeat a thread for servers' sakes. This question is still pertinent, moreso now I would argue, with the amount of newer users and the amount of traffic that has gone up since this question had been brought to light. Yet, the Code of Conduct does not resolve this issue in any way.

List threads and VS. threads are also not mentioned, which, should be a given for most current users (one would hope) as they don't hold much content for discussion within the threads, but again, I'm looking at the Code of Conduct for future users. This fact is not as apparent as one would think.

.

However, in light of these comments, I feel I should reiterate that I'm glad you lot have taken the time to look over the old rules to help keep up with the community. I know I'm not the only one that noticed the fact that it was becoming less inviting to be here, and I'm glad The Management has noticed as well.

As a side note:
"Deliberately inflammatory threads; posts written with the sole intention of irritating [...] will be removed, as will your forum privileges." I disagree with this method. Not entirely, but partially. When users have been banned/probated for certain posts, clearly, it is a message to the community: "What not to do." I know that for most times if I come accross a [small]User has been banned for: X. (Time length)[/small] I will click it, whether I've heard of them before or not. Why? It is a learning opportunity of what not to do. It also reinforces the rules. So, if you decide to delete all posts that warrant Mod Wrath, the learning opportunity for the rest of the community disappears.

Also, it would have been nice for the old Posting Guidelines to still be available to look at for the beginning of this new Code of Conduct. It would have been nice to be able to analyze the changes and fully acknowledge how things have been affected.

Edit: I find it somewhat ironic that before I could state my thoughts on this new Code of Conduct I was being informed that it had changed.
 

Ashcrexl

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May 27, 2009
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does snarkiness count? one could technically classify every single zero punctuation video as breaking these rules. am i allowed to respond to something with a reasonable amount of constructive bitterness?
 

BonsaiK

Music Industry Corporate Whore
Nov 14, 2007
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I think the new rules are good, they're really just the same as the old ones, just with less legalese.
 

Claymorez

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Apr 20, 2009
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joethekoeller said:
Seems it's the popular thing right now to demand some clarity, so I'm here to get my share. I really only have one question: What's the guideline for disagreeing and arguments?

Based off my expereince with our moderators and the fact that our number one guideline Don't be a jerk. supposedly trumps all other rules, I'm going to assume that I can still openly state that I think somebody on here's wrong about something, even if that someone is in whatever way or form connected to The Escapist (Moderators, Contributors, Yahtzee), long as I show a modicum of restraint plus a basic level of respect and make sure I clarify that I'm attacking an opinion and not the human being behind it. Quite obviously we can't stop disagreeing (would make discussion a bit awkward), so I'm really only curious as to where you draw the line between negativity and negativity for negativity's sake. Case in point, while I'm hardly an aggravating presence or short-tempered by any definition, I have gotten in some [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/528.178144-Poll-Do-you-agree-with-a-public-smoking-ban-Searchbar-approved?page=3#6446132] arguments [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/528.178144-Poll-Do-you-agree-with-a-public-smoking-ban-Searchbar-approved?page=3#6451250] and would appreciate a perspective on whether or not I need to change something about the way I handle these. At any rate it would be intereting to hear if my profanity-free, apologetic attitude towards such events is actually as calming and respectful as I'd like to believe or if I come off as smug.
I would clarify negativity for negativities sake as something like slacking off/insulting a person for no reason other then a posters own personal amusement. Expressing a negative opinion and expressing it in an un-necessarily over the top manner are very different things e.g. "I dislike this" and "WTF X has no F**ck**g talent! This show is a piece of c**p".
 

Claymorez

Our King
Apr 20, 2009
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Empireth said:
I've asked Kulinai if we can put this up on the thread page of the rules.

[HEADING=2]Welcome to The Escapist forums![/HEADING] [small](The Internet?s version of the Lighthouse of Alexandria [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lighthouse_of_Alexandria])[/small]
[hr]

[/hr]
[HEADING=1]The Escapist Forum Rules:[/HEADING]

We want our forums to be a place where everyone, regardless of who they are, can gather to socialize and talk with like-minded people in a safe and welcoming environment. In order to make that happen we have certain rules we ask all members of our community to adhere to. These rules will be vigorously enforced so that a handful of bad apples don't spoil it for everyone else.

[HEADING=1]. [/HEADING]

[HEADING=2]Don't Be a Jerk:[/HEADING]

This rule trumps any other. Any loophole you think you've found in any other rule is covered by this one. If you make our forums a less pleasant place to be, we don't want you here.

[HEADING=2]Have Respect for Others:[/HEADING]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but no one is entitled to attack others for sharing, or not sharing, that opinion. If you can't communicate without using combative, aggressive, or demeaning language, then please keep those comments to yourself, or be shown the door. Deliberately inflammatory threads; posts written with the sole intention of irritating people; attacks toward or inappropriate commentary regarding The Escapist staff, creators, or other posters; or attempts to derail a thread will be removed, as will your forum privileges.

[HEADING=2]Have Respect for the Site and its Content:[/HEADING]

We put a lot of work into the content on the site, and if you've just shown up to trample on that hard work, we will remove your comments and ask you to leave. Constructive criticism is welcomed; negativity for its own sake is not. Further, discussions instructing or otherwise advocating the circumvention of The Escapist's advertisements, security mechanisms, media protections or similar facilities will not be tolerated.

[HEADING=2]Put Some Effort Into Your Communication:[/HEADING]


A well-made thread or a well-written comment engages its audience and facilitates discussion. We do ask that posters take just a little time to make their posts as readable as possible and keep their responses on topic. We also ask that you take a moment to check your spelling and grammar.

[HEADING=2]Use Our Forums Appropriately:[/HEADING]

Our forums are a place to talk with like-minded people, not a place to advertise your blog or YouTube channel. Your profile has a place for such things, and that is where it should stay. Similarly, posts including, advocating, or linking to illegal or adult material are a very quick way to end your time as part of The Escapist community.

[HEADING=1]. [/HEADING]

[HEADING=3]Penalties[/HEADING]

There are no hard and fast rules on what punishment you will receive should you break any of these rules. Instead, we will make the punishment fit the infraction and the individual. We do not enjoy banning people, but we will not hesitate to do so if we think that a person's removal will have an overall positive effect on the community.

Types of wrath:
­
Probation: This is just a warning with no substantive changes to your posting abilities. You will most likely get a Private Message from the moderator that put you on Probation detailing why (so that you know what not to do next time)­
Suspension: These place temporary limitations on a forum member?s posting abilities and last anywhere from 3 days to a month in length.­
Ban: We reserve this for spammers, people who repeatedly and flagrantly ignore the standards established here, and ban jumpers. A ban is permanent.

[HEADING=3]Other:[/HEADING]
[li]Thread Necroing and Thread Duping: We know that our forums have a very high volume of traffic and sometimes you will end up wanting to talk about subjects that are being discussed elsewhere on the forums. To keep thread spam to a minimum, we ask that you try not to start threads in the same board on exactly the same topic as another thread that?s already active that day. We reserve the right to combine, merge, or delete redundant threads where we see this happen. We will ban for thread spamming in a persistent, abusive, or exploitative manner. If you want to have a discussion on a topic that?s been the subject of a past thread, you should generally join in that thread if it?s a live discussion. If that thread has been inactive for a month or more, its good etiquette to start a new thread and link to the old thread if you want to provide it as background information, and we discourage arbitrary bumping. We will ban for thread bumping if and when it is conducted in a persistent, abusive, or exploitative manner.[/li]


[li]PM Spam: If you receive a Personal Message (PM) from someone that is spamming you, either another user or some low-paid spam-marketer, please either report the user that sent your the PM (from their Profile page), or forward the PM directly on to a Moderator.[/li]

[HEADING=1]. [/HEADING]

Getting to Know Your Moderators
Currently, we employ a staff of Escapist editors, programmers and volunteers to communicate with our readers, uphold the forums, keep everything organized and swing the Banhammer in times of need. They are:

[li]Matt Kuliani, our Community Manager[/li]
Susan Arendt, our Senior Editor.
Russ Pitts, our Editor-in-Chief.
Jason "Virgil" Smith, our IT Director.
Jeff "Spinwhiz" Palumbo, our Brand Manager.
[li][user]John Funk[/user], Associate Editor[/li]
wilsonscrazybed, a member of the Red Guard, a community-based Neighborhood Watch.
Logan Westbrook, another proud member of the Red Guard.
[li]Alex_P, another proud member of the Red Guard.[/li]
[li]Labyrinth, the female member of the Red Guard.[/li]
[li]Baby Tea, the Red Guard with the radio voice.[/li]
[li][user]Varchld[/user], Red Guard and the IRC queen and overlord.[/li]
[user]Claymorez[/user], another proud member of the Red Guard.
[user]NewClassic[/user], another proud member of the Red Guard.
[user]Sevre90210[/user], another proud member of the Red Guard.
[user]Zombie_Fish[/user], another proud member of the Red Guard.
[user]ColdStorage[/user], another proud member of the Red Guard.
[user]Aylaine[/user], an Advice Forum moderator.
[user]zombiesinc[/user], an Advice Forum moderator.




Other Fun Stuff

[li]Lord Krunk's Guide to the Forums: The Banhammer and You: A User's Guide to the Forums [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.112832][/li]
Moderation questions. Private Message Kuliani.
Profiles. You can edit yours here. We obviously encourage this, but mainly because our Community section [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/profiles/] of the site uses the information contained in the profiles to help you connect with others that agree and play with you.
Titles. They?re based on your post count, unless you are staff, contributors, or other odd people.
Badges. Relax, you?ll get some. Keep a lookout for contests, events, and other fun things that we put together all the time, and you'll have plenty of chances for some of the more rare badges!
Forum markup. You can find documentation on the tags our forums support here. This is how you make your posts look more professional and/or entertaining!
User Groups. Small and large groups of users that share common interests hang out here [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/]. They have unique features not found in the forums, especially for forum games and roleplaying. There are official ones (Tech Team [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/Tech-Team]), ones for fans (Zero Punctuation Fans [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/Zero-Punctuation-Fans]), and user-created ones (The Escapist Team Fortress 2 Group - PC [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/The-Escapist-Team-Fortress-2-Group-PC]) or (The Avatar Store [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/The-Avatar-Store-New-and-Second-Hand]).

 

technoted

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Nov 9, 2009
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Well I should probably have read them before I agreed to them, but oh well I don't go round acting like a dick so I should hopefully be fine.
 

Claymorez

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Apr 20, 2009
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Thread Drama! [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Thread%20Drama.mp3]
Mod Drama [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Mod%20Drama.mp3]

Just thought I would post this to give not only some amusement to people but the mod drama does give a good example of what is not an acceptable way to express an opinion.
 

Motiv_

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Jun 2, 2009
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Claymorez said:
Thread Drama! [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Thread%20Drama.mp3]
Mod Drama [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Mod%20Drama.mp3]

Just thought I would post this to give not only some amusement to people but the mod drama does give a good example of what is not an acceptable way to express an opinion.
That honestly just made my day. Danke my good man/woman/extra terrestrial.
 

Augustus Drakken

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Nov 10, 2010
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I have no problem with showing respect and being curious. I have a problem with getting on my knees to suck the dick of every mod and user that just so happens to visit the site. I don't get in trouble for saying "idiot" on the playground in grade school, I shouldn't here.

At the end of the day, this is the internet. Nut up or shut the fuck up. If you don't like what someone wrote, don't respond. If you disagree, show some respect. If you act like an ass, be prepared to be treated like one.

The site went wrong when it banned all the elder members, who used to show what the true spirit of the site was like. And no amount of rules or mods can change this, the community is shaped by its people, not the mods squad.

And in conclusion, I don't censor myself. I'm fully prepared to take the maximum heat for anything I write. And considering this site draws a lot of strong willed people with strong opinions, its going to be awfully fun to see these new rules try to cope with them.
 

Broken Orange

God Among Men
Apr 14, 2009
2,367
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Reading these "QQ"ing of people, I think the people who are complaining are the ones who are the butt munches jerks that are making this an negative place to be.
Claymorez said:
Thread Drama! [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Thread%20Drama.mp3]
Mod Drama [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Mod%20Drama.mp3]

Just thought I would post this to give not only some amusement to people but the mod drama does give a good example of what is not an acceptable way to express an opinion.
...I love you for that.
 

Roxas1359

Burn, Burn it All!
Aug 8, 2009
33,758
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Claymorez said:
Thread Drama! [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Thread%20Drama.mp3]
Mod Drama [http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1545125/Mod%20Drama.mp3]

Just thought I would post this to give not only some amusement to people but the mod drama does give a good example of what is not an acceptable way to express an opinion.
That just made me laugh so much. Thanks for posting it.
OT: I'm glad that the rules are a bit more clarified for people and hopefully the updated set of rules clarifies some things for users.