One Million Moms Fights Gay Superheroes

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downsyndromechimp

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May 25, 2012
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If you've read through all the replies, well..

First off - congrats! You can not only read, but must actually enjoy doing so if you read all of them... Trust me, it takes a lot of time and effort. (Seriously, be proud of your perseverance.)

And now to the bad part:

If you have read all of them, you are most likely familiar with my replies. For the record, I actually issued a challenge: To create a logical argument in favor of your opinion. An argument that did not rely on your own interpretation of "fact Vs opinion," or on your own emotional views. As of such, I have received several threats of banning - even typing this, I'm all but sure it will most likely NOT get past the pseudo censors of this site - and only one truly courageous individual has actually rose to the challenge.

If this Actually gets through him/her: Mr/Mrs/Ms Omega... I'd like to hear more from you. You're a person of reason and I'd like to bounce a few ideas off you! If not, then I guess no one will see this anyway.

Any-who, keep trying to rise to any challenge. This is the only way we can not only better ourselves - but those around us. (In this context, the gaming community in general!)
 

ReiverCorrupter

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Jun 4, 2010
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downsyndromechimp said:
If you've read through all the replies, well..

First off - congrats! You can not only read, but must actually enjoy doing so if you read all of them... Trust me, it takes a lot of time and effort. (Seriously, be proud of your perseverance.)

And now to the bad part:

If you have read all of them, you are most likely familiar with my replies. For the record, I actually issued a challenge: To create a logical argument in favor of your opinion. An argument that did not rely on your own interpretation of "fact Vs opinion," or on your own emotional views. As of such, I have received several threats of banning - even typing this, I'm all but sure it will most likely NOT get past the pseudo censors of this site - and only one truly courageous individual has actually rose to the challenge.

If this Actually gets through him/her: Mr/Mrs/Ms Omega... I'd like to hear more from you. You're a person of reason and I'd like to bounce a few ideas off you! If not, then I guess no one will see this anyway.

Any-who, keep trying to rise to any challenge. This is the only way we can not only better ourselves - but those around us. (In this context, the gaming community in general!)
What is a logical argument? Are you talking about a deductive argument that is both valid and sound? Those are pretty hard to generate. To be honest, just rejecting someone's premises is generally more than enough to reject their argument, or at least move the argument to an analysis of said premises. Most people would reject two seemingly implicit premises underlying OMM's argument: 1) that homosexuality is a choice/gay superheroes are more likely to turn children gay, and 2) that homosexuality is wrong.

Now if you're asking that people defend their reasons for rejecting these claims, then where does it stop? You can't expect people to completely defend their claims down to fundamental principles of epistemology and ontology (i.e. act like a five-year-old and keep asking them "why"... "why"..."why"...etc.).

Don't get me wrong, I'm in the same boat. People rarely defend their positions with any sort of coherent argument. But in this particular case there just isn't much need for an argument because there is already an obvious disagreement about the facts underlying the issue.

At any rate, these forums mostly consist of people who want to throw in their aphoristic two cents, with only a few people actually interested in conversation or trying to convince others of their position, so I wouldn't just assume that they confusedly think they are presenting definitive arguments.
 

Treblaine

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Jul 25, 2008
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Averant said:
Honestly, can't we all come to an agreement? We agree to let them be homophobes, they agree to stop posting this idiocy because we already know what they think about it. Seriously, it's getting redundant by this point.

OMM: WE HATE TEH GAYS!!!1!

Me: That's nice. Why is this news again?


CAPTCHA: seven ate nine

Son of a *****, it's grasping the concept of rudimentary humor. It's proceeding into the AI stage.
Well then part of that agreement is they stop claiming to speak for the majority or even a significant minority. They claim to be an association of families, they claim to have at least one million members, both misrepresentations.

Its fairly well known that the Westbro Baptist church is just one small church that is mostly a single extended family, that really sets their extreme hateful belief as not denigrating all americans.

But the American Family Association act like it speaks for all families, they need to agree to change their name and public stance acting as if they have more support for this petty hatred than they actually do.
 

Gordon_4_v1legacy

New member
Aug 22, 2010
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Knowing that it has driven these fucking morons into a frothing fury and therefor outing them as blatant homophobes and arseholes, I hope Superman pulverises the closet door with all his Kryptonian might.
 

Realitycrash

New member
Dec 12, 2010
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Secretly wishing for it to be Superman.

(Did you know that Pink kryptonite turn superman gay? Atleast in Earth-One. I'm not making this up, that shit is fucking canon)
 

Realitycrash

New member
Dec 12, 2010
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ReiverCorrupter said:
downsyndromechimp said:
If you've read through all the replies, well..

First off - congrats! You can not only read, but must actually enjoy doing so if you read all of them... Trust me, it takes a lot of time and effort. (Seriously, be proud of your perseverance.)

And now to the bad part:

If you have read all of them, you are most likely familiar with my replies. For the record, I actually issued a challenge: To create a logical argument in favor of your opinion. An argument that did not rely on your own interpretation of "fact Vs opinion," or on your own emotional views. As of such, I have received several threats of banning - even typing this, I'm all but sure it will most likely NOT get past the pseudo censors of this site - and only one truly courageous individual has actually rose to the challenge.

If this Actually gets through him/her: Mr/Mrs/Ms Omega... I'd like to hear more from you. You're a person of reason and I'd like to bounce a few ideas off you! If not, then I guess no one will see this anyway.

Any-who, keep trying to rise to any challenge. This is the only way we can not only better ourselves - but those around us. (In this context, the gaming community in general!)
What is a logical argument? Are you talking about a deductive argument that is both valid and sound? Those are pretty hard to generate. To be honest, just rejecting someone's premises is generally more than enough to reject their argument, or at least move the argument to an analysis of said premises. Most people would reject two seemingly implicit premises underlying OMM's argument: 1) that homosexuality is a choice/gay superheroes are more likely to turn children gay, and 2) that homosexuality is wrong.

Now if you're asking that people defend their reasons for rejecting these claims, then where does it stop? You can't expect people to completely defend their claims down to fundamental principles of epistemology and ontology (i.e. act like a five-year-old and keep asking them "why"... "why"..."why"...etc.).

Don't get me wrong, I'm in the same boat. People rarely defend their positions with any sort of coherent argument. But in this particular case there just isn't much need for an argument because there is already an obvious disagreement about the facts underlying the issue.

At any rate, these forums mostly consist of people who want to throw in their aphoristic two cents, with only a few people actually interested in conversation or trying to convince others of their position, so I wouldn't just assume that they confusedly think they are presenting definitive arguments.
I appreciate this post, and the analytical-philosophical explanation I was too tired (and drunk) to add myself.

In all fairness, as you have pointed out, even "facts" can be rejected by looking at them hard enough from a certain epistemological standpoint. There's a certain common ground (axioms, as we call them in the academia) that we all take for granted when we argue with eachother. Things that "no sane person" would dispute. But one can certainly dispute them, but if you do, you have to have a "valid" axiom to put in its place, which is where OMM fails to convince most of us. They do have one, it's just not an universally accepted one.
Basically, it's "God hates gays".
Now you can dispute this, dispute that God exists, or dispute that God hates anything, but in the end, it always comes down to;
"You're wrong.
- No, I'm not. God says so.
- Why?
- Fuck you, that's why."
 

Panorama

Carry on Jeeves
Dec 7, 2010
509
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Geo Da Sponge said:
Panorama said:
mattttherman3 said:
Hey, someone tell these moms that plastic man is no one's childhood icon.
Well said!!! I have only just started reading comics but still have no clue as to who the hell he is
I dunno, he did have a pretty good pilot for a TV show that never aired:

He seems a much cooler version of mister fantastics.
 

monkeymo4d

New member
Jan 22, 2012
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BNguyen said:
monkeymo4d said:
I wonder who it could be *looks at guy with blue and red FABULOUS tights* . But seriously its these fundamentalist busy body moms like these who give Christianity a ba-......worse name.
first of all, I find your view of Christianity as wrong and immoral to say that all of them are bad, it's practically saying everyone who isn't a Christian is automatically good

and

why is it that so far, the commentors only think that the character must be a guy, why can't the character be female? like Wonder Woman?
Ah Apologies my good Sir/madam it seems you have misinterpreted my exaggerated statement as it was simply made for comedic effect.Indeed as you said being Christian or not does not automatically make you a good or bad person however personally I think everyone of these moms should be rounded up and fed to the Nathak (free cookie if you get the reference)

Although I will admit that taking cheap shots at Christianity does give me a bit of satisfaction(Probably because I grew up in a house with an incredibly Christian family and I was the only who didn't really believe... didn't end well )
 

Hazy992

Why does this place still exist
Aug 1, 2010
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DefiantGoblin said:
CriticKitten said:
"These companies are heavily influencing our youth by using children's superheroes to desensitize and brainwash them in thinking that a gay lifestyle choice is normal and desirable."
....

Let's review, shall we?

Christianity is a religion based on the teachings of Jesus, who preached tolerance in an age of corruption and unfairness, and encouraged his followers to practice forgiveness and compassion for all people in the world. All of which are genuinely good ideas.

Fast forward to the present day, and it's considered "Christian" to be intolerant of homosexuals, among other incredibly insensitive beliefs.

Good job. Jesus would be so proud of what his church has become, I'm sure.
These people aren't Christian and don't represent what the modern church is like in any way, shape or form.

Most of the Western world are tolerant of homo-sexuality, it literally seems to be America that have a problem with it. It seems to me that whenever these groups do anything like this people come out and make negative comments about Christianity but nobody seems to pick up on the fact that they are all American. No Christian from Europe or Africa would condone these views so I don't understand why Christianity in general is tarnished with this negativity.

Right-wing America need to realise that the rest of the world have moved on and that their views are bordering on archaic.
I [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17320932] beg [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17102352] to [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17249099] differ [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-17380950]
America isn't the only country with homophobia and American Christians certainly aren't the only homophobic ones. To suggest otherwise is naive.
 

DefiantGoblin

New member
Dec 21, 2011
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Hazy992 said:
DefiantGoblin said:
CriticKitten said:
"These companies are heavily influencing our youth by using children's superheroes to desensitize and brainwash them in thinking that a gay lifestyle choice is normal and desirable."
....

Let's review, shall we?

Christianity is a religion based on the teachings of Jesus, who preached tolerance in an age of corruption and unfairness, and encouraged his followers to practice forgiveness and compassion for all people in the world. All of which are genuinely good ideas.

Fast forward to the present day, and it's considered "Christian" to be intolerant of homosexuals, among other incredibly insensitive beliefs.

Good job. Jesus would be so proud of what his church has become, I'm sure.
These people aren't Christian and don't represent what the modern church is like in any way, shape or form.

Most of the Western world are tolerant of homo-sexuality, it literally seems to be America that have a problem with it. It seems to me that whenever these groups do anything like this people come out and make negative comments about Christianity but nobody seems to pick up on the fact that they are all American. No Christian from Europe or Africa would condone these views so I don't understand why Christianity in general is tarnished with this negativity.

Right-wing America need to realise that the rest of the world have moved on and that their views are bordering on archaic.
I [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17320932] beg [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17102352] to [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17249099] differ [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-17380950]
America isn't the only country with homophobia and American Christians certainly aren't the only homophobic ones. To suggest otherwise is naive.
3 of the four articles you posted were in relation to the Catholic view on Gay marriage. Taking into account that the Catholic church believe marriage to be a union under the eyes of God and also see homo-sexuality, as an act, to be a sin it is hardly unreasonable or homophobic of them to not condone what they believe to be a sin being performed in the house of God. It's hardly in the same league as walking around with sandwich boards saying 'God hates fags' or condeming the media for allowing homo-sexuality.

In terms of the Libia one I refer you to the start of the post of mine you have quoted "most of the Western world" now, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that Libia are classified as a western country.

I certainly don't believe American Christians are the only homo-phobic groups on the planet by any means, but in terms of the way they express it they are most certainly conveying the wrongfully negative views if Christianity. In my own observation of Christianity in other countries, particularly the United Kingdom, the majority of churches would actually condemn the actions of these American groups.
 

Hazy992

Why does this place still exist
Aug 1, 2010
5,265
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0
DefiantGoblin said:
Hazy992 said:
DefiantGoblin said:
CriticKitten said:
"These companies are heavily influencing our youth by using children's superheroes to desensitize and brainwash them in thinking that a gay lifestyle choice is normal and desirable."
....

Let's review, shall we?

Christianity is a religion based on the teachings of Jesus, who preached tolerance in an age of corruption and unfairness, and encouraged his followers to practice forgiveness and compassion for all people in the world. All of which are genuinely good ideas.

Fast forward to the present day, and it's considered "Christian" to be intolerant of homosexuals, among other incredibly insensitive beliefs.

Good job. Jesus would be so proud of what his church has become, I'm sure.
These people aren't Christian and don't represent what the modern church is like in any way, shape or form.

Most of the Western world are tolerant of homo-sexuality, it literally seems to be America that have a problem with it. It seems to me that whenever these groups do anything like this people come out and make negative comments about Christianity but nobody seems to pick up on the fact that they are all American. No Christian from Europe or Africa would condone these views so I don't understand why Christianity in general is tarnished with this negativity.

Right-wing America need to realise that the rest of the world have moved on and that their views are bordering on archaic.
I [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-17320932] beg [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17102352] to [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17249099] differ [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-17380950]
America isn't the only country with homophobia and American Christians certainly aren't the only homophobic ones. To suggest otherwise is naive.
3 of the four articles you posted were in relation to the Catholic view on Gay marriage. Taking into account that the Catholic church believe marriage to be a union under the eyes of God and also see homo-sexuality, as an act, to be a sin it is hardly unreasonable or homophobic of them to not condone what they believe to be a sin being performed in the house of God. It's hardly in the same league as walking around with sandwich boards saying 'God hates fags' or condeming the media for allowing homo-sexuality.

In terms of the Libia one I refer you to the start of the post of mine you have quoted "most of the Western world" now, forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that Libia are classified as a western country.

I certainly don't believe American Christians are the only homo-phobic groups on the planet by any means, but in terms of the way they express it they are most certainly conveying the wrongfully negative views if Christianity. In my own observation of Christianity in other countries, particularly the United Kingdom, the majority of churches would actually condemn the actions of these American groups.
So? When the head of the biggest Christian denomination in the world, a domination with more than a billion members speaks out against same sex marriage it's safe to say he represents the modern Church. Are all Catholics homophobic? Of course not, but the homophobia goes all the way to the top.

As for the article on Liberia (not Libya) you said no Christian from Europe or Africa would hold these views. I showed you otherwise. I mean just look how many countries in Africa have outright banned homosexuality [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory#Africa]
 

Lugbzurg

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Mar 4, 2012
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Guys, I cannot express how ignorant you are. You honestly think that stuff like this doesn't influence kids?
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17852_3-57441370-71/marvel-creates-superhero-for-boy-with-hearing-aid/
Children mimic what they see. Just because something being in the right or wrong is clear to you, doesn't mean children will see things the same way. Heck, even people your age will copy and adore something just because they think it's cool. That's why we still have people pumping toxic chemicals into their lungs. Because, they think it's cool. Then, they're stuck with it and can't leave it behind.
 

scorptatious

The Resident Team ICO Fanboy
May 14, 2009
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As much as I disagree with what these people are doing, I can't help but understand how they are feeling.

WAIT! WAIT! BEFORE YOU FLAME ME, LISTEN TO WHAT I HAVE TO SAY!

Like it or not, kids are impressionable. I know I was when I was little. Kids shouldn't have to feel that they need to be a certain sexual orientation just because the people they look up to are. They're kids! They shouldn't have to worry about this kind of thing at their age.

Now if these parents did their job and explain to their kids about what's going on instead of trying to censor everything, then we wouldn't have a problem.
 

chetoos

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Jul 13, 2009
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Not sure how iconic he is, or if he's been mentioned before in the thread, but isn't Gear still gay?
 

ReservoirAngel

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Nov 6, 2010
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Lugbzurg said:
Guys, I cannot express how ignorant you are. You honestly think that stuff like this doesn't influence kids?
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17852_3-57441370-71/marvel-creates-superhero-for-boy-with-hearing-aid/
Children mimic what they see. Just because something being in the right or wrong is clear to you, doesn't mean children will see things the same way. Heck, even people your age will copy and adore something just because they think it's cool. That's why we still have people pumping toxic chemicals into their lungs. Because, they think it's cool. Then, they're stuck with it and can't leave it behind.
I would remind you of one thing: being gay isn't something you can just suddenly become. At the very most it might make some specific kids slightly willing to experiment a little. But even then, if they do so and enjoy it... they were gay already. If they try it and don't like it, no harm no foul and nothing changes.

So no matter how you slice it, "a comic book character being gay will make children into faggots!" is stupid.
 

Mullahgrrl

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Apr 20, 2008
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Zhukov said:
When did "family" become a euphemism for "uptight conservative killjoys"?
I am guessing due to the Manson Family.

Either that or it is a evolution from it meaning mafia.
 

Mullahgrrl

New member
Apr 20, 2008
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Lugbzurg said:
Guys, I cannot express how ignorant you are. You honestly think that stuff like this doesn't influence kids?
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17852_3-57441370-71/marvel-creates-superhero-for-boy-with-hearing-aid/
Children mimic what they see. Just because something being in the right or wrong is clear to you, doesn't mean children will see things the same way. Heck, even people your age will copy and adore something just because they think it's cool. That's why we still have people pumping toxic chemicals into their lungs. Because, they think it's cool. Then, they're stuck with it and can't leave it behind.
No, were not ignorant, it is just nothing wrong with being gay.
 

samaugsch

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Oct 13, 2010
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TomLikesGuitar said:
I have a completely serious question.

Why are comics suddenly so fucking obsessed with gay activism and political correctness? Both of the major comic companies have dived faced first into confronting homosexuality and it's ridiculous. There's a reason most video game protagonists are straight. Most people are straight.

That's how life is.

Why make a character gay for no reason? It's tacky. Maybe if one of them had a male antagonist who always had some slight degree of sexual tension it could be cool (think Batman and Catwoman), but otherwise it just feels like they are shoehorning political correctness into the already fully stuffed boot that is the comic industry.
Maybe gay people recently started complaining about the lack of gay characters? Yeah, that's all I've got.