PETITION: Continue to sell Grand Theft Auto 5 in Australia

[NuclearKangaroo]

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

You heard it here, folks, Gamergate can pack up and go home. Nobody cares about editorial content, legitimising all those "Gamers are Dead" articles and other "Social Justice" content GG has been complaining about. And while we're at it, can we get Jim Sterling back here?

I mean, seriously I can't help but notice how little of the content that offends GG is news. I mean, just look at ho many GGers are up in arms about Anita Sarkeesian being hired by EA (despite this being false). It has nothing to do with news, journalistic ethics, or even reality. I mean, I know you hate Anita, but some consistency would be nice once in a while.

GG will pack up and go home when news outlets start enforcing more transparency, actual ethics and stop pushing politics into gaming

the problem with the articles is that they prove there was collusion among news outlet and theres evidence of that

 

[Haerthan]

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

gamergate is not a person, but the movement is and has always been about ethics in games journalism, and about keeping politics out of gaming

there are ways to express your political beliefs that do not lead to developers being pressured into participating into a certain agenda

so far i have only participated in activities that promote these goals, that punish unethical news outlets and support ethical ones, ive stopped visiting sites accused of corruption and pushing political agendas, ive sent emails to the advertisers of corrupt outlets and outlets run by people for for instance, support bullying, ive also congratulated the efforts of certain unless towards being more transparent, such as the escapist

Really, keeping politics out of games? Is that even possible? Every rational person would say no. Our very culture, and all other cultures are political. Everything has a politics. EVERYTHING. THere is no such as a product/industry/person who isn't political. It is impossible by the very nature of humanity. But hey keep telling yourself that.

And what outlets were "unethical"? The ones that ran those OP-EDs of "Gamers are dead". Trying to censor harassment and showing you that gaming is diverse does not count as unethical. Your very campaign is rooted in misogyny and all your attempts to show differently are just lies or misinformation.

Attacking "unethical" outlets just cause they have a different politics or believe in diversity of gaming is unethical in of itself. I read the OP-ED after September from Polygon. You know what it says for every OP-ED at the end of it? That the opinions shown in the article are not Polygon's. And that is one example that I know off. Since Intel pulled off their ad funding from Polygon, or was it them

http://www.polygon.com/2014/11/17/7235801/game-criticism-ideology-gamergate-and-they-live

Guess what it says on the pic: OPINION. The end says :"The views expressed in this article are those of the author and do not necessarily represent the views of, and should not be attributed to, Polygon as an organization". In my eyes you are nothing more than a cancer willing to silence everyone that has a different opinion.
Want more proof that your entire movement is tainted? HEre it is:
http://www.polygon.com/2014/8/28/6078391/video-games-awful-week. Again an OP-ED. Time and time again you and your cohorts have done nothing more than attack people for daring to:

1) be women in a male-dominated industry
2) attack everyone who has a different opinion as if games were something sacrosanct.

Congratulations. You PROVED Jack Thompson right. You proved everyone who had a stiffy against gamers right. And it is all on YOU.

 

[Zhukov]

[snippety]

they are using their position to push agendas into gaming, take a good look at the situation right now

if you dont appeals to the political agendas of these people your game gets lower review scores and retailers are pressued to pull your game off the shelves, dont you see how this can affect what gets and what doesnt get added into a game?

*ahem*

"If you don't appeal to the political agendas of Gamergaters your advertisers will be pressured to pull ads from your website, don't you see how this can affect what gets and what doesn't get written by news outlets?"

See how this works?

Buddy, this little debate ends one of two ways. Either you accept that anti-game consumer action does not constitute censorship or you admit that the equivalent consumer action of Gamergate does constitute censorship by your own definition. Take your pick. Don't fret, I'll be smugly satisfied with either outcome.

also did you know about this little thing about gone home?

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/817/157/bc8.png

http://i.imgur.com/8atPtzN.jpg

the developer and the polygon reviewer had a close relationship before the game was reviewed, dont you think theres a problem there?

Haha, yeah, I've seen those.

This is why I view Gamergaters in the same light as conspiracy theorists.

"They exchanged messages on Twitter! They were on a podcast together! Corruption! This goes all the way to the top! Games journos can't have friends! Nor can they have conversations with other people in the industry!"

Just another pack of incredibly petty people throwing a tantrum because a game they didn't like got a score they didn't think it deserved, so they run about frantically trying to discredit the reviewer any way they can rather than face the prospect of someone liking a game they didn't like.

Comes across as especially dumb in this case. Gone Home got respectable scores from most reviewers [http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/gone-home/critic-reviews], including 14 in the 90-100 range. Polygon was only one of seven to give it a perfect score. Gosh, the developers must be Twitter friends with damn near everyone!

The two stores in Australia who pulled GTA5 did so as a result of the same decision since they are both owned by the same parent company.

alright then, is still a big problem, but maybe the issue isnt expanding then

Y'know, given that I actually live in Australia and have been on the receiving end of actual game censorship, wherein a body of authority forced the removal of content they deemed unacceptable (L4D2, Stick of Truth), you don't get to tell me when it's a big problem.

Hey, #NotYourBloodyShield mate.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Oh God something hilarious just happened. A bunch of people demanded that Target stop selling the Bible on the grounds that it's also mysognistic. Got 40,000 signatures, just short of the one that got GTA V. I wasn't sure what to think of this, but then something happened that I find to be hilarious. Target explained why they can't stop selling the Bible. They weren't actually selling it in the first place. This would've been the ultimate ironic take that if the makers of the new petition had looked before they jumped.

You have to admit that's pretty funny.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/ryanhatesthis/target-cant-ban-the-bible-because-they-dont-sell-it

They apparently don't sell anything that might be offensive? Do they only sell watercress and sticks to shoo away local wildlife?

 

[Haerthan]

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

gamergate is not a person, but the movement is and has always been about ethics in games journalism, and about keeping politics out of gaming

there are ways to express your political beliefs that do not lead to developers being pressured into participating into a certain agenda

so far i have only participated in activities that promote these goals, that punish unethical news outlets and support ethical ones, ive stopped visiting sites accused of corruption and pushing political agendas, ive sent emails to the advertisers of corrupt outlets and outlets run by people for for instance, support bullying, ive also congratulated the efforts of certain unless towards being more transparent, such as the escapist

Really, keeping politics out of games? Is that even possible? Every rational person would say no. Our very culture, and all other cultures are political. Everything has a politics. EVERYTHING. THere is no such as a product/industry/person who isn't political. It is impossible by the very nature of humanity. But hey keep telling yourself that.

And what outlets were "unethical"? The ones that ran those OP-EDs of "Gamers are dead". Trying to censor harassment and showing you that gaming is diverse does not count as unethical. Your very campaign is rooted in misogyny and all your attempts to show differently are just lies or misinformation.

Attacking "unethical" outlets just cause they have a different politics or believe in diversity of gaming is unethical in of itself. I read the OP-ED after September from Polygon. You know what it says for every OP-ED at the end of it? That the opinions shown in the article are not Polygon's. And that is one example that I know off. Since Intel pulled off their ad funding from Polygon, or was it them

http://www.polygon.com/2014/11/17/7235801/game-criticism-ideology-gamergate-and-they-live

Guess what it says on the pic: OPINION. The end says :"The views expressed in this article are those of the author and do not necessarily represent the views of, and should not be attributed to, Polygon as an organization". In my eyes you are nothing more than a cancer willing to silence everyone that has a different opinion.
Want more proof that your entire movement is tainted? HEre it is:
http://www.polygon.com/2014/8/28/6078391/video-games-awful-week. Again an OP-ED. Time and time again you and your cohorts have done nothing more than attack people for daring to:

1) be women in a male-dominated industry
2)

attack everyone who has a different opinion as if games were something sacrosanct.

Both sides are guilty of that,I've had plenty of Anti GGers attack me and other people just for having a different opinion so it's not the sole work of GamerGate.

Congratulations. You PROVED Jack Thompson right. You proved everyone who had a stiffy against gamers right. And it is all on YOU.

Okay now you've lost me here....how does a internet group prove Jack Thompson and company right?Alright I've got back home from work so let's see what he have here...

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

(Sighs)....Once again,letting potential sponsors and advertisers know just how much of a ass the people they're working with are is not censorship.

I'm done with this crap,you people can have your petty little fights.I'm washing my hands of all of this GamerGate nonsense.

Ok im going to make it in simple words GamingBlaze. The amount of harassment thrown to Zoe Quinn shows that we are IMMATURE. That we view games as sacrosanct for some stupid reason. We proved him right when the first harassment campaign started against her and Anita Sarkeesian. There was a bloody videogame ffs about beating her up. He could have safely said :"See they are violent". That simple fact proved.

Oh and having a different opinion is being an ass. No GamingBlaze you are an ass. Everybody is entitled to their opinion. As you believe that having a different opinion means being an ass in your eyes, in my eyes you are a cancer for the community. So again Congratulations, nobody is taking us seriously anymore. I hope you are freaking happy.

Edit: I do apologize for insulting you. But this entire thing is tainted. Stop GG and maybe people will stop seeing as nothing more than misogynists.

 

[IceForce]

]

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

(Sighs)....Once again,letting potential sponsors and advertisers know just how much of a ass the people they're working with are is not censorship.

Why not also let the local dairy owner know, or the owner of the local garden center?

Don't be disingenuous. The endgame goal of "letting sponsors and advertisers know" is to put pressure on the websites in question to alter their content or change what content they publish in the future. Either that or drive them out of business altogether by severing their advertising income.

 

[Something Amyss]

what false information?

You mean aside from pretending that there's a new development that there's multiple stores and this reflects some sort of progression, the very point you were trying to make in your slippery slope argument?

so it was a huge coincidence that this avalance of articles were written all almost in the same day?

Except they weren't, but can you prove it wasn't a coincidence? Your evidence was crap, so now you're trying to use conspiracy theory logic.

just because they can say what they want doesnt mean i have to support it, its ridiculous

You just asked who cares about editorial content, and then immediately railed against it. That's a contradiction right there. You don't have to support it, but you just said editorial content wasn't an issue and made an issue out of it. You can't even keep your own story straight.

GG will pack up and go home when news outlets start enforcing more transparency, actual ethics and stop pushing politics into gaming

Ah, but you're changing your story again.

the problem with the articles is that they prove there was collusion among news outlet and theres evidence of that

There really isn't. No number of red lines and link spamming will change that.

Y'know, given that I actually live in Australia and have been on the receiving end of actual game censorship, wherein a body of authority forced the removal of content they deemed unacceptable (L4D2, Stick of Truth), you don't get to tell me when it's a big problem.

Hey, #NotYourBloodyShield mate.

You know what's best about that? I just replied to a post by one NuclearKangaroo who said that #notyourshield demonstrated that we should let people talk for themselves.

im just saying, before doing something in the name of X people, why not ask X people first?

if #notyourshield proved anythign is that you should let people talk for themselves, do not claim to represent an entire group of people, unless they elected you to do so or something

I don't know, maybe this doesn't apply to Australians?

 

[Haerthan]

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

gamergate is not a person, but the movement is and has always been about ethics in games journalism, and about keeping politics out of gaming

there are ways to express your political beliefs that do not lead to developers being pressured into participating into a certain agenda

so far i have only participated in activities that promote these goals, that punish unethical news outlets and support ethical ones, ive stopped visiting sites accused of corruption and pushing political agendas, ive sent emails to the advertisers of corrupt outlets and outlets run by people for for instance, support bullying, ive also congratulated the efforts of certain unless towards being more transparent, such as the escapist

Really, keeping politics out of games? Is that even possible? Every rational person would say no. Our very culture, and all other cultures are political. Everything has a politics. EVERYTHING. THere is no such as a product/industry/person who isn't political. It is impossible by the very nature of humanity. But hey keep telling yourself that.

And what outlets were "unethical"? The ones that ran those OP-EDs of "Gamers are dead". Trying to censor harassment and showing you that gaming is diverse does not count as unethical. Your very campaign is rooted in misogyny and all your attempts to show differently are just lies or misinformation.

Attacking "unethical" outlets just cause they have a different politics or believe in diversity of gaming is unethical in of itself. I read the OP-ED after September from Polygon. You know what it says for every OP-ED at the end of it? That the opinions shown in the article are not Polygon's. And that is one example that I know off. Since Intel pulled off their ad funding from Polygon, or was it them

http://www.polygon.com/2014/11/17/7235801/game-criticism-ideology-gamergate-and-they-live

Guess what it says on the pic: OPINION. The end says :"The views expressed in this article are those of the author and do not necessarily represent the views of, and should not be attributed to, Polygon as an organization". In my eyes you are nothing more than a cancer willing to silence everyone that has a different opinion.
Want more proof that your entire movement is tainted? HEre it is:
http://www.polygon.com/2014/8/28/6078391/video-games-awful-week. Again an OP-ED. Time and time again you and your cohorts have done nothing more than attack people for daring to:

1) be women in a male-dominated industry
2)

attack everyone who has a different opinion as if games were something sacrosanct.

Both sides are guilty of that,I've had plenty of Anti GGers attack me and other people just for having a different opinion so it's not the sole work of GamerGate.

Congratulations. You PROVED Jack Thompson right. You proved everyone who had a stiffy against gamers right. And it is all on YOU.

Okay now you've lost me here....how does a internet group prove Jack Thompson and company right?Alright I've got back home from work so let's see what he have here...

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

(Sighs)....Once again,letting potential sponsors and advertisers know just how much of a ass the people they're working with are is not censorship.

I'm done with this crap,you people can have your petty little fights.I'm washing my hands of all of this GamerGate nonsense.

Ok im going to make it in simple words GamingBlaze. The amount of harassment thrown to Zoe Quinn shows that we are IMMATURE. That we view games as sacrosanct for some stupid reason. We proved him right when the first harassment campaign started against her and Anita Sarkeesian. There was a bloody videogame ffs about beating her up. He could have safely said :"See they are violent". That simple fact proved.

Oh and having a different opinion is being an ass. No GamingBlaze you are an ass. Everybody is entitled to their opinion. As you believe that having a different opinion means being an ass in your eyes, in my eyes you are a cancer for the community. So again Congratulations, nobody is taking us seriously anymore. I hope you are freaking happy.

Edit: I do apologize for insulting you. But this entire thing is tainted. Stop GG and maybe people will stop seeing as nothing more than misogynists.

And he would be wrong,generalizing a entire group based of the actions of a minority is something I dislike.

And what else is new?I've been insulted left and right on multiple forums over this crap.You wanna talk about immaturity?Look no further than the people who are on your side.I'm a cancer?Really???

[Edit]:I missed the part where you apologized but my point still stands.

Oh dont worry the people on my side who harass other people are scumbags, just like the ones on your side. I never said that my side didn't have issues. What I am saying is that your side has bigger issues than mine. At least I call out people from my side and say that what they are doing isn't right. So here goes "nothing":

EVERYBODY WHO HARASSES IS A SCUMBAG IN MY EYES, REGARDLESS OF IDEOLOGY.

 

[Something Amyss]

There wouldn't even be a ad/sponsor campaign if some of these journalists acted like professionals so reap what you sow and all that jazz.

How strange, then, that GG felt they had to be dishonest to get their way.

And how is instructing people not to use sites and to use adblockers not a boycott, while we're at it?

 

[Haerthan]

Also let us not forget that GG at its most powerful is not even 10,000 accounts. This link, if trustworthy, shows that there's no more than 1000 accounts all tweeting and echoing each other:

http://www.reddit.com/r/GamerGhazi/comments/2kmh6j/lets_not_forget_that_they_arent_as_big_as_they/

So as far as I am concerned, you are no revolt. You are an error in sales projection. You are nothing more than the backwardness finally being kicked out and now that the monster has been revealed it is time to bring you with the rest of us into the future. You will like or not. I dont care.

 

[Haerthan]

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

gamergate is not a person, but the movement is and has always been about ethics in games journalism, and about keeping politics out of gaming

there are ways to express your political beliefs that do not lead to developers being pressured into participating into a certain agenda

so far i have only participated in activities that promote these goals, that punish unethical news outlets and support ethical ones, ive stopped visiting sites accused of corruption and pushing political agendas, ive sent emails to the advertisers of corrupt outlets and outlets run by people for for instance, support bullying, ive also congratulated the efforts of certain unless towards being more transparent, such as the escapist

Really, keeping politics out of games? Is that even possible? Every rational person would say no. Our very culture, and all other cultures are political. Everything has a politics. EVERYTHING. THere is no such as a product/industry/person who isn't political. It is impossible by the very nature of humanity. But hey keep telling yourself that.

And what outlets were "unethical"? The ones that ran those OP-EDs of "Gamers are dead". Trying to censor harassment and showing you that gaming is diverse does not count as unethical. Your very campaign is rooted in misogyny and all your attempts to show differently are just lies or misinformation.

Attacking "unethical" outlets just cause they have a different politics or believe in diversity of gaming is unethical in of itself. I read the OP-ED after September from Polygon. You know what it says for every OP-ED at the end of it? That the opinions shown in the article are not Polygon's. And that is one example that I know off. Since Intel pulled off their ad funding from Polygon, or was it them

http://www.polygon.com/2014/11/17/7235801/game-criticism-ideology-gamergate-and-they-live

Guess what it says on the pic: OPINION. The end says :"The views expressed in this article are those of the author and do not necessarily represent the views of, and should not be attributed to, Polygon as an organization". In my eyes you are nothing more than a cancer willing to silence everyone that has a different opinion.
Want more proof that your entire movement is tainted? HEre it is:
http://www.polygon.com/2014/8/28/6078391/video-games-awful-week. Again an OP-ED. Time and time again you and your cohorts have done nothing more than attack people for daring to:

1) be women in a male-dominated industry
2)

attack everyone who has a different opinion as if games were something sacrosanct.

Both sides are guilty of that,I've had plenty of Anti GGers attack me and other people just for having a different opinion so it's not the sole work of GamerGate.

Congratulations. You PROVED Jack Thompson right. You proved everyone who had a stiffy against gamers right. And it is all on YOU.

Okay now you've lost me here....how does a internet group prove Jack Thompson and company right?Alright I've got back home from work so let's see what he have here...

who cares about their editorial content? if they want to write an editorial defending jocial justice or blaming the jews for 9/11 i couldnt care less

when they push lies as news, i care, when they hold close relationships with the individuals they are covering, i care, when they take money for positive press, i care, when they try to use their position to push politics into gaming i care

So, again, what do you think of people pressuring websites to alter their editorial content? You think pressuring developers into changing their content is censorship, so we're all just wondering if you'll be consistent with your views. So far, all you've done is sidestep it with GamerGate nonsense you all love parroting over and over and over without anyone asking.

(Sighs)....Once again,letting potential sponsors and advertisers know just how much of a ass the people they're working with are is not censorship.

I'm done with this crap,you people can have your petty little fights.I'm washing my hands of all of this GamerGate nonsense.

Ok im going to make it in simple words GamingBlaze. The amount of harassment thrown to Zoe Quinn shows that we are IMMATURE. That we view games as sacrosanct for some stupid reason. We proved him right when the first harassment campaign started against her and Anita Sarkeesian. There was a bloody videogame ffs about beating her up. He could have safely said :"See they are violent". That simple fact proved.

Oh and having a different opinion is being an ass. No GamingBlaze you are an ass. Everybody is entitled to their opinion. As you believe that having a different opinion means being an ass in your eyes, in my eyes you are a cancer for the community. So again Congratulations, nobody is taking us seriously anymore. I hope you are freaking happy.

Edit: I do apologize for insulting you. But this entire thing is tainted. Stop GG and maybe people will stop seeing as nothing more than misogynists.

And he would be wrong,generalizing a entire group based of the actions of a minority is something I dislike.

And what else is new?I've been insulted left and right on multiple forums over this crap.You wanna talk about immaturity?Look no further than the people who are on your side.I'm a cancer?Really???

[Edit]:I missed the part where you apologized but my point still stands.

Oh dont worry the people on my side who harass other people are scumbags, just like the ones on your side. I never said that my side didn't have issues. What I am saying is that your side has bigger issues than mine. At least I call out people from my side and say that what they are doing isn't right. So here goes "nothing":

EVERYBODY WHO HARASSES IS A SCUMBAG IN MY EYES, REGARDLESS OF IDEOLOGY.

My side?
No fuck that noise,I'm tired of having to explain every fucking time that I don't and never have supported GamerGate.People like you have constantly tried to push me into their camp because you take a "us vs them" to the extreme.

So no,you nor anyone else don't get to label me just so I can be a "enemy",fuck that shit.

Then how about you stop parroting the crap they spew? Maybe then people will stop pushing you that way. Think for yourself for a minute, because if you are not a GGer than you are either a neutral, which I applaud, or you are one of us (one of us, one of us, one of us). So if you are not on their side, why would you spew their rhetoric? And that is an actual question

 

[Something Amyss]

People like you have constantly tried to push me into their camp because you take a "us vs them" to the extreme.

Seems to be people like you, too. You seem to be very quick with terms like that, or broad statements about Anti-GG folk and whatnot. I don't even care that you seem to be as strong an apologist for GG as there is, despite how you define yourself, but you seem quick to call people for actions you do yourself.

 

[Something Amyss]

I don't like the methods they use but my inner free market supporter likes the results.

If you're a free market supporter, don't you like the results of the Target petition?