[Politics] Effing Trump and the Media.

[Saelune]

Trump and Controversy

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

Your complains aren't well founded. You speak about media, without showing the general public's opinion...

So, I actually did.

...That Democratic-affiliated persons' trust in the media [https://news.gallup.com/poll/243665/media-trust-continues-recover-2016-low.aspx] jumped from 51%-76% in the wake of the Trump election baffles, and frankly outrages, me...

That said, how about some more links about failing media literacy? Would you like those? I got those!

https://www.orfonline.org/expert-speak/media-literacy-a-need-for-the-hour-52210/

https://www.cjr.org/the_new_gatekeepers/disinformation-whitney-phillips.php

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-disinformation-exclusive/exclusive-echo-chambers-fake-news-fact-checks-hobbled-by-low-reach-study-shows-idUSKCN1U60PT

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/study-finds-college-educated-americans-130000779.html

https://www.niemanlab.org/2019/07/nuclear-disasters-information-vacuums-how-a-lack-of-data-in-fukushima-led-to-the-spread-of-fake-health-news/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/prudygourguechon/2019/06/26/chilling-new-study-says-most-college-educated-americans-fail-at-basic-digital-literacy/#77187be83033

Pop quiz time! I popped a "fake news" link in there on purpose, can you guess which? Answers below!

Spoiler

It's the Yahoo link, duh! It's undisclosed native advertising, published by a for-profit corporation that specializes in press release publication and search optimization. "MindEdge" is a for-profit online school, make of that what you will. I threw the Forbes link in there to be a dick, because it discusses the same study, but is actually a blog -- not that's disclosed on the Forbes page, which has been a long-running sawmill against Forbes for some time.

While the cited study is datawalled, it actually appears for all intents and purposes to be legitimate, with its methodology and findings readily available. However, the study itself appears to be of dubious and pernicious intent, being utilized to farm data and advertise the services of the company which produced it, the idea being to scare individuals into paying to take their media literacy classes.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Let's take every last word you wrote at face value. Then why crap up the signal-to-noise ratio reporting for days on end about tweets?

What exactly new information does three days' worth of reporting on a tweet add?

The fact that Trump's actions are getting closer to an official Censure, which some believed these Racist Tweets earned?

The fact that just yesterday, the House came together and voted to condemn (and not censure as some wanted) Trump's actions?

The fact that if it gone through, the last President that has been formally Censured was Andrew Jackson? Meaning it's been 185 years since a President has gotten so close to being officially Censured by name.

That Trump's actions are getting so inexcusable that Legislative Branches must formally condemn it in order to show his conduct is unbecoming of the most Powerful Man in The World... the very man who's been eroding that very station since he got into office?

That is a big deal.

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

The fact that Trump's actions are getting closer to an official Censure, which some believed these Racist Tweets earned?

Hate to break it to you, but that's absolutely nothing new. Trump's an asshole and the country's known it for decades. People voted for him, as you yourself stated in this very thread among others, for that precise reason. That tweet was Trump being Trump, and there's absolutely no reason to devote four news cycles to it now other than "for the ratings".

The fact that just yesterday, the House came together and voted to condemn (and not censure as some wanted) Trump's actions?

Blue dogs and corporate Democrats are increasingly losing their ability to run interference for the bastard, by trying to turn Trump's antics and impeachment into electoral carrot-and-stick motivators, you mean. Not because Trump acts any different, or worse, now than he has at any point in the past, but because progressive Democrats, and Democratic voters in sum, expect Democrats to do the job they campaigned to do. Even then, 137 of the fuckers still voted to kill impeachment despite an overwhelming amount of evidence to draw articles -- that existed before this week's shitshow.

As evidenced by the growing feud between progressive Democrats and Pelosi. That's what's new.

But thank God Dastardly Doo-Doo Face Rand Paul nicked the 9/11 first responders' fund bill as most expected some Senate Republican to do, or else we might have to hear about that.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

The fact that Trump's actions are getting closer to an official Censure, which some believed these Racist Tweets earned?

Hate to break it to you, but that's absolutely nothing new. Trump's an asshole and the country's known it for decades. People voted for him, as you yourself stated in this very thread among others, for that precise reason. That tweet was Trump being Trump, and there's absolutely no reason to devote four news cycles to it now other than "for the ratings".

The fact that just yesterday, the House came together and voted to condemn (and not censure as some wanted) Trump's actions?

Blue dogs and corporate Democrats are increasingly losing their ability to run interference for the bastard, by trying to turn Trump's antics and impeachment into electoral carrot-and-stick motivators, you mean. Not because Trump acts any different, or worse, now than he has at any point in the past, but because progressive Democrats, and Democratic voters in sum, expect Democrats to do the job they campaigned to do. Even then, 137 of the fuckers still voted to kill impeachment despite an overwhelming amount of evidence to draw articles -- that existed before this week's shitshow.

As evidenced by the growing feud between progressive Democrats and Pelosi. That's what's new.

But thank God Dastardly Doo-Doo Face Rand Paul nicked the 9/11 first responders' fund bill as most expected some Senate Republican to do, or else we might have to hear about that.

Dismissal of perceived importance of what I said aside, you asked why we're still talking about it. That is why we are still talking about it. Full stop.

Measure importance how you will, but that was the news of yesterday, and the fall out of it is still felt today because now those Republicans who didn't vote to speak out against Trump's actions must answer for it.

 

[Saelune]

The fact that Trump's actions are getting closer to an official Censure, which some believed these Racist Tweets earned?

Hate to break it to you, but that's absolutely nothing new. Trump's an asshole and the country's known it for decades. People voted for him, as you yourself stated in this very thread among others, for that precise reason. That tweet was Trump being Trump, and there's absolutely no reason to devote four news cycles to it now other than "for the ratings".

The fact that just yesterday, the House came together and voted to condemn (and not censure as some wanted) Trump's actions?

Blue dogs and corporate Democrats are increasingly losing their ability to run interference for the bastard, by trying to turn Trump's antics and impeachment into electoral carrot-and-stick motivators, you mean. Not because Trump acts any different, or worse, now than he has at any point in the past, but because progressive Democrats, and Democratic voters in sum, expect Democrats to do the job they campaigned to do. Even then, 137 of the fuckers still voted to kill impeachment despite an overwhelming amount of evidence to draw articles -- that existed before this week's shitshow.

As evidenced by the growing feud between progressive Democrats and Pelosi. That's what's new.

But thank God Dastardly Doo-Doo Face Rand Paul nicked the 9/11 first responders' fund bill as most expected some Senate Republican to do, or else we might have to hear about that.

Yeah, that IS just Trump being Trump. BUT HIS SUPPORTERS HAVE BEEN CLAIMING THATS NOT TRUE! They have been pulling that shit for years! They claim he is not racist when he does racist things! They claim he is not sexist when he does sexist things!

They praise him for being rude, then condemn his critics for being rude! They tell left-wingers to stop being 'fragile snowflakes' then utterly meltdown when pointed out how much of a little ***** Trump is at EVERY SINGLE SLIGHT!

Stop blaming Democrats for what Trump is doing, stop blaming Democrats for what Republicans are doing! This is the problem. When they do anything wrong, its us getting yelled at!

 

[Saelune]

I make a bunch of topics pointing out how bad Trump is

'You complain about Trump too much'

Ok, well, here is Rand Paul being terrible

'Why aren't you focusing on Trump!?'

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

Measure importance how you will, but that was the news of yesterday, and the fall out of it is still felt today because now those Republicans who didn't vote to speak out against Trump's actions must answer for it.

Four hours of bickering between progressive and corporate Democrats, and Republicans, about parley pro and House rules, followed by the sitting chair basically saying fuck it and walking out, culminating in a non-binding House resolution with less weight than a vote to seat a subcommittee to investigate and report on whether the House should select an official pancake. That's the fucking story, right there. You keep wanting to talk about the great import of the issue since it was the First Time Ever Since Johnson that a sitting President was...written a strongly-worded angry letter from the House. Except Johnson was actually, y'know, impeached (something of a prerequisite for censure).

Literally the only thing standing in the way to impeachment is House Democrats' ardent refusal to do their fucking job, because they're scared of potential blowback for doing their fucking job, as opposed to the guaranteed blowback for not doing their fucking job. Like it or not, Republicans will enter 2020 with the notion of turning the election into a referendum on impeachment, thus Democrats have nothing to lose by doing their fucking job. And given that 2020 is a redistricting election and state parties are still absolutely fucked after the 2016 piggy bank raid that was the Clinton campaign with no clear attempt or even plan to rebuild in the next year, after last month's dumpster fire of a SCOTUS ruling on gerrymandering this upcoming election is one Democrats absolutely, positively cannot afford to fuck up. Because, frankly, it very much is an existential matter to the republic.

Which is why current reporting is shit. It's 24-hour, seven day a week, Mickey Mouse bullshit for ratings while reality goes conveniently ignored.

The truly outstanding thing here, is you expect House Republicans to go back to their constituencies and answer for...doing exactly what they were elected to do. Oh, please, anything but making Republicans go back to the people who voted for them in the first goddamn place and explain they fulfilled a campaign promise! Because this is totally different from the "this time Republicans have to answer for themselves!" of...

...kids in cages...
...Hurricane Maria...
...pick a cabinet member, any cabinet member...
...very fine people...
...Stormy Daniels, Jessica Drake, Karen McDougal, and Alana Evans...
...grabbin' em by the pussy...
...making fun of handicapped reporters...
...his Home Alone 2 cameo...
...the other 15 women who have accused him of sexual misconduct...
...Trump University...
...Trump steaks...
...business ties to Russia and China...
...the Kushners...
...and the list goes on!

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Measure importance how you will, but that was the news of yesterday, and the fall out of it is still felt today because now those Republicans who didn't vote to speak out against Trump's actions must answer for it.

Four hours of bickering between progressive and corporate Democrats, and Republicans, about parley pro and House rules, followed by the sitting chair basically saying fuck it and walking out, culminating in a non-binding House resolution with less weight than a vote to seat a subcommittee to investigate and report on whether the House should select an official pancake. That's the fucking story, right there. You keep wanting to talk about the great import of the issue since it was the First Time Ever Since Johnson that a sitting President was...written a strongly-worded angry letter from the House. Except Johnson was actually, y'know, impeached (something of a prerequisite for censure).

Literally the only thing standing in the way to impeachment is House Democrats' ardent refusal to do their fucking job, because they're scared of potential blowback for doing their fucking job, as opposed to the guaranteed blowback for not doing their fucking job. Like it or not, Republicans will enter 2020 with the notion of turning the election into a referendum on impeachment, thus Democrats have nothing to lose by doing their fucking job. And given that 2020 is a redistricting election and state parties are still absolutely fucked after the 2016 piggy bank raid that was the Clinton campaign with no clear attempt or even plan to rebuild in the next year, after last month's dumpster fire of a SCOTUS ruling on gerrymandering this upcoming election is one Democrats absolutely, positively cannot afford to fuck up. Because, frankly, it very much is an existential matter to the republic.

Which is why current reporting is shit. It's 24-hour, seven day a week, Mickey Mouse bullshit for ratings while reality goes conveniently ignored.

The truly outstanding thing here, is you expect House Republicans to go back to their constituencies and answer for...doing exactly what they were elected to do. Oh, please, anything but making Republicans go back to the people who voted for them in the first goddamn place and explain they fulfilled a campaign promise! Because this is totally different from the "this time Republicans have to answer for themselves!" of...

...kids in cages...
...Hurricane Maria...
...pick a cabinet member, any cabinet member...
...very fine people...
...Stormy Daniels, Jessica Drake, Karen McDougal, and Alana Evans...
...grabbin' em by the pussy...
...making fun of handicapped reporters...
...his Home Alone 2 cameo...
...the other 15 women who have accused him of sexual misconduct...
...Trump University...
...Trump steaks...
...business ties to Russia and China...
...the Kushners...
...and the list goes on!

Eacaraxe, you have a remarkable ability to ask questions and impose so much more onto someone than what they answered.

You asked a question why we are talking about the Tweets. I gave the answer because that it just didn't happen once, but the situation has lead to multiple things occurring from it. You tell me what I already know about Censure, but fun fact, most people in America don't even know what that is, let alone how often we flirt with it. But this latest incident had some senators ready to reach for the Censure Button. Which in itself is news worthy because if it went through, it would be one of the first times in history that a President was Censured and stuck.

We both know it's nothing more than a Demerit, but that's a history making thing.

And you're acting like I'm personally asking Republicans to chime in. I'm not. America wants them to. And the Media, as the people who make a living giving America the info they want, asks the Republicans to answer for why they voted the way they did, or how do they truly feel about the matter.

Because that's what they feel Americans are interested in.

Not me. I'm speaking on why the Media is doing what they consider their job, and they are doing it because they are measuring what Americans are clicking on... Oh, and also because it's the news that is happening now. Just like CNN had the front page of Trump's latest Klan Rally with the crowd chanting Send her Back [https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/17/politics/donald-trump-greenville-rally/index.html]

I'm not doing the chanting, Worgen's not talking about Omar at the Rally he set up for his Re-election, Saelune isn't apart of the News Media writing these questions to ask Trump and all of the Republicans. We're merely reporting this.

Do you see why it's unfair to then go after us like the manner you've just done with me now? I don't expect anything from the Republicans. Especially even less now. But other Americans do. Other Americans want answers or clarity. The media is asking for them. And that's all I'm saying.

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

Snip.

Actually, what I pointed out was my firm belief Trump and the mass media have a symbiotic relationship, wherein Trump's antics feed the circus, and the circus signal boosts Trump's message for profit. Because there's an established pattern that every time Trump tweets something dumb, something else even worse happens which flies under the radar thanks to the circus fixating on the tweet.

What I want to know, is why more don't recognize this very obvious pattern, and the quite simple fact Trump has been the most profitable President for corporate media in the country's history, and start asking themselves on whose side corporate media is really on.

Which sector has posted record year-after-year profits since Trump announced his candidacy?

Spoiler

The mass media.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/dbloom/2018/11/05/happy-election-season-media-donald-trump-has-been-very-good-for-you/#32757df33abd

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/05/donald-trump-media-enemies/525381/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/10/25/yes-donald-trump-has-been-good-for-the-media-business/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.6ae0121fd184

Which sector are massive beneficiaries of Trump deregulation?

Spoiler

The mass media.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/26/business/media/att-time-warner-appeal.html

https://www.vox.com/culture/2019/3/20/18273477/disney-fox-merger-deal-details-marvel-x-men

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/16/business/media/fcc-local-tv.html

https://www.thenation.com/article/trumps-fcc-chair-moves-to-undermine-journalism-and-democracy/

Out of which sector were the biggest beneficiaries of the Trump tax cuts?

Spoiler

The mass media.

https://www.alternet.org/2018/02/disney-inadvertently-exposes-trumps-tax-cut-scam-its-been-start/

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/05/14/disgraceful-while-reaping-21-billion-windfall-trump-tax-cuts-report-shows-att

https://www.salon.com/2019/05/16/att-pocketed-donald-trumps-tax-cuts-after-promising-7000-new-jobs-and-it-slashed-23000-instead/

https://thinkprogress.org/comcast-tax-windfall-ad6cbf125028/

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/qvwkdm/how-tax-bill-impacts-telecom-comcast-att

In an industry that supposedly hates Trump so much, they sure do seem to love Trump's antics...and Trump's deregulations and tax cuts...and all the money that comes with it. Funny how all of those stories along with any discussion of earned media and the role it may have played in 2016 and 2018, get buried neatly underneath the circus. And in the meantime, for an alleged fascist President who hates the "free" press so much he wants them destroyed, he sure seems willing to cut them one blank check after another in the form of tax cuts and deregulation.

Might I suggest an alternate explanation? Like Trump's good friend Vince McMahon might say,


It's kayfabe. Trump being the heel, corporate media being the face, but really they're both on the side of the 1%.

There?s a ton of news right now, a lot is going on, and we have all these 24-hour news networks, and we could be covering everything. Instead, we?re covering three topics. Every hour is Trump, Russia, Hillary, and a panel full of people that remind you why you don?t go home for Thanksgiving. Milk comes from nuts now all because of the gays.

You guys are obsessed with Trump. Did you used to date him? Because you pretend like you hate him, but I think you love him. I think what no one in this room wants to admit is that Trump has helped all of you. He couldn?t sell steaks or vodka or water or college or ties or Eric, but he has helped you. He?s helped you sell your papers and your books and your TV. You helped create this monster, and now you?re profiting off of him. If you?re going to profit off of Trump, you should at least give him some money, because he doesn?t have any.

-Michelle Wolf, 2018 WHCD. The one part of her monologue the entirety of the mass media collectively failed to discuss.

Funny that, and funny how after uttering those words a comedian with an otherwise meteoric rise to fame out of nowhere was quietly ushered into a consolation prize Netflix talk show that was unceremoniously canned after ten episodes. One might almost surmise she was deplatformed for speaking truth to power.

The closest thing to an answer you're going to find aligning with your point of view, consistent with established fact, and consistent with the notion the media gives Americans the info they want as opposed to the info they need, isn't that Americans want clarity and answers. The answers to which you speak are already there, already come to light and been known for years, and clear for all the world to see. You either want real news, or you want the circus; one cannot proliferate in the existence of the other because as the saying goes, sunlight is the best disinfectant. That's as close to a dichotomy you're going to find in this discussion.

Americans have chosen the circus, as another poster stated in the previous page. That's the only answer, given facts at hand, logically consistent with your own point of view. I reject the notion; I assert Americans have had the circus chosen for them, by the circus and for the circus, and that this abominable situation arises due to outstanding lack of media literacy in the country and the fact Americans have been so far divorced from real news for so long, they've forgotten what real news even looks like.

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

Hey, genius! I don't know if you noticed, but there is a new thing: he is currently the POTUS! If you don't see that as a reason to pay attention to what he says to the general public, then you're a fucking lost cause!

Once again and for the last time, my grievance is with the media's unusual fixation upon Trump tweets and passing statements to the point of excluding and suppressing other stories of greater import, up to and including substantive changes to US domestic and foreign policy. Largely for the sake of profit as opposed to educating the American populace on the policies and positions of their own government, which raises serious implications on the intent and good faith of corporate media.

 

[CaitSeith]

Once again and for the last time, my grievance is with the media's unusual fixation upon Trump tweets and passing statements to the point of excluding and suppressing other stories of greater import

I'm going to pull out an Eacaraxe here and say this isn't unusual. This has been business as usual for decades. The "human interest" articles and reports about Trump tweets pay the bills for the more serious/substantive articles.

The only difference is that 68% of Americans get their news on social media; not corporate media (and the trustworthiness of social media itself is, well, much more subjective than corporate one and completely devoid of ethics other than the site's ToS).

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Hey, genius! I don't know if you noticed, but there is a new thing: he is currently the POTUS! If you don't see that as a reason to pay attention to what he says to the general public, then you're a fucking lost cause!

Once again and for the last time, my grievance is with the media's unusual fixation upon Trump tweets and passing statements to the point of excluding and suppressing other stories of greater import, up to and including substantive changes to US domestic and foreign policy. Largely for the sake of profit as opposed to educating the American populace on the policies and positions of their own government, which raises serious implications on the intent and good faith of corporate media.

I'm choosing to reply to this than what you said to me because I think I might reach you in this sentiment than the one you just sent me.

Could it possibly be that it's not that we're fixated on Trump, but the sway he has had on some people? How the nation has been more divided than it's ever been? We have American Citizens chanting to send another fellow citizen to they don't know where not because the Media reported on it, but because Trump said it and he is the reason for that sentiment?

You can call what he's doing Kayfabe. And for him, it very well might be. But there are large proportions of the population who believe in it. Who are turning to attack dogs, even in the face of 'Kayfabe'. It is disconcerting. Even if he's just a Trevor Slattery, there are people who are going to his (or whoever's) machinations.

And if people are stupid enough to just hear on Media that X is saying Y and then they go "Well, Y seems like something I should be about", then pull the plug on all of humanity and the idea of rational thought. Because if we can't even present occurrences in life without the fear that occurrences are enough to turn everyone's minds into malleably brain-dead drones who just parrot any nonsense they hear, what are we even doing any more?

But that's not the case. Kayfabe Trump or real Trump, those people who are rallying to his words are real. Whatever the veracity of the message, it has found a home in no small part of the American Population. And people must know that the highest seat in the land, again for real or for fake, is the one turning the crank that people are dancing to.

 

[CaitSeith]

Hey, genius! I don't know if you noticed, but there is a new thing: he is currently the POTUS! If you don't see that as a reason to pay attention to what he says to the general public, then you're a fucking lost cause!

Once again and for the last time, my grievance is with the media's unusual fixation upon Trump tweets and passing statements to the point of excluding and suppressing other stories of greater import, up to and including substantive changes to US domestic and foreign policy. Largely for the sake of profit as opposed to educating the American populace on the policies and positions of their own government, which raises serious implications on the intent and good faith of corporate media.

I'm choosing to reply to this than what you said to me because I think I might reach you in this sentiment than the one you just sent me.

Could it possibly be that it's not that we're fixated on Trump, but the sway he has had on some people? How the nation has been more divided than it's ever been? We have American Citizens chanting to send another fellow citizen to they don't know where not because the Media reported on it, but because Trump said it and he is

You can call what he's doing Kayfabe. And for him, it very well might be. But there are large proportions of the population who believe in it. Who are turning to attack dogs, even in the face of 'Kayfabe'. It is disconcerting. Even if he's just a Trevor Slattery, there are people who are going to his (or whoever's) machinations.

And if people are stupid enough to just hear on Media that X is saying Y and then they go "Well, Y seems like something I should be about", then pull the plug on all of humanity and the idea of rational thought. Because if we can't even present occurrences in life without the fear that occurrences are enough to turn everyone's minds into malleably brain-dead drones who just parrot any nonsense they hear, what are we even doing any more?

But that's not the case. Kayfabe Trump or real Trump, those people who are rallying to his words are real. Whatever the veracity of the message, it has found a home in no small part of the American Population. And people must know that the highest seat in the land, again for real or for fake, is the one turning the crank that people are dancing to.

Coincidentally enough, something similar happened with Milo Yiannapopotamus: conservatives at his left thought he was a joke, his peers thought he was clever, and those to his right thought he was serious. Fortunately, he wasn't the POTUS, so the general public heard very little of him.

 

[Saelune]

We live in a world where the cheaters get the people who follow the rules in trouble for cheating. Playing fair with bad people only makes you lose.

 

[Eacaraxe_v1legacy]

Snip.

You're absolutely right. The circus is nothing new. It's also why we're in the situation we are now, thanks to 2016 being a point of fracture between the Trump election, fake news crises, and growing role of social media and search engine administration in regulating news content and reach. Because the circus promotes echo chamber culture and media illiteracy, and the American populace has grown, at large, so media illiterate the center can no longer hold. Now, we're at a point where news reporting has been wholly subsumed by the circus, and that's the aberration.

You just cited big tech's untrustworthiness and general lack of professional ethics. It's rather telling that, in the wake of 2016, rather than promoting media literacy in end users, the FANG's have stepped away from their role as platforms and into the role of publisher to regulate media consumption, isn't it? And of course, to that you can add the ongoing phenomenon of adpocalypses and increased presence and algorithmic preference to legacy media on platforms. Do you really trust FANG's to act in good faith in a publication role, given their proven ethical track record elsewhere?

If you do, I have some fantastic beachfront property in Kansas to sell you.

Here are the facts. Political polarization in this country correlates to differing and evolving media habits [https://www.journalism.org/2014/10/21/political-polarization-media-habits/]. Political polarization in this country has grown [https://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/political-polarization-in-the-american-public/], dramatically to a point unseen in American history since the Civil War [https://news.usc.edu/110124/political-polarization-at-its-worst-since-the-civil-war-2/], in the past twenty years. This correlates directly to media consolidation over the past twenty years as initiated by the '96 telecoms act [https://blog.oup.com/2015/10/telecommunications-political-polarization/].

In other words, this is a problem of, by, and for corporate media. And until our media landscape is re-regulated and focus once again placed on fostering media literacy, the problem will not be fixed. End of story.

And as a parting thought, just because this is the way the media's always been, means the situation is okay, there's nothing inherently wrong with it, and nothing needs to be done about it? I never would have pegged you to unironically embrace a boilerplate conservative argument in defense of corporate malfeasance.

Snip.

We're not seeing eye to eye, because we're not arguing on the same plane. You keep pointing to Trump and acting as if he's the sole cause of these issues. First, he's a symptom and not a cause, and second, he's only one half of the current drama that plays out on our idiot boxes in real time. I'm not calling what he does alone kayfabe; I'm calling the mutually-beneficial relationship between Trump and the media itself kayfabe.

And if people are stupid enough to just hear on Media that X is saying Y and then they go "Well, Y seems like something I should be about", then pull the plug on all of humanity and the idea of rational thought. Because if we can't even present occurrences in life without the fear that occurrences are enough to turn everyone's minds into malleably brain-dead drones who just parrot any nonsense they hear, what are we even doing any more?

That's exactly what I'm saying is happening. Except that's a phenomenon not exclusive to Trump supporters. Last page I responded to Kyle and said I feel like we're collectively living a prologue chapter to Fahrenheit 451. How clearer can I be?

Not to be an asshole about this, but,

Spoiler

Eacaraxe Theory of Dum-Dum News for Dum-Dum!

Step 1: Reagan let media make dum-dum news for dum-dum!
Step 2: Media make dum-dum news for dum-dum!
Step 3: Dum-dum love dum-dum news!
Step 4: Clinton let media eat other media!
Step 5: Media who make dum-dum news eat media who don't make dum-dum news!
Step 6: Only media who make dum-dum news left!
Step 7: Dum-dum news make more dum-dum!
Step 8: Dum-dum billionaire runs for president!
Step 9: Media make dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president!
Step 10: Dum-dum love dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president! <3
Step 11: Media makes shitload of money making dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president!
Step 12: Dum-dum running for president wins election for president! UH-OH!
Step 13: Media makes shitload of money making dum-dum news about dum-dum president!
Step 14: Media secretly love dum-dum president, and dum-dum president secretly love media! <3
Step 15: Country go ker-blooey because full of dum-dum!

 

[CaitSeith]

In other words, this is a problem of, by, and for corporate media.

You just said correlation. That isn't causation. Sorry, but the story has to take account social media (whose ubiquitous presence is more recent than the 1996 and has given to politicians a more effective way to spread polarizing ideas) or it isn't accurate.

I agree that news media is pretty polarizing if you have only one source of information. But social media has had more effect in spreading dividing and extremist socio-political notions than corporate media since before the elections. Putting all the blame in corporate media while leaving social media out of the picture is missing the forest for the trees.

And as a parting thought, just because this is the way the media's always been, means the situation is okay, there's nothing inherently wrong with it, and nothing needs to be done about it? I never would have pegged you to unironically embrace a boilerplate conservative argument in defense of corporate malfeasance.

PS: That's why I said I was pulling out an Eacaraxe (it provokes the "always been =/= ok" counterargument). The problem is that the alternative to corporate media isn't any more trustworthy (and I'd dare to say that sometimes is worse), and it is replacing the latter. Unless regulation affects Youtubers, bloggers and other independent outlets; it will be for naught (that's it if the regulation itself doesn't end up just censoring news that the government doesn't want to be heard).

PPS: The source from your articles puts the blame for the Telecommunications Act of 1996 on Hilary Clinton for letting the Republicans to take the House of Representatives back then. *rolls eyes* It's like I just got rickrolled.

I feel like we're collectively living a prologue chapter to Fahrenheit 451

PPPS: Burn everything that isn't videogames or anime!!!

 

[Kwak]

Not to be an asshole about this, but,

Spoiler

Eacaraxe Theory of Dum-Dum News for Dum-Dum!

Step 1: Reagan let media make dum-dum news for dum-dum!
Step 2: Media make dum-dum news for dum-dum!
Step 3: Dum-dum love dum-dum news!
Step 4: Clinton let media eat other media!
Step 5: Media who make dum-dum news eat media who don't make dum-dum news!
Step 6: Only media who make dum-dum news left!
Step 7: Dum-dum news make more dum-dum!
Step 8: Dum-dum billionaire runs for president!
Step 9: Media make dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president!
Step 10: Dum-dum love dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president! <3
Step 11: Media makes shitload of money making dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president!
Step 12: Dum-dum running for president wins election for president! UH-OH!
Step 13: Media makes shitload of money making dum-dum news about dum-dum president!
Step 14: Media secretly love dum-dum president, and dum-dum president secretly love media! <3
Step 15: Country go ker-blooey because full of dum-dum!

I disagree with your main position in this thread, but I like your summary here.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

We're not seeing eye to eye, because we're not arguing on the same plane. You keep pointing to Trump and acting as if he's the sole cause of these issues. First, he's a symptom and not a cause, and second, he's only one half of the current drama that plays out on our idiot boxes in real time. I'm not calling what he does alone kayfabe; I'm calling the mutually-beneficial relationship between Trump and the media itself kayfabe.

And if people are stupid enough to just hear on Media that X is saying Y and then they go "Well, Y seems like something I should be about", then pull the plug on all of humanity and the idea of rational thought. Because if we can't even present occurrences in life without the fear that occurrences are enough to turn everyone's minds into malleably brain-dead drones who just parrot any nonsense they hear, what are we even doing any more?

That's exactly what I'm saying is happening. Except that's a phenomenon not exclusive to Trump supporters. Last page I responded to Kyle and said I feel like we're collectively living a prologue chapter to Fahrenheit 451. How clearer can I be?

Not to be an asshole about this, but,

Spoiler

Eacaraxe Theory of Dum-Dum News for Dum-Dum!

Step 1: Reagan let media make dum-dum news for dum-dum!
Step 2: Media make dum-dum news for dum-dum!
Step 3: Dum-dum love dum-dum news!
Step 4: Clinton let media eat other media!
Step 5: Media who make dum-dum news eat media who don't make dum-dum news!
Step 6: Only media who make dum-dum news left!
Step 7: Dum-dum news make more dum-dum!
Step 8: Dum-dum billionaire runs for president!
Step 9: Media make dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president!
Step 10: Dum-dum love dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president! <3
Step 11: Media makes shitload of money making dum-dum news about dum-dum running for president!
Step 12: Dum-dum running for president wins election for president! UH-OH!
Step 13: Media makes shitload of money making dum-dum news about dum-dum president!
Step 14: Media secretly love dum-dum president, and dum-dum president secretly love media! <3
Step 15: Country go ker-blooey because full of dum-dum!

Trump is as much as a symptom as he was the choice of many people who 'didn't like the way America was going' which was code for many to mean 'Minorities are getting too much focus'. He is elected because of that.

Now, if we want to branch out to the many conversations that he was placed in there by Russia, we can.

If we want to have a conversation that he's being controlled by the Illuminati, we can.

But because this is the darkest timeline, he is our President. He Represents us. As he was chosen representative of what we think should be the leadership of the future of America, his statements matter. Even if the media has a financial interest in reporting on his antics... they have a financial interest in reporting anything as that's what people pay them to do. There's nothing special about that. Nor is there anything wrong about doing so.

If they were making these things up, it would be wrong. It would be harmful, shameful, and destructive to the American people. But they are not. He is actually saying these things. I am interested because I see how this is riling up a segment population and it is shameful to me that America has reverted to this. Jimmy in Connecticut is interested in this because he is a secret white nationalist and he loves how this is going. Sarah in Utah has no strong feelings either way, but she wants to be informed about what is happening in the United States.

Until we have undeniable proof that the entire Presidency of That Man was a fabrication that made video, reports, and documentations that are totally made up in order to damage the actually stellar presidency of the 45th, then we have to assume they are reporting on these things because they are happening at the time of the report. And yes, for financial reasons.

It's the same reason why Rare New Zealand Parakeet Population doubling [https://www.npr.org/2019/07/18/743137333/rare-new-zealand-parakeet-population-doubles-after-epic-breeding-season] isn't the front story in every news outlet. It happened today to be sure, but save for New Zealanders and Bird Enthusiasts, it doesn't matter that much to others. An Unstable Man who seemingly lies every five seconds, who taunts Despots, and has the biggest army Humanity has ever seen at his Beck and Call will ALWAYS take precedence over most things because he is a danger to everyone's way of life.

Like a Drunk Truck Driver at night that seemingly always wants to keep pace with you, you wonder what every lane switch, speed up and slow down means for your life.

I know News Media is doing well since his election. But they aren't doing well by fabricating anything. He does these things. And that's it. The Leader of the Free World saying something that most of the world takes as racist or despicable is news. If you don't consider it more worth it than a byline on page 35 is neither here nor there.

It would be the equivalent of if the Pope said all Asians have no souls, so they shouldn't bother to come to Church. It's shocking, it's horrifyingly disgusting, and it is severely harmful to those who still believe in the church as a place where anyone is welcome, even barring the injustices that are still carried on in the Church's name. That destroys any hope that the Church can turn around and be truly welcoming. That kind of blow resonates with people. And I'm sorry, but there are still a lot of people resonating even if you are not.

 

[Pseudonym]

I basically agree that we should not forget to focus on policy rather than just what people say about one another. Trump escalating tensions with Iran and racking up the deficit to give tax breaks to those who don't need it, to take two examples, are far worse than any insulting tweet could be. It is important to see though, that in this case the two are related. The idea that people who aren't white should go back to where they came from is precisely what motivates all these restrictions on migration and assylumseeking. The personal hateful bigotry and the systematic cruelty towards migrants go hand in hand.