Poll: 50hz, Does it bother you? (Europe, UK and Australian question)

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Jazoni89

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Dec 24, 2008
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If you live in Pal territories (like me), you have been plagued with slower game speeds, and black borders in your games since forever.

The reason for this being is because nearly all games we play are designed to work with a NTSC television set.

However transferring the picture quality of the NTSC image is a problem for Pal tv's, as a Pal tv has more scanlines than a NTSC TV which results in lost frames and black borders.

Pal gamers had to put up with this for decades blissfully unaware that they were playing an inferior version. That was until the launch of sega's last console the Dreamcast, which featured the option for a Pal 60hz in roughly 90% of all the games available on the system.

Pal-60 is the same pal image, but it has been optimised to play, and look exactly like it's NTSC counterpart. Though this option would not work with very old Pal television, due to being unable to show a 60hz image.

Time went on, and more, and more games became Pal-60, but their were many releases especially on the PS2 which did not feature this option for a Pal-60 image.

Nowadays all PS3, and 360 games are Pal 60hz (with a very few Wii games that aren't such as Madworld).

Even though it isn't a problem nowadays, 50hz games still plague retro gaming enthusiast such as myself.

For example, today i was Playing Metal Gear solid 3 Snake Eater, and their is no option for a pal 60 picture, so i kept wondering how much better it would play if it was a NTSC copy (however the game is full screen optimised which is good).

To be honest, 50hz games don't really bother me that much unless it has huge black borders around the screen, and then to me it becomes unplayable, though not all 50hz games are like this (see above).

So what do you fellow Pal gamers think about it, does it bother you, or are you just not bothered.
 

jpoon

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Mar 26, 2009
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Gladly, im not dealing with the problem since I live in the states. That would definitely be a bit annoying though, I feel for ya man, but what can be done about it?
 

Phoxinator

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Nov 20, 2010
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No it doesn't because I only have experience of this on PS1 and possibly PS2 and I've always thought the graphics haven't gotten in the way of my enjoyment of the game.
 
Mar 9, 2010
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I never knew the difference between 50hz and 60hz settings or PAL games. I spent my entire childhood with PAL games so I guess I've just become accustomed to it, if it is an actual problem that is. I've never been bothered by black borders either, grew up with those too.
 

Jazoni89

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Dec 24, 2008
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jpoon said:
Gladly, im not dealing with the problem since I live in the states. That would definitely be a bit annoying though, I feel for ya man, but what can be done about it?
You could install a mod in your console which is like a dipswitch which would force the console into displaying a 60hz image on a 50hz game.

Though you would have to have a huge knowledge of the hardware, that of which i don't have.
 

Wolfram23

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Mar 23, 2004
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I don't think this makes much sense... 50hz vs 60hz refresh doesn't really make a difference. And really, most console games optimize for 30fps at 720p instead of 1080p (recently I mean). I can only figure these black bars your talking about is a difference in resolution not in frequency.
 

GeorgW

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Aug 27, 2010
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I have a feeling most people won't even understand the question.
It doesn't bother me. I've never cared about graphics. What does bother me is how unnecessary it all is. Region locking, 50hz, all of it. Just annoying.
 

Nutcase

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Dec 3, 2008
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This, and other console-related bullshit, kept me a PC-only gamer for the first 15 years of gaming. When I finally got a console, I immediately modded it to get rid of region locking. Later on, I imported an entire console which is now in active use. Whenever I want a game that has a superior release in another region, I import it.
 

Merkavar

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Aug 21, 2010
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cause i never played games in america i didnt know the difference so i didnt care.

Black boarders werent so bad but i never notice slower game speeds.
 

loc978

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Sep 18, 2010
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...Well, I'm an American, but I lived in Europe for a few years and dealt with 220V, 50Hz power... had to get a locally bought alarm clock, but I never noticed any problems with games on a TV... 'course, the only console I had was a PS2...
 

Jazoni89

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Dec 24, 2008
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Wolfram01 said:
I don't think this makes much sense... 50hz vs 60hz refresh doesn't really make a difference. And really, most console games optimize for 30fps at 720p instead of 1080p (recently I mean). I can only figure these black bars your talking about is a difference in resolution not in frequency.
The refresh rate is not a huge difference in HD, but what im talking about is SD, because most old games are literally unplayable in HD due to not being designed for that picture.
 

Craig Cameron

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Jun 8, 2010
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You ask us in 2011 if we get annoyed at 50hz Pal tv settings in games that we played years ago?
When we had never seen games run at 60hz?

Sorry for the dickishness there but I needed to get it out of the way before I actually answered you in case it sneaked it's way in. Anyway, you seemed to have completely missed the point here, when we had to run games at 50hz we had never seen them run at 60hz, so any notion that somehow we could tell the difference between a 60hz copy of the game and a 50hz copy is ridiculous, not only that but one of your answers refers to black borders, in all my years of gaming I have never seen a 50hz game run with black borders around it or at least remember a title that did so, nor would I be able to comment on how game speed was apparently affected since 10hz of a difference is practically imperceptible. Not that any of that matters now since LCD Tv's run at about 100hz to 240hz.

This poll can be likened to walking up to someone who has only eaten bananas for their entire life, never seen another type of food ever, then asking them if they prefer bananas or tomatoes.
 

Bon_Clay

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Aug 5, 2010
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I chose the last option but I'm actually from Canada. But such is life as a Canadian, we never really get mentioned. Either way no clue what any of this 50hz stuff is about.
 

mireko

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Sep 23, 2010
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Won't you get black borders anyway?

Most PS2 games are in 4:3 (with some exceptions), so it's either that or squishing the image on a modern TV.

[sub]Unless the image is additionally squished/bordered, which I haven't noticed with my PS2.[/sub]
 

Jazoni89

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Dec 24, 2008
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Craig Cameron said:
You ask us in 2011 if we get annoyed at 50hz Pal tv settings in games that we played years ago?
When we had never seen games run at 60hz?

Sorry for the dickishness there but I needed to get it out of the way before I actually answered you in case it sneaked it's way in. Anyway, you seemed to have completely missed the point here, when we had to run games at 50hz we had never seen them run at 60hz, so any notion that somehow we could tell the difference between a 60hz copy of the game and a 50hz copy is ridiculous, not only that but one of your answers refers to black borders, in all my years of gaming I have never seen a 50hz game run with black borders around it or at least remember a title that did so, nor would I be able to comment on how game speed was apparently affected since 10hz of a difference is practically imperceptible. Not that any of that matters now since LCD Tv's run at about 100hz to 240hz.

This poll can be likened to walking up to someone who has only eaten bananas for their entire life, never seen another type of food ever, then asking them if they prefer bananas or tomatoes.
That is only your personal experiences, and their is a noticeable difference especially when put it side by side.

Here's a F-zero GX comparison, luckily this game had a option for Pal-60.


Its the exact same replay just different hertz


As i said, it isn't a problem nowadays with the inclusion of console enabled 60hz, and the god knows how many hertz tv's, but knowing that their is a lot of old games out there that don't run as well as 60hz (including every single game that came out before the Dreamcast), it's kinda sad.

The only reason why i made this topic, was because of the retro gamer's, that still get frustrated by this issue, and trust me their are a few.
 

SyphonX

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Mar 22, 2009
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50hz, 30fps, <75 FOV.

The way of the dinosaur.

We're supposed to be living in the "HD Era", let's all act like it please.
 

teqrevisited

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Mar 17, 2010
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It might have bothered me but I couldn't be arsed. If I recall correctly, the 12 hour challenge in FF9 was impossible on anything but a Japanese version due to the other versions running slower.

Other than that I've had no issues, after all it was the norm.
 

Catchy Slogan

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Jun 17, 2009
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loc978 said:
...Well, I'm an American, but I lived in Europe for a few years and dealt with 220V, 50Hz power... had to get a locally bought alarm clock, but I never noticed any problems with games on a TV... 'course, the only console I had was a PS2...
That's because it barely made a difference.

OT: I never realy cared about it and still don't.