Poll: Can you view auras?

[Bored Tomatoe]

I can sense people, no seeing auras though...although I can smell fires and such before they happen.

 

[TMAN10112]

I thought I could once, but it stopped once I got glasses(It turns out that I'm near sighted in one eye).
Now if you will excuse me, I have to spend the next 48 hours without glasses(or contacts) to test this theory.

 

[Mizaki]

And now we're at the core of the issue. In order to justify your position, you have to treat very close (if not past) the "all of reality is subjectively perceived" line that Hume drew. That's fine, but it's pretty much the end of any reasonable discussion. It could be that there are those who can perceive that which (a) the vast majority of humanity cannot, and (b) that no controlled test has been able to either replicate, nor confirm the perception of, but that seems less likely. Once again, we're back to Ockham, and I'll ask the question again:

Which requires fewer unnecessary entities: that these powers don't exist, or that these powers do exist, but they cannot be shown to anyone else in a controlled environment, nor confirmed in any way, shape, or form, except by the word of the person who has them?

I'm with the other guy. If you can prove you've got this power, James Randi's got a cool million for you.

Both sides kill reasonable discussion, actually. This is a dead debate but hey I like to get my brain working.

I think it's difficult for those who have them really, because even if they aren't real, they percieve it, thus making it real in their own reality. In my process of understanding things like this, I've found that reality differs from one person to the next. Even the most ridiculous of things could very well be real in another person's reality. Things like religious experiences could very well be absolutely true because it had a shown effect that nobody can explain without the use of blunt pessimism or skeptical counter-guessing. I'll even let out a little something for this one. At certain times, when I look at an object that is brightly colored or white when there is enough light (especially when there is alot), I see a moving glittering substance. I'm not sure what it is, and I don't try to guess because that would ruin it. I really do see this. I don't hear voices when I see it, and I don't have any emotional reaction to it. It's just there. I can see it when I look at the sky on a sunny day. And sometimes it's not there. Sometimes it's barely there. At times, like right now, it's even in front of my monitor when I'm on a white page. However, if you can explain it, I'd be delighted. Also, there are times when certain people seem seperate from their surroundings, like they were pasted or photoshopped onto it. It's those things I'm usually reluctant to mention because I don't want to be met with the rudeness that I see in this thread. It would be especially bad considering how even after some dude goes "youre crazy" I'll still see it.

The unecessary entities statement is entirely why this discussion will be an uphill battle on both sides, because I personally do not think that these kind of... abilities can be done on purpose, hence why readers and the likes always look stupid. Of course, it would be easier if these things could be disproven, but disproven and not experienced are two different things.

 

[Snowalker]

Well, since I'll be taking slack for this, lemme explain.


I do not see an amazing glowy light around some one, well I do for one person, but thats unrelated. What I see is when light passes over them, and I can feel it subconusly, I see a shade of something on their face. Its not as supernatural as it sounds, if they're sad, not cring, but just sad. They look really pale, If they are angry, they seem redish, if they're mad, they have a dark shade to them, and if they are happy, they look absolutly normal.

I'm not saying I'm supernatural, I'm merely saying I can sometime pick up somepeople emotions better than other people. I have to be near them and I have to see them to get a good estimate, and thats all it is an estimate, not a fullproof "your sad" thing. So sure this may not be what he's talking about, but it sounded close enough to me.


*braces for flame*

 

[Limos]

I recommend you seek mental help immediately, you have some of the symptoms of Schizotypal Personality Disorder [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizotypal_personality_disorder], it is characterized by

1.) Ideas of reference
2.) Odd beliefs or magical thinking that influences behavior and is inconsistent with subcultural norms (e.g., superstitiousness, belief in clairvoyance, telepathy, or "sixth sense"; in children and adolescents, bizarre fantasies or preoccupations)
3.) Unusual perceptual experiences, including bodily illusions
4.) Odd thinking and speech
5.) Suspiciousness or paranoid ideation
6.) Inappropriate or constricted affect
7.) Behavior or appearance that is odd, eccentric, or peculiar
8.) Lack of close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives
9.) Social anxiety that tends to be associated with paranoid fears rather than negative judgments about self

I can't say for sure that you fit all the symptoms, but usually people who believe in such nonsense as Auras, Chi, Spirits, Demonic possession or the like are suffering from this disorder. Hopefully a good psychiatrist will be able to help you.

 

[Snowalker]

I recommend you seek mental help immediately, you have some of the symptoms of Schizotypal Personality Disorder [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizotypal_personality_disorder], it is characterized by

1.) Ideas of reference
2.) Odd beliefs or magical thinking that influences behavior and is inconsistent with subcultural norms (e.g., superstitiousness, belief in clairvoyance, telepathy, or "sixth sense"; in children and adolescents, bizarre fantasies or preoccupations)
3.) Unusual perceptual experiences, including bodily illusions
4.) Odd thinking and speech
5.) Suspiciousness or paranoid ideation
6.) Inappropriate or constricted affect
7.) Behavior or appearance that is odd, eccentric, or peculiar
8.) Lack of close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives
9.) Social anxiety that tends to be associated with paranoid fears rather than negative judgments about self

I can't say for sure that you fit all the symptoms, but usually people who believe in such nonsense as Auras, Chi, Spirits, Demonic possession or the like are suffering from this disorder. Hopefully a good psychiatrist will be able to help you.

I know I'm crazy, they have a name for my problem, great...


EDIT: I also meant to ask, why do you think I have social problems? I actually have quiet a few friends, and many fo them are very close to me. so... I don't think your all right on that.

 

[Trace2010]

This stuff is junk science, period. Sorry if you can't see that.[/quote]

Apology accepted.

"Skepticism is no longer healthy when it becomes condescending and rude."

Someone else said it best above. Sorry if you couldn't see it was only about that.

 

[Seldon2639]

And now we're at the core of the issue. In order to justify your position, you have to treat very close (if not past) the "all of reality is subjectively perceived" line that Hume drew. That's fine, but it's pretty much the end of any reasonable discussion. It could be that there are those who can perceive that which (a) the vast majority of humanity cannot, and (b) that no controlled test has been able to either replicate, nor confirm the perception of, but that seems less likely. Once again, we're back to Ockham, and I'll ask the question again:

Which requires fewer unnecessary entities: that these powers don't exist, or that these powers do exist, but they cannot be shown to anyone else in a controlled environment, nor confirmed in any way, shape, or form, except by the word of the person who has them?

I'm with the other guy. If you can prove you've got this power, James Randi's got a cool million for you.

Both sides kill reasonable discussion, actually. This is a dead debate but hey I like to get my brain working.

I think it's difficult for those who have them really, because even if they aren't real, they percieve it, thus making it real in their own reality. In my process of understanding things like this, I've found that reality differs from one person to the next. Even the most ridiculous of things could very well be real in another person's reality. Things like religious experiences could very well be absolutely true because it had a shown effect that nobody can explain without the use of blunt pessimism or skeptical counter-guessing. I'll even let out a little something for this one. At certain times, when I look at an object that is brightly colored or white when there is enough light (especially when there is alot), I see a moving glittering substance. I'm not sure what it is, and I don't try to guess because that would ruin it. I really do see this. I don't hear voices when I see it, and I don't have any emotional reaction to it. It's just there. I can see it when I look at the sky on a sunny day. And sometimes it's not there. Sometimes it's barely there. At times, like right now, it's even in front of my monitor when I'm on a white page. However, if you can explain it, I'd be delighted. Also, there are times when certain people seem seperate from their surroundings, like they were pasted or photoshopped onto it. It's those things I'm usually reluctant to mention because I don't want to be met with the rudeness that I see in this thread. It would be especially bad considering how even after some dude goes "youre crazy" I'll still see it.

The unecessary entities statement is entirely why this discussion will be an uphill battle on both sides, because I personally do not think that these kind of... abilities can be done on purpose, hence why readers and the likes always look stupid. Of course, it would be easier if these things could be disproven, but disproven and not experienced are two different things.

This is where any discussion of the supernatural goes off the rails. The question is not necessarily what can be "disproven" but what can be "proven". By all existing standards of scientific evidence, I can prove myself to exist. My scientist friends would look at me weird for desiring to prove it, but I could do so. The issue is that from the perspective of anyone who does not already believe in what you believe, you need to overcome some burden of proof in order for me to accept that it exists (not the phenomenon itself, I'll take your word, but the supernatural element of it). In your case, as a believer, I would need to overcome a burden of proof to prove it *doesn't* exist.

Now, we can argue the scientific method, and how it's always based on "it's not true until it's proven true", but that gets us nowhere new. This entire discussion smacks of the old atheist/theist argument, which (while entertaining the first dozen or so times) is pretty tiresome.

 

[incrediblegeek]

This stuff is junk science, period. Sorry if you can't see that.

Apology accepted.

"Skepticism is no longer healthy when it becomes condescending and rude."

Someone else said it best above. Sorry if you couldn't see it was only about that.[/quote]

Looking back, yeah, I read your post wrong, and I'm sorry about that. I shouldn't have been responding to you specifically.

This sort of thing gets me riled up and I kinda get tunnel vision. Sorry 'bout that.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Naysayers it's possible.

People are hot after all (temperature wise). Heat creates radiation, all you need to see glowing people is a slightly broader range of vision than the average human.

You can see energy traveling through a medium?

Um, yes. And unless you're blind you can too.

 

[Seldon2639]

Well, since I'll be taking slack for this, lemme explain.


I do not see an amazing glowy light around some one, well I do for one person, but thats unrelated. What I see is when light passes over them, and I can feel it subconusly, I see a shade of something on their face. Its not as supernatural as it sounds, if they're sad, not cring, but just sad. They look really pale, If they are angry, they seem redish, if they're mad, they have a dark shade to them, and if they are happy, they look absolutly normal.

I'm not saying I'm supernatural, I'm merely saying I can sometime pick up somepeople emotions better than other people. I have to be near them and I have to see them to get a good estimate, and thats all it is an estimate, not a fullproof "your sad" thing. So sure this may not be what he's talking about, but it sounded close enough to me.


*braces for flame*

I'd attempt to provide the "real" explanations for your observed phenomena (because it is generally true), but I fear it would fall on deaf ears. People do change subtly when they're in different moods, and their physiology changes with them. I would guess that the better someone is at suppressing an emotion, the less you get your "feeling" about them. But, especially with close friends, or with people who wear their hearts on their sleeves, it's not difficult if you pay attention.

In case you're interested:

The paleness is caused because (a) any kind of shock tends to drain blood from our faces, and (b) any crying would do the same. I'm assuming that most of what you're looking at is in the face (since that's where most of our emotions register).

The redness is the opposite. An angry reaction draws blood into the head/face, and usually gives it a redish tinge.

The darkness is a bit more difficult to get a pin in, because there's no purely physiological reason. It's mostly the way people hold themselves. In normal interaction, we put our "best faces forward". Any time we're feeling antagonized, we do the opposite, hiding ourselves subtly.

And, of course, anyone who isn't at the time emotional, or better at hiding it, would appear the same as a "normal" person. It would be interesting to test that ability in a controlled environment, though.

 

[Bulletinmybrain]

Naysayers it's possible.

People are hot after all (temperature wise). Heat creates radiation, all you need to see glowing people is a slightly broader range of vision than the average human.

You can see energy traveling through a medium?

Um, yes. And unless you're blind you can too.

Eh, you are right.. In a sense. You can see the light which is emitted, but for the most part I am going to guess you cannot see the wave length of a normal human because of the fact it is so subtle.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Naysayers it's possible.

People are hot after all (temperature wise). Heat creates radiation, all you need to see glowing people is a slightly broader range of vision than the average human.

You can see energy traveling through a medium?

Um, yes. And unless you're blind you can too.

Eh, you are right.. In a sense. You can see the light which is emitted, but for the most part I am going to guess you cannot see the wave length of a normal human because of the fact it is so subtle.

I'm talking about heat. Any sufficiently hot object (like a human) radiates light in the infrared spectrum.

An extended range of vision could allow a person to see some of this radiation.

 

[Mizaki]

I'd attempt to provide the "real" explanations for your observed phenomena (because it is generally true), but I fear it would fall on deaf ears. People do change subtly when they're in different moods, and their physiology changes with them. I would guess that the better someone is at suppressing an emotion, the less you get your "feeling" about them. But, especially with close friends, or with people who wear their hearts on their sleeves, it's not difficult if you pay attention.

In case you're interested:

The paleness is caused because (a) any kind of shock tends to drain blood from our faces, and (b) any crying would do the same. I'm assuming that most of what you're looking at is in the face (since that's where most of our emotions register).

The redness is the opposite. An angry reaction draws blood into the head/face, and usually gives it a redish tinge.

The darkness is a bit more difficult to get a pin in, because there's no purely physiological reason. It's mostly the way people hold themselves. In normal interaction, we put our "best faces forward". Any time we're feeling antagonized, we do the opposite, hiding ourselves subtly.

And, of course, anyone who isn't at the time emotional, or better at hiding it, would appear the same as a "normal" person. It would be interesting to test that ability in a controlled environment, though.

I read your above post, and yes that is true. I don't think there is a definate end to either side because any amount of evidence on either side contradicts the reasoning for the person being on the side they are, starting a circle.

Also, with that being explained (the physical caracteristics of emotions), no matter what they call it, it's still amazing they can detect this. I at least give them kudos for observing that. But.. when it is explained scientifically I think for some people it removes the folksy charm, know what I mean? As far as I'm concerned, I'd rather things be explained to me because I'd like to understand it, but I think some are happy with their own definitions. Not to say you shouldn't explain things to people, but I think sometimes when people talk about auras and the like.. it may just be a little of both. Maybe there's some sort of non-verbal message humans can transmit and the brain picks it up however it feels like and it's up to the person to decide what it is, or maybe they're not a member of the scientific reality? It's an interesting thing, really.

 

[Bulletinmybrain]

Naysayers it's possible.

People are hot after all (temperature wise). Heat creates radiation, all you need to see glowing people is a slightly broader range of vision than the average human.

You can see energy traveling through a medium?

Um, yes. And unless you're blind you can too.

Eh, you are right.. In a sense. You can see the light which is emitted, but for the most part I am going to guess you cannot see the wave length of a normal human because of the fact it is so subtle.

I'm talking about heat. Any sufficiently hot object (like a human) radiates light in the infrared spectrum.

An extended range of vision could allow a person to see some of this radiation.

Yes it radiates light, but the light that is radiated is not on the visible spectrum.

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Yes it radiates light, but the light that is radiated is not on the visible spectrum.

Which is why most people can't see it.

 

[Bulletinmybrain]

Yes it radiates light, but the light that is radiated is not on the visible spectrum.

Which is why most people can't see it.

Which is why no one can see it, without mechanical aid.

 

[Dorian]

Yes it radiates light, but the light that is radiated is not on the visible spectrum.

Which is why most people can't see it.

Which is why no one can see it, without mechanical aid.

Are you saying that some of us are becoming cyborgs?

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Yes it radiates light, but the light that is radiated is not on the visible spectrum.

Which is why most people can't see it.

Which is why no one can see it, without mechanical aid.

It's not like "visible light" is a definitive spectrum with precisely defined boundaries. It varies between individuals and a few people can see into the range of light that radiates from a human body.

 

[incrediblegeek]

Which is why no one can see it, without mechanical aid.

It's not like "visible light" is a definitive spectrum with precisely defined boundaries. It varies between individuals and a few people can see into the range of light that radiates from a human body.

Got a link to back that claim up? That's the sort of thing a 5 minute test could prove.