Poll: Cultural/Western Imperialism?

[Seldon2639]

As the result of an argument in one of my classes, I'm curious what people here think about cultural imperialism (western imperialism. I don't just mean McDonalds and Pokemon, I mean the suppression of native cultures to supplant Western values. We did it with aborigines basically everywhere. The question is: is this a bad thing?

If Western culture brings with it technology, advancement, better medicine, improve crops, higher quality of life, and the cost is the lost of provincial and parochial local customs, what's the issue? I may be an apologist for Western civilization, but the reason we've been running the world for a large part of human history (especially if I get to claim Rome and the Hellenic states as "Western") is because of our cultural traditions. It feels like Kipling was right, that we should expect the blame of those we better, and the hate of those we guard.

So, what's your thinking?

 

[Cpt_Oblivious]

Other. We can do the Imperialism thing, but still let them keep cultural traiditioons and all that jazz. It's only nice.

We're taking you're country, but you can still do what you've been doing for ages.

 

[mrkittles]

This reminds me of the story of some governer put in charge of an african area.
In this area it was a tradition that a mans wife would be burned on the funeral pyre of her dead husband.

When the governer told them to stop doing this they replied "its out tradition" to which the governer replied "In England we also have a tradition, our tradition is that men who burn women alive are hung. So you build your funeral pyre, and my engineers will build our gallows. You perform your tradition, then we will perform ours."

Not all traditions are like this of course, but equally not all traditions are worth saving.

Also: To the person that oringinally (and in a superior way, it had names and everything) told this story Hi!.

 

[mplummer]

Western Imperialism seems to be an inevitable outcome of our style of foreign policy. Personally, i believe it would be possible to help other cultures without the imperialist attitudes which are consistently used by western governments. Take for example a simple african village (try and find 'an open letter to a young researcher',unfortunately i can't post the link at the moment). They had the idea of setting up a communal farming scheme and decided to pool resources to buy machinery etc. However, they soon came under the notice of the British who decided to bring them into their scheme of 'development', ultimately alienating them and causing more harm than if they had simply left them alone. It is fully acceptable to use our funds to aid others in need, however the notion of imperialism and that of 'developing' other cultures is an old fashioned trend which needs to be quelled. More important is to remain in tune with what the people think they need, not what we think the people need. Our modernizing efforts often cause more harm than good, especially when we have our own interests in a country developing, such as late imperial China. Western values are not better than others, only equal, and this is something that imperialism can never truly appreciate.

EDIT: That being said, i'm not trying to make the west out to be some kind of monster which simply dominates other cultures for their own gain, rather i feel that our attempts are misguided or miss the point, it's very rare that there is intent to cause problems.

 

[IxionIndustries]

Imperialism is the worst thing ever created. It causes destruction of nations until they are ready to give in to a culture that they want no part of.
Also, I'm sick of the religions of other cultures becoming prey to things like Christianity. I read mythology books, and some of them are downright vivid. It's things like this that send history into the dirt, waiting to be dug up some-odd years later.
I don't think that if I were a carefree person, living in say, some village, everybody pulling their share, that I would want to wind up working in McDonalds because some dick of a country decided to force their culture upon my hometown.

 

[Bluebacon]

This reminds me of the story of some governer put in charge of an african area.
In this area it was a tradition that a mans wife would be burned on the funeral pyre of her dead husband.

When the governer told them to stop doing this they replied "its out tradition" to which the governer replied "In England we also have a tradition, our tradition is that men who burn women alive are hung. So you build your funeral pyre, and my engineers will build our gallows. You perform your tradition, then we will perform ours."

Not all traditions are like this of course, but equally not all traditions are worth saving.

Also: To the person that oringinally (and in a superior way, it had names and everything) told this story Hi!.

Sorry, I just thought I'd mention it was in India, the funeral tradition is called Sati, and the governor was Sir Charles James Napier. God I love wikipedia. Didnt mean to be a nitpicker, but I'd randomly wikipedia'd it a while ago and was like 'I know that!'

 

[mrkittles]

Sorry, I just thought I'd mention it was in India, the funeral tradition is called Sati, and the governor was Sir Charles James Napier. God I love wikipedia. Didnt mean to be a nitpicker, but I'd randomly wikipedia'd it a while ago and was like 'I know that!'

It's fine, part of the reason for the last paragraph was in the hope someone would come and fix my butchered quote.

 

[RetiarySword]

Other. We can do the Imperialism thing, but still let them keep cultural traiditioons and all that jazz. It's only nice.

We're taking you're country, but you can still do what you've been doing for ages.

I say all that jazz! I thought I was the only one!!

Anyway, I think we can help other culters and stuff, but we don't have to push our beliefs onto them.

 

[Steelfists]

As the result of an argument in one of my classes, I'm curious what people here think about cultural imperialism (western imperialism. I don't just mean McDonalds and Pokemon, I mean the suppression of native cultures to supplant Western values. We did it with aborigines basically everywhere. The question is: is this a bad thing?

If Western culture brings with it technology, advancement, better medicine, improve crops, higher quality of life, and the cost is the lost of provincial and parochial local customs, what's the issue? I may be an apologist for Western civilization, but the reason we've been running the world for a large part of human history (especially if I get to claim Rome and the Hellenic states as "Western") is because of our cultural traditions. It feels like Kipling was right, that we should expect the blame of those we better, and the hate of those we guard.

So, what's your thinking?

..."Bring them up"? What does that mean? Are we raising poor countries like children? Thats terribly patronising.

 

[traceur_]

As the result of an argument in one of my classes, I'm curious what people here think about cultural imperialism (western imperialism. I don't just mean McDonalds and Pokemon, I mean the suppression of native cultures to supplant Western values. We did it with aborigines basically everywhere. The question is: is this a bad thing?

If Western culture brings with it technology, advancement, better medicine, improve crops, higher quality of life, and the cost is the lost of provincial and parochial local customs, what's the issue? I may be an apologist for Western civilization, but the reason we've been running the world for a large part of human history (especially if I get to claim Rome and the Hellenic states as "Western") is because of our cultural traditions. It feels like Kipling was right, that we should expect the blame of those we better, and the hate of those we guard.

So, what's your thinking?

Actually, I would think that in the case of Local Muslim tribes who believe that torturing and beating their wives because it is allowed under local law, NEED to be BRUTALLY Imperialized.

Agreed.

 

[Moormur]

I love how immidiately you go "ZOMGWESTERNIMPERIALISMWESCREWALL." We aren't the only ones doin' this, ya know. Long before Europeans were lifting their heads from their slop buckets, the Chinese were eradicating cultures left and right (you want to talk about an arrogant, elitist culture? Look up Ancient China). The Aztecs and Incas went on rampages to destroy surrounding villages AND their cultures to assimilate them. Ever since the creation of organized society, people have thought their way of doing things is best and have been violent in their mission to 'help' others see it their way. Go ahead and blame Christianity or Western countries...our school systems have taught us that we are the evil. But if you want to do justice to the issue, you need to spread the blame to the real perpatrators; every single individual who has ever lived (I don't care how selfess they proclaimed to be) thinks their way is correct.

 

[pffh]

I say we unite the world in one culture, one language, one law and under one government.

 

[Tech Team FTW!]

Living in Australia, I can give you a perfect example of the evils of 18th century British Imperialism.

The Aboriginal tribes lived throughout this continent in something of a utopia for more than 15,000 years. They divided into nations of similar tribes and due to this in excess of 350 separate languages were created. Their way of life remained much the same throughout their history. They were perfectly adapted to life in the harsh conditions of the most arid continent on the planet.

After only 200 years of European settlement, a mere 100 of those languages remain, and the majority of the Aboriginal population live in third world conditions. Over the course of European settlement, there have been a number of "Stolen" generations of "half-caste" Aboriginal children, who were taken from their parents under the guise of assimilation.

Now, Australia has one of the most highly urbanised populations of any country in the Western world while our native population must either adapt and renounce their 15,000 years of history, or die a slow and painful death over the course of centuries.


It was all done under the premise that natives are simple and need to be re-educated as "proper" Christians and become good second class citizens while their land was taken from them for the purposes of unsustainable European-style agriculture.

How the fuck is that good?

It feels like Kipling was right, that we should expect the blame of those we better, and the hate of those we guard.

You seem to like Rudyard Kipling. But I must disagree with you and Kipling in this case. The blame of those we better comes from the destruction of culture and tradition. They may be better now, but we worsened them to begin with.

 

[mplummer]

How the fuck is that good?

I think that's one of the main problems, people do think it's good. It's not an 'evil', its an attempt to help which is severely antagonistic to native populations, and it's the cultural friction which ensues which causes all the problems...