Poll: Do you think spanking is wrong?

[bam13302]

Made me who i am today, and i am very happy about who i am, and for that matter, so are my parents

 

[chiggerwood]

Denis Leary put it best. You don't need to spank your kids, waving the gun around works just as well.

Seriously though? Spanking your kids is fine. My mom spanked me and my brothers. She had two rules she had 1. don't spank when you're angry, and 2. no more than tree whacks. Me and one of my brothers (the other one is a clinically diagnosed sociopath since 8 or 9) turned out relatively fine considering the mental abuse our sorry son of a ***** father put us through.

A friend of the family had a different form of punishment: 3-6 hour lectures that he would quiz you on. You would be begging to have your ass beat before it was all over.

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

Spanking is abuse and abuse is never justified.

 

[TinCynic]

Spanking is not a bad thing if used appropriately. Don't spank the child while you're angry. Then you're punishing them because you're mad and not because they need to learn a lesson.

 

[Daipire]

Well, sometimes you can work in a little light spanking if she's into it.
OT: Ohhhh, spanking kids!
I'm undecided, I feel that it's necessary sometimes, but some people rely on it way too much.

EDIT:

Violence does nothing but cause more violence.

And I always like it how people who were hit as kids never question their parents, treat kids like they're worthless and seemed thankful for abuse.

That's completely sane.


EDIT 2.0: I've found that what I was taught as a kid pales in comparison to what I've learnt myself.
People set kids off down a road, that road can be good morals or bad, but regardless, people end up makig their own lives, defining themselves through rebellious teenaged years.

 

[LetalisK]

Spanking is one of the most effective ways to gain immediate compliance, but is poor for long term behavior modification. I don't know if this has been brought up, but psychological studies have been conducted that shows spanking has a negative impact on child development in several areas, especially emotional control. There is one interesting exception to this, though: impoverished urban black children. It was discovered that when whites use spanking, they tend to do it out of frustration, anger, or punitive punishment. When it is used by a poor urban parent, it tends to be used in a precautionary way, if that makes sense. Considering the various dangers that exist in poor urban neighborhoods, spanking is used as a way to keep the children away from those dangers. Basically, to protect them. Interestingly, when the researchers who discovered this presented this study at a psychological convention, they were initially booed off the stage because everyone initially thought the study was suggesting blacks were naturally more violent. Truth is, we've learned from studies like this and the authoritarian Asian-American studies* that intent behind an action can completely change the impact it has.

*These studies suggest that even though an authoritarian parenting style tends to mess up a child in the long run, this same effect wasn't seen in first and second generation asian-american authoritarian families. The reason for this is because when the authoritarian style is normally used, it's used as a way to control and dominate the child. However, when used by the asian-american immigrant or immigrant offspring family, it was used as a way to put the child on a course that would lead to success later in life. The asian-american authoritarian model also doesn't involve as much subtraction of warmth as the typical authoritarian model does.

tl:dr: Spanking is generally harmful, with one exception. There are better methods of punishment that allow for both immediate compliance and long term behavior modification.

 

[xXAsherahXx]

I wouldn't outright hit the child, I think it deserves punishment definitely, but one that is related to the offense. You don't take out the trash, it stays in the child's room until it is where it needs to be.

 

[Sonofadiddly]

It's wrong in the way that anyone who thinks it's ever a good idea is wrong. One spank probably won't traumatize the kid (read: probably), but it's generally bad for the kid and is counterproductive. It's been 35 years since they figured out that corporal punishment sucks and still 90% of people think it's fine. Why are people so freaking slow? It teaches the kid that violence will solve problems and causes the kid to misbehave more in the future. It also creates feelings of animosity and distrust toward the parent.

You don't want your kid to hit people, do you? Then don't hit your fucking kid, hypocrite!

 

[Jamash]

I think it's wrong to use spanking as a punishment, for revenge or to do it in anger, however it is a useful tool for conditioning a child against wrong or dangerous behaviour.

For example, if you saw your child reaching for a pan of boiling water on the hob or about to drink a bottle of bleach, spanking their hand would be an effective method of teaching them to associate that action with pain and danger, and hopefully not to do it again.

When children aren't developed enough to understand the complexities of morals, appreciate the concept of action and consequence, or to fully understand and recognise the dangers present in the world and society, you sometimes have to teach them right from wrong by appealing to their base instincts.

 

[James Mann]

are we ignoring the 'youre hitting a child, whats wrong with you?' aspect? or are we sticking to the mindset 'its my child ill treat it as i like' ?

 

[Captain_Coolio]

Im only pro-spank if its my girlfriend......

although really i dont mind the whole smack the kid whos being an idiot.

 

[Darkman94]

Tell me, if it's just a "light smack to the bottom" that doesn't hurt or injure, you mean to tell me that it's no really about inflicting pain?

Because if that's what you're saying, you will inevitably have to concede to the fact that you yourself believe that children can respond to other types of communication than the infliction of pain. Naturally this begs the question that if it isn't about inflicting pain, then why couldn't you use a less barbaric and civlized way of communicating your idea to the child?

This is an example of a fallacy of Composition...

However, if it IS about inflicting pain, hen how is that any more right than any other form of torture?

Trust me, I know plenty of ways to hurt you in ways you will find excruciating, but won't really cause you much in the way of physical injury (I won't even have to leave a mark on your body). Are you saying that I shouldn't be arrested and tried for assault if I used these methods on you with the intenion of "teaching you some manners"?

Take waterboarding for instance (a technique considered by many counries across the world to be a form of torture and thus banned). You're not going to die by being subjected to waterboarding. You're not even going to have any permanent marks on your body or suffer any oher kind of disabiliy as a result of physical injury, since waterboarding doesn't really cause any physical injuries.

Does that make it right and proper to use when teaching random strangers "some manners"? And if not, why would you teach that lesson to a child that it is okay to use violence (as long as it doesn't cause physical injuries) against people? Because that's exactly what the child is being taught. The child is being taught that tolerating certain forms of violence with the specific intention of degrading, humiliating and cause people pain and physical discomfort is yay-okay.

I don't really care what you're going to try and argue in your attempt to refue this. It's obvious that you somehow believe that spanking is some kind of "magical solution" that will ALWAYS instill the EXACT meaning that the parent might want to instill in the child.

... and this is an example of a Straw Man Argument

 

[the_bearpelt]

I think it depends a lot on what's counted as spanking. Some who think of the severe, almost beating-like spanking who call it abuse make a valid point. BUt there's also such a thing as a light smack, like I do with my dog when he does something particularly bad like bite for no reason.
It really varies a lot on situation. I believe that when it's properly used, there's nothing wrong with it. Of course, the difficulty then lies in when it IS properly used.

 

[Elf Defiler Korgan]

Spanking the monkey? Spanking a child? Spanking random passers-by?

 

[Peteron]

I was spanked when I was out of hand. It taught me discipline. When your a little brat someone has to teach you to learn your boundaries. Sometimes this involves spanking. Paying for your mistakes helps you learn. I got spanked on occasion (however, I am the obedient one of my siblings) and it did not harm me, but helped me learn. And those of you who see it as "child abuse," need to understand that this is not scarring children, they are not experiencing heavy bodily injury.

 

[RandV80]

It's kind of interesting how in the poll only 20% say spanking is wrong yet at least half of the comments are strongly pitched towards it.

It's not violence, it is punishing them, as long as the parent establishes that because he or she is the parent he or she has the right to punish them then the kid will eventually figure out that it is different with his parents then with other people. Teenagers on the other hand are a completely different matter, the only thing you can do is try to direct them the right way and hope by god they find it.

Yes IT IS VIOLENCE. "Punishment" might be the motivation for the violence, but it's violence nontheless. And in these society which we live in violence IS NOT OKAY to use UNLESS it is in self defense. Get it?

"Punishment" doesn't cut it as a viable reason.

If you went up to me in a bar and poured a pint of beer over my head, that would be unacceptable behaviour on your part. But you can be damn sure that if the cops find out that I punched you in the face for pouring a beverage over my head, do you really think they would listen if I just told them that I was "punishing" you to "teach you some manners"?

Sorry, but that defense wouldn't fly in any court where it is illegal to use violence against other people for other reasons than self defense.

You seem to have a very broad definition of violence. For the kid that had his mother use a cane for discipline then told the cops on her, to which you said

Then apparently her son (despite all the odds) had learned his lesson about how a civilized society works. If people hit other people then you can call the cops and they will arrest he people who use violence against others and put them through trial. Kudos to the kid.

If our society finds physical violence to be unacceptable unless it's being used as self-defense, then why the hell do some parents find it fit to teach their children that it's okay to use violence in order to "teach people some manners" or some similar silly reason?

Does that mean if an older child gives his younger sibling a charlie horse the correct response for the latter is to call the cops? I mean if a parent disciplining their child by smacking their bottom then sibling fisticuffs must be violence too right? Or how about when I'm playing hockey and someone body checks me into the boards? Technically that's violence too right? Or when my buddies digital avatar is just chilling out over there and I shoot him in the head with a digital sniper rifle? How about user "Hurray Forums" avatar (bottom of page 3)? Terrible, terrible violence!

In otherwords, what I'm emphasizing here is that what's illegal that your alluding to is PHYSICAL ASSAULT. Violence on the other hand is everywhere in our society. It's entertaining, it's fun, it's funny. We use it in competitive sports, we use it in digital entertainment, and on a national level we still use it to subject our enemies. Whether or not you want to classify physical discipline as a form of violence is a matter of interpretation, and whether or not it's classified as an illegal activity to whatever extent is a decision for our elected officials. Someone who is as strongly against to violence as you seem to be makes me wonder what the hell your doing on a gaming forum, as the extent to which you seem to oppose it more aligns with the part of society that would outright ban violent video games from society.

 

[Housebroken Lunatic]

Does that mean if an older child gives his younger sibling a charlie horse the correct response for the latter is to call the cops? I mean if a parent disciplining their child by smacking their bottom then sibling fisticuffs must be violence too right?

Nope. Mainly due to legal differences. Children in fisticuffs with eachother can't be held responsible for their actions due to grounds of immaturity. (though a reasonable approach of the adult handling the situation would be to simulate the kind of punishment that society deals out to criminals who break the law, by taking away certain liberties that the child usually enjoys through grounding, pulling videogaming or tv priviliges etc. etc. In order to give the kids the general idea of what it's like for a grown up who breaks the law)

Their adult parents however are very much responsible for their actions, and if those actions break the law, then they will have to face the consequences of it. Thus making a kid who call the cops when his mother is beating him all in accord with the laws and standards of most modern societies.

Or how about when I'm playing hockey and someone body checks me into the boards? Technically that's violence too right?

A game of hockey isn't a simulaion nor an analogy of real life, and certain violent manouvers are an integrated part of the game, as is the general understanding of each participant that one can get hurt due to the violen nature of he sport. If one wishes to insure ones own safety one can simply refuse to participate.

Also, certain forms of violence do become punished formally by the referee in a hockeymatch.

Or when my buddies digital avatar is just chilling out over there and I shoot him in the head with a digital sniper rifle?

Fictional violence doesn't apply.

In otherwords, what I'm emphasizing here is that what's illegal that your alluding to is PHYSICAL ASSAULT. Violence on the other hand is everywhere in our society. It's entertaining, it's fun, it's funny. We use it in competitive sports, we use it in digital entertainment, and on a national level we still use it to subject our enemies. Whether or not you want to classify physical discipline as a form of violence is a matter of interpretation, and whether or not it's classified as an illegal activity to whatever extent is a decision for our elected officials. Someone who is as strongly against to violence as you seem to be makes me wonder what the hell your doing on a gaming forum, as the extent to which you seem to oppose it more aligns with the part of society that would outright ban violent video games from society.

Im not "strongly against violence".

However, I do call bullshit and hypocrisy where I see it. And when it comes to parening vs he laws and ideals of society in general there's a fucking truckload of hypocrites all spewing filth everywhere in regards to the subject.

Also I call out on dysfunctional courses of action in terms of problem solving where I see them.

 

[Zorg Machine]

The usual reasons for children to become such assholes that they need physical violence to get better are neglect, pampering and a unstable family (many fights, divorces and such).
To hit a child in order to remove the problems that happened because you are a bad parent feels incredibly wrong to me.

I believe in the Montessori method where you give a child a small responsibility for their studies and treat them as if they aren't "unreasonable creatures" as some here have put it.
btw, this actually works on almost all children who are in schools like this and only a few need a little extra attention in order to be productive.

The worst part about hitting your child is that there are few (major) outcomes.

Either, the child will hate you for it and become more and more rebellious (which will probably make the parent hit them more) and when they are adults, they will probably lose all communication with you and tell everyone about their horrible parents.

Or they will think that they deserved it and respect you and all will be well. Except for the fact that most of them will now have learned that the best (if not only) way to get respect from other children is to hit them. they will later grow into relatively stable adults and when they get children, they will know that it's okay to hit them because it didn't hurt you.

also, it can traumatize children and give them psychological problems when they are older.

I'm just going to finish by saying that I do not expect anybody who reds this to change their opinions, as it hasn't happened on any of the other threads where I have tried to argue with people about this.