Poll: Ex-marine shot at 70 times hit atleast 60 bleeds out because SWAT team wouldn't let paramedic's in
- Thread starter Matt Oliver
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Unfortunately, no. SWAT aren't usually brought in to arrest people, they conduct raids, and they take out hostile targets. That's it.jumjalalabash said:
The whole case sounds fishy, and as someone who knows a few marines, I'm just gonna say it, I bet those SWAT guys fucked the pooch hard core, and then lied about what happened to cover their asses. Seriously people, actually read the article before you go siding with the SWAT team. And yea, this whole thing could have been averted with non-lethal weapons.
Seriously, this is just disgusting, because as others have said, any non-criminal who heard people breaking into their house wouldn't think "oh shit cops", they would think "holy shit burglars, I need to protect my family". Which is probably what he did, and he got killed for it. The cops are to blame 100% for this, and I REALLY hope they don't get away with it. How many times have they changed their story?
.....I am now depressed. Thank you for bringing this depressing news to my attention, OP, you jerk.
So let me get this straight.
In America most people defend the right to own a gun; most say it's for defense against crime. The police have to support this since if someone legitly gets a gun, they have the legal right to have it in their house. But in this same country cops bang down your doors and scream things while waving guns at you - basically acting like the criminals you are trying to defend yourself against - and if you happen to be holding that gun the law says you can own, without evaluating the situation what so ever the police will murder you.
What an amazing system.
In America most people defend the right to own a gun; most say it's for defense against crime. The police have to support this since if someone legitly gets a gun, they have the legal right to have it in their house. But in this same country cops bang down your doors and scream things while waving guns at you - basically acting like the criminals you are trying to defend yourself against - and if you happen to be holding that gun the law says you can own, without evaluating the situation what so ever the police will murder you.
What an amazing system.
Cripes this is terrible. The police realy f'ed up on this one bad. Really? all that SWAT and high profile agression on a bloody marijuhana bust? not even the dangerous stuff like cocain or heroin or crud like that, but the drug that makes you see rainbows?
And the nerve of the SWAT not letting paramedics in, wth?! it may have been useless in the end seeins as they bloody shot him 60 times, but still....Jeez....and they call us brutes and savages....
And the nerve of the SWAT not letting paramedics in, wth?! it may have been useless in the end seeins as they bloody shot him 60 times, but still....Jeez....and they call us brutes and savages....
Ever heard of rubber bullets? they stun perfectly without killing, trust me. Or tear gas or flash grenades to blind. PLENTY of non-leathal disabling options out thereKopikatsu said:
Oh you Americans and your weapons. Over here people are cautious about carrying airsoft pistols around in public.
*reads into it further*
What this is, I don't even...
*reads into it further*
What this is, I don't even...
Is now a good time to mention the Indiana State Supreme Court ruling which effectively negates you having any option to deny the police coming into your home even if it is an illegal entry?
To everyone that's commenting on the fact that the former marine's safety was, the SWAT team did not, and could not know that. They just saw someone holding an assault rifle while in a house suspected of holding drugs and drug traffickers. The former marine may have even been holding the rifle in a threatening manner (i.e. like he was about to fire). And it's doubtful that anyone in law enforcement would deliberately let the suspect/assailant fire first or make the first aggressive move if they could prevent it.
As for the wife and kids being in the house, I'm pretty sure that drug traffickers sometimes have families that they live with, or hold their shipments in the same house as their families. It might even be a better way for them to hide their drug shipments.
I think that the SWAT team legitimately believed that they were in danger when they opened fire, and that they shouldn't get in trouble for the shooting (beyond anything that comes from accidental shootings). But I don't see why they denied medical help, unless it was due to protocol.
As for the wife and kids being in the house, I'm pretty sure that drug traffickers sometimes have families that they live with, or hold their shipments in the same house as their families. It might even be a better way for them to hide their drug shipments.
I think that the SWAT team legitimately believed that they were in danger when they opened fire, and that they shouldn't get in trouble for the shooting (beyond anything that comes from accidental shootings). But I don't see why they denied medical help, unless it was due to protocol.
Because people seem to completely miss the problem repeatedly I'll say it here - stop giving the public easy access to firearms, stop being so hostile towards police.
The trouble rests with those who issue the orders, who make the laws, who establish the guidelines and rules that those lower in the chain have to abide by.
It doesn't help that the police get firebombed when responding to noise complaints, and that bogan hicks keep telling their children to disrespect the 'pigs'.
Nevermind all those rapists, murderers and thieves, all the child molesters and slave traffickers they capture. Nevermind those hostages they save. They're only in it for the power, right?
The trouble rests with those who issue the orders, who make the laws, who establish the guidelines and rules that those lower in the chain have to abide by.
It doesn't help that the police get firebombed when responding to noise complaints, and that bogan hicks keep telling their children to disrespect the 'pigs'.
Nevermind all those rapists, murderers and thieves, all the child molesters and slave traffickers they capture. Nevermind those hostages they save. They're only in it for the power, right?
Police aren't required to pronounce themselves if they get a no-knock warrant, but they have to have pretty damned good evidence to file one of those. All they had was a knock-warrant FOUR DAYS after they raided the place. By law they don't really have to announce themselves as police until you are within eye-contact, and even then they aren't required to say it if they are afraid for their lives.MASTACHIEFPWN said:
The guy couldn't have fired his gun, he had gun safety on, which the polcie SHOULD have had on their own guns.
Police do not need to wait to be fired on if they beleive their life is in danger, but ONLY if they see a weapon. (that's why they have a fucking tazer)
He was suspected of wearing a police uniform to break into people's homes and steal things such as illegal drugs. Most likely a cover-up story.
This whole situation is a big fuck-up by unorganized and irrationally thinking police officers who with even a couple seconds worth of rational thought could have prevented this whole fucking situation. It's things like this that piss me off and make me question how the good cops manage to stay in the system when so many corrupt ones ruin their name.
I live in Israel, I was 3 years in the army, I'm a combat medic and I had friends with more training and sense in their trigger finger then all those SWAT cops. Trust me when I say hostile situations are NOT something unfamiliar here, I may not be a master "tactician" but what I said is still perfectly valid.Trolldor said:
Yikes, good thing I don't live in the United States, I don't want to have to worry about being shot by the police in my own home. In Argentina, instead, you have to worry about being robbed by your government on a daily basis, getting beaten to death in a dance club or shot in the street because you happened to have a modern cellphone... wait.
I just doubt a rubber bullet would put someone down(and out) faster than they can pull a trigger. The fastest way is probably to use real bullets, which reduces the danger to the team.BlackIvory said:
I think the SWAT have done nothing wrong, they're following a set of codes and an order, and you will not be in the SWAT for long if you start to use your own rationalisations in lieu of what you're told to do.
The blame lies on the man who told them to go in with a no-knock warrant armed.