Poll: How does console piracy work?

[Darknacht]

Most console piracy is done with emulators not with physical consoles.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

Most console piracy is done with emulators not with physical consoles.

This is only true of consoles from last gen on back. Currently, consumer PC hardware is not at a point where the PS3 or the Xbox 360 can feasibly be emulated. In order to emulate a system, you need hardware that is an order or magnitude more powerful than it.

 

[Wintermoot]

as far as I know consoles are put into a Homebrew enabled mode (IE giving it the ability to run home made games).
as far as I know games are burnt onto discs or run from a stick or memory card.
also most games are downloaded using a program like Bittorent or direct links (a regular PS2 game is about 3GB)

 

[sharpshooter188]

The games are purchased through legal means and then ripped via a certain program then usually torrented. Person with modded console wants said game, finds it online and then downloads it. Usually an ISO file or something. A friend of mine has a modded xbox and showed me the ins and outs of it. Well sort of.... I stopped paying attention after a while cause I was on my psp.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

You can very easily mod chip the wii just the same as the ps1/ps3/360 but an unfortunate downside to that is that afterwords it very rarely plays actual retail copies. So you pretty much have to use 100% burnt games after that.

The 360 you can either mod chip or install a new hacked disk drive. This allows you to play burnt games but unlike the wii it still allows you to play new ones as well.

PS3 I am not very familiar with but there is some kind of dongle I believe that allows you to work around the software protection. You obviously cant use a burnt disk since they are all blueray and most to big for a regular dvd. Im guessing you just have to hook up an external harddrive to transfer the game over.


All of these methods are extremely easy to do if you spend a little time researching and a bit of cash on the parts.

As for getting the games these days it is most likely all torrented. In the good old days the main source were either your small asian run corner stores (which still sell wii/360 games these days) or people who rented games and then burnt them. The later normally also sold copies of those games out of the back of his car or sometimes he also worked at that video rental store and kept them under the counter, literally.


I live in Canada just in case you wanted to know.

For the psp you just DL the game and put it on a hacked PSP memory card. For the 360 you DL it and use a hacked Disc drive. Those are the only 2 I know 100%. As for the DS I heard you can buy the cards then put the game on them with specific programs.

You just need to buy an r4 card. They are extremely easy to find online and most of the shady asian run corner stores have them as well but those ones normally come loaded with a couple hundred games.

The Wii doesn't need to be modchipped anymore, though. Depending on what version of the firmware you're on, running homebrew on the wii can be literaly as easy as putting a file on an SD card. That particular exploit has been fixed, but there is a list of games out there that, when trying to load a specially modified save file, allow you to run unsigned code, which is then used to install the homebrew channel. Incidentally, the Homebrew channel is awesome. I don't use it to pirate anything, but I've got a media player app on it that lets the wii play DVDs and media files. There's also cool apps like a Wii port of ScummVM, which is a virtual machine that allows you to play all of the old Lucasarts adventure games (you have to provide your own data files) as well as a fair few other games, like Beneath a Steel Sky. That last one in particular has legally been released as freeware.

 

[Vigormortis]

OK. Give me one solid and honest reason why used games are harmful to the industry and why publishers have the right to complain about them when the film and music industries have been getting more used sales for a longer amount of time.

Used games are not, have never been, and never will be evil.

And this:

But when a company does it, while they're charging the publisher money to carry the same game, it's just the epitome of a dick move.

Where have you ever heard that any game retailer charges a publisher to carry the game? I'm quite certain the game retailer buys the games from the publisher and puts them on shelves.

I think you've found yourself highly misinformed and have a very loose grasp on how most people actually do their game shopping - buy a game from a series on the cheap and used, see if you like it, and if you do, then dive headfirst into the newest installment with the plastic and a fancy "new" sticker still on it. This is why people are raging against you: they will find it even harder to take risks with uber-expensive new games and no way to try them out without the ability to return them. This is because most people don't have the money nor the time to take the chance on buying bad games. For a better argument:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/4568-Online-Passes-Are-Bad-For-Everybody

And don't say renting. Go look up Gamefly's infamously long delivery dates and how often you get the game you didn't really want before you say renting.

Okay, I can see there's been some confusion. I am not against used game sales in principle.

Let me start with the simplest answer on the retailer question. When I say they charge to carry a publishers game, it's true. It's just not quite up front. The cut of the profits they take from the sale of the game are the fees they're effectively charging the publisher. If that wasn't clear in my original post, my apologies. But, I think we can both agree this is true.

Now, to give you an example of how used game sales are hurting the industry, let me begin by setting up a scenario. Let's say, for the sake of discussion, that you are the CEO of some big publishing company. You've just received the latest report on the sales figures for your latest, big release. Cutting to the chase, the report indicates you've sold a total of one million units. However, at the other end of the report, you notice it indicates that there has been over three million different accounts (on the service of your choice) that have logged on to play the game. This means that more than twice as many people are playing the game, at some point, who didn't pay you for it as those that did.

Ordinarily, this wouldn't matter much. And in the "olden" days, it was a moot point. However, and this is something I think most people are forgetting, we live in the age of online gaming. This means that game developers and publishers don't just make a game and throw it out there. They have to provide updates and support, host and maintain content and match servers, and subsequently, pay employees to do so. Therefore, if over half of the people currently playing the game online didn't pay you for it, then continuing to host it online for them equates to a loss.

But this, again, wouldn't be such an issue if the retailers who are reselling used titles paid even a small percentage of the huge profits they make on them to the publishers. Not to mention, not charge ridiculously high prices for them or trick people by repackaging them as "new". Sadly, they don't. As a result, we get stuff like Online Passes and it's ilk.

And please don't assume I'm some corporate minded jerk who's defending all of that. I'm not. But at the same time, people who defend stores like Gamestop are just as guilty of the same thing they're accusing me of being.

Believe me, I agree with your second assertion about a lot of people not having the cash to buy into an "uber-expensive" new game without pre-knowledge. (though I think it's a bit presumptuous to assume most only buy a new game used, then pay full price for subsequent releases) I've been in that boat before and still am on occasion. However, it doesn't make sense to defend stores like Gamestop over it.

There is nothing wrong with used game sales. The issue I have is how most stores handle it. By that I mean having store policies that screw both the customer and the publisher. Again, if they'd pay even the smallest of a percentage of the massive profits they make from used sales back to the publishers and developers, there'd be no issue at all. And, in the end, everyone would win.

I hope that clears up my stance on the whole affair a bit. Kinda sick of one side or the other chastising me because they assume I think one thing when in fact I don't. Whether it be those for or against used games.

 

[Vigormortis]

snip

I don't completely disagree, but I'm not gonna repost my thoughts. Just see my post directly above.

 

[TrevHead]

Its also worth remembering that for the 360 atleast a JTAG modchip is the only way to get past region locking on the console and the only alternative is to pay through the nose in shipping and extra charges to import a console from asia or where ever.

But the ppl who do this and dont pirate are in a tiny minority, but there will be some ppl who used to crack the regoin locking using a softmod disc for their old gen consoles have turned pirates because there is no other option other than paying aload of money. (importing is an expensive hobby as it is due to the high price of Japanese games)

I bet a fair number of US Wii owners are softmodding their machines to play PAL xenoblade.

 

[targren]

snip

I don't completely disagree, but I'm not gonna repost my thoughts. Just see my post directly above.

Okay, then it looks like we're more in agreement than you think. I, too, think Gamestop are a bunch of scumbags. I just don't consider the act of buying and selling used games to be any part of that. (Buying for 15% and selling for 95%, on the other hand... yeah...)

As for the "online gaming" point, though... Shoehorning online gaming into every single thing they put out these days is a blatant grab for half-assing through the game (see all the MW and WWII shooters) and saying the multiplayer will make up for it. They spend their entire dev budgets on whizbang flashy graphics and excessive voice actors, and they forget to actually make the game.

And they've got no compunctions about killing the official servers when it suits them. It's happened before. So they really don't get any sympathy from me, there. If you don't want to have to support a game forever, then don't. Go back to hosted games instead of trying to keep an iron-fisted grip on every aspect of the game once it's sold, and they won't have to incur those costs.

 

[Zyst]

In Mexico they sell pirate games in the middle of the street, but mostly in "Mercados" (A group of small businesses that operate together, sometimes not every day of the week [ie: Just Fridays] and usually don't pay taxes) And there's literally hundreds of pirate games.

I myself don't support piracy, but another method is downloading the pirate game file (Which is readily available at a plethora of sites) and then you burn it, put it in and play.

 

[BelfastSpartan]

Not sure about console modding but as for game pirating.......
From what I hear you can download a widely accessible game torrent.
With the downloaded files you can run them through a program that 'fixes' the files
These are then burnt onto the disc which will now play in the previously modded console.
It looks like a surprisingly easy method that takes an hour or so.

However with new advancements in anti-pirating measures like the new disc types for xbox, etc it is becoming increasingly more difficult.

*I am not a pirate, as much as I think it would be fun to be a real pirate.......eye patch, cutlass, ARRRRRRRR, etc I don't condone pirating software!

 

[Caenis]

My last exposure to console piracy was PS2, so I don't know if this is how it still works or not but...

...you got a chip and then soldered it into the console somewhere. As far as downloading stuff? No. This was long enough ago that downloading an entire game would have taken FOREVER. We got them from friends and, in some cases, ordered them off the internet. Or we'd rent them, copy them, and then return them. What was cool about ordering them is you could get stuff made for Japanese audiences that was never released in the US. I'm not sure how we got past the region encoding, but we did. Those Japanese people play some STRANGE games.

Did I say we? I meant my neighbors did. Yeah. Uh huh.

 

[godofallu]

Wow. You seem to be taking my statement personally. Let me guess. You work at Gamestop, don't you? Why else would someone defend a place like that who's company policy is "rip-off both the publishers and consumers".

I hate Gamestop, and haven't done a dime's worth of business with them in many years.
Pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of corporate fellatio doesn't mean I defend their company; it means I can't stand seeing hypocrites gargling cooperate cocks while denying the rights of CONSUMERS to resell the products they BOUGHT AND PAID FOR.

Defending the truth is not defending the company.

Gamestop is a middle-man. No different than buying and selling used games on eBay. They take their cut, too. Do you hate them, or is their dick too big to swallow?

"Gamestop....the little guy"? I may literally die from laughing.

Compared to public libraries? They're fucking peasants compared to the number of titles people "don't pay for" each year. Context. I thought it was pretty goddamn clear, but I can whip out the crayons next time and draw you a picture if you like.

Libraries don't steal, they "borrow" by rights.

Libraries buy one copy of a piece of media then freely give it out to thousands.
To a hypocrite like yourself, this is OK.

Third party middleman buy ONE copy of a game and resell it to ONE person.
This is OMGTHEFTERSTEELING LIEK PIRACY OMG!

Makes sense.

So why only Gamestop? Why not threads against Craiglist, Ebay, any of the dozens of "game trader" websites where users buy, sell, and exchange used games, or any of the rental places that profit on loaning out a single title thousands of times?

Are they not also costing game developers money?

You simply don't have an argument. None.

But don't worry, I'll still read any of your pathetic justifications after you hit the "Report" button and run away crying.

But I'm guessing you're the kind of person who either doesn't get that or doesn't care.

I care quite a bit when a bunch of ignorant teenagers have decided to rally in defense of game companies against MY right to OWN and control the products I have PAID for.

You fight for the game companies to control MY use.

Yes, I'm the type of person that will call you out. You are an ENEMY to the consumer. As a consumer, that makes you my enemy. So, slobber on, corporate whore. Slobber on.

Upon further "research" I have discovered that you've been on the Escapist for a short time yet have already racked up 3 warnings.

Yeah, it's funny how that works; Come into a forum that is under the ruling fist of game companies and call out the fans fellating industry rule in the name of corporate profits while attacking the oldest and most basic consumer rights of First Sale. My rights.

Amazingly they have a problem with it. Go figure.

You'll notice the Corporate Shill that started this thread didn't stick around. Wonder why?

Also, you got something on your chin.

I totally agree with your main point. Used game sales are a good thing, and not a problem. The problem with this post is that you used good logic but also sullied it with aggressive insults and juvenile flaming.

You can't really call someone a corporate whore, and a crying teenager on the forums and get away with it. Even if they are kind of annoying and hypocritical.

 

[Mandalore_15]

You'll notice the Corporate Shill that started this thread didn't stick around. Wonder why?

Um, I'd be interested to know just how I'm a corporate shill exactly? If you read my reply to Vigormortis you'll see that I am against games companies doing anything that interferes with the first sale doctrine. Seriously, are you just insulting me for the sake of it?

 

[OldGus]

On a slightly related note, isnt it weird you can get your console modded in shops that advertise it in their windows in Germany? Isnt that shit illegal? Not that I really care since piracy isnt all that rampant on consoles, but you would think a country that will take you into custody for mowing your lawn on a Sunday afternoon would crack down on it.

The thing is, a typical console mod will not just remove disc-read protections (to make sure its not just a DVD-R with the game image on it), but also region protections. Consider how the big three have wavered back and forth over the years on region locks, and how now the PSP and PS3 are region free (at least for games.) Its not because importing games is incredibly illegal, but they trust that customers would never, ever do it. Its because while importing games is legal, the games themselves usually have to have content edited so that it better fits the culture (or in the case of Australia, the law.) Long story short, most of the shops that proudly advertise the mods do it and sell imported games, therefore legitimizing their practice of modding with legal business practices. Similarly, the PS3 being region free works in favor of the law in general because the only reason(s) to modify it is/are to pirate games (or as many have argued, to install your own OS, just like they originally promised, launched with, and later removed.)

More OT:As people are pointing out, the major way console games are pirated is via torrents, with a large portion of previous generation games taking out the console-middleman and just running it on an emulator. Assuming the consoles are properly modded, an ISO on a hard drive is ok. But, especially in countries like China, piracy is an industry, full of people buying the full price copy, ripping and burning hundreds of copies, then selling it at a reduced rate.

I guess I should make myself clear... I am not in favor of piracy. I am also not in favor of region protection, and am in favor of importing (especially since monitoring imports is a good way for companies to test the water).

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

Wow. You seem to be taking my statement personally. Let me guess. You work at Gamestop, don't you? Why else would someone defend a place like that who's company policy is "rip-off both the publishers and consumers".

I hate Gamestop, and haven't done a dime's worth of business with them in many years.
Pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of corporate fellatio doesn't mean I defend their company; it means I can't stand seeing hypocrites gargling cooperate cocks while denying the rights of CONSUMERS to resell the products they BOUGHT AND PAID FOR.

Defending the truth is not defending the company.

Gamestop is a middle-man. No different than buying and selling used games on eBay. They take their cut, too. Do you hate them, or is their dick too big to swallow?

"Gamestop....the little guy"? I may literally die from laughing.

Compared to public libraries? They're fucking peasants compared to the number of titles people "don't pay for" each year. Context. I thought it was pretty goddamn clear, but I can whip out the crayons next time and draw you a picture if you like.

Libraries don't steal, they "borrow" by rights.

Libraries buy one copy of a piece of media then freely give it out to thousands.
To a hypocrite like yourself, this is OK.

Third party middleman buy ONE copy of a game and resell it to ONE person.
This is OMGTHEFTERSTEELING LIEK PIRACY OMG!

Makes sense.

So why only Gamestop? Why not threads against Craiglist, Ebay, any of the dozens of "game trader" websites where users buy, sell, and exchange used games, or any of the rental places that profit on loaning out a single title thousands of times?

Are they not also costing game developers money?

You simply don't have an argument. None.

But don't worry, I'll still read any of your pathetic justifications after you hit the "Report" button and run away crying.

But I'm guessing you're the kind of person who either doesn't get that or doesn't care.

I care quite a bit when a bunch of ignorant teenagers have decided to rally in defense of game companies against MY right to OWN and control the products I have PAID for.

You fight for the game companies to control MY use.

Yes, I'm the type of person that will call you out. You are an ENEMY to the consumer. As a consumer, that makes you my enemy. So, slobber on, corporate whore. Slobber on.

Upon further "research" I have discovered that you've been on the Escapist for a short time yet have already racked up 3 warnings.

Yeah, it's funny how that works; Come into a forum that is under the ruling fist of game companies and call out the fans fellating industry rule in the name of corporate profits while attacking the oldest and most basic consumer rights of First Sale. My rights.

Amazingly they have a problem with it. Go figure.

You'll notice the Corporate Shill that started this thread didn't stick around. Wonder why?

Also, you got something on your chin.

I agree with you, but take a look real quick at my forum health bar. I've never actually had more than one warning on it at a time (discounting the time I disputed a warning that happened as the result of a server error, won my case, and got it removed), and yet I argue a lot of the same stuff you do. It's all in how you word it; you have to find a way to call people corporate whores without actually using the word "whore;" "shill" works nicely. Similar connotation, but without the nasty denotation. Really, the only rule around here that is a direct result of The Escapist's relationship with the industry and will get you banned if you aren't careful is the piracy rule. Don't admit to it, and don't advocate it in its current form, and the only way they can pin anything on you is if you break another rule in the process. Heck, I've made a pretty good career around here out of pointing out that Piracy isn't really all that big of a problem, and it's more of a scapegoat to keep publishers from having to lower their exorbitant prices.