Poll: If you've ever downloaded something illegally, YOU are to blame for SOPA/PIPA.

[Kolby Jack]

Burnie Burns made a great point on the Rooster Teeth podcast this week about what actually caused SOPA. It's not congressmen who don't understand the internet, nor is it greedy publishers trying to get as much money as they can. It's you, the people who download things without paying for them. Piracy caused SOPA, and it's what will cause the next SOPA and the one after that. As long as people keep downloading things illegally, congress will be forced to make bills like SOPA.

I'm not asking anyone to admit they've downloaded illegally, nor am I referring to any specific person when I say "you." It is true that Congress is dumb when it comes to the internet, but it is also true that they wouldn't be making these bills if people would just pay for the things they want like they should. We shouldn't be blaming congress for these bills (at least not fully), we should be blaming media pirates and demanding THEM to stop.

 

[Mr.Mattress]

I believe so. I was actually gonna make a topic about how the Fear of Piracy leads to laws against Piracy, regardless of how Piracy really affects the Movie Industry. Just like how a fear of bees basically create laws against bees.

 

[w9496]

Yeah, I agree with you. SOPA would probably never have existed if it weren't for piracy.

 

[manic_depressive13]

Um, no? SOPA was a really fucking stupid law which wasn't even designed to combat piracy. If someone overreacts to something and punches someone in the face, do you say it's the victim's fault for provoking him? No, you blame the guy who thinks punching people in the face (in SOPA's case it's more akin to punching innocent bystanders) is a reasonable response to whatever was annoying him.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

I believe so. I was actually gonna make a topic about how the Fear of Piracy leads to laws against Piracy, regardless of how Piracy really affects the Movie Industry. Just like how a fear of bees basically create laws against bees.

Hear hear. These bee laws are getting completely out of control.

 

[Viridian]

No. Pirate something like, for instance, gameboy advance roms, and you aren't to blame. Why? Because there isn't any profit to be made anymore off of the x year-old game that you pirated when it isn't even commercially available. I'm not saying that it's right, and I'm not saying that it's wrong. I'm saying that most companies won't care (and thus won't freak out), because the time of gameboy advance games has passed. And even if they were available, they would be dirt cheap.

Music and current gen games and movies though? Pirate that and people go into lockdown mode, because "WE'RE LOSIN' TEH MONEEZ."

 

[CulixCupric]

When a soccer mom comes out and calls for normal footballs to be banned in schools because her kid got hit in the head with one and has a concussion, we call her stupid.

and yet dodgeball has been banned in schools, because those soccer moms are afraid of thier kids getting hurt, all over America, exactly where sopa/pipa/acta/open are all coming from.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2006-06-26-recess-bans_x.htm

so even if we call them stupid, they're winning. no matter who we call stupid, they just might win. it's mob mentality, and it can over power anything with enough ignorant gits who fear something enough.

EDIT: this ban on recess and sports in schools is contributing to child obesity, along with parents who feed their children only fast food, along with other factors. they blame the restaurants, when the problem is the parents, who usually use the TV to baby sit the kid, who then gets no exercise at home or school, and then only eats only food with trans-fats, because that's all the parents give them.

 

[Lilani]

-snip-

And those little beeper things on clothes in retail stores probably wouldn't exist if people wouldn't shoplift. But here's the difference: those little beepers are hardly a problem. Sometimes they forget to take them off when you leave, but if that's the case just go back with your receipt and have them removed. The equivalent of SOPA in that situation would be turning every store into Alcatraz with stone walls, thousands of cameras, full-body scans and polygraphs and fingerprints when you enter and exit, and a full lockdown the moment anyone looks over their shoulder. That would likely stop shoplifting dead in its tracks, but the consequences would force the store to close within weeks.

 

[Wintermoot]

no it,s people being paranoid.
me pirating episodes of Scrubs is no different from me recording them from TV.
(strictly theoretical)
also Piracy is 9/10 time the only way to get out-of-print software.
for example Shenmue or a crapton of GB/GBC games even IF I were to buy them used it wouldn't make any difference towards the developer.

Piracy is a problem but not as big as people say and SOPA/PROTECT IP aren,t the answer
either
A)have copyright and after X years.
B)make digital distribution mandatory making piracy obsolete.

 

[FernandoV]

Burnie Burns made a great point on the Rooster Teeth podcast this week about what actually caused SOPA. It's not congressmen who don't understand the internet, nor is it greedy publishers trying to get as much money as they can. It's you, the people who download things without paying for them. Piracy caused SOPA, and it's what will cause the next SOPA and the one after that. As long as people keep downloading things illegally, congress will be forced to make bills like SOPA.

I'm not asking anyone to admit they've downloaded illegally, nor am I referring to any specific person when I say "you." It is true that Congress is dumb when it comes to the internet, but it is also true that they wouldn't be making these bills if people would just pay for the things they want like they should. We shouldn't be blaming congress for these bills (at least not fully), we should be blaming media pirates and demanding THEM to stop.

Hahaha, funny. The bill goes far beyond the scope of limiting piracy's impact on the internet to being vague enough to limit freedoms on the internet. Proportionality is key here; learn it, love it and abide by it.

 

[Kolby Jack]

Some people seem to be completely missing the point and somehow come to the conclusion that I support SOPA or Congress, neither of which is true (I even called Congress dumb in my post). This leads me to believe that a few of you didn't even read my post and are just reacting to the topic title. That's stupid.

Uh, what? When faced with an issue the Congressmen are responsible for how they react. If they react poorly that is their decision and that is their responsibility. If greedy publishers influence the Congressmen they are in part responsible as well. You can claim pirates are in part responsible for causing the problem, but it is utterly absurd to say that how people go about trying to solve it isn't something they are responsible for.

Besides, Congress has a responsibility to understand what they pass laws about. If they fail that they should be blamed. You do not go tip toeing around their incompetence, you call them out on it.

I agree, but that doesn't make pirating okay. My point was that while SOPA was stupid, piracy made Congress think it was a good idea, so we should probably focus less of our attention on how stupid congress is (because at this point that's just beating a dead horse) and focus more on how media pirates almost fucked up the internet for all of us. They are the criminals here, and I'd rather persecute criminals than idiots.

Music and current gen games and movies though? Pirate that and people go into lockdown mode, because "WE'RE LOSIN' TEH MONEEZ."

Because they have enough money already, right? They won't miss a few million dollars. That is the flimsiest justification for breaking the law there is. Stealing from the rich is still stealing, any judge will tell you that.

no it,s people being paranoid.
me pirating episodes of Scrubs is no different from me recording them from TV.
(strictly theoretical)

Actually, downloading an episode of Scrubs off iTunes after paying for it is no different than you recording it. But recording it, copying it, and then distributing it for free IS illegal, which is what piracy is. Buying the copy is also illegal, at least if you know the guy copied it, which 99% of the time you would. Most arguments against piracy don't seem to amount to anything more than "Things cost money?! THAT'S STUPID!" These people need to grow up.

 

[Hoplon]

What a load of old crap, the people that are responsible are the people that lobbied to have it created in the first place, only then because they are feeling like they can't dictate the terms of how content is sold rather than any actual belief that it is hurting their revenue streams.

 

[Kolby Jack]

Uh, what? When faced with an issue the Congressmen are responsible for how they react. If they react poorly that is their decision and that is their responsibility. If greedy publishers influence the Congressmen they are in part responsible as well. You can claim pirates are in part responsible for causing the problem, but it is utterly absurd to say that how people go about trying to solve it isn't something they are responsible for.

Besides, Congress has a responsibility to understand what they pass laws about. If they fail that they should be blamed. You do not go tip toeing around their incompetence, you call them out on it.

I agree, but that doesn't make pirating okay. My point was that while SOPA was stupid, piracy made Congress think it was a good idea, so we should probably focus less of our attention on how stupid congress is (because at this point that's just beating a dead horse) and focus more on how media pirates almost fucked up the internet for all of us. They are the criminals here, and I'd rather persecute criminals than idiots.

It doesn't matter whether piracy is okay or not, that's not what I was talking about or what your topic seemed to be about. It's about assigning blame. Who is responsible and all that.

See, it wasn't just piracy making Congress think it was a good idea. It was those corporations pushing for it, as well as their own ignorance. We should focus on getting Congress to shape up because they are a long term problem. And it is their job to deal with such things and they are not doing it properly. They are to blame for doing their job improperly, and those who pushed them to try for SOPA are to blame for also pushing Congress to do their job improperly.

Further, if you want to be realistic, you can do nothing about piracy. What do you plan to do, shame then? No, it takes a solution higher up. Like the law, which will be the domain of Congress.

It doesn't matter much who you'd rather persecute. That doesn't mean that your favored target is the one that is really responsible. Because they're not. Congress is. I like manic_depressive's example. If someone overreacts and punches someone entirely innocent, who is at fault? The one who decided the proper course of action was punching people. If the provocateur did something wrong, you can blame them for their own crimes. But a poor reaction is the fault of the one who reacted.

Actually, you can do everything about piracy by not downloading pirated stuff. And I already said I agree, the reaction part of this debacle was wrong, and on Congress. But that doesn't give pirates a free ride on the innocent train. Lobbyists made the bill stupid, but pirates made the bill possible. Their actions threaten to make the rest of us victims of a stupid system, and they don't give a shit. And since we all love analogies so much apparently and I'm in the military, let me give you a military analogy:

Your squad has a commander who is a real asshole and likes to punish the entire squad for the fuck-ups of a single person or small group. You would file a complaint, for for the sake of this analogy let's say for whatever reason that's not possible. Now one guy starts screwing up knowingly and pisses the commander off, so the whole squad is getting punished constantly for this one guy. When you try and call him out on it, he says "Well the commander shouldn't be such a hard-ass!" That statement is true, but what is also true is that the guy shouldn't be screwing up at the expense of everyone else!

It isn't a perfect analogy, but I think it works for the most part. Pirates know what they are doing is wrong and that their actions will have consequences for everybody, but they do it anyway. If they don't know that, then they are even stupider than Congress. So while we can try to change the system so we don't pay for their crimes, we should also be trying to make them stop committing those crimes. Work the issue from multiple angles instead of laying all our effort on one component of it.

 

[Promethax]

Of course pirates are to blame for SOPA and PIPA.

I've heard an analogy that SOPA is like dropping a nuke to kill an ant hill. No need to drop the nuke if the ant hill isn't already there.

Simple cause and effect, people.

 

[Kolby Jack]

does NOT address the people who will keep downloading stuff. Yes, in a nice idealistic world everyone would listen and stop. But no, that is not a realistic expectation. It's less realistic than expecting Congress to shape up. Your solution is not a solution at all, it's a request and plenty of people will ignore it. And in the end you lack the power to enforce it.

And they are innocent in regards to the bill really. Lobbyists made the bill stupid, the stupidity is their own fault. You're avoiding the real problem: the system. Why is the system the real problem? Because it will continue to churn out bad solutions for the various problems it comes across. It doesn't just need to be piracy. It can be other things. See: recent NDAA, and the Patriot Act.

As for your example, the commander is still the one at fault the most. And taking away the ability to deal with the commander is ridiculous. You're refusing to look at the fact that Congress is easier to deal with than voluntarily getting millions of people to stop pirating. It's more reasonable to have a scenario where you can complain about the commander while you have an incorrigible person in the squad really. And quite frankly not giving into unreasonable punishment is not very much a fault. Giving into unreasonable punishments just gives the asshole what they want.

It makes no sense to try to stop them from committing crimes. Why? Because you don't have any kind of hold over them. You can't stop them, they can just ignore you. You have just about no means to work at the issue from the angle you want to work it from.

I'm not saying I can just ask pirates to stop pirating and hope they do. I'm just saying that it wouldn't hurt to stop supporting them. Raise awareness a little bit. Set an example. I don't expect piracy to diminish overnight, nor do I expect it to ever disappear completely, but I think it's about time we made it clear to these assholes that what they are doing effects more than just some media company's profits. I don't think it's too much to ask for people, before they download something illegally, to stop and ask themselves "Would it kill me to pay a couple bucks for this instead?"