Poll: Is zero a number? (Read before voting)
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/agreesummerof2010 said:Garblarg! I can't believe this thread has gone to over 700 posts! Can there be that much disagreement about such a basic thing? This just irritates the piss out of me. The OP is talking right out of his ass, as are half of the posters here! This is the most pointless, nonsensical, semantic bullshit I've ever seen! I just... GAH!
Yes! It's a number! As in, there are 0 reasons this thread is still hot. The existence of absolute "nothing" may be philosophically debatable, but the common concept of nothing is still a valid and useful one, so what the fuck are we talking about? I can say nothing else, just... please!
EDIT: 171 people on this thread are either phenomenal idiots or trolls. And another handful are either also idiots or have been misled by the more convincing idiots.
/agree so hard its a gorram agreement singularity being formed inside my brain, here.
Tee hee, I guess this is how wars started and people of different religions started to dislike each other. Tee hee.summerof2010 said:
I finally understand why some find maths so hard. Tee hee.
No point in hanging around here any more, got to go to bed.
This is still going on? Don't you people have important shit to discuss instead? I've said this before...
WE'RE ARE NOT THE MOST BRILLIANT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD.
Do you really think that any of you who said it is not a number are genius enough to be the first person to recognize that if it we're completely true? If it was, WE PROBABLY WOULD NOT EVEN KNOW OF ZERO'S EXISTENCE AS A NUMBER BY DEFINITION TODAY, MORE THAN 2000 YEARS AFTER IT'S CREATION.
Now I feel bad. It's true that it is not by a certain definition of number... But you know what? It is considered a number BY MORE DEFINITIONS THAN IT IS NOT.
Can we please get over this?
WE'RE ARE NOT THE MOST BRILLIANT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD.
Do you really think that any of you who said it is not a number are genius enough to be the first person to recognize that if it we're completely true? If it was, WE PROBABLY WOULD NOT EVEN KNOW OF ZERO'S EXISTENCE AS A NUMBER BY DEFINITION TODAY, MORE THAN 2000 YEARS AFTER IT'S CREATION.
Now I feel bad. It's true that it is not by a certain definition of number... But you know what? It is considered a number BY MORE DEFINITIONS THAN IT IS NOT.
Can we please get over this?
But life as we know it hinges on this important question! Don't those who dwell beneath bridges have as much right to their anecdotal "evidence" as we do to our logic? Aren't semantics the basis for the culture at large and are how we will get out of the recession?summerof2010 said:
As I understand it, it's a number the same way black or white aren't technically colours because they're not on the spectrum; they represent an absence of colour or all the colours simultaneously.
But I don't know. I got a C in mathematics. And it wasn't a very good C either.
But I don't know. I got a C in mathematics. And it wasn't a very good C either.
all numbers represent value and zero represents a value that equals no value so zero is indeed a number and is widely accepted as such.
Your sort of right yet, entirely pointless argument is intriguing.crystalsnow said:
Zero ,in my belief, is the numerical representation of the void aka nada, nothing zilch etc.
It is like morality there Evil(-),Neutral(zero), and Good(+).
Oh my god. I leave this thread overnight, and it goes from page 8 to 21. I had 20 messages in my inbox from people quoting me. I can't (and won't) respond to all of them, because I already have a headache as it is. I have no doubt almost everyone has a valid argument, because just skimming through the pages I can see a lot of thought put into posts, even though I'm sure there are a few trolls too. Thank you all for contributing to this thread, this went way farther than I thought.
Honestly, you can't prove zero is a number. And you can't prove it isn't. Some people are getting very angry in this thread (and quite a few of them are getting off topic), even though it's just a simple opinion thread. Whether or not zero is a number in your mind depends on what kind of thinker you are, and what you define as a "number".
Honestly, you can't prove zero is a number. And you can't prove it isn't. Some people are getting very angry in this thread (and quite a few of them are getting off topic), even though it's just a simple opinion thread. Whether or not zero is a number in your mind depends on what kind of thinker you are, and what you define as a "number".
The OP seems like he should become a philosopher. He sure isn't a mathematician.
It's universally understood that zero is a number.
It's universally understood that zero is a number.
YOU can't absolutely prove zero is a number - but a properly trained mathematician can run up a rigorous proof for you in about 5 minutes. In fact, many have, all through the thread. Read them, there are some folks here who DO know what they're talking about. I wouldn't go to my dentist and tell him he fixes my teeth wrong, because I don't know anything about teeth. Similarly, you should not try and tell mathematicians what they're doing wrong if you knowq little/nothing about numbers.
Crystal, you were innocently wrong, and are encouraged to ask questions like this because they are questions that have been asked for thousands of years - not because it is 'unknowable', but because the process of thinking of the question and internalising the answer is worthwhile. But here's the rub - when you ask a question, you have to be prepared to recieve an answer and properly evaluate it before integrating it into your worldview.
I'm almost positive that kunoiichi is in fact a massive troll - he is logical fallacies incarnate. And it is clear that his "who says you need a degree to be smart?" attitude seems utterly facetious when he tries to argue with anyone actually holding one. Obviously you don't need to get a degree to be smart, but wilfully ignoring the value of higher education (in terms of enriching a student's general worldview and specifically qualifying them as an expert in a chosen field) is positively galling to those of us who have done the hard yards, and learned the hard lessons. He's gone on for the 12 hours I was out on the town, and I stagger home to bed notinging that this damn thread that was mathematically resolved back around page 6 is STILL FREAKING GOING.
Kuno, sometimes in your life you have to acknowledge that there are people in the world more knowledgeable than you. The only way to change this is by acquiring their knowledge from them, listening to them, learning from them. If you refuse to learn from those people, the way you have refused to learn from us, then your knowledge gain will be much slower than it should be. Perhaps this is the real reason school wasn't for you? Not big on authority?
Crystal, you were innocently wrong, and are encouraged to ask questions like this because they are questions that have been asked for thousands of years - not because it is 'unknowable', but because the process of thinking of the question and internalising the answer is worthwhile. But here's the rub - when you ask a question, you have to be prepared to recieve an answer and properly evaluate it before integrating it into your worldview.
I'm almost positive that kunoiichi is in fact a massive troll - he is logical fallacies incarnate. And it is clear that his "who says you need a degree to be smart?" attitude seems utterly facetious when he tries to argue with anyone actually holding one. Obviously you don't need to get a degree to be smart, but wilfully ignoring the value of higher education (in terms of enriching a student's general worldview and specifically qualifying them as an expert in a chosen field) is positively galling to those of us who have done the hard yards, and learned the hard lessons. He's gone on for the 12 hours I was out on the town, and I stagger home to bed notinging that this damn thread that was mathematically resolved back around page 6 is STILL FREAKING GOING.
Kuno, sometimes in your life you have to acknowledge that there are people in the world more knowledgeable than you. The only way to change this is by acquiring their knowledge from them, listening to them, learning from them. If you refuse to learn from those people, the way you have refused to learn from us, then your knowledge gain will be much slower than it should be. Perhaps this is the real reason school wasn't for you? Not big on authority?
zero by all terms is a number but there is more of an abstract thought behind the place of a 0. its a barrier. a place where all information and existance starts and ends with: nothing. in numbers it is a place between real numbers (1 to infinite) and negative numbers (-1 to oblivion)
Just because it's an imaginary number doesn't make it any less than a real number.
After all, Pi is an imaginary number but we all love it.
Who would want to live in a world without Pi?
For that matter, how will we ever have future episodes of Sesame Street when children become hyper intelligent, we must have Sesame Street brought to us by the letters Theta, Gamma, and the number i. (Still the best joke I remember from college, even if I forgot which Greek letters were used at the time.)
After all, Pi is an imaginary number but we all love it.
Who would want to live in a world without Pi?
For that matter, how will we ever have future episodes of Sesame Street when children become hyper intelligent, we must have Sesame Street brought to us by the letters Theta, Gamma, and the number i. (Still the best joke I remember from college, even if I forgot which Greek letters were used at the time.)
I believe 0 is a number as numbers are just representations of values. and 0 can be represented in an empty hand or vacuum.
Also as soon as you contain a situation to a certain area it no longer matters what is or isn't in another area, all other areas becoming irrelevant to the situation. also you having no money and no debt is having 0 dollars. that there is more money out there in the world no longer matters to the case as it has been contained to "you".
*edit* i have only just started college so my views are simple and poorly thought out, so plz don't criticize me for being poorly learned as I know I am.
Also as soon as you contain a situation to a certain area it no longer matters what is or isn't in another area, all other areas becoming irrelevant to the situation. also you having no money and no debt is having 0 dollars. that there is more money out there in the world no longer matters to the case as it has been contained to "you".
*edit* i have only just started college so my views are simple and poorly thought out, so plz don't criticize me for being poorly learned as I know I am.
Zero is in fact not a number, it is a placeholder and nothing more.
Zero represents either the absence of an item or a place as is 10 equals ten, because nothing is in the 1's place.
Yeah, remember that from math class. 1's, 10's, 100's places? That's right, those little 0's are placeholders, not numbers.
That's just my two cents, nothing more.
Zero represents either the absence of an item or a place as is 10 equals ten, because nothing is in the 1's place.
Yeah, remember that from math class. 1's, 10's, 100's places? That's right, those little 0's are placeholders, not numbers.
That's just my two cents, nothing more.
From what I've read on it, zero's both a real and imaginary number. Meh.Lukeje said:
As far as Pi, we're talking about a number used to represent "the ratio of any circle's circumference to its diameter". It's practically a variable even though it's claimed to be a constant. I'm certain die hard mathematicians would disagree, but it may as well be imaginary as far as I care. It can't be exactly calculated, it's more functional in imprecise use, and the more I read on it, the more it sounds like a philosophical concept than a scientific one.
