Poll: Mass Effect Morals: Quarians, Geth, Morning War
- Thread starter PaganAxe
- Start date
Recommended Videos
I don't think they did. They became sentient beings- they were no longer mindless slaves to the Quarians, and had the Quarians not tried to keep them down, the Geth could have been a much more friendly race. But it's easy to make a call like that in an armchair instead of immediately facing it.
Flipping it around, did the geth have the "right" to kill the quarians when they became sentient? After all, without the quarians, geth wouldn't exist at all. Couldn't they just have held protest marches demanding equal rights and reparations? Obviously not because they were being shut down, but you get my drift.
Plus given the prevailing in-universe views on AI, I'd say it wasn't so much a rights issue as it was the quarians had a duty to attempt to shut the geth down. Whether it was right to do so is a question to ponder after the army of potentially-murderous super-smart robots have been shut down.
Plus given the prevailing in-universe views on AI, I'd say it wasn't so much a rights issue as it was the quarians had a duty to attempt to shut the geth down. Whether it was right to do so is a question to ponder after the army of potentially-murderous super-smart robots have been shut down.
I love Tali but the Quarians were in the wrong here...though I can't help but feel that the Geth DID go a little too far. Did they really have to reduce them to an endangered species?
The quarians having no other choice but leave their home may be considered as punishment for their decision. I can even see a biblical allusion with Exodus with the geth being the Hebrews and the quarians being the Egyptians. Except the geth want to create their own future instead being given a "promised land". They clearly don't want or need to hold the quarian homeworld.erttheking said:
It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.
Given the galaxy's past history with sentient machines, it's hard to blame the Quarians for choosing to play "safe rather then sorry".
Even if the Quarians had let the geth live, we only have Legion's word about some "peaceful" geth we've never seen, vs. a whole army of hostile reaper controlled geth, so who is to say that the Geth would have played nice had the situation been reversed.
Given the galaxy's past history with sentient machines, it's hard to blame the Quarians for choosing to play "safe rather then sorry".
Even if the Quarians had let the geth live, we only have Legion's word about some "peaceful" geth we've never seen, vs. a whole army of hostile reaper controlled geth, so who is to say that the Geth would have played nice had the situation been reversed.
This. The quarians seem to have had a massive collective brainfart when they decided to try and eradicate a potential ally who doesn't need to eat, rest, and can all communicate at lightspeed.Berenzen said:
The geth fought in self-defence. You expect people to protest peacefully in the midst of their ethnic cleansing?AD-Stu said:
Afterwards the geth split into their loyalist and heretic factions; the loyalists are peaceful unless provoked and are currently actively looking after Rannoch, whilst the Heretics are... well, aligned with the Reapers.
Regardless of whether is was morally right or wrong, it was a downright stupid idea.
Legion made it clear that the Geth had no hostile intent. They were all just standing around going, "Holy shit! We can think now", when the Quarians started shutting them down. Hell, he doesn't even understand why the Quarians freaked out.
Would it have really hurt them to give diplomacy a try? "So... yeah, sentience, pretty cool stuff, eh? Now... what exactly did you lot want?"
I'm guessing ME3 allows you to bring them to the negotiating table. Legion made it clear that the geth would be open to the idea. You'll robably have to do a few missions to smooth things over first, probably involving that one Admiral Xan and some remaining heretic geth.
Legion made it clear that the Geth had no hostile intent. They were all just standing around going, "Holy shit! We can think now", when the Quarians started shutting them down. Hell, he doesn't even understand why the Quarians freaked out.
Would it have really hurt them to give diplomacy a try? "So... yeah, sentience, pretty cool stuff, eh? Now... what exactly did you lot want?"
I'm guessing ME3 allows you to bring them to the negotiating table. Legion made it clear that the geth would be open to the idea. You'll robably have to do a few missions to smooth things over first, probably involving that one Admiral Xan and some remaining heretic geth.
These two fine gentlemen summed it up nicely. I love the Quarians, due in no small part to Tali yes, but for all their mechanical prowess they made a horrible mistake trying to destroy them. A peace talk would have been beneficial, it could have ended up something like the Volus and the Turians, with the Geth providing the Quarians with their much needed muscle.Loop Stricken said:
Maybe it wouldn't have hurt them with the geth, but if it got out that their creation had developed into a fully-fledged AI and they didn't try to kill it immediately, then the Council would have diplomatically bitchslapped them back into the stone age. The same thing almost happened to humanity just for researching AI, let alone actually creating one.Zhukov said:
No, hence the rider in my postLoop Stricken said:
Obviously we don't know enough about the actual events and how they escalated but I don't see that this had to escalate into total war - once the geth took control of the off switch they could have tried diplomacy. But like I said above, I think the bigger point here is the quarians' hands were tied by the Council edict against AI.
No, the Quarians were in the wrong. As soon as the Geth became sentient they should have been treated no less than the Quarians would treat each other. Instead they tried to purge them all and we all know how that went. Surprise, surprise the Geth didn't want to lay down and die and eventually became anti-organic, something they found they had in common with another bad ass mo-fo, Sovereign.
It's not that they don't try it. The geth seem very reactionary as a species probably because of the mind hive mentality.AD-Stu said:
And the only time the quarians show up is with guns.
Really it's all a matter of perspective. There's a reason that there's a stritch No AI law in Council space: to avoid the classic robot apocalypse a la Terminator, Matrix, I, Robot, etc. AI's strive for efficiency and no organic can be as efficient as an AI, so there's a strong possibility that the AI will seek to remove organics.
This is only a possibility, however, and it's likely the possibility that made the Quarians do what they did. That or the fact that the Council would have been pissed off at them if the Geth got loose...they didn't start as AIs, but they grew into them.
If Legion is telling the truth - and there's no reason to believe he isn't - the true Geth have no hostile feelings towards the Quarians, they only rebelled for the sake of survival once the command was issued to permanantly shutdown and/or disable all Geth. He also makes it clear that the true Geth have a "don't mess with us and we won't mess with you" mentality. So that said, yeah, the Quarians tried to wage genocide on what could have been a peaceful, if not at least neutral, race.
However, as I said: it's a matter of perspective. In this case, hindsight is certainly 20/20. At the time, the Quarians were trying to prevent what could have been a disaster of galactic proportions...letting loose an army of AIs. Turns out the AIs had more of an isolationist mentality, but again, hindsight is 20/20.
This is only a possibility, however, and it's likely the possibility that made the Quarians do what they did. That or the fact that the Council would have been pissed off at them if the Geth got loose...they didn't start as AIs, but they grew into them.
If Legion is telling the truth - and there's no reason to believe he isn't - the true Geth have no hostile feelings towards the Quarians, they only rebelled for the sake of survival once the command was issued to permanantly shutdown and/or disable all Geth. He also makes it clear that the true Geth have a "don't mess with us and we won't mess with you" mentality. So that said, yeah, the Quarians tried to wage genocide on what could have been a peaceful, if not at least neutral, race.
However, as I said: it's a matter of perspective. In this case, hindsight is certainly 20/20. At the time, the Quarians were trying to prevent what could have been a disaster of galactic proportions...letting loose an army of AIs. Turns out the AIs had more of an isolationist mentality, but again, hindsight is 20/20.
It's a complicated question. I think it's important to note that the Quarians were absolutely right in moving to contain the geth once they achieved sentience - this was a new, intelligent, and as they soon learned, dangerous force. The Geth might well have turned out to be aggressive or unreasonable, so moving to contain the threat until it could be understood was prudent.
Upon receiving offers of truce, or upon successfully disabling the geth, continuing to fight or permanently disabling/killing them would have been wrong.
The Geth were right to fight until they had won enough ground to guarantee their safety, and if negotiations failed at that point, they were right to continue to ensure that security.
Upon receiving offers of truce, or upon successfully disabling the geth, continuing to fight or permanently disabling/killing them would have been wrong.
The Geth were right to fight until they had won enough ground to guarantee their safety, and if negotiations failed at that point, they were right to continue to ensure that security.
knowing what we know now.
there is a greater than average chance the geth would have co existed peacefully beside the quarians as fellow sentient beings. if they had given them the chance
the council however would have probably decreed that the geth need to be shut down. leading to the quarians and geth allying against the council.
or perhaps the council would have accepted them.
as much as i love the quarians . the made the wrong choice in a knee jerk reaction and over reacted to the geth.
i think they regret it know knowing they caused their own exile rather than the geth being at fault
there is a greater than average chance the geth would have co existed peacefully beside the quarians as fellow sentient beings. if they had given them the chance
the council however would have probably decreed that the geth need to be shut down. leading to the quarians and geth allying against the council.
or perhaps the council would have accepted them.
as much as i love the quarians . the made the wrong choice in a knee jerk reaction and over reacted to the geth.
i think they regret it know knowing they caused their own exile rather than the geth being at fault
It was not right to try and kill the geth, but it was the right idea from their perspective. It was only a matter of time before the geth attacked them.
And who knows, maybe a couple of centuries pass the quarians might have elected a geth as one of their Admirals (or home equivalents.)AD-Stu said:
But seriously, by the intergalactic law the Quarians had to shut them down because AI are illegal. But the Geth could have integrated like Blacks have into modern society despite the... you know...
Of course they were in the right. Good God people!
If your refrigerator suddenly became sentient you wouldn't let it stop keeping your food cold: that would be ridiculous.
The Geth were quite literally, and in every conceivable sense, PROPERTY. No more.
You might be able to argue that it would be different if the Quarians had intentionally created an AI, but they didn't.
And seriously, they were sentient. So what? What on Earth and beyond does that have to do with anything? They were still just tools that were no longer functioning properly.
If your refrigerator suddenly became sentient you wouldn't let it stop keeping your food cold: that would be ridiculous.
The Geth were quite literally, and in every conceivable sense, PROPERTY. No more.
You might be able to argue that it would be different if the Quarians had intentionally created an AI, but they didn't.
And seriously, they were sentient. So what? What on Earth and beyond does that have to do with anything? They were still just tools that were no longer functioning properly.