Yeah, I'm on the same wavelength. Whilst there are the large amount of fakers these things illnesses are real things and do effect real people.Toynip said:
Poll: Mental illness: a conspiracy?
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While it is probably over-diagnosed by people who either don't understand it or just want to make a buck, it does exist. I have reasons to beleive that there is a physical or genetic reason for most of it. If you would look at people on the autism spectrum, you will see that they often have health problems. I'm not entirely sure, but I think that this is related, and if it is, then there's your physical evidence.
My Degrees in Psychology, so I feel like I can at least shed a little insight onto things.
Firstly, Psychology is a difficult field of science. You don't have to be concerned that your treating a helium atom in a morally acceptable manner, nor do you have to find a way to get a random sample of Atoms while still filtering out those atoms that won't work in your study. You can't jab a needle into a persons brain and say, "Yep, 20 milligrams of depression". And while other sciences were busy becoming well established, Psychology was getting over Freud ranting about screwing your mother, penises and cocaine. To top it all off, you need to get very precise, insightful observations from people who you wouldn't trust with your order at Taco Bell. Psychology, by its very nature, is about putting numbers and data into things where numbers and data are not necessarily apparent, and requires interpretation and utmost professionalism from flawed human beings. It requires the finesse of an artist and the exactitude of a scientist, a rare combination that leads to a ton of BS, and the public at large is not qualified to sift through the BS to find the important, salient gems. Mental illnesses are real, Psychologists are just busy trying to make the best possible construct for how to interpret the various behaviors. By the time Psychology filters out of the papers and into real treatment, it gets filled with the BS you hear about so often.
Another problem is that there's shades of Grey in Mental illness, and people *hate* anything that's not black and white. You don't always have a person who is dyslexic on one hand, and a person whose not on the other. You have a person whose a little dyslexic, someone whose a little more, a little less, a person whose a bit more intelligent but a bit more dyslexic, a person whose a bit more motivated, a person whose a bit more self conscious about there dyslexia and screws up tests because of it, a person whose dyslexic and a little of something else... there's a million variables involved, and its difficult to take a million variables and slap a single label on it. So people take a complex set of variables, simplify it to x, and say y cures x. Give y, problem solved. When that doesn't work, you blame the doctor. Give the study of Mental Illnesses a break. Your dealing with the single most complicated chunk of molecules in the universe, the answers to problems with it is not likely to be simple.
Firstly, Psychology is a difficult field of science. You don't have to be concerned that your treating a helium atom in a morally acceptable manner, nor do you have to find a way to get a random sample of Atoms while still filtering out those atoms that won't work in your study. You can't jab a needle into a persons brain and say, "Yep, 20 milligrams of depression". And while other sciences were busy becoming well established, Psychology was getting over Freud ranting about screwing your mother, penises and cocaine. To top it all off, you need to get very precise, insightful observations from people who you wouldn't trust with your order at Taco Bell. Psychology, by its very nature, is about putting numbers and data into things where numbers and data are not necessarily apparent, and requires interpretation and utmost professionalism from flawed human beings. It requires the finesse of an artist and the exactitude of a scientist, a rare combination that leads to a ton of BS, and the public at large is not qualified to sift through the BS to find the important, salient gems. Mental illnesses are real, Psychologists are just busy trying to make the best possible construct for how to interpret the various behaviors. By the time Psychology filters out of the papers and into real treatment, it gets filled with the BS you hear about so often.
Another problem is that there's shades of Grey in Mental illness, and people *hate* anything that's not black and white. You don't always have a person who is dyslexic on one hand, and a person whose not on the other. You have a person whose a little dyslexic, someone whose a little more, a little less, a person whose a bit more intelligent but a bit more dyslexic, a person whose a bit more motivated, a person whose a bit more self conscious about there dyslexia and screws up tests because of it, a person whose dyslexic and a little of something else... there's a million variables involved, and its difficult to take a million variables and slap a single label on it. So people take a complex set of variables, simplify it to x, and say y cures x. Give y, problem solved. When that doesn't work, you blame the doctor. Give the study of Mental Illnesses a break. Your dealing with the single most complicated chunk of molecules in the universe, the answers to problems with it is not likely to be simple.
Im with you on that and I have ADD.razer17 said:i wasn't trying to say ADHD isnt real. ill edit my post if thats what it sounds like. i just think it is massively over diagnosed. as some one else has said, timmy is failing in school, it must be ADHD. also helps give excuses to bad parents. although im sure there are real cases of ADHD, just not as common as psychiatrists would have you believehomoagogo said:Well, Down's and such are more developmental disorders than "mental," but I also work with children with mental disabilities such as Tourette's (sp?) and ADHD. I used to think that ADHD was a "lazy psychiatrist" label, but now that I have to manage 4 un-medicated severe ADHD children... It looks like an uncontrollable disorder with behavioral effects. Seeing an ADHD kid get worked up about something trivial and then start crying because they "don't wanna be like that"...orannis62 said:Severe disorders are not to be messed with.
Alot of parents do claim that there children have ADHD as an exucse for there behavior. I got distracted easly when I was little and Im more easly distracted than most now, but never once did I throw a show at some ones face.
One of my cousins did this to me, he was 8. That child did not have ADHD, that child has no self control and requires his ass to get beat after he messes with the wrong person.
Now I've seen people that actully have ADHD and they are simply exitible and easly distracted. These kids dont behave badly, there just more sporatic. All they need is to be calmed down and pointed back into the proper derection for the moment, easyer said than done but still very possible.
I would also like to point out that medication isnt always the magic most parents assume it is. When I took medication for my ADD, my appitite all but vanished (I couldnt even finish a simple sandwich, and I was big for my age) I became rahter apathetic, and my creativity dropped like a stone. So to all the parents out there, see if the medication is turly worht the strain it places on children.
I think mental illness is real, but some people are overdiagnosed. I know someone diagnosed with bipolar disorder. Personally, I think I'm more bipolar than the bipolar patient. In order to be truly bipolar, a person's mood swings have to have nothing to do with their circumstances. In other words, the trigger needs to be internal. However, when the person's mood swings are triggered by an event or person, that's normal behavior. Unfortunately, many doctors don't get all the information needed before making their diagnosis. It's important for the patient to be aware of their own health, and do research of their own to supplement what medical professionals are telling them.
Oh, totally this. I'm a paramedic, so I see genuine mental illness daily - and I can say daily with all honesty, because I have Asperger's - and so does my boyfriend. However, on the flip side, I see TONS of people who fake things to get out of things. I had a girl who faked Schizophrenia to get out of an assault; I had a man who faked Borderline Personality Disorder to get out of rape charges. Now fortunately, in both of those cases, it was brought to light that they were faking (I actually testified against the man in court) - but there are tons of other cases that I've dealt with where people were faking and get all the sympathy in the world, and then get away with anything they want.pimppeter2 said:
And seriously, if I get one more fat ass patient who uses the "ZOMG I AM TEH DEPRESSED AND THAT IS WHY I IS TEH FATTY" excuse, I'm going to punch them in the face. Not that there aren't people who are depressed and then eat to comfort themselves - it's just the biggest mental illness situation I see abused. And trust me, I lift a lot of fat asses into my ambulance.
Someone I love dearly suffers from depression. I have a touch of it myself, but nothing like this. I never realised how devastating depression can be, and the toll it takes on people until I fell in love with him. It's not easy hanging in through the ups and downs, but I'm staying the course.
Some mental illness is over diagnosed, i.e. ADHD, Autism, etc. I'm diagnosed with ADHD and a very slight case of a type of Autism. I also have a few emotional issues due to my life being, and still is, hell. Many learning disabilities are overly diagnosed and is usually caused by what your eating. Now real mental illness is no lie. True, some illnesses can be cured by a drastic change in diet (look up Gary Null for more info). Others however, are very serious, and can't be cured. Find someone schizophrenic and you will see it's not fake. Other mental disablitys are real but, can be cured or treated. However, if you are schizo, bypoler, or something like that, you may have emotional problems as well.
In conclusion, learning disables are overly diagnose, some real illnesses can be cured with change of diet and lifestyle, and some mental illnesses come with other emotional problems as well.
In conclusion, learning disables are overly diagnose, some real illnesses can be cured with change of diet and lifestyle, and some mental illnesses come with other emotional problems as well.
I'd like to talk to the people that said mental illness is a conspiracy. I've been to the psychiatric (sp?) ward where my mother works. Never again; it was obvious that the patients there were not faking it. Also, having seen two of my relatives die whilst in the grips of dementia, I saw a deterioation that could not be faked.
Yes, some people use these conditions as an excuse to get out of responsiblity, but that doesn't mean that they are fake. There are people in Britain pretending to be wheelchair bound to get benefits, but that doesn't mean that all disabled people are doing this. Same applies here...
Yes, some people use these conditions as an excuse to get out of responsiblity, but that doesn't mean that they are fake. There are people in Britain pretending to be wheelchair bound to get benefits, but that doesn't mean that all disabled people are doing this. Same applies here...
I've taken offence to everything you've said just then. My sister has depression and an anxiety disorder. She tried to kill herself. The medication she is on is the only thing keeping her mood stable enough to allow her to function. She couldn't handle uni and her despression has really taken a massive toll on her life and our entire family because of the extra effort the parents have to put in into ensuring she's alright. It is not just a 'lazy psychiatrist' and I don't appreciate you jumping to those conclusions without knowing the facts behind mental illnesses such as depression.razer17 said:
I have Depression mixed with something that can cause me to lose perception of reality if i get too angry.
I almost killed my brother it got so severe, i don't really remember much but alot of the house was kinda broken (dishes, basement door was downstairs instead of upstairs).
I also hallucinate alot, mainly things like cracks on the ground can move, slowly, but i see them moving. or a black speck on a table could start moving around.
I wish i could be more open about my issues in public, too bad society is too fucking retarded to understand anything anymore.
Anyone who thinks mental illness' are a conspiracy or fake is just ignorant.
I almost killed my brother it got so severe, i don't really remember much but alot of the house was kinda broken (dishes, basement door was downstairs instead of upstairs).
I also hallucinate alot, mainly things like cracks on the ground can move, slowly, but i see them moving. or a black speck on a table could start moving around.
I wish i could be more open about my issues in public, too bad society is too fucking retarded to understand anything anymore.
Anyone who thinks mental illness' are a conspiracy or fake is just ignorant.
im very sorry that is how you have interpreted my post, but thats not what i was saying. i know full well that people truly do have depression, and other disorders. and for the people who do have it, it's a terrible burden that i wouldnt like to see anyone with. what i was saying is some psychiatrists jump to these conclusions too quickly. just because someone is unhappy doesnt make them depressed, but psychiatrists are too quick to prescribe the meds. of course, when people are contemplating suicide that is a clear indication of actual depression.Inverse Skies said:
Who can know. One person's mentality is a completely separate perception of the universe from everyone else's. All we can really do is is identify certain trends. Certain trends can lead to dangerous outcomes and thus we attempt to counteract those dangerous outcomes. That's what all illness really is on the most vague level I can go without entirely losing the point.
I have mental disorders, do you think I'm a conspiracy?
I have mental disorders, do you think I'm a conspiracy?
Clinical depression does exist, but only the rarest cases actually have reason for treatment.
My problem with people claiming they have psychological disorders slash mental illnesses is that they all use some sort of self-diagnosis using a list of symptoms on an Internet site as a guide. Hello? You aren't clinically or psychologically suffering from ANYTHING until you go see a doctor/psychiatrist. Saying you have depression because you have certain symptoms does not mean you officially suffer from depression.
And every psychological disorder comes in a variety of degrees. Most people don't suffer from a crippling or limiting form. Most can go with their lives like normal as long as they realize what their problem is and avoid things that aggravate symptoms. Those who use the disorder as a crutch are either lazy or ignorant, and I would seek to remove any benefit achieved due to their disregard for their own mental health.
ADD and ADHD are real, but the fact is that most parents force their doctors to write a prescription for the drugs needed to mentally retard their own kids. This is a case of bad parents pushing around a weak-willed doctor. Most parents don't understand the first thing about ADD or ADHD so they do all sorts of stupid things as treatment. Which sometimes just makes the problem worse. OCD is a behaviorial disorder, so it can be licked after a lot of personal focus and time.
My problem with people claiming they have psychological disorders slash mental illnesses is that they all use some sort of self-diagnosis using a list of symptoms on an Internet site as a guide. Hello? You aren't clinically or psychologically suffering from ANYTHING until you go see a doctor/psychiatrist. Saying you have depression because you have certain symptoms does not mean you officially suffer from depression.
And every psychological disorder comes in a variety of degrees. Most people don't suffer from a crippling or limiting form. Most can go with their lives like normal as long as they realize what their problem is and avoid things that aggravate symptoms. Those who use the disorder as a crutch are either lazy or ignorant, and I would seek to remove any benefit achieved due to their disregard for their own mental health.
ADD and ADHD are real, but the fact is that most parents force their doctors to write a prescription for the drugs needed to mentally retard their own kids. This is a case of bad parents pushing around a weak-willed doctor. Most parents don't understand the first thing about ADD or ADHD so they do all sorts of stupid things as treatment. Which sometimes just makes the problem worse. OCD is a behaviorial disorder, so it can be licked after a lot of personal focus and time.
Finally. Someone else pursuing the same degree as the one I possess. Welcome, my friend, to the fun that is Psychology/Sociology.Xanadu84 said:
Mental illness is real. Doctors and psychiatrists are lazy in their diagnoses. It's hard to find a balance there.