Poll: No-kids-allowed movement. Yay or nay?
- Thread starter Beautiful End
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No is not an infringement of freedom, at least not any freedom guaranteed by the constitution or bill of rights. Any privately owned business has the right to refuse service at any time if it impedes their ability to offer the services they claim to offer or if it has a specific interest they are meeting by refusing service (safety, etc.). It's why clubs and bars can refuse people under 21 from even getting in the front door, why stores can say "no shirt, no shoes, no service", and why "black-tie" restaurants can exist.haloman13 said:
Almost any business could easily claim that they are refusing to allow children into the establishment because they are a potentially disruptive presence and it prevents them from offering a suitable dining, theater, etc. experience to the other customers. Or they can refuse service because they are catering to a specific clientele (such as in the case of clubs). That clientele could be broadly defined as "individuals over the age of X." They can't say "We're refusing service to children because we hate children," however.
Segregation because you've acted up is absolutely acceptable, and I have no problem with it.xmbts said:
Segregation based on age is a little more iffy, but I don't think it's anywhere near as bad as segregation by race. There are carnival rides where you have to be of a certain height to ride them, for safety reasons; do you think kids make the jump to "racial segregation is okay" based on that?
In fact, the inversion exists: Places a kid can only play if he's under age X (McDonalds Playland used to be like this). I think kids generally understand that age can open some doors and close others. It's part of growing up.
I like this sign I got from a friend: CHILDREN LEFT UNATTENDED WILL BE SOLD AS SLAVES. It's funny and makes a good point without being too dry
As a point, this movement wouldn't have so much momentum if people where raising their children "right". That said, it's too late. Too many interrupted movies. Too many ruined dinners. Too many flights made worse by screaming children.GenericAmerican said:
"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure"
That is to say if more parents over the last few years had been more observant and respectful of others then they wouldn't be dealing with the backlash they're currently facing.
You can blame parents but it will do you no good, parents hands have been tied and in a public place there is no politically correct punishment as you cant' put them in time out, you can't spank them and talking to them like some kind of therapist is exactly what people are complaining about when they say parents LET the kids act up.Ralen-Sharr said:
Kids have always misbehaved but parents today have fewer options to control them so the misbehaving is getting worse.
Next time you see a kid misbehaving in public and you begin to blame the parents, think about how you would react if that parent spanked the kid. Would you then blame the parent for disciplining their kid? Would you call Child Protective Services? Are you part of the problem with kids misbehaving?
God forbid I become a parent, and even then, god forbid I have a vacation, but if I did have one I would probably be forced to bring my child with me. This law would basicly say 'You have the gall to try and be a good parent by having your child with you?' it may just exclude babies and whatnot from certain places, but when someone wants a vacation, saying no to them because they reproduced is a bad business plan in the long term. Because chances are the parents would probably never want to go to a hotel or use an airplane that won't allow their children, meaning for the next 1-13/14 years they will no be flying with them, or staying in the hotel. They'll be cutting their profits down, and it'd be a big cycle, with only rich people who haven't reproduced will be the only ones interested in luxury.
I'm sorry, but no. No a thousand times over. Can you imagine a childhood never going to the theater, or to restaurants? Can you imagine the trouble for both a child and a parent if children weren't allowed on a plane? I can't believe people are hating on kids this much; without them, the entire human race dies out. I think you can handle a little inconvenience now and again for the sake of raising them correctly, you selfish pricks.
As the old saying goes "You can't tell me how to raise my kid!" This statement is usually followed by someone swinging a beer bottle or falling off a stool. Besides, they let the TV raise their kid the rest of the day, why not while they're out to. And no one is forcing these people to stay home. Playgrounds, parks, drive ins, amusement parks, etc, all this crap exists for families to go to. Take the kids there, where they belong and no one cares how obnoxious they are.GenericAmerican said:
I'd love to see how many of the anti-kids people in this topic feel when they have children of their own, especially when they want a break from being stuck at home or work all day and want to go have some fun and can't get a babysitter. Or when they need to get food or can't find anyone to watch their child (children) so have to take them along.
Segregation is segregation just because one instance of it causes you to feel racial guilt doesn't make the others better.Kilyle said:Segregation because you've acted up is absolutely acceptable, and I have no problem with it.xmbts said:
Segregation based on age is a little more iffy, but I don't think it's anywhere near as bad as segregation by race. There are carnival rides where you have to be of a certain height to ride them, for safety reasons; do you think kids make the jump to "racial segregation is okay" based on that?
In fact, the inversion exists: Places a kid can only play if he's under age X (McDonalds Playland used to be like this). I think kids generally understand that age can open some doors and close others. It's part of growing up.
I like this sign I got from a friend: CHILDREN LEFT UNATTENDED WILL BE SOLD AS SLAVES. It's funny and makes a good point without being too dry
Restaurants and Cinemas and airplanes aren't unsafe for children to be in. A ban like this only benefits people who are so ill tempered and maladjusted that their entire day is ruined by a simple tantrum. I'm not saying it isn't annoying and I'm not saying kids shouldn't behave themselves but is it really such a big deal that you need to bar them from public places and put another burden onto parents?
I absolutely support this. I hate it when people bring their kids to theaters. If you have a kid, get a sitter or don't see the damn movie. I don't want to hear about how you haven't gotten out of the house in months. Of COURSE you haven't. You had a fucking CHILD. It's kind of a big commitment. Get used to it.
I dont like people in general do i want to ban them from everywhere i go? No, i could explain why but it basically comes down to grow some balls and quit your bitching. Some one no matter their age etc is gunna find a way to piss you off just learn to ignore em if i can do it so can you.
I'd only agree with a no-kids ban if there was a no-adults ban as well. I'm sure there's just as many kids that see adults as self-centered, slow, and unimaginative as there are adults that see kids as loud, hyper, and immature. Many adults don't realize the amount of freedom that they have as a result of being older. Many children are limited in what they can do as a result of adults occupying more and more of the environment around them. I remember woods and parks that I used to frequent as a kid that no longer exist because "development" has turned them into adult oriented shopping centers and warehouses. I agree that some children need more discipline from their parents, but the loud few should not condemn the silent majority.
With the way many people react to children on this board, it's no surprise that there's such an issue with childhood obesity and depression. They can't go anywhere or do anything because no one wants to spend time with them. I'd be fat and suicidal too if people only ever told me they hated me. If you want to keep kids out of those places then give them something to do rather than taking away what little they have left. Letting your child throw a temper tantrum is just as irresponsible as leaving them at home for hours because you "don't want them around." (would like to put "don't want to deal with being a human being" but that'd just be speaking out in anger)
If there were a better integration of adult and child areas, then parents would have an easier time getting around with their children. It would also help keep children out of the hair of those that don't have children. There are obvious areas where children don't belong and laws are already established that are supposed to prevent them from going there. It's irresponsible and ignorant to believe you can live your entire life without ever interacting with children. They form an important foundation of society that holds together generations. We should spend more time trying to develop and support that foundation rather than trying to bolster already cracked and crippled pillars. Develop children that are responsible and mature and they'll pass that on to their children. Drop them in the corner or leave them at home and they'll simply repeat our own mistakes.
With the way many people react to children on this board, it's no surprise that there's such an issue with childhood obesity and depression. They can't go anywhere or do anything because no one wants to spend time with them. I'd be fat and suicidal too if people only ever told me they hated me. If you want to keep kids out of those places then give them something to do rather than taking away what little they have left. Letting your child throw a temper tantrum is just as irresponsible as leaving them at home for hours because you "don't want them around." (would like to put "don't want to deal with being a human being" but that'd just be speaking out in anger)
If there were a better integration of adult and child areas, then parents would have an easier time getting around with their children. It would also help keep children out of the hair of those that don't have children. There are obvious areas where children don't belong and laws are already established that are supposed to prevent them from going there. It's irresponsible and ignorant to believe you can live your entire life without ever interacting with children. They form an important foundation of society that holds together generations. We should spend more time trying to develop and support that foundation rather than trying to bolster already cracked and crippled pillars. Develop children that are responsible and mature and they'll pass that on to their children. Drop them in the corner or leave them at home and they'll simply repeat our own mistakes.
After you then. If you fancy yourself enough to pass judgement on others who have as much right to live as anyone else, stands to reason you lead us to the enlightened world of planet earth, population 4 billion and decreasing.ks1234 said:
Only thing worse than the ban ravers are misanthropes like you.