Poll: Saints Row 2 Morality (spoilers)

[Sinspiration]

There really isn't a morality issue involved. It's eye for an eye, guy tries to blow you up, you kill him till he's damn well dead.

Morality has a way of stampeding over a more natural kind of primitive, but very fair justice. It gets enforced considering you take justice to not only the gangs but all the way to the top of the Ultor building.

Sure it's not lawful, but the law has a tendency to be horribly in-adaquate for people like the Boss and really I don't mind that at all. If there was ever a kind of criminal you'd want running a gang, it's one like the boss.

 

[XMark]

Heh, I'll say that neither of them really has moral high ground on the other, so it just comes down to a personal grudge.

Besides, someone's gotta think of poor Ramirez that Julius kept bossing around and telling to do ridiculously dangerous things.

 

[busterkeatonrules]

The Boss is a complete psycho, all right - but this is precisely what makes the game what it is[small]*[/small]. Besides, Julius got off lightly. A quick bullet to the head, for treason? Look at what Shogo Akuji of the Ronin got for attacking the Saints during Aisha's funeral!

[small]*A better GTA-experience than GTA:IV.[/small]

 

[Farther than stars]

Anyway, I think Julius was in the right here. After all, Julius was the Saints. The protagonist just took them over.

You *did* play the original right?

The Boss/Playa/insert name here didn't exactly take the Saints over so much as Julius promoted him to right hand man after he more or less singlehandedly wipes out the Vice Kings, Rollers and Los Santos and then gets 'arrested' immediately after doing so. In order to free him the PC is made to cause even more acts of terror by the corrupt police chief (who is also subsequently killed in revenge).

And then Julius blows him and Alderman Hughes up (not that Hughes didn't deserve it), puts them in a coma with severe burns and decapitates the Saints. Which causes Ultor, the triad, the Samedi and brotherhood to move in and bring the city more or less back to square one (or possibly even worse).

Not that the boss is completely innocent, (s)he is an indisputable psycho, but in this case(s)he is probably the one I tend to side with.

TL;DR - BOTH of them are in the wrong, but i side witht eh Boss. Whose real moral event horizon is probably the tit for tat stuff with Maero.

I think you may have misunderstood me when I used the word "take". I didn't mean the PC became the Saints' leader through force or something, just that he became the leader after Julius was gone. The fact that I pair Julius up with the true good the Saints did is more because the gang was his initiative in the first place. And with that I tried to counteract the first argument of the poll's creator.
Also, I think that quite a lot of the people who think that the protagonist was in the right, are just trying to protect his actions regardless of moral dilemna. And I think that in part has to do with the frustration of not being able to make the execution choice yourself. In this sense GTA 4 even outdoes SR2, as it does afford you the opportunity to choose between execution and not in Nico's standoff with his nemesis.
I'm actually hoping really badly that the new Saints Row with its flexible story arcs allows for more such "choices" rather than scripted cutscenes.

 

[Something Amyss]

Morality in Saints Row you say?
Is that some sort of Diversion or Activity?

It's what you get from Forgive-N-Forget.

 

[Redem]

The thing is the Boss is a damn vicious animal, he's not merely happy with destroying his ennemy he want them to suffer as much as possible

 

[Something Amyss]

I think you may have misunderstood me when I used the word "take". I didn't mean the PC became the Saints' leader through force or something, just that he became the leader after Julius was gone. The fact that I pair Julius up with the true good the Saints did is more because the gang was his initiative in the first place. And with that I tried to counteract the first argument of the poll's creator.

Of course, when we take over, the main character takes a defunct gang and rebuilds it entirely. New Lieutenants, new place to live, new goals, new everything. And the Boss "succeeds" there Julius failed, since he couldn't keep the Saints alive in the end. Is this for better or worse? Probably worse, but still.

Also, I think that quite a lot of the people who think that the protagonist was in the right, are just trying to protect his actions regardless of moral dilemna. And I think that in part has to do with the frustration of not being able to make the execution choice yourself. In this sense GTA 4 even outdoes SR2, as it does afford you the opportunity to choose between execution and not in Nico's standoff with his nemesis.

To be fair, whether or not those guys live will have no effect on the next game. Whether or not Julius is still alive will. I would like the choice to not kill him, but Schrodinger's Cat doesn't work that well with a direct sequel, especially if we later find our choice was invalidated by the canon.

I'm actually hoping really badly that the new Saints Row with its flexible story arcs allows for more such "choices" rather than scripted cutscenes.

Being that it's the end of the saga of the Saints (Though hopefully not the last game), it almost certainly will. What was holding back the last game was plans for a trilogy.