Poll: Security Guards V.S. 12-year old punk

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CCountZero

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StBishop said:
CCountZero said:
I don't see the problem. You were concerned, sure it sucks that it was a prank but really that's the best case scenario.

I'll admit I shat myself when I thought a kid who was under my care got knocked out by a football (she is on a football team, and the team were playing around after their game waiting for the other team to finish and the bus to arrive) she got hit in the head, fell down and didn't get up.

I ran over and was shitting myself worried that she'd seriously hurt herself when falling over and she was just messing around.

To be honest I was more relieved than annoyed.

I wouldn't say these are examples of "kids these days" being stupid. It's just kids messing around.
Well, obviously I'm glad she wasn't actually hurt, but I still maintain that personal well-being just isn't an acceptable subject for pranks.

Hell, I'd rather she'd come to my house and filled my mailbox with shaving cream.
That'd just make me slightly annoyed.

But what she did hit much deeper than "Oh, damnit, now I gotta clean that shit off my mail."
And that just isn't acceptable.
 

Flames66

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Aug 22, 2009
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Nope, the kid assaulted the guard and he was well within his rights to subdue him.
 

Flames66

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kinggamecat said:
When the kid kicked the guard that at least here could cause the kid to be charged with assault, and I think what the guards did was acceptable, but using that stick thing to lash his ars maaaay have been a bit too rough, but I think the the kid deserved everything up to that point.
I saw no lashing, I just saw him flick the hitting stick out to make it clear he wasn't fucking around and would defend himself if the other kid attempted to intervene.
 

___________________

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The security guard didn't do anything special. Why is everyone so worked up about this? Violence against kids is wrong but come on...we don't want another generation of pussies who think they're superman and can do whatever they want without consequences either.
 

MrTub

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SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
FelixG said:
SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
Shycte said:
SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
I totally agree with that a parent you never ever hit their child. Again, sweden was the first country in the world to ban corporal beatings in the home. But! These aren't the kids parents, they are security guards doing their job and here's a shocker, you are supposed to obey security guards. If they jump you ask how high. Holding him against the wall simply didn't work as he countinued to resist, so he put him on the ground. As I wrote in the OP, the police investigated and found that they did nothing wrong.
Of course hes going to fucking resist. I bet you would resist if I ran up to you, smashed you into a wall and held you there for 5 minutes.

Yeah, they are security guards - so what? I guess we have different views on this but I dont give a shit if a dude is a security guard or not, if he wants to punk me he can kiss my ass, but hell, maybe blind obedience is the norm today. Its worth mentioning that the people who have these jobs are usually criminals or have the criminal mindset.
Troll harder?

Or maybe read the article thats been posted numerous times about what really happened?

Where did you even get the idea that the security guard ran up and smashed him into the wall and held him there?
Yeah, I probably should read the article. Mind linking me?

Because its not in the OP and sorry, but I will certainly not spend an hour reading every single fucking reply in a thread that is 10 fucking pages long. If you have that much fucking time, I envy you.
Abandon4093 said:
What did he actually do? Because the vid starts with him up against a wall nits hard to take sides when you don't know what happened.
Here is a source in English.


http://www.thelocal.se/36574/20111006/



"The incident took place last summer at the Slussen metro station after guards were called to deal with youngsters who were reportedly riding between the rail cars of the Saltsjöbanan tram line.

When the guards met up with the 12-year-old and his friends, the situation quickly turned heated.

"I climbed between the cars, and then went in again. Then they came up and said, 'follow us, don't resist'," the boy told Sveriges Television (SVT)."
 

RemuValtrez

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I don't think they did anything wrong. People need to learn to respect the law and authority figures. If you're going to do something stupid, expect repercussions.
 

Daveman

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Well speaking as a guy who was once grabbed by the throat, pinned to the floor and dragged out of a nightclub for allegedly punching a bouncer (it was a nightclub... I bumped into him when dancing), I'm not remotely surprised by this. Luckily the kids got it on camera so the guy can get what's coming to him.

I'm not sure what the kid did, but they had him pinned with his face in either a wall or on the floor for a good five minutes for, as far as I could tell, no good reason as in the end they just hauled him off elsewhere. It seemed they were waiting for "back-up" which really seemed unnecessary. Why didn't the guys take him away straight away? Again, no fucking clue. But really, an arm lock when he's already cuffed? Maybe if he was a massive man that might be needed, but that kid is never going to muscle his way out of either one of those.

I have no sympathy for big strong guys picking on little guys as I'm pretty sure we've left the middle ages.
 

Nexus4

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Daveman said:
I have no sympathy for big strong guys picking on little guys as I'm pretty sure we've left the middle ages.
It's called global politics, look it up sometime :p

Anyway, back OT: I don't think that he did anything seriously wrong, that wasn't really much of a throw down to hurt the kid. Whilst he was never going to escape their clutches, I imagine that it would've been quite annoying to the guard to be kicked repeatedly; and if there is one person you don't piss off it is security guards.
 

Insanity72

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I think what he did was completely acceptable, all the people who are saying "He is only 12 years old he doesn't deserve that etc." 12 year olds aren't the same as they were when you were 12, 12 year olds today are acting like 18 year olds from 10 years ago, A lot of the 13 year olds in my school (that started as 12) are drug users / sellers, smokers, carry knives, won't stop swearing at any single person who tells them to please be quiet and generally try to annoy the living hell out of them there after. When i see a little punk like that get his ass handed to him, i think "Good, maybe now he'll realise his actions have consequences".

Oh and the guard didn't hit him with the baton, when he took the kid to the ground he got it out (to open it you flick it forward with force) when the kids friends tried to run over to him.
 

Insanity72

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AndyFromMonday said:
He's 12. Think about that for a moment.
So what if he's 12? the recently turned 13 year olds at my school, drink, smoke, use drugs and carry weapons.

And i go to one of the leading public schools in Queensland

EDIT: sorry for the double post
 

Dastardly

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AndyFromMonday said:
If you actually believe violence is the proper tool for instilling certain values in children then congratulations, you're going to be an unfit parent.
If you're unable to distinguish between "force" and "violence," congratulations -- you're going to be the unfit parent that tells other parents how to parent incorrectly.

The purpose of this use of physical force (not the same as "violence") also wasn't to "instill values." It was to bring a stop to violent behavior. Perhaps people don't realize how much damage can actually be done with repeated kicks to the kneecaps (even by someone who's "only 12").

Use of physical force is one tool for one step in behavior modification. It's not always appropriate, it's not always the best choice. And it rarely, if ever, accomplishes anything on its own. But that doesn't mean it has no purpose.
 

doublenix

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Shycte said:
doublenix said:
Sorry, the kid might have been harassing the guard, but the guard is an adult. There's no way he should used that much force on a kid. If the same thing happened to my child, regardless what happened prior, then I'd be going after the guard and his company with an army of lawyers.
Okay then. What should he have done?
Simple. Turn the kid sideways so he wouldn't be able to press his foot against him, (I can't even consider those "kicks" by any stretch of the imagination). Considering the way that he already had him held, it would have been an easy move.
 

direkiller

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Porygon-2000 said:
Thyunda said:
Also, this website has a total crimes per country chart. Let's see. The top 2 are the United States and United Kingdom, respectively, with Saudi Arabia dropping in at #48

US: 11,877,218
UK: 6,523,706
Saudi Arabia: 84,599


Do you really want me to continue? You made a stupid, ignorant comment, and now I'm going to force you to eat it.


EDIT: Forgot to source the stats: http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri-crime-total-crimes
Well, see, that list is already pretty suspect, seeing as how Japan pops in at #6 (...in the WORLD), and it look as though Australia isn't worth a mention.

Personally, if you give out shit, expect to be given shit in return. Pretty simple, really
you will also be surpassed how often that thing uses Wikipedia as a source and 11 year old data(half the data is from 2000 some is from 2005 very little is 2007)

that looks like a site a middle-schooler setup for a math project or something(just a guess because it uses the term "Fat People" instead of "Obesity".

That poll is far from accurate
 

SpaceBat

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Are people fucking serious? I find some of these comments to be baffling. The guard didn't beat the shit out of the kid, he wasn't on some power trip and he wasn't even treating him like a goddamn adult (If you think an adult would be treated in the same way and you're actually being serious, then you're incredibly delusional).

The kid committed an offense. He knows he did something wrong, because he's fucking twelve. TWELVE! Not seven or eight years old during which he might not yet have learned how to behave. What, is the common person retarded at that age (Don't even THINK about bringing up kids on xbox live, because nearly everyone of any age can be an irritating prick due to anonymity)? I don't know about you guys or your upbringing, but I sure as shit knew how to act towards authority figures and in general at that age.

What the guy does is cuff him and restrain him. The other kids, including the restrained kid, taunt the guards with words like "whore" and "I'm going to kill you". The kids say that the guard can't do that, because the kid isn't fifteen and the guard replies with something incredibly sensible: "Do you think you can act any way you want just because you're twelve?". The restrained kid then kicks the guard, the guards press him against the floor (not violently) and then drag him away. And the guard is to blame?

Sure, a lot of cops abuse their power and I am completely against hitting kids (You can raise a child without beating him. Spanking is possibly acceptable, but just plain hitting is child abuse and anyone who does that or thinks of doing that is unfit to be a parent and/or an idiot), but this is fucking ridiculous. Kids need to be taught matters, they need to be taught that what they say or do have consequences and that they should respect adults. That's ALL that happens here.

What would you want them to do? Just stand there and say "Oh ho ho, silly children. Swearing, committing crimes and disrupting the order is against the rules, but you're kids, so go ahead."? If the clip contained cops beating a child for misbehaving (or hitting him in any way, actually), I would have clicked the no option faster than the speed of light, but nothing of the sort happens here.

And the reason they were holding the kid for a good four minutes or so, was because multiple guys were shouting death threats at them and they waited until one or two other guards could come and help them out. They wanted to be sure nothing bad would happen, such as the kids suddenly starting to attack the guards due to them being outnumbered or whatever. That's it.
Oh and there's one other thing that quite a few people seem to forget for some reason: Using force =/= Using violence.
 

anthony87

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JMeganSnow said:
anthony87 said:
AndyFromMonday said:
anthony87 said:
AndyFromMonday said:
Shycte said:
AndyFromMonday said:
I'm sorry but last time I checked, 12 year old's aren't adults and treating them like adults is fucking stupid and borders on actual abuse.
And what if the kid is violent?... Like in this case?...
He's 12. Think about that for a moment.
Getting taught to not be a prick is best taught at an early age.
If you actually believe violence is the proper tool for instilling certain values in children then congratulations, you're going to be an unfit parent.
And if you believe that the security guard should've just stood there, waggled his finger and said "Ah now, enough of that" then congratulations, your child is probably going to end up being a criminal.
If children are initiating the use of force against others, adults have the right (and responsible adults have the obligation) to use force to stop them. In general it's not necessary to use *violence*, because the adults are bigger, stronger, and more capable. Still, you sow the wind, you reap the whirlwind. Don't like it? Don't be a pissant.
Wait...is that directed towards me? Or the guy I was quoting who has long left this thread because he couldn't come up with any decent counter-arguments beyond "He's twelve"?

I'm pretty sure I wasn't being a pissant although I suppose I'd biased in that regard wouldn't I?
 

anthony87

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Thedek said:
anthony87 said:
AndyFromMonday said:
anthony87 said:
AndyFromMonday said:
Shycte said:
AndyFromMonday said:
I'm sorry but last time I checked, 12 year old's aren't adults and treating them like adults is fucking stupid and borders on actual abuse.
And what if the kid is violent?... Like in this case?...
He's 12. Think about that for a moment.
Getting taught to not be a prick is best taught at an early age.
If you actually believe violence is the proper tool for instilling certain values in children then congratulations, you're going to be an unfit parent.
And if you believe that the security guard should've just stood there, waggled his finger and said "Ah now, enough of that" then congratulations, your child is probably going to end up being a criminal.
Or already is and they are completely obvious to the fact because they never pay attention to their children.
Heh, this made me chuckle.

Well said.

EDIT: Nuts...double post.
 

Toaster Hunter

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Jun 10, 2009
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The kid got what he deserved. You act like an idiot, you will be treated like one, a lesson for any age.
 

MarlonBlazed

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Jun 9, 2011
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The case is over and after seeing the video the judge agreed that the security guard did his job right.

Also, WTF people you call this violence? He was subdued in a less then graceful manner... Maybe the problem here isn't the fact that he did it and maybe the problem is that your a bunch of little girls. Oh no I hope he didn't bruise his skin... Get over it, I've seen kids half his age hurt themselves more then this voluntarily... And he was literally asking for it because he could, its what they do, its what I did and I can guarantee you said offender knew exactly what he was doing, he was just testing his luck to look cool in front of everyone.

I'll bet this kid doesn't even care like you guys do so why are you defending him... Wait, the kids a bastard so why are you defending him in the first place.
 

karloss01

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Shycte said:
in case needed heres the translation of the youtube video description (though it was with google translate)

video description said:
This clip shows a young murder threaten and kicking a security guard because of the mischief that he (the kid) has been committed.

Update: My mother has been crying out in the media and of course, they (Aftonbladet, Expressen, etc.) has taken her party.
She has said that her son is not God's best child, it can then ask themselves is what the kid has done before? When this question was not answered so I assume that the kid is suffering from a character disorder and is generally messy at school where his friends made ​​up of the area's low life.

Then the media as usual is very PK so it would be good to have a backlash. Why not some our support by starting a petition or whatever, that show what the real community feel is correct?

Update2: prosecutor has now seen the movie (the investigation was previously down because he completely followed the police's version) several times and even talked to their colleagues.
According to him, so this does not alter anything, the guards took care of it properly.
from the sound of it, the kid (with his friends it looks) was messing aroud in a subway (looks like it) so the guards probably told him to stop because of safety reasons. kid didn't listen so they restrained him.

kid deserved it, and the mother crying to the media is low.