Poll: Should smoking be made illegal?

[Sikachu]

No. If smoking is banned then drinking has to be banned as well.

Smoking harms you and others around you.

Drinking only harms you.

Both are done by choice, so any third consequential damage (like driving under the influence and running over a guy) would hold that person accountable. Smoking however, doesn't make you guilty for causing other people to breathe in your smoke involuntarily.

These are two different things we're discussing here. One is harmful to the public in general and the other is harmful to the user only. I'd have no problem with smoking being banned from small confined public spaces and keeping alcohol law as it is.

The damage is still done overall. The person who got hit by your car isn't choosing to be hit by your car. You just happened to hit him because you were drunk. There is no way you can say just because one does less then the other, only one should be banned. What applies for deathly causing goes for all.

You're dealing with prevention here, not consequence. Besides, you can still hit a person with your car even if you're not drunk and there's already a CONSEQUENCE for it.

I never said smoke should be completly banned. I said smoking should be kept away from PUBLIC CONFINED spaces. That means you'd still be able to do it on your own home or at a large open space.

Like I said, the damage done by people under alcohol is already well regulated and holds the guy who did it accountable. It's already illegal to drive while drunk, so people who do that are breaking the law. To put it clearer for you: Alcohol is already ILLEGAL if you're driving a car.

So, in this outrageous train of thought, Smoking should be ILLEGAL in places where it can cause damage to thirds. This is under public law, of course, so it wouldn't apply to smoking inside your own house.

You're definitely right. That said, you can drive as drunk as you want on a privately owned racetrack, if the person who owns it consents and informs everyone else using it that this is a 'drinking racetrack'. Would you agree that this should also be the case for smoking pubs?

 

[TheEndlessSleep]

It shouldn't be banned.

People just need to realise that it kills them slowly and painfully and give up on thier own... or never start in the first place for that matter.

My sympathies lie with those people who got into smoking way back in the day when the 'SMOKING KILLS' labels weren't mandatory and indeed smoking was portrayed as cool without ever mentioning the side effects.

However... anybody stupid enough to start up today without accepting the consequences beforehand, what with all the blatant health warnings and scientific proof of long term damage, is a bloody fool and should not be surprised when they find themselves dying of some god awful disease.

So, basically...
- if you have been smoking for decades, good luck giving up
- if you started last week without actively accepting the side affects, have fun coughing and spluterring your life away fool.
- also, if you really must smoke, don't do it near non-smokers and especially not children; go outside, smoke near an open window or something.

 

[MikeFrost]

You're definitely right. That said, you can drive as drunk as you want on a privately owned racetrack, if the person who owns it consents and informs everyone else using it that this is a 'drinking racetrack'. Would you agree that this should also be the case for smoking pubs?

Yes, I agree. That's why there's already a regulation for it around Europe.

In some countries around Europe (including mine), pubs can be "smoking pubs" as long as they meet the right conditions stablished by the law for them. Displaying it is one of those conditions.

In a nutshell, it's all about consent and freedom.

1) People need to be informed.
2) People need to agree with it.
3) You can't cause harm to people who don't agree with it.

 

[HappyPillz]

I always hated the "People have a right to smoke whatever they want" argument. Why should smokers have that right? Upwards of 3000 nonsmokers are killed every year by second hand smoke. And sure, drinking is hazardous to others, but the difference is that drinking causes direct harm that is avoidable. It's hard to avoid inhaling someone elses smoke, when you are standing at a bus stop and the idiot next to you lights up a cigarette.

If people have the right to smoke, I should have the right to go out onto my front lawn with a gun and start firing randomly into the air. It might kill people, but it's on my property with my gun. To me, that's the logic of someone having the right to smoke.

 

[gammazuma]

No. If smoking is banned then drinking has to be banned as well.

EDIT 2: I am not saying that drinking is worse then smoking.

Now is everyone ok? We all good? Your asses don't hurt anymore?

A recent survey just came out that says alcohol is worse for you than cocaine.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101101/ap_on_he_me/eu_med_dangerous_alcohol

 

[Sikachu]

It shouldn't be banned.

People just need to realise that it kills them slowly and painfully and give up on thier own... or never start in the first place for that matter.

My sympathies lie with those people who got into smoking way back in the day when the 'SMOKING KILLS' labels weren't mandatory and indeed smoking was portrayed as cool without ever mentioning the side effects.

However... anybody stupid enough to start up today, what with all the blatant health warnings and scientific proof of long term damage, is a bloody fool and should not be surprised when they find themselves dying of some god awful disease.

So, basically...
- if you have been smoking for decades, good luck giving up
- if you started last week, have fun coughing and spluterring your life away fool.
- also, if you really must smoke, don't do it near non-smokers and especially not children. The rest of the world doesn't want your smoke in them...

How much exercise do you get every day?
How much fruit do you eat per day?
How many hours sleep a night do you get?
Do you drink carbonated beverages?
Do you drink more than two units of alcohol in any given 24 hour period?
How much fish oil do you get in you diet weekly?

I could do this literally all day until we find some good reason to call you a fool. Fortunately for me, I'm not in the business of judging the lifestyle choices of others and insulting them for it for no reason.

On the plus side, you're absolutely right that smokers should not be surprised when they find themselves fucked up with some disease, and depending on your definition of 'dont do it near non-smokers/children' (i.e. if you'd let privately owned places decide their own smoking policies, no smoking inside publicly owned places, and strongly discourage parents from smoking in an unventilated (door/big windows WIDE open) home) then you've earned my respect as a considerate non-smoker.

 

[Sikachu]

I always hated the "People have a right to smoke whatever they want" argument. Why should smokers have that right? Upwards of 3000 nonsmokers are killed every year by second hand smoke. And sure, drinking is hazardous to others, but the difference is that drinking causes direct harm that is avoidable. It's hard to avoid inhaling someone elses smoke, when you are standing at a bus stop and the idiot next to you lights up a cigarette.

If people have the right to smoke, I should have the right to go out onto my front lawn with a gun and start firing randomly into the air. It might kill people, but it's on my property with my gun. To me, that's the logic of someone having the right to smoke.

Upwards of a hell of a lot more people are killed every year by cars. You think we should ban those?

 

[SaKenyi]

I believe that it shouldn't be banned. But, as a smoker, I would come to terms with a restriction on the places where you could smoke. Hell, they're already doing that around here anyway, so I don't really mind. The thing I do mind though, is people continuously whining about smoking.

Not the kind of whining that goes 'Oi, could you move away with that cigarette?' because I'm polite enough to take a few steps from people that can't stand cigarettes (One of my best friends has asthma, I always ensure that I'm not near enough to induce the possibility of a asthma attack on him when I light up a fag) but the people that go 'You should stop smoking, it's bad for you, you know'.

I'm well aware that smoking slowly kills you. I'm well aware that it's bad. I'm not going to stop, so please, do us all a favour and stop remarking on the habit/addiction. I mean, really, once is fine, but people endlessly repeating themselves towards you, even when you make it clear that you are going to continue smoking anyway is somewhat frustrating.

But, back to the point. I myself would be willing to accept a restriction on general places, that including designated rooms/places for possible smokers. as long as it is executed humane instead of herding all the smokers up like cattle. This is entirely my own opinion, though.

 

[TheEndlessSleep]

my snip

your snip

Fair play on all that stuff, feel free to judge me and call me a fool about something else if you wish.

Also, I realise I didn't make this clear before but as long as they accept the consequences it's ok i guess. However, what i'm saying is that the fools are the ones who take up smoking nowadays and then wonder why thy're dying (sorry for not being clear).

Essenitally what I meant by don't do it near non-smokers and children is 'be considerate'; go outside or smoke near an open window etc...

 

[HappyPillz]

I always hated the "People have a right to smoke whatever they want" argument. Why should smokers have that right? Upwards of 3000 nonsmokers are killed every year by second hand smoke. And sure, drinking is hazardous to others, but the difference is that drinking causes direct harm that is avoidable. It's hard to avoid inhaling someone elses smoke, when you are standing at a bus stop and the idiot next to you lights up a cigarette.

If people have the right to smoke, I should have the right to go out onto my front lawn with a gun and start firing randomly into the air. It might kill people, but it's on my property with my gun. To me, that's the logic of someone having the right to smoke.

Upwards of a hell of a lot more people are killed every year by cars. You think we should ban those?

That's just silly. Cars have become an essential part of modern civilization. Society can exist as it is without them. It would have made more sense if you'd continued the alchohol argument.

My point is that cigarettes provide no benefits at all, and kill people that don't use them.

 

[Anarchy In Detroit]

I have a friend who's a radical straight edge kid. We had a discussion on facebook the other day on smoking, and the fact that more people in our community have started smoking. My friend is of the opinion that smoking should be made illegal and classed as a drug, and that the state should step in to essentially protect people from themselves.

Me being a libertarian, I argued that people, knowing the dangers of smoking, should choose for themselves if they want to do it or not. I was immediately stormed by an angry mob of facebookers who showed their dislike with indignified comments.

Eager to get to the bottom of this, I thought I'd ask you guys.

Tl;dr: Should smoking be made illegal?

No. Anything illegal becomes a valuable black market substance. Your friend is straight edge to the point of blind stupidity.

Increased crime? No thanks. People can quit substances when they're actually alive.

 

[Sikachu]

I always hated the "People have a right to smoke whatever they want" argument. Why should smokers have that right? Upwards of 3000 nonsmokers are killed every year by second hand smoke. And sure, drinking is hazardous to others, but the difference is that drinking causes direct harm that is avoidable. It's hard to avoid inhaling someone elses smoke, when you are standing at a bus stop and the idiot next to you lights up a cigarette.

If people have the right to smoke, I should have the right to go out onto my front lawn with a gun and start firing randomly into the air. It might kill people, but it's on my property with my gun. To me, that's the logic of someone having the right to smoke.

Upwards of a hell of a lot more people are killed every year by cars. You think we should ban those?

That's just silly. Cars have become an essential part of modern civilization. Society can exist as it is without them. It would have made more sense if you'd continued the alchohol argument.

My point is that cigarettes provide no benefits at all, and kill people that don't use them.

Your point is that of a self-centred infant. Cigarettes provide shit loads of benefit to those who smoke them, because they like smoking. You just don't happen to appreciate those benefits, and have therefore concluded that there can't be any.

And I really didn't need to continue the alcohol argument, if you bothered to read the thread you'll see that that case has already been made and won convincingly on the side of the smokers. I was just challenging your 'a number of people get killed by it so it should be banned' reasoning.


ESCAPIST MODERATORS

Why is it acceptable for people on these forums to continuously insult other forum users and call them things like "idiots", when you come down hard on that sort of behaviour everywhere else?

 

[shikt]

Of course smoking shouldnt be made illegal, WHY would you make something like smoking illegal? EVER! what are the arguments for it being illegal? from what i can see here, its bad for you... Like other people have said, so is drinking. And since this poll is probably coming from the States, id like to add food to that list. Heart disease is the biggest killer over there, and i dont see anyone banning NOT going to the gym, or NOT eating shit food all the time.

I dont smoke, but i enjoy the occasional cigar, at holidays and special occasions, the culture and quality behind the cigar is something few people truly appreciate. Why can i have my whiskey but not a cigar to go with it? I agree that in most public places, smoking should be banned, indoors, but why cant pubs make a choice? why cant we have smoking bars so I have somewhere to go with my family at xmas to enjoy a whiskey and a damn cigar??? And before you guys start complaining that i'm taking my 'family' to a smoking area, itd just be me, my dad, and a couple of uncles

 

[bad_dog14]

No, that's stupid. It's retarded enough that marijuana is illegal here, now they're picking on smokers as well. If someone outlawed smoking to "protect people from themselves" then they should just outlaw sex, music, movies, games, alcohol and the internet.

 

[Colour Scientist]

I always hated the "People have a right to smoke whatever they want" argument. Why should smokers have that right? Upwards of 3000 nonsmokers are killed every year by second hand smoke. And sure, drinking is hazardous to others, but the difference is that drinking causes direct harm that is avoidable. It's hard to avoid inhaling someone elses smoke, when you are standing at a bus stop and the idiot next to you lights up a cigarette.

If people have the right to smoke, I should have the right to go out onto my front lawn with a gun and start firing randomly into the air. It might kill people, but it's on my property with my gun. To me, that's the logic of someone having the right to smoke.

That's a bit dramatic. The majority of people affected by second-hand smoke is from repeated exposure to it within a confined area.
The amount of smoke emited from a cigarette outside doesn't do any damage especially if you're just near them at a bus stop.
It's perfectly simple to stop inhaling other people's smoke, don't go near them. Oh, and stay away from exhaust fumes, cities, chimneys and kettles because the steam might annoy you too.
It seems to me that it would be easier to avoid cigarette smoke than a drink driver swerving towards you.

 

[Maze1125]

How much exercise do you get every day?
How much fruit do you eat per day?
How many hours sleep a night do you get?
How much fish oil do you get in you diet weekly?

These four are different to smoking as smoking is an active choice to do something that's bad for you, whereas those are simply a failure to do something that is good for you.

Do you drink carbonated beverages?
Do you drink more than two units of alcohol in any given 24 hour period?

These two are more accurate, and I treat them in exactly the same way I treat smoking.
Is someone has a coke now and then, that's just a lifestyle choice.
If someone has 3 or 4 units a day, that's their choice.
Is someone smokes 3 or 4 cigarettes a day, that's just what they want to do.

If, on the other hand, someone drinks nothing but coke or puts themselves in an alcoholic stupor every night or smokes 6 packs a day. Then that's just fucking stupid.

 

[guntotingtomcat]

Alcohol is statistically worse so if they ban smoking they are obliged to ban drinking too.

 

[Sikachu]

How much exercise do you get every day?
How much fruit do you eat per day?
How many hours sleep a night do you get?
How much fish oil do you get in you diet weekly?

These four are different to smoking as smoking is an active choice to do something that's bad for you, whereas those are simply a failure to do something that is good for you.

Do you drink carbonated beverages?
Do you drink more than two units of alcohol in any given 24 hour period?

These two are more accurate, and I treat them in exactly the same way I treat smoking.
Is someone has a coke now and then, that's just a lifestyle choice.
If someone has 3 or 4 units a day, that's their choice.
Is someone smokes 3 or 4 cigarettes a day, that's just what they want to do.

If, on the other hand, someone drinks nothing but coke or puts themselves in an alcoholic stupor every night or smokes 6 packs a day. Then that's just fucking stupid.

You are of course right that there is an important difference to be made between acts and omissions, but I don't think it matters to the point that I was making which is that everyone chooses an extent to which they value their health and life expectancy, and that there will always be people out there who look down on YOU for your perceived health 'failures'.

 

[Spectre4802]

So, make it illegal in public places. That way, no second hand smoke trying to kill me and non-smokers walking down the street or in a mall carpark.
(Of course, this requires policing - so it may never come to anything.)

Increasing tax might persuade some people to quit, too.