Poll: Should the U.S. expect to have a Value Added Tax? EDIT 1

[Trace2010]

i dont get it, this would be a flat tax. exactly what everyone wanted.

I concur. It's about time we simply make the tax system a yearly tithe where EVERYONE will know how much money is being taken, and thus (assuming they are halfway intelligent) be able to anticipate how much they owe in taxes without an attorney.

Plus a flat tax would allow MORE MONEY TO SPEND NOW, whereas if you are withholding taxes from your check it's not really your money to use.

 

[Trace2010]

If the rich don't pay their taxes, take the money by force. That's all I'm gonna say. They should not be allowed to use loopholes to keep their money. They're gonna pay like all of us. I despise people like that.

And if they don't, throw them off a cliff and hand out the dollar bills ya'll.

So when they invest money in private militia with advanced weaponry and butcher all the peasants running around with sticks and rocks, you would have no problem with that, would you?

 

[neolithic]

i dont get it, this would be a flat tax. exactly what everyone wanted.

I concur. It's about time we simply make the tax system a yearly tithe where EVERYONE will know how much money is being taken, and thus (assuming they are halfway intelligent) be able to anticipate how much they owe in taxes without an attorney.

Plus a flat tax would allow MORE MONEY TO SPEND NOW, whereas if you are withholding taxes from your check it's not really your money to use.

Couple things: a flat tax has been shown to favor the rich in the longer run. And this whole VAT stuff, isn't redoing your income tax. It's a flat tax on EVERYTHING you buy. You will still pay income tax, still pay property tax, sales tax, etc, this goes on top of all that.

 

[Bat Vader]

I've always thought income tax was fairest myself, tho it does leave some gaps that would need plugging, such as people sitting on mountains of cash and living off the interest, and the like.

However , call me a communist, but I don't believe anyone needs to earn more than a million a year, so a 90% tax bracket once you hit that would be fine in my book.

Of course then you have to find a way to stop everyone rich just moving their cash to a tax exile country.

It sure ain't easy.

Socialism or Communism would work best in my opinion. Bad thing is people are greedy and a Socialism or Communism has the best interest of the citizens, but there are sure to be greedy politicians though.

I think we should tax big businesses 80% of what they make.

 

[Zac_Dai]

VAT is a nice idea if it wasn't for the fact income tax exists as well.

Also I hope you Americans don't a get a VAT system as the government needs to learn fucking manage its money rather then fuck over its citizens more.

 

[Trace2010]

i dont get it, this would be a flat tax. exactly what everyone wanted.

I concur. It's about time we simply make the tax system a yearly tithe where EVERYONE will know how much money is being taken, and thus (assuming they are halfway intelligent) be able to anticipate how much they owe in taxes without an attorney.

Plus a flat tax would allow MORE MONEY TO SPEND NOW, whereas if you are withholding taxes from your check it's not really your money to use.

Couple things: a flat tax has been shown to favor the rich in the longer run. And this whole VAT stuff, isn't redoing your income tax. It's a flat tax on EVERYTHING you buy. You will still pay income tax, still pay property tax, sales tax, etc, this goes on top of all that.

I don't see where favoring the rich is necessarily a bad thing: THEY'RE THE ONES PAYING THE BULK OF THE TAXES. Problem is, the current tax system favors the rich while taking more and more money from them each passing year (and underneath the table the rich know that 1/3 to one-half of the current population of the U.S. DOESN'T PAY A CENT IN TOTAL INCOME TAX).

 

[Trace2010]

I've always thought income tax was fairest myself, tho it does leave some gaps that would need plugging, such as people sitting on mountains of cash and living off the interest, and the like.

However , call me a communist, but I don't believe anyone needs to earn more than a million a year, so a 90% tax bracket once you hit that would be fine in my book.

Of course then you have to find a way to stop everyone rich just moving their cash to a tax exile country.

It sure ain't easy.

Socialism or Communism would work best in my opinion. Bad thing is people are greedy and a Socialism or Communism has the best interest of the citizens, but there are sure to be greedy politicians though.

I think we should tax big businesses 80% of what they make.

Then what incentive do they have to make a superior product or dabble in unionized labor?

 

[Trace2010]

If the rich don't pay their taxes, take the money by force. That's all I'm gonna say. They should not be allowed to use loopholes to keep their money. They're gonna pay like all of us. I despise people like that.

And if they don't, throw them off a cliff and hand out the dollar bills ya'll.

ACTUALLY I AM FOR THE DESTRUCTION OF THE NEO-WHITE SUPREMACIST...
Go right ahead, let's start with Connecticut, Massachusettes, Maryland, New Hampshire, Vermont, and Delaware...throw Maine in for good measure...start with the Kennedy's, the Kerry's...
My problem is, the RICH WHITE NORTHEAST teaches all other races to hate PEOPLE LIKE ME white, affluent middle class people who are no higher on the totem pole than anyone else in the middle class of a different ethnicity.

 

[Pendragon9]

If the rich don't pay their taxes, take the money by force. That's all I'm gonna say. They should not be allowed to use loopholes to keep their money. They're gonna pay like all of us. I despise people like that.

And if they don't, throw them off a cliff and hand out the dollar bills ya'll.

So when they invest money in private militia with advanced weaponry and butcher all the peasants running around with sticks and rocks, you would have no problem with that, would you?

What are you talking about?

 

[faselei]

I don't understand, I thought American's had VAT already? I haven't been there in under a decade, but I could have sworn you have.

America add VAT after a purchase I believe. They'll advertise a game as 60 dollars before VAT. When in the UK VAT is applied to the RRP and not added later.

I'm more than likely wrong though. I haven't lived in the US for 10 years.

We don't have VAT in the form that is being discussed. Sales tax is not done on a national scale. It's determined on a state/county/city level. This is a straight % tax on top of all other allready in place taxes that goes straight to the feredal government. And I've heard whispers of numbers as high as 20-25% so....that 60 dollar game, just became 75 dollars....plus all applicable state/local sales taxes....so...80+ bucks...

Obviously, it's all mainly hearsay, including what I just said. But that's the basic idea of it. It's come up a few times in our history, but never got very far. However, from all I've read, if it had a chance to get passed, our current government would be the most able to pass it.

In addition, from what little there is to go on, this would apply to EVERYTHING, and I mean... EVERYTHING, food, services, goods, and it would apply to EVERY STEP OF PRODUCTION.

Scary, eh?

That would be silly. Most countries with VAT (or TVA or whatever they call it) do not apply it to things like college fees (as worried about further up), non luxury food items, energy, kids clothing and so on.

Its 20% in France and 15% in the UK and is only added at the point of sale. Companies do not pay VAT when buying equipment for example, and it is not charged on second hand goods. It is simply a consumer tax.

 

[Ancientgamer]

How about instead of creating some rediculous new sales tax, we actually tax the income of the rich assholes who own the majority of the wealth. You know, the ones who've been in bed with Phil Grahm and just about everyone else in our government as well for years. The same pricks who got us into this current economic crisis because of their own greed, because even though they owned more than anyone could ever need, they still didn't feel that they had enough. Yeah, I say we tax them, and unlike Bush did, we don't let them find little loopholes to worm their ways out of it.

Are you aware of a thing called tax brackets? As is, the amount you have to pay increases near exponentially the richer you get. This is already happening, it's been happening for a very long time, even under bush. Don't pay taxes? What are you on? By the time you start talking in millions, you're already paying almost half your income to the government. Now you want to punish them even more, just for being successful? What are you trying to get from wanting to hurt them so badly, is this just some kind of jealousy thing? "I don't have this much, so nobody should have this much ;_; "

Boo-freaking-hoo.

Well, we're supposed to have a bracket system, but the fact is that we don't. The people who are supposed to be paying more than anyone else, find loopholes to get out of paying. Take for instance Boone Pickens. Some of you may have seen his Pickens Plan commericals, some of you may have seen him on Real Time with Bill Maher getting interviewed, the point is, he's a very very rich man. Mr. Pickens is a figure who is particularly relevant to my life, because I live in Stillwater Oklahoma, and attend Oklahoma State University. OSU loves Boone Pickens so much that we named our football stadium after him because of a massive donation he gave us, here's the catch though, under the tables, we gave it all right back. People like Pickens find other rich people (like the president of OSU) who are willing to work with them, hand off massive sums of money in the form of a donation, making it tax exempt, and then find loopholes in the system to get it back. This is a pretty standard practice. And, even forgetting the brackets and tax evasion, consider that the corporations that make more money than any of these rich pricks, have the lowest tax rates of all. So, before you buy the bullshit that these rich assholes are feeding you, maybe you should realize it for what it is, these people who already have more than anyone could ever need, still don't feel like they have enough.

Okay, even taking you at face value. Boone Pickens used a legal loophole. Big freaking deal. Prove to me everyone making 100K+ is cheating the system, then maybe I'll consider what you're saying. The tax brackets work, and you claiming to know of one or two cases of tax evasion doesn't mean a single thing. The burden of proof is absolutely on your side here.

And all I'm getting from you is the same entitlement complex I hear from most people demanding higher taxes, "rich" is not indicative of "asshole". If you're so intent on shoving everyone who's better off than you down to your level. Go find some communist state to live in. In our (quasi) capitalist system you're entitled to your own money. If someone has more of it than you, good for them. It doesn't make them evil.

I'll quote the footnotes

claiming to know of one or two cases of tax evasion doesn't mean a single thing. The burden of proof is absolutely on your side here.

 

[shadowstriker86]

correct me if im wrong, but isnt a crapload of taxation the reason why the revolution started?

 

[Leorex]

I have no problem with the rich keeping what they worked for. However, I don't appreciate it when they try to avoid taxes or anything similar. The government needs to establish a group that focus purley on investigating this stuff. In addition, they need to fix there own damn budget problems before forcing us to pay more. How much will the public have to pay for government bailouts of companies that are corrupt?

this, im a rich person, but i pay my taxes. i pay upwords of 10,000 a year not including holdings. yah i dont like it. but i do it.

 

[asinann]

EDIT 1: Apparently, some people are in favor of taxing the rich more. I don't like the idea myself.

Since they don't pay nearly what I do in taxes anyway, I think they need to pay some.

I lose some 35% of my income to various taxes.
My dad clears 200k a year and pays LESS than what I do a year total and as a percentage (last year me:$1200 him: $2700 REFUND.)

The rich just donate money to a charity (getting up to $10 per dollar donated in write offs) and don't have to pay squat.

Social security and medicare taxes both stop at around 110k.
It's not so much that the rich need to be taxes MORE, it's that they need to actually PAY taxes.

i dont get it, this would be a flat tax. exactly what everyone wanted.

This isn't a flat tax, it would tax the poor a larger portion of their income than it would the rich. A flat tax would tax the same percentage off of everyone.

 

[asinann]

this, im a rich person, but i pay my taxes. i pay upwords of 10,000 a year not including holdings. yah i dont like it. but i do it.

Didn't you say you and your parents weren't rich in your first post?
And the US has some of the lowest taxes in the western world, whine to people about your 30% to people that pay 75-80 and see how they laugh at you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_the_Netherlands
"The Netherlands has a partly progressive tax rate. In the past the highest income bracket in the Netherlands was 72%, but in 1990 the highest income bracket was changed to 60%"

just wish I could find a site with the tax rates added together other than this one.

sorry bout the double.

 

[Leorex]

this, im a rich person, but i pay my taxes. i pay upwords of 10,000 a year not including holdings. yah i dont like it. but i do it.

Didn't you say you and your parents weren't rich in your first post?
And the US has some of the lowest taxes in the western world, whine to people about your 30% to people that pay 75-80 and see how they laugh at you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_the_Netherlands
"The Netherlands has a partly progressive tax rate. In the past the highest income bracket in the Netherlands was 72%, but in 1990 the highest income bracket was changed to 60%"

just wish I could find a site with the tax rates added together other than this one.

sorry bout the double.

i never said my parents weren't rich. and i have no problem paying my taxes. my problem is everyone thinking that becase im rich i dont pay my taxes. or have it easer.

 

[hypothetical fact]

EDIT 1: Apparently, some people are in favor of taxing the rich more. I don't like the idea myself.

Since they don't pay nearly what I do in taxes anyway, I think they need to pay some.

I lose some 35% of my income to various taxes.
My dad clears 200k a year and pays LESS than what I do a year total and as a percentage (last year me:$1200 him: $2700 REFUND.)

The rich just donate money to a charity (getting up to $10 per dollar donated in write offs) and don't have to pay squat.

Social security and medicare taxes both stop at around 110k.
It's not so much that the rich need to be taxes MORE, it's that they need to actually PAY taxes.

i dont get it, this would be a flat tax. exactly what everyone wanted.

This isn't a flat tax, it would tax the poor a larger portion of their income than it would the rich. A flat tax would tax the same percentage off of everyone.

It may take the same percentage but it would take a different portion.
E.G I make $1,000,000,000 per year and get taxed 10%. I now make $900,000,000 per year, big woop I can still buy whatever I want and spoil my kids rotten.
Alternatively I make $10,000 and get taxed 10%. I now make $9,000 per year and that is alot of stuff I can no longer afford.

 

[manaman]

i dont get it, this would be a flat tax. exactly what everyone wanted.

I concur. It's about time we simply make the tax system a yearly tithe where EVERYONE will know how much money is being taken, and thus (assuming they are halfway intelligent) be able to anticipate how much they owe in taxes without an attorney.

Plus a flat tax would allow MORE MONEY TO SPEND NOW, whereas if you are withholding taxes from your check it's not really your money to use.

Couple things: a flat tax has been shown to favor the rich in the longer run. And this whole VAT stuff, isn't redoing your income tax. It's a flat tax on EVERYTHING you buy. You will still pay income tax, still pay property tax, sales tax, etc, this goes on top of all that.

I pay my taxes, so if they want to shift the tax around in favor of a less complex system where everyone pays based on their consumption. Only if the tax was used to replace some of the more regressive tax structures around, and not to add more tax onto what already exists.

There are some advantages to a VAT, not being able to avoid taxes in good, and it is not regressive. It actually taxes luxury items more then necessities.

NO NEW TAXES!!!! But I am okay with a few old ones being replaced.

I am also okay with income taxes, but not with property taxes, makes me fell like I am just borrowing the land from the goverment and have to pay them for its use.