To show the difference in writing, the people that were involved with DS9 went on to make Battlestar Galactica. The people that wrote Voyager went on to make Enterprise...
Poll: Star Trek (Voyager mostly)
- Thread starter Sixcess
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Voyager has an entire episode that is anti-canon. So much so that all the writers don't consider it as part of the canon at all. It is never mentioned again for the rest of the series, even though it should technically have helped them. Breaking the warp 10 barrier. That's all I'm going to say.
The best episode in TNG is after Picard gets tortured by the alien for days at a time, and at the very end when asked how many lights he saw (even though he saw four); Picard yells back "THERE ARE FOUR LIGHTS". Just refused to be broken, even when he was. That sir, is why I voted for Picard!El Danny said:
While I admit that Brooks could be uneven at times, I have to disagree that he couldn't convey anger. When he was pissed, or when he wanted to sound threatening, then holy shit, stay away from his rage.Blablahb said:
That is hilarious. Is it wrong that it took me a minute or two to realise that wasn't the regular Janeway? Being a malevolent bloodthirsty warmonger really suits her.Sneezeguard said:
I think it's like Doctor Who fans with the question of 'favourite Doctor' - there is no right or wrong answer and they all have their fans. Besides, in the poll Janeway currently has more votes than Kirk... which I admit surprised me.Eamar said:
But then I grew up with the reruns of TOS, before TNG ever aired, so Kirk is the captain for me, just as the constitution class is the real Enterprise. But I don't take it as a slight when people disagree. That would be... illogical.
Different era, different style. The campiness and larger than life performances of TOS was something I really missed when TNG aired - Picard seemed so wishy washy after Kirk, and the show did take quite a while to find its own voice. I recall reading that a lot of the early TNG drew on repurposed material for the 'phase 2' revival they'd planned before the movies came along, so you had 80s/90s actors handling 70s scripts. God, Season 1 was bad.El Danny said:
It's as well they did move on though. I can't imagine Picard getting into punch ups with monsters and teaching alien space babes about "this... thing... we call... love."
Picard is the best captain, but Voyager was the best show (IMO). Even if the end was just as badly done as ME3's was.
The idea, however, that Jeri Ryan would have suited the roll of Janeway is pretty much nonsense. Jeri Ryan doesn't really command authority physically; she's very sleek and slender, feminine and was unashamedly put in Voyager to be eye candy (though her character was very, very good). She's great as a variation on the femme fatale but not as The Captain. By casting her as the captain you would have made the captain character into some weak "woman trying her best but needing a man to help her" character, a novice damsel in distress.
Mulgrew, on the other hand, has a chin like a rock face and is quite "Tough" looking/sounding. I mean sure she looks like an idiot when she's fighting and don't even get me STARTED on the orgasm-noise she makes when she's in pain/shocked/struggling but she looks and sounds the part.
All in all, however, I'm sure we can all agree that The Doctor was one of the best characters in Star Trek period.
The idea, however, that Jeri Ryan would have suited the roll of Janeway is pretty much nonsense. Jeri Ryan doesn't really command authority physically; she's very sleek and slender, feminine and was unashamedly put in Voyager to be eye candy (though her character was very, very good). She's great as a variation on the femme fatale but not as The Captain. By casting her as the captain you would have made the captain character into some weak "woman trying her best but needing a man to help her" character, a novice damsel in distress.
Mulgrew, on the other hand, has a chin like a rock face and is quite "Tough" looking/sounding. I mean sure she looks like an idiot when she's fighting and don't even get me STARTED on the orgasm-noise she makes when she's in pain/shocked/struggling but she looks and sounds the part.
All in all, however, I'm sure we can all agree that The Doctor was one of the best characters in Star Trek period.
Evil Janeway is the best Janeway she's so entertaining to watch and you gotta love the campness and how over the top it is with the black leather gloves.Sixcess said:
Shame it was all made up
Didn't Sisko get promoted to Captain?Vuliev said:
Janeway was one a really great character and Muldew pulled it off really well, I thought. A good blend of feminity and grit.
I'm pretty sure he's just referring to Jeri Ryan as an actress and not implying that Seven should have been the captain.
Oh right...my poll choice.
Patrick Stewart holds a special place in my heart, and he represents the ethical soul of Starfleet (at least until the TNG movies where he goes way out of character).
And Kirk is the soul of exploration; he goes on adventures. He kicks ass. He takes action.
But my choice is...Sisko.
Yes. Sisko. He came across as a man of planning, diplomacy and action. But distant and troubled. Very rarely does Sisko's troubles come to the surface.
He's not so lofty/enlightened as Picard that I find him unbelievably preachy, but not so campy and shirt-ripping as Kirk as to find him fragmented.
(though Star Trek 2 Kirk blows every other Trek performance out of the water. This is how you ACT, Mr. Shatner. See what you're capable of when you don't let your ego run all over the set?)
Sisko's position of command is uniquely difficult, yet, more believable than the other Starfleet brass I've seen.
The worst part of his story arcs ironically, are his encounters with The Prophets. I know that supernatural encounters aren't exactly new to the series, but the whole overarching plot felt contrived, forced, and like it didn't belong in Star Trek.
As for the other Captains...
Archer is an asshole commanding a ship full of assholes. I'm not going into any more detail than that, lest I am forced to actually remember more of Enterprise.
Janeway..in addition to what I've already said about her. Well, how do I put it...
She was a neckless stiff who got turned into a lizard-thing, knocked up by a junior officer, and laid eggs at one point.
(I am dead serious)
Patrick Stewart holds a special place in my heart, and he represents the ethical soul of Starfleet (at least until the TNG movies where he goes way out of character).
And Kirk is the soul of exploration; he goes on adventures. He kicks ass. He takes action.
But my choice is...Sisko.
Yes. Sisko. He came across as a man of planning, diplomacy and action. But distant and troubled. Very rarely does Sisko's troubles come to the surface.
He's not so lofty/enlightened as Picard that I find him unbelievably preachy, but not so campy and shirt-ripping as Kirk as to find him fragmented.
(though Star Trek 2 Kirk blows every other Trek performance out of the water. This is how you ACT, Mr. Shatner. See what you're capable of when you don't let your ego run all over the set?)
Sisko's position of command is uniquely difficult, yet, more believable than the other Starfleet brass I've seen.
The worst part of his story arcs ironically, are his encounters with The Prophets. I know that supernatural encounters aren't exactly new to the series, but the whole overarching plot felt contrived, forced, and like it didn't belong in Star Trek.
As for the other Captains...
Archer is an asshole commanding a ship full of assholes. I'm not going into any more detail than that, lest I am forced to actually remember more of Enterprise.
Janeway..in addition to what I've already said about her. Well, how do I put it...
She was a neckless stiff who got turned into a lizard-thing, knocked up by a junior officer, and laid eggs at one point.
(I am dead serious)
Whats with all the hate for Enterprise?! I think scott bakula is a great actor and the show had a pretty good plot (time travel ftw)
I always thought Janeway's catchphrase was "Do it," which seemed pretty weak compared to Picard's "Make it so."Sixcess said:
That aside, I still think that Kirk (Shatner) is the best captain. Picard is great, don't get me wrong, but he seemed more suited to be an admiral than a captain.
HOW DARE YOU PROFANE FALSE CANON!Vuliev said:
At first, Sisko was merely a commander. He later got promoted to captain, as enshrined in episode 26, season 3, "The Adversary".
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/The_Adversary_(episode)
Yeah, I'm just that nerdy.
That happened, and we all let it happen.Soviet Heavy said:
I agree completely, shame he kept passing up the promotion. But who wouldn't want to stay on the flagship? That was Riker's whole bit too. In fact... why the hell did everyone refuse any opportunity to leave? Except for that one Marty Sue that took every opportunity...Dudeman325 said:
I love how half of this thread is people arguing over the poll and half is actually arguing over the content of the original post. Like some before me, I'll do both at once.
I've always loved Picard (and voted for him), but I like Janeway. Yes, she was somewhat robotic at times (though when you're stood next to Tuvok and Seven of Nine, it's kinda hard to notice), but more than any other captain I've seen (bearing in mind I never watched the newest series), she screws up. And she screws up badly. She lets her emotions get the better of her, makes terrible snap decisions, is either too trusting or not trusting enough, and generally does an EXCELLENT job of portraying exactly how fallible that much stress would put on a person.
Voyager was the first Trek to feel like it was a team effort; Janeway relied on the whole crew (or at least the whole bridge crew) in almost every situation, in a way that you would, again, have to do trapped that far from home. Picard was so fucking badass that during some episodes of TNG I couldn't help thinking he didn't really need a crew other than to fly the damn ship. It made him awesome, but it also elevates him. Janeway felt very humanly flawed. Was she the best leader? Hell, no. But she got them home, and in mostly one piece.
Edit: I didn't really mention any of the other captains above, so in brief. Kirk's a prick, Sisko is awesome but I just couldn't get into DS9 the way I did TNG and Voyager. Nothing on him, but the setting didn't win me over.
P.S. Captcha Complex Number
4+2i
I've always loved Picard (and voted for him), but I like Janeway. Yes, she was somewhat robotic at times (though when you're stood next to Tuvok and Seven of Nine, it's kinda hard to notice), but more than any other captain I've seen (bearing in mind I never watched the newest series), she screws up. And she screws up badly. She lets her emotions get the better of her, makes terrible snap decisions, is either too trusting or not trusting enough, and generally does an EXCELLENT job of portraying exactly how fallible that much stress would put on a person.
Voyager was the first Trek to feel like it was a team effort; Janeway relied on the whole crew (or at least the whole bridge crew) in almost every situation, in a way that you would, again, have to do trapped that far from home. Picard was so fucking badass that during some episodes of TNG I couldn't help thinking he didn't really need a crew other than to fly the damn ship. It made him awesome, but it also elevates him. Janeway felt very humanly flawed. Was she the best leader? Hell, no. But she got them home, and in mostly one piece.
Edit: I didn't really mention any of the other captains above, so in brief. Kirk's a prick, Sisko is awesome but I just couldn't get into DS9 the way I did TNG and Voyager. Nothing on him, but the setting didn't win me over.
P.S. Captcha Complex Number
4+2i
Voyager was the series that was on when i was growing up and for me is the best series, just only edged out by TNG. I even prefer the design of the Intrepid class compared to the others.
On top of all that, the best character has to be Riker. You just can't argue with the beard of awesome. Rikers beard is so awesome that all my Star Trek Online characters have that beard, even the female characters
On top of all that, the best character has to be Riker. You just can't argue with the beard of awesome. Rikers beard is so awesome that all my Star Trek Online characters have that beard, even the female characters
Janeway was a decent captain. HOWEVER. in my opinion, the writing was really going downhill all throughout Star Trek: Voyager (it got better with the addition of seven of nine, but eventually even she started having massive plot holes between what she was capable of and what she chose to do.) not to say it was Shakespeare before that, but the actions of the captain and the crew in voyager had some truly appalling moments where all you could do was yell at the screen: ARE YOU FCKING SERIOUS??! WHY?? WHY?! (other star trek series also had that, but imo Next Generation was as good as it got.)
Star Trek Enterprise was...an abomination. It would have been fine as a stand alone science fiction series, but The writers misinterpreted and fucked up the most simple to understand species of star trek: The Vulcans. (aside from that it was pretty decent, but fucking up the ENTIRE VULCAN SPECIES is unforgivable)
What they did was this: look at vulcans. Look at Romulans. Get them confused. Go "OOOOH!! I understand!! VULCANS ARE SLIGHTLY LESS VIOLENT ROMULANS! HURR DERRR. They aren't logical: They have little to no logic in their actions, 'poorly' mask emotion with every sentence, and They're emotional and bigoted but CALL it logic and act all uppity and superior with no basis for it. All bases covered here" *Snort more cocaine*.
When 'I' am more rational and logical than a vulcan commander, something is seriously fucking wrong.
Deep space 9 was O.K. I disliked it through the first season, but it got much much better. I didn't like the religious overtones though, and in my opinion it was overall less interesting than the star trek series that focused on a ship rather than a space station.
Kirk was awesome, but his best work was the star trek movies. I loved Wrath of Kahn in particular. The TV show was sort of...cheesy. in a lot of ways.
Picard forever as the best captain.
EDIT: just so you know, I love all the series with the exception of Enterprise. All are good. all are worth watching.
Star Trek Enterprise was...an abomination. It would have been fine as a stand alone science fiction series, but The writers misinterpreted and fucked up the most simple to understand species of star trek: The Vulcans. (aside from that it was pretty decent, but fucking up the ENTIRE VULCAN SPECIES is unforgivable)
What they did was this: look at vulcans. Look at Romulans. Get them confused. Go "OOOOH!! I understand!! VULCANS ARE SLIGHTLY LESS VIOLENT ROMULANS! HURR DERRR. They aren't logical: They have little to no logic in their actions, 'poorly' mask emotion with every sentence, and They're emotional and bigoted but CALL it logic and act all uppity and superior with no basis for it. All bases covered here" *Snort more cocaine*.
When 'I' am more rational and logical than a vulcan commander, something is seriously fucking wrong.
Deep space 9 was O.K. I disliked it through the first season, but it got much much better. I didn't like the religious overtones though, and in my opinion it was overall less interesting than the star trek series that focused on a ship rather than a space station.
Kirk was awesome, but his best work was the star trek movies. I loved Wrath of Kahn in particular. The TV show was sort of...cheesy. in a lot of ways.
Picard forever as the best captain.
EDIT: just so you know, I love all the series with the exception of Enterprise. All are good. all are worth watching.