Poll: Superbowl 2013: Do You Care And Why?

[MPerce]

My option wasn't in the vote. I like watching football, so I watched it.

 

[Jedi-Hunter4]

Not enough to stay up until 3 in the morning to watch a rugby game with an overinflated budget and body armour mind /obligatory UK comment on how American Football is just nancy boy's rugby

Not really, when in rugby do you charge at each other head to head? if you pulled some of the moves that go down in the NFL in rugby people would be killed left, right and center.

An I'm English, grew up playing rugby, got into american football while I was at uni and played for the uni team. Anybody who thinks the Armour takes away from the physical aspect of it has never played the game, it's just as physical because they throw themselves into it far more. Plus the way you tackle in rugby is to grab your opponent, which most of the time your not allowed to do in AF you have to knock them down. Plus in rugby you can only properly get physical with the ball carrier.

This site is packed full of eurokiddies so I have no doubt the last option will win.

More of a following in Europe than you would expect, was at the international series in London this year, literally 10's of thousands of fans out for it.

Back to the topic at hand I'm a Cowboys fan sop we were out a while ago, wanted the ravens to win to see Ray Lewis go out on a high, plus thought they would win so I had money riding on it!

Crazy amount of hate for other peoples sports on here...odd amount.... I'm a Motorcycle & Motorsport engineer so Motorsports are my bread and butter, so in that I follow MotoGP, WSBK, BSB & F1 + the TT when its on. But I also follow Football (Portsmouth) (as in the one with the round ball), NFL (Cowboys), NHL (Canucks) and very occasionally cricket (Hampshire). Embrace the sports!

EDIT:

Sorry just had to bring this up quickly

they're not really that confusing (nothing like as confusing as football's offside rule, anyway).

Not a dig at you but I've always wondered who the HELL are all these people who find the offside rule hard?!?!?! I know I'm English but growing up in pompey heartland I knew the offside rule from about 7 or 8 maybe younger.

 

[Anget Colslaw]

So far, according to the thread, if you don't like football you're either a nerd or a eurokiddy. That's just classy. I think I'll claim being a eurokiddy despite being American.

 

[CommanderL]

Do not care for handegg at all Nor any sport I dont mind me some tennis which is weird as My caring for all sports is non exsistant

 

[Baron von Blitztank]

I'm in the UK so naturally my feelings are a resounding "meh". Much is my feelings toward any other sport really.

 

[Lionsfan]

My profession is Sports Journalist. I write for the largest sports website in the Northwest US. Yes I'm watching, no I don't care who wins. I don't want to see Ray Lewis get a win in his goodbye, but I despise Randy Moss of the 49ers.

It was a good game, Niners made it close towards the end.

How can you despise Randy Moss? Everyone he's played with has said essentially nothing but good things about him, and this years 49er's team has praised him for being a good role model and things of that nature

Everyone he's played with? He threw both Daunte Culpepper and his QBs in Oakland under the bus when things weren't going well. He spent the week before the Super Bowl claiming he was the greatest WR of all time, while playing for San Francisco. He has always shown a prima-donna arrogance alongside his contemporaries (Chad Johnson, Terrell Owens) considering how little a WR really has an impact on an offense. That's why.

Regarding the QB's, how is it throwing your QB under the bus when they suck? Culpepper was made better by Moss, and in his time in Oakland he was playing with Kerry Collins in '05, and Andrew Walker/Aaron Brooks in '06, which could be one of the worst QB tandem's of all time.

You say that WR's have very little impact on the offense, so then by logic, he was right to criticize his QB's and their play when things went south, after all, they have more impact on the offense, so it's more their fault that the teams were horrible.

Next, comparing him to Chad Johnson and T.O is just silly. He hasn't actively wrecked lockerrooms like those two have, and his off the field incidents are childs play.

Finally, you could make the argument that Moss is the GOAT when it comes to WR's, it's not as ridiculous as you make it out to be

 

[EscapeGoat_v1legacy]

Yeah, I didn't watch the Superbowl. Honestly, I'm not a fan of American football (hockey's my American sport of choice) and it also seems like such hard work to watch it over here in England. I did have to put up with a running commentary of it from one of my friends though, as payback for my Skype commentary of the Sabres' first game after the lockout ended.

Anyway, my time's been taken up now with watching the Six Nations!

 

[ElectroJosh]

An I'm English, grew up playing rugby, got into american football while I was at uni and played for the uni team. Anybody who thinks the Armour takes away from the physical aspect of it has never played the game, it's just as physical because they throw themselves into it far more. Plus the way you tackle in rugby is to grab your opponent, which most of the time your not allowed to do in AF you have to knock them down. Plus in rugby you can only properly get physical with the ball carrier.

As a massive rugby nut I have to agree. People who think that American Football is for wimps are nuts. If anything the padding makes it more dangerous because creates a false sense of security. Add to that the fact that the tackling in each sport works differently: American Football tackles end that particular play while in Rugby play continues and the tackling team can attempt to steal the ball back making bit hits often counter-productive.

 

[BrotherRool]

Yeah I can't care about American football. To be fair the actual sport is tense, but it's 10% people playing stuff and 90% people standing around. There was a stat that during the 3 hour superbowl, you get to see 11 minutes actual play. It's tense, but Rugby's tense and they spend most of their time playing.

And I'm just so used to sports that flow, seeing only one pass per move seems ludicrous to me. Isn't it better to see fast changing play between player and player and player.

And finally, what the ef is a superbowl? One country? Snooker draws from a bigger pool than that. At least the six nations has six nations. The football world cup draws from almost every country in the entire world. Heck the Premiership by itself draws some of the best plays from hundreds of countries, many of which devote their entire national sporting effort to football. American Football just seems a little small by comparison. And a little insular, it's name shows the restriction.

I could believe it's fun to watch, if I was American it would feel like a thing. But more people on Facebook were talking about how Ireland beat Wales and what the weekly football scores were than this.

 

[AbstractJuggler]

I tried. I honestly did. I watched the first few downs. I saw a touchdown happen even though no touching down takes place. I counted the 8 seconds of play compared to the minute-long breaks inbetween. But I find absolutely no enjoyment in watching a 5 hour event where only around 12 minutes of actual sport is played, and where players are only moving for about 6 minutes each, in periods of no more than 15 seconds with occasional time-outs to make sure they don't get too tired.
It's the sport that's supposed to be exciting, guys; not the half-time shows.

 

[Lionsfan]

My profession is Sports Journalist. I write for the largest sports website in the Northwest US. Yes I'm watching, no I don't care who wins. I don't want to see Ray Lewis get a win in his goodbye, but I despise Randy Moss of the 49ers.

It was a good game, Niners made it close towards the end.

How can you despise Randy Moss? Everyone he's played with has said essentially nothing but good things about him, and this years 49er's team has praised him for being a good role model and things of that nature

Everyone he's played with? He threw both Daunte Culpepper and his QBs in Oakland under the bus when things weren't going well. He spent the week before the Super Bowl claiming he was the greatest WR of all time, while playing for San Francisco. He has always shown a prima-donna arrogance alongside his contemporaries (Chad Johnson, Terrell Owens) considering how little a WR really has an impact on an offense. That's why.

Regarding the QB's, how is it throwing your QB under the bus when they suck? Culpepper was made better by Moss, and in his time in Oakland he was playing with Kerry Collins in '05, and Andrew Walker/Aaron Brooks in '06, which could be one of the worst QB tandem's of all time.

You say that WR's have very little impact on the offense, so then by logic, he was right to criticize his QB's and their play when things went south, after all, they have more impact on the offense, so it's more their fault that the teams were horrible.

Next, comparing him to Chad Johnson and T.O is just silly. He hasn't actively wrecked lockerrooms like those two have, and his off the field incidents are childs play.

Finally, you could make the argument that Moss is the GOAT when it comes to WR's, it's not as ridiculous as you make it out to be

1) Because throwing tantrums when things aren't going well isn't the sign of a professional, it's the sign of a child. Larry Fitzgerald put up with possibly THE WORST QB Tandem this year with John Skelton, Ryan Lindley, and Kevin Kolb. Not a word of complaint, and certainly no threats to walk out on the team, or the need to bench him for behavior like Art Shell had to to Moss in 2006. You don't complain, you work with your team to get better. Fitzgerald does this, Isaac Bruce did it with Kurt Warner when he replaced Trent Green, Steve Smith did it with Jake Delhomme and Cam Newton.

2) Not as many incidents of behavior? You mean like

A) Running into a street officer with his car?

B) Walking off the field before the game was over, abandoning the rest of the team?

C) Accusations by his coaches and opposing players of giving up when he isn't targeted enough?

D) Beating his girlfriend and not allowing her to seek medical attention?

3) Comparison between Moss and Jerry Rice:

Receptions: Rice 1549, Moss 982
Yards: Rice 22,895, Moss 15,292
Touchdowns: Rice 197, Moss 156
Years with 1,000 yards receiving: Rice 14, Moss 9
Super Bowl Rings: Rice 3, Moss 0
Super Bowl MVPs: Rice 1, Moss 0
All-Pro Seasons: Rice 12, Moss 5
Pro Bowls: Rice 13, Moss 7
Offensive Player of the Year Awards: Rice 2, Moss 0
All-Decade Team Awards: Rice 2, Moss 1


Rice holds the career record for receptions, yards, receiving touchdowns, total touchdowns, and 5th all time in yards receiving per game played. Rated by three different professional sports organizations as the greatest NFL player of all-time... at any position.

Little nitpick, this year's Cardinals QB's weren't the worst tandem, that definitely belongs to the '08 Lions.

Next, so you're mad at Moss because after being forced into a bad situation, he tried to leave and showed his displeasure? Fitzgerald signed a 100-something million deal, he went all in with the Cards. Bruce had been with the Rams before Warner showed up, and same with Steve Smith. They wanted to be with those teams, and are you seriously trying to compare Delhomme and Warner to the Oakland QB's? It's easy to work with them to make things better when they're good at what they do.

2) Considering we just watched a league celebrate a roided-up murderer get his "happy ending" all while praising Jesus, or had guys like Donte Stallworth drink and drive and kill someone and be allowed back into the league after only serving a month in jail, yeah I would say Moss' incidents aren't that bad. As far as C goes, using that as "evidence" is just ridiculous.

And finally for 3), comparing stats is fucking dumb because Jerry Rice had two guys named Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him in San Fran, played with Jeff Garcia (3 time Pro Bowler), and Rich Gannon (2002 NFL MVP).

I mean if we're comparing stats, then Brett Farve is obviously the greatest QB ever. He's got like every single QB record, so logically he's the best right?

This isn't a math class, number's don't tell the whole story[footnote]PS: using Super Bowls is probably the dumbest thing you ever could have used as proof. Do you think Trent Dilfer is a better QB than Dan Marino? Or that David Reed and Tandon Doss are better WR's than Larry Fitzgerald and Calvin Johnson? And don't even get me started on Pro Bowls....[/footnote]

 

[Sion_Barzahd]

I got a couple of friends who are really into american football, despite us being in the UK. (Ones a massive Jets fanatic and the other backs Packers)
Ravens are my team, and was excited to hear they got into the superbowl, i missed the play offs due to the insane workload we got before xmas.

So yeah three of us chilled out, drank beer and watched the superbowl. It was epic.

 

[game-lover]

I was going to choose the "Commercials" option. But then I realized... I'm not even going to watch it for that.

Because I can just go on the internet and find all the wonderful and amusing commercials that way.

So yeah, I really don't care about football. It bores me.

 

[Lionsfan]

My profession is Sports Journalist. I write for the largest sports website in the Northwest US. Yes I'm watching, no I don't care who wins. I don't want to see Ray Lewis get a win in his goodbye, but I despise Randy Moss of the 49ers.

It was a good game, Niners made it close towards the end.

How can you despise Randy Moss? Everyone he's played with has said essentially nothing but good things about him, and this years 49er's team has praised him for being a good role model and things of that nature

Everyone he's played with? He threw both Daunte Culpepper and his QBs in Oakland under the bus when things weren't going well. He spent the week before the Super Bowl claiming he was the greatest WR of all time, while playing for San Francisco. He has always shown a prima-donna arrogance alongside his contemporaries (Chad Johnson, Terrell Owens) considering how little a WR really has an impact on an offense. That's why.

Regarding the QB's, how is it throwing your QB under the bus when they suck? Culpepper was made better by Moss, and in his time in Oakland he was playing with Kerry Collins in '05, and Andrew Walker/Aaron Brooks in '06, which could be one of the worst QB tandem's of all time.

You say that WR's have very little impact on the offense, so then by logic, he was right to criticize his QB's and their play when things went south, after all, they have more impact on the offense, so it's more their fault that the teams were horrible.

Next, comparing him to Chad Johnson and T.O is just silly. He hasn't actively wrecked lockerrooms like those two have, and his off the field incidents are childs play.

Finally, you could make the argument that Moss is the GOAT when it comes to WR's, it's not as ridiculous as you make it out to be

1) Because throwing tantrums when things aren't going well isn't the sign of a professional, it's the sign of a child. Larry Fitzgerald put up with possibly THE WORST QB Tandem this year with John Skelton, Ryan Lindley, and Kevin Kolb. Not a word of complaint, and certainly no threats to walk out on the team, or the need to bench him for behavior like Art Shell had to to Moss in 2006. You don't complain, you work with your team to get better. Fitzgerald does this, Isaac Bruce did it with Kurt Warner when he replaced Trent Green, Steve Smith did it with Jake Delhomme and Cam Newton.

2) Not as many incidents of behavior? You mean like

A) Running into a street officer with his car?

B) Walking off the field before the game was over, abandoning the rest of the team?

C) Accusations by his coaches and opposing players of giving up when he isn't targeted enough?

D) Beating his girlfriend and not allowing her to seek medical attention?

3) Comparison between Moss and Jerry Rice:

Receptions: Rice 1549, Moss 982
Yards: Rice 22,895, Moss 15,292
Touchdowns: Rice 197, Moss 156
Years with 1,000 yards receiving: Rice 14, Moss 9
Super Bowl Rings: Rice 3, Moss 0
Super Bowl MVPs: Rice 1, Moss 0
All-Pro Seasons: Rice 12, Moss 5
Pro Bowls: Rice 13, Moss 7
Offensive Player of the Year Awards: Rice 2, Moss 0
All-Decade Team Awards: Rice 2, Moss 1


Rice holds the career record for receptions, yards, receiving touchdowns, total touchdowns, and 5th all time in yards receiving per game played. Rated by three different professional sports organizations as the greatest NFL player of all-time... at any position.

Little nitpick, this year's Cardinals QB's weren't the worst tandem, that definitely belongs to the '08 Lions.

Next, so you're mad at Moss because after being forced into a bad situation, he tried to leave and showed his displeasure? Fitzgerald signed a 100-something million deal, he went all in with the Cards. Bruce had been with the Rams before Warner showed up, and same with Steve Smith. They wanted to be with those teams, and are you seriously trying to compare Delhomme and Warner to the Oakland QB's? It's easy to work with them to make things better when they're good at what they do.

2) Considering we just watched a league celebrate a roided-up murderer get his "happy ending" all while praising Jesus, or had guys like Donte Stallworth drink and drive and kill someone and be allowed back into the league after only serving a month in jail, yeah I would say Moss' incidents aren't that bad. As far as C goes, using that as "evidence" is just ridiculous.

And finally for 3), comparing stats is fucking dumb because Jerry Rice had two guys named Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him in San Fran, played with Jeff Garcia (3 time Pro Bowler), and Rich Gannon (2002 NFL MVP).

I mean if we're comparing stats, then Brett Farve is obviously the greatest QB ever. He's got like every single QB record, so logically he's the best right?

This isn't a math class, number's don't tell the whole story[footnote]PS: using Super Bowls is probably the dumbest thing you ever could have used as proof. Do you think Trent Dilfer is a better QB than Dan Marino? Or that David Reed and Tandon Doss are better WR's than Larry Fitzgerald and Calvin Johnson? And don't even get me started on Pro Bowls....[/footnote]

A) When you get paid like a professional, you play like one, you act like one. I don't suppose Moss works for free? If a person went into any job in the normal world, and acted like Moss does, he'd be fired in 30 seconds flat. If you want to talk about the players you're with, you make them better, you don't break them down. Andrew Walter may not be a Hall of Fame QB, but he is still in the top 1% of 1% of all players who ever played the position at the college level or above. Playing for Al Davis didn't suddenly make them forget how to play.

B) So because other players are worse, we should tolerate vehicular assault and domestic abuse? C) also means a lot more when it came from 4 of his own assistant coaches, and 6 opposing players that were willing to be identified on record. ART SHELL BENCHED HIM FOR BEHAVIOR. Nothing more needs to be said.

C) John Taylor, Dwight Clark, JJ Stokes, Brent Jones. Four other recievers that played with Montana and/or Young. I'm not seeing their names in the record books anywhere. Because Rice entirely dominated the game in a way that Moss never has. If the QB makes the WR so good, why isn't Antonio Freeman in the Hall of Fame? He played with Favre the same amount of seasons Rice played with Montana. Why isn't Mark Clayton in? He played with Dan Marino longer than Rice played with either Young or Montana. What happened to Jeff Garcia after he left San Francisco? He burned out entirely. The only reason he did as well as he did is because he had Rice.

To insinuate that any reciever in NFL history is in the same galaxy as Rice is madness, let alone a player who whined and complained his way out of Minnesota, Oakland, and especially Tennessee.

EDIT: Culpepper had a 63.9 QB Rating for the 2008 Lions. Jon Kitna had a 77.2 QB Rating. Meanwhile Ryan Lindley had a 32.2 QB Rating, and John Skelton had a 40.1. Not even close.

First, you fail at simple fact checking. From the NFL Website: John Skelton [http://www.nfl.com/player/johnskelton/497129/profile] had a QB rating of 55.4 for the 2012 season, and Ryan Lindley [http://www.nfl.com/player/ryanlindley/2532894/profile] had a QB rating of 46.

A) Comparing professional athletes to real life jobs is just....gah....don't. It's apples and oranges mate. Half the stuff NFL players do would get themselves fired from a real job in 30 seconds flat. You can try to make players around you better, but there's a certain point where it doesn't matter. And thanks for your comments about Andrew Walters, when I saw this:

Andrew Walter may not be a Hall of Fame QB, but he is still in the top 1% of 1% of all players who ever played the position at the college level or above.

I almost had a breakdown from laughing so hard

On what basis are you claiming that? His spectacular 54.9% in college? Or his multi-year pro career?

Anyways, onward.

No, others players behaviors don't excuse what Moss did, but those few actions are hardly representative of his entire career, which for the most part has been incident free, as he's kept to himself off the field.

And for C) OMG! WE Should totes base how good a player is/isn't off the testimonials of random players and assistant coaches! As for the Art Shell thing, Holy Cow! A Coach who hadn't coached in over a decade and never again after the 2006 season benched him for behavior. Oh the Humanity! Clearly this AMAZING COACH was disgusted by Moss' behavior and wanted to send a message, as opposed to finding a scapegoat to try and save his job.

And finally, I'm not saying that a HoF QB automatically makes everybody around him record-breaking HoF'ers. That thinking would be stupid. But when you add up HoF QB's, with a HoF WR, you're going to get greatness. And when Randy Moss finally got a HoF QB to throw the ball to him....well we all saw what happened in 2007. If Brady and Moss had been together for as long as Rice-Montana/Young were, well who knows what great things we would have seen.

To insinuate that any reciever in NFL history is in the same galaxy as Rice is madness, let alone a player who whined and complained his way out of Minnesota, Oakland, and especially Tennessee.

Out of everything you've written, this is the most foolish, and what I take the most issue with.

It's not madness to think Randy Moss is the greatest receiver of all time, what's truly madness is blindly following the same drumbeat, and attempting to put players on a pedestal that's so high up, nobody can see it.

I'm violating my personal sportswriting rule by acknowledging B/R, but someone already laid out [http://bleacherreport.com/articles/143974-why-jerry-rice-is-not-the-greatest-wide-receiver-in-nfl-history] the case why Jerry Rice is not the GOAT, and it's something I recommend you read. Jerry Rice as the GOAT isn't as Black and White as you'd like it to be

 

[Lionsfan]

My profession is Sports Journalist. I write for the largest sports website in the Northwest US. Yes I'm watching, no I don't care who wins. I don't want to see Ray Lewis get a win in his goodbye, but I despise Randy Moss of the 49ers.

It was a good game, Niners made it close towards the end.

How can you despise Randy Moss? Everyone he's played with has said essentially nothing but good things about him, and this years 49er's team has praised him for being a good role model and things of that nature

Everyone he's played with? He threw both Daunte Culpepper and his QBs in Oakland under the bus when things weren't going well. He spent the week before the Super Bowl claiming he was the greatest WR of all time, while playing for San Francisco. He has always shown a prima-donna arrogance alongside his contemporaries (Chad Johnson, Terrell Owens) considering how little a WR really has an impact on an offense. That's why.

Regarding the QB's, how is it throwing your QB under the bus when they suck? Culpepper was made better by Moss, and in his time in Oakland he was playing with Kerry Collins in '05, and Andrew Walker/Aaron Brooks in '06, which could be one of the worst QB tandem's of all time.

You say that WR's have very little impact on the offense, so then by logic, he was right to criticize his QB's and their play when things went south, after all, they have more impact on the offense, so it's more their fault that the teams were horrible.

Next, comparing him to Chad Johnson and T.O is just silly. He hasn't actively wrecked lockerrooms like those two have, and his off the field incidents are childs play.

Finally, you could make the argument that Moss is the GOAT when it comes to WR's, it's not as ridiculous as you make it out to be

1) Because throwing tantrums when things aren't going well isn't the sign of a professional, it's the sign of a child. Larry Fitzgerald put up with possibly THE WORST QB Tandem this year with John Skelton, Ryan Lindley, and Kevin Kolb. Not a word of complaint, and certainly no threats to walk out on the team, or the need to bench him for behavior like Art Shell had to to Moss in 2006. You don't complain, you work with your team to get better. Fitzgerald does this, Isaac Bruce did it with Kurt Warner when he replaced Trent Green, Steve Smith did it with Jake Delhomme and Cam Newton.

2) Not as many incidents of behavior? You mean like

A) Running into a street officer with his car?

B) Walking off the field before the game was over, abandoning the rest of the team?

C) Accusations by his coaches and opposing players of giving up when he isn't targeted enough?

D) Beating his girlfriend and not allowing her to seek medical attention?

3) Comparison between Moss and Jerry Rice:

Receptions: Rice 1549, Moss 982
Yards: Rice 22,895, Moss 15,292
Touchdowns: Rice 197, Moss 156
Years with 1,000 yards receiving: Rice 14, Moss 9
Super Bowl Rings: Rice 3, Moss 0
Super Bowl MVPs: Rice 1, Moss 0
All-Pro Seasons: Rice 12, Moss 5
Pro Bowls: Rice 13, Moss 7
Offensive Player of the Year Awards: Rice 2, Moss 0
All-Decade Team Awards: Rice 2, Moss 1


Rice holds the career record for receptions, yards, receiving touchdowns, total touchdowns, and 5th all time in yards receiving per game played. Rated by three different professional sports organizations as the greatest NFL player of all-time... at any position.

Little nitpick, this year's Cardinals QB's weren't the worst tandem, that definitely belongs to the '08 Lions.

Next, so you're mad at Moss because after being forced into a bad situation, he tried to leave and showed his displeasure? Fitzgerald signed a 100-something million deal, he went all in with the Cards. Bruce had been with the Rams before Warner showed up, and same with Steve Smith. They wanted to be with those teams, and are you seriously trying to compare Delhomme and Warner to the Oakland QB's? It's easy to work with them to make things better when they're good at what they do.

2) Considering we just watched a league celebrate a roided-up murderer get his "happy ending" all while praising Jesus, or had guys like Donte Stallworth drink and drive and kill someone and be allowed back into the league after only serving a month in jail, yeah I would say Moss' incidents aren't that bad. As far as C goes, using that as "evidence" is just ridiculous.

And finally for 3), comparing stats is fucking dumb because Jerry Rice had two guys named Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him in San Fran, played with Jeff Garcia (3 time Pro Bowler), and Rich Gannon (2002 NFL MVP).

I mean if we're comparing stats, then Brett Farve is obviously the greatest QB ever. He's got like every single QB record, so logically he's the best right?

This isn't a math class, number's don't tell the whole story[footnote]PS: using Super Bowls is probably the dumbest thing you ever could have used as proof. Do you think Trent Dilfer is a better QB than Dan Marino? Or that David Reed and Tandon Doss are better WR's than Larry Fitzgerald and Calvin Johnson? And don't even get me started on Pro Bowls....[/footnote]

A) When you get paid like a professional, you play like one, you act like one. I don't suppose Moss works for free? If a person went into any job in the normal world, and acted like Moss does, he'd be fired in 30 seconds flat. If you want to talk about the players you're with, you make them better, you don't break them down. Andrew Walter may not be a Hall of Fame QB, but he is still in the top 1% of 1% of all players who ever played the position at the college level or above. Playing for Al Davis didn't suddenly make them forget how to play.

B) So because other players are worse, we should tolerate vehicular assault and domestic abuse? C) also means a lot more when it came from 4 of his own assistant coaches, and 6 opposing players that were willing to be identified on record. ART SHELL BENCHED HIM FOR BEHAVIOR. Nothing more needs to be said.

C) John Taylor, Dwight Clark, JJ Stokes, Brent Jones. Four other recievers that played with Montana and/or Young. I'm not seeing their names in the record books anywhere. Because Rice entirely dominated the game in a way that Moss never has. If the QB makes the WR so good, why isn't Antonio Freeman in the Hall of Fame? He played with Favre the same amount of seasons Rice played with Montana. Why isn't Mark Clayton in? He played with Dan Marino longer than Rice played with either Young or Montana. What happened to Jeff Garcia after he left San Francisco? He burned out entirely. The only reason he did as well as he did is because he had Rice.

To insinuate that any reciever in NFL history is in the same galaxy as Rice is madness, let alone a player who whined and complained his way out of Minnesota, Oakland, and especially Tennessee.

EDIT: Culpepper had a 63.9 QB Rating for the 2008 Lions. Jon Kitna had a 77.2 QB Rating. Meanwhile Ryan Lindley had a 32.2 QB Rating, and John Skelton had a 40.1. Not even close.

First, you fail at simple fact checking. From the NFL Website: John Skelton [http://www.nfl.com/player/johnskelton/497129/profile] had a QB rating of 55.4 for the 2012 season, and Ryan Lindley [http://www.nfl.com/player/ryanlindley/2532894/profile] had a QB rating of 46.

A) Comparing professional athletes to real life jobs is just....gah....don't. It's apples and oranges mate. Half the stuff NFL players do would get themselves fired from a real job in 30 seconds flat. You can try to make players around you better, but there's a certain point where it doesn't matter. And thanks for your comments about Andrew Walters, when I saw this:

Andrew Walter may not be a Hall of Fame QB, but he is still in the top 1% of 1% of all players who ever played the position at the college level or above.

I almost had a breakdown from laughing so hard

On what basis are you claiming that? His spectacular 54.9% in college? Or his multi-year pro career?

Anyways, onward.

No, others players behaviors don't excuse what Moss did, but those few actions are hardly representative of his entire career, which for the most part has been incident free, as he's kept to himself off the field.

And for C) OMG! WE Should totes base how good a player is/isn't off the testimonials of random players and assistant coaches! As for the Art Shell thing, Holy Cow! A Coach who hadn't coached in over a decade and never again after the 2006 season benched him for behavior. Oh the Humanity! Clearly this AMAZING COACH was disgusted by Moss' behavior and wanted to send a message, as opposed to finding a scapegoat to try and save his job.

And finally, I'm not saying that a HoF QB automatically makes everybody around him record-breaking HoF'ers. That thinking would be stupid. But when you add up HoF QB's, with a HoF WR, you're going to get greatness. And when Randy Moss finally got a HoF QB to throw the ball to him....well we all saw what happened in 2007. If Brady and Moss had been together for as long as Rice-Montana/Young were, well who knows what great things we would have seen.

To insinuate that any reciever in NFL history is in the same galaxy as Rice is madness, let alone a player who whined and complained his way out of Minnesota, Oakland, and especially Tennessee.

Out of everything you've written, this is the most foolish, and what I take the most issue with.

It's not madness to think Randy Moss is the greatest receiver of all time, what's truly madness is blindly following the same drumbeat, and attempting to put players on a pedestal that's so high up, nobody can see it.

I'm violating my personal sportswriting rule by acknowledging B/R, but someone already laid out [http://bleacherreport.com/articles/143974-why-jerry-rice-is-not-the-greatest-wide-receiver-in-nfl-history] the case why Jerry Rice is not the GOAT, and it's something I recommend you read. Jerry Rice as the GOAT isn't as Black and White as you'd like it to be

I went by ESPN Fantasy, my mistake. They're stat taking is suspect, that said, Culpeper and Kitna STILL had much better years then Skelton and Lindley.

A) Andrew Walter IS 1% of 1% at college or above. Whether you believe it or not. Wanna know how I know. Because he played in the NFL at all. 625 colleges play football. 32 teams in the NFL. In total, since 2000, there have been almost 2,500 players that have played QB in college. Of those, only 133 started a single down in the NFL. That means that only 5% of all players since 2000 that played QB in college made it to start in the NFL. That's top of the top of the top. That doesn't count everyone who has played QB in high school. Just because he didn't make it in the NFL doesn't mean Walter, or Lindley, or Drew Henson couldn't outthrow you or me 100 times out of 100.

B) According to the NFL, 93% of players never have an off the field incident, and less than 1% have 3 or more. Moss had 3. Any questions?

C) Do you have personal experience with Randy Moss? Because obviously you do if you think you know more than the people that work with him every single day for 9 months at a time. This isn't one person. THIS IS MULTIPLE COACHES ON MULTIPLE TEAMS. He was benched in Oakland, he played less than 40% of snaps in Tennessee because he refused to learn the playbook because it wasn't designed around him.

Do you have any proof Art Shell, one of the most respected coaches in Oakland history, scapegoated Randy Moss? On one hand you have a player that told reporters in 2004 "I play when I feel like playing, I take plays off", or the Coach of the Year in 1990, whose firing by Al Davis Davis himself admitted was a mistake?

D) Brady and Moss had two good seasons and one okay one. Then Moss whined and complained his way out of THAT SITUATION TOO. Demanding a trade early on because he wasn't getting paid more than Wes Welker. Seeing a pattern yet?

And while I agree with several points the B/R writer puts out, and while I think Hutson was an amazing player, comparing a player from that era with a player from this one just doesn't work. The players weren't nearly as fast, nearly as strong, and many of them played it to make extra money in between their real jobs.

Kitna and Culpepepper also played in less games, and had their stats inflated greatly by Calvin Johnson being on the field.

A) That's just silly reasoning. Yes, it's cool that Walter made the NFL, but by your logic, there are no bad QB's. Because, hey, they all made the NFL right? Yes, when you're comparing Andrew Walter to Billy Bob of the Huntsville Beer League, it's obvious that Walter is a great athlete. But compared to his peers, he's a fucking joke. Making the NFL isn't a great achievement when all your competitors have made the NFL as well.

B) You keep switching your numbers around. Above, you said he had 2 off the field incidents, and now you're saying 3? Stay consistent. And I'm not arguing that he didn't do them, but again, they're not as bad as you're making them out to be. Regarding the dating violence thing, there were never even any criminal charges filed.\

C) Yes, Al Davis admitted that firing Shell was a mistake....in the 90's. He never said anything about regretting things in 2006, because by then Shell was washed up and a failure. So no, I don't think it's unreasonable to think, that in the midst of a 2-14 season, Shell was looking to deflect blame away from himself for that failure of a season (and it wasn't his fault either)

Look here's statements from teammates praising Moss

?The experience that he went through in this game is kind of hard to shy away from,? 49ers wide receiver Ted Ginn Jr. said. ?You just try to soak up everything. For him to be able to still be in this league at that age is a feat. I see how he works out every day, how he swims and keeps his body right. He?s not vocal, he leads by example.?

?He?s still a very, very good receiver,? said Devin McCourty. ?I learned a lot just going against him when he was here. You see him out there, he?s still able to make plays. There are special things about him. He?s still able to get by guys. I guess one good thing is that we have some familiarity with him where that can help us a little bit. But he?s still a very good receiver.?

?He?s the greatest deep-ball receiver I think that?s ever played,? Bill Belichick said Wednesday during a conference call with San Francisco reporters. ?Nobody runs better patterns, better at the deep part of the field, than Randy Moss can. I still see him doing that. You have to respect his ability to stretch the field so deep and get behind you. It?s hard to take that away and defend everything else that he can do. He?s an explosive, dynamic player. Probably the smartest receiver I?ve ever coached. I know he absolutely knows what he?s doing, knows what the defense is doing.?

I don't have a subscription to the Boston Herald, but there's also a quote from Chad Pennington out there praising him, and that Randy Moss has gotten a bad rap.

Isn't finding random opinions fun?

D) There's never really a situation where Wes Welker should be getting paid more than Randy Moss

As for the B/R article, I'm not saying Don Huston was the best ever. What I was saying, is that your idea that Jerry Rice is the GOAT and that "To insinuate that any reciever in NFL history is in the same galaxy as Rice is madness", well that's stupid. Really really stupid