Poll: This needs a dedicated thread. What to do with R&P?

[Trunkage]

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

I've personally had many discussions in R&P.

That might not seem much, but most places' religion and/or politics sections are more abut yelling and telling than actual discussion. Sure it sometimes turns to the former but frequently it doesn't

 

[Saelune]

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

Have you been to the political reddits? And yes, I mean both sides. Echo chambers, all of them. Sure, sometimes I browse the left-wing ones and go 'Hah I agree with all of this!' but then I know places like r/conservative are all bragging how they are right and the left are wrong, and anyone who disagrees gets downvoted to oblivion.


And I also hate up/down voting. It is a terrible system, and glad it is not here.

 

[Saelune]

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

It doesn't have a 140 character limit allowing for people to take an amount of words appropriate for communicating things with some measure of nuance and explanation and it has people with differing views in it. Yes, it leans leftwing but Zontar and CM156 are still around as well.

R&P would not have such a rep for being so toxic if it was just one side always agreeing with itself.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

It doesn't have a 140 character limit allowing for people to take an amount of words appropriate for communicating things with some measure of nuance and explanation and it has people with differing views in it. Yes, it leans leftwing but Zontar and CM156 are still around as well.

Does Reddit have a character limit? I don't know I never go there.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

I've personally had many discussions in R&P.

That might not seem much, but most places' religion and/or politics sections are more abut yelling and telling than actual discussion. Sure it sometimes turns to the former but frequently it doesn't

That's how I imagine most of the internet is regarding those topics, the yelling and telling I mean. Somehow I doubt here is any different, but I'll take your word for it.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

Have you been to the political reddits? And yes, I mean both sides. Echo chambers, all of them. Sure, sometimes I browse the left-wing ones and go 'Hah I agree with all of this!' but then I know places like r/conservative are all bragging how they are right and the left are wrong, and anyone who disagrees gets downvoted to oblivion.


And I also hate up/down voting. It is a terrible system, and glad it is not here.

No, politics gives me a headache and that's off the internet. On the internet it gives me an aneurysm.

 

[Saelune]

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

It doesn't have a 140 character limit allowing for people to take an amount of words appropriate for communicating things with some measure of nuance and explanation and it has people with differing views in it. Yes, it leans leftwing but Zontar and CM156 are still around as well.

Does Reddit have a character limit? I don't know I never go there.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

I've personally had many discussions in R&P.

That might not seem much, but most places' religion and/or politics sections are more abut yelling and telling than actual discussion. Sure it sometimes turns to the former but frequently it doesn't

That's how I imagine most of the internet is regarding those topics, the yelling and telling I mean. Somehow I doubt here is any different, but I'll take your word for it.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

Have you been to the political reddits? And yes, I mean both sides. Echo chambers, all of them. Sure, sometimes I browse the left-wing ones and go 'Hah I agree with all of this!' but then I know places like r/conservative are all bragging how they are right and the left are wrong, and anyone who disagrees gets downvoted to oblivion.


And I also hate up/down voting. It is a terrible system, and glad it is not here.

No, politics gives me a headache and that's off the internet. On the internet it gives me an aneurysm.

Well, what gives me an aneurysm is letting injustices like bigotry go uncontested, and sticking our fingers in our ears over politics wont help anyone.

 

[vallorn]

Exactly. It's not the people exactly that are the issue, it's the behaviors and grudges encouraged by R&P. R&P itself is the problem which should be excised like a tumour. It's already metastasized somewhat but with a good course of rules based chemotherapy it can be tamped out.

You assert that people's negative behaviors and grudges are inevitably encouraged by the forum's reputation. You then take this hypothesis as sufficient reason to "excise" the forum itself.

Such an assertion seems presumptuous in that it inherently reduces posters to being easily influenced sheep. The following logic directing the removal of the forum itself is weak. Are you sure you wrote what you meant to convey?

The reputation results from the enviroment not the other way around. There's definitly a 'culture' to that subforum which is different to the rest of the site, not to the same degree as you have "board cultures" on the chans, but the subject matter and practices of argumentation commonly used there lend themselves to negative behaviours that then bleed out into the rest of the site. That's where the reputation originates from, the conflict between the distinctive "R&P culture" and the rest of the forums.

 

[BreakfastMan]

R&P is shitty because discussion about religion and politics is always shitty. Unlike video games and movies, it is about stuff that has a huge impact on people's lives, so people tend to care much more deeply about it and treat it more seriously than speculation about which guns the new Doom will have. If there wasn't a dedicated sub for it, it would leak out into all the other threads and make OT and GD a more hostile place. Which it did before it was moved to it's own sub-forum back before most of the people posting in this thread joined the escapist. So, I vote for keeping it around.

 

[Elvis Starburst]

But I make a choice to think this way. You, yourself, state that you have grudges and people have grudges with you stemming from there. And you and them are constantly making a choice not to reach out to the other person and say "Hey, can we squash this?". The R&P forums are just as important as Race, Creed, Gender, and Sexuality when it comes to how we as individuals interact with one another: It's an excuse.

I feel like this needs to be a /thread on this and every R&P thread that turns into a shit show. I love it!

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

I wouldn't come specifically for the politics, but then again pretending mediaand its consumption doesn't have possible political commentary is empirically false. Moreover as per in this thread, you literally have people talking about how they would consider such a move petty and pointless and would affect their decision to come here at all.

I have about as much validity to believe them when they say that than I do the apparent 'grievances' of people who are still posting here about an entirely elective forum with entirely elective posts that they can entirely elect to ignore.

 

[Drathnoxis]

I say leave it be. Much like the wild west it was one of the few reasons I kept coming back to the site if for no other reason than to take a couple minutes to go over the latest shit show.

I mean. Do people really want the site to go down the path where it deletes the hated flavour of the month?

I had a thread I made to liven things up briefly. I had no expectation it would last long. It wasn't serious. It existed for levity. It was immediately locked and recently it was deleted entirely. I don't like where this site is heading and if it goes much further there's a good chance I stop giving a shit entirely and never come back. I don't have many sites I'd call home, but the escapist isn't the only one anymore.

Yeah, I saw that. Exactly the reason why we needed the WW.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P had a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

Thanks for the Update! That is good to hear! I agree that the state of R&P is much better than it has been in the past, and most of the regulars get along well enough to allow for good discussion of issues. ALSO glad you resolved computer/internet issues and good to see you back
OT:
I had already stated how I felt about it on the other thread so will just post that here:

It seems to feel like some of those who feel as though they lost something with the loss of WW and GID just want to try and" take" something away from other forums users for no other reason than to " make them lose something too". tbh and I don't think that is right.

R&P was never given "special rules" as the WW and GID forum were,( Yes even GID had special rules apply as well) so it has always been moderated, and most of the R&P regulars, even though we may disagree on issues, get along well enough. Our R&P user group ( it still exists though most the members are long gone now) was made up of people from all sides of the political spectrum and still got along very well, members would play RTS games together for the most part. I see this call for removal more of an attempt to take from others because they feel slighted rather than an actual taking issue with people discussing current events in a civilized manner. For the most part, forum users are respectful of one another and try to keep the debates focused on the subject matter and it can be good discussion.

I think most everyone in R&P on this site has managed to learn something from past discussions at some point and I think that is a good thing as it is expanding our understanding of the world we live in rather than ignore it and pretend like it doesn't exist.

The rough period was prior to GID being made and the forum was being invaded and sadly some of the regulars were caught up in it and got themselves banned due to raging about the "subject that shall not be named". It calmed down after that topic was exiled from " the basement" to the " sub basement" however.

Anyways, I do hope Russ decides to keep R&P, as it gives people a place to discuss current events without flooding the other forums, as well as a place for them to move those threads to when they shift into political territory as they often tend to do. People live in a real world and these things affect them so people are going to discuss them, at least this way they have a designated place to discuss them rather than have them take over all the other forums as the topics are often intertwined.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

It doesn't have a 140 character limit allowing for people to take an amount of words appropriate for communicating things with some measure of nuance and explanation and it has people with differing views in it. Yes, it leans leftwing but Zontar and CM156 are still around as well.

Does Reddit have a character limit? I don't know I never go there.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

I've personally had many discussions in R&P.

That might not seem much, but most places' religion and/or politics sections are more abut yelling and telling than actual discussion. Sure it sometimes turns to the former but frequently it doesn't

That's how I imagine most of the internet is regarding those topics, the yelling and telling I mean. Somehow I doubt here is any different, but I'll take your word for it.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

Have you been to the political reddits? And yes, I mean both sides. Echo chambers, all of them. Sure, sometimes I browse the left-wing ones and go 'Hah I agree with all of this!' but then I know places like r/conservative are all bragging how they are right and the left are wrong, and anyone who disagrees gets downvoted to oblivion.


And I also hate up/down voting. It is a terrible system, and glad it is not here.

No, politics gives me a headache and that's off the internet. On the internet it gives me an aneurysm.

Well, what gives me an aneurysm is letting injustices like bigotry go uncontested, and sticking our fingers in our ears over politics wont help anyone.

I can't stand such injustices either, but it's been my experience that trying to challenge them on the internet just leaves me exhausted and mentally drained without accomplishing anything.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

I can't stand such injustices either, but it's been my experience that trying to challenge them on the internet just leaves me exhausted and mentally drained without accomplishing anything.

You mistake 'not getting the outcome you want' with 'without accomplishing anything'/

Total eradication of bigotry in all forms. I think for the most part, a vast number of us would be cool with that. But as we all know, we can't change people's minds.

But what we can do is make it known that this is a safe place for everyone, not a select few. We can enforce the rules and laws to keep this place and every place free. Because when people are apolitical and retreat from speaking up, we just create a vacuum. And we can just look at the news to see how that actually works out. Not well for those who want the our world that has no place for injustices.

 

[Elijin]

The R&P should be shut down notion has always had a whiff of pettiness. Like, a lot of its advocates were big Wild West users, who seem pretty stuck on the idea that R&P users got WW shut down, and this idea seems to getting 'em back.

 

[Saelune]

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

It doesn't have a 140 character limit allowing for people to take an amount of words appropriate for communicating things with some measure of nuance and explanation and it has people with differing views in it. Yes, it leans leftwing but Zontar and CM156 are still around as well.

Does Reddit have a character limit? I don't know I never go there.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

I've personally had many discussions in R&P.

That might not seem much, but most places' religion and/or politics sections are more abut yelling and telling than actual discussion. Sure it sometimes turns to the former but frequently it doesn't

That's how I imagine most of the internet is regarding those topics, the yelling and telling I mean. Somehow I doubt here is any different, but I'll take your word for it.

Russ intends to keep R&P. He told us R&P has a place and a community needs an outlet for that kind of talk.

We'll be keeping the R&P forum where folks shall continue to be free to post and bicker, etc.

It's frankly an absolute necessity: The Religion and Politics forum was created specifically to compartmentalize threads about such topics away from the Off Topic forum where they tended to clutter up the front pages and annoy Escapists who weren't vaguely interested in such subjects on a gaming site.

And because R&P routinely deals with topics that inflame many people the forum's threads were further isolated by not showing up on the Hot Thread Topic box on the front page.

Furthermore Gethsemani is right about the state of the current forum. It is in better shape than it's been in for some time.

I'll tell you a secret, too: When I joined years ago R&P has a reputation for being a lair of "scum and villainy". Most of those who were here 6 years ago are long, long gone.

Did new posters replace them? Yes.

Are those new posters inherently "scummy and villainous"?

Frankly, no more than their predecessors. You see, the R&P forum's reputation is infamous and shall remain so...whether its respective posters deserve a bad reputation or not.

R&P forums tend to be vilified as a routine matter of course. But the Escapist's R&P forum isn't going anywhere.

That's Russ' prerogative, however in my mind a site called "The Escapist" should provide an escape from such BS. Of course over the years it has repeatedly failed to do so. ...even without R&P

You don't have to click or post on it... Getting rid of R&P will just kill the total poster pool. I doubt more people will return simply because you ixnay a forum that was entirely elective to begin with.

Surely you should be increasing total access and exposure, not throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Will it? That's kinda sad really. Why would you come to a gaming and media site to discuss politics? Aren't there places specifically for discussing that garbage like Twitter or Reddit?

Twitter isn't for discussion and reddit might as well be 'echochamber.com'.

How is R&P any different?

Have you been to the political reddits? And yes, I mean both sides. Echo chambers, all of them. Sure, sometimes I browse the left-wing ones and go 'Hah I agree with all of this!' but then I know places like r/conservative are all bragging how they are right and the left are wrong, and anyone who disagrees gets downvoted to oblivion.


And I also hate up/down voting. It is a terrible system, and glad it is not here.

No, politics gives me a headache and that's off the internet. On the internet it gives me an aneurysm.

Well, what gives me an aneurysm is letting injustices like bigotry go uncontested, and sticking our fingers in our ears over politics wont help anyone.

I can't stand such injustices either, but it's been my experience that trying to challenge them on the internet just leaves me exhausted and mentally drained without accomplishing anything.

R&P has improved, expanded and altered my views due to things said by people on both sides.

 

[Souplex]

r&P isn't the problem, the problem is that we unbanned the Nazis who made it a shitshow.
People are gonna wanna discuss religion and politics. It's a dedicated enough niche that it warrants a forum and can't simply be swept into Off Topic.

 

[Silent Protagonist]

R&P has improved, expanded and altered my views due to things said by people on both sides.

One quick trick to really improving, expanding, and altering your views is to stop thinking and referring to politics as "both" sides but as many or all sides. There are a lot more than two perspectives, goals, motivations, philosophical bends, etc in politics and reducing all of this down to "both" just encourages the Us v Them mentality that is at the core of all bigotry and enabling the two party politics in the US that has devolved into a race to the bottom of lesser of "two" evils.

More seriously,though, this post is the exact reason I think R&P should remain. It is/was one of the few places I know of where politics are discussed that wasn't an echo chamber and had some diversity of opinion. I go there not to have my views reinforced, but to learn what people with different views than me might think on the topics and why. There you could actually see different views interact and debate each other in a manner that could lead to a better understanding of the topic. There is a lot less diversity of opinion now than there used to be, but I like to think that's because of the decline in total posters rather than a deliberate attempt to force out any particular way of thinking. Hopefully if the new management can bring some more life into the site R&P will be improved by the increase in users, rather than held back from getting more users by the existence of R&P

 

[EvilRoy]

I've already said plenty about how I feel R&P has affected the site, but I guess I'll reiterate for the sake of completeness here that I really do feel the majority of the negative behavior on the site originates from the attitudes and tactics (baiting, targeting, derailment squads) that was developed, tested and perfected on R&P.

The Wild West did nothing more than remove the filter from people willing to go to these extents to try to get rid of people or hurt them, and what we saw got pretty fucked up at times. If that section of the site can't be purged, fine, but something has to be done about that culture. As long as it persists the site is going to remain just as unwelcoming to new people, ideas, or contributors. This whole fresh start thing is the right time to crush those tactics, deal with the people who refuse to change, and keep them from hampering any recovery or improvement that the site might see.