Poll: Transhumanism: How Far Would You Take It?

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Oliver Cuenca

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Mar 31, 2012
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I'm going to go with minor augmentation, or at least non-intrusive like JC Denton. I just want to have the amazing powers, I don't want to draw attention to myself, and I'm kinda uncomfortable with the idea of losing limbs and being effectively cripples if I have to give up the augmentations because I can't afford to pay for Neuropozyne anymore. :)I wanna feel like a cybernetic sorcerer, able to conjure fire from my fingers, and have brain power able to handle any natural or un-natural disaster. :D
 

IamLEAM1983

Neloth's got swag.
Aug 22, 2011
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I'd go for the second option. Convenience is one thing, abandoning my limitations is another. I think I, as a human, am unable to do certain things on a physical level for a reason. Being forced to fail, to fall, to injure yourself and to regret certain attempts teaches you humility, and I'm almost afraid to consider what I'd become if you somehow put me off to the hook, in terms of standard human limitations.

I'm saying this based on the fact that not everyone tends to act nobly, when confronted with the ability to seize power. The posters joking about getting complete Eldritch replacements and basically turning into a sentient supercomputer thingy are what would honestly bother me, if this were a real possibility.
 

Fleaman

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Nov 10, 2010
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Option 6. Everything must go.

If the objective is longevity, a robot body doesn't go far enough. If the solution doesn't prevent Alzheimer's, then it's no solution at all.
 

FalloutJack

Bah weep grah nah neep ninny bom
Nov 20, 2008
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I'm actually looking forward to option five. We'll discuss further mutations later.
 

Scarim Coral

Jumped the ship
Legacy
Oct 29, 2010
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Option 2 sound ideal for me, being a better version myself (I would go with better eyes and have more strength) without needing to removed any of my original organ or major changing to it.
 

krazykidd

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Mar 22, 2008
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After playing xenosaga , and meeting ziggarat 8 ( ziggy) , i prefer to be pure squishy killable human . Dying ain't so bad.
 

Dedtoo

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Aug 28, 2009
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I'll start at 2, but if/as my body starts failing I would probably be up for some spare parts. Hands no longer able to grasp stuff? New, shiny ones!
Heart no longer beating properly? New, heat powered one!
Brain starting to have memory problems? I'm already forgetful, so gimme!
 

Pebkio

The Purple Mage
Nov 9, 2009
780
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Technically I'd go for option five but with a very large asterisk: I don't care about physical augmentation. In fact, leave my body all weak and pudgy because being physically awesome doesn't really matter in a world in which we have that kind of technology. In other would, that kind of nonsense is for macho meathead douchenozzles.

I wouldn't go for option six though because I'm heavily addicted to being an introvert and would like to unplug when too many people get uppity.

Basically, I'd want more memory space with a built in manager for clearer access to those memories and the option for some editing. The ability to access the globat connection of information and communication would also be required. I'd only need limited AR so my eyes wouldn't have to be modified, the programing could just layer information over the things I see. But yes, I'd then also, probably, have my nervous system altered to that I can control the intesity of my senses. I'd like to be able to turn any of those senses as well. Most of my wanted changes would be internal, not external, and wouldn't, in any way, make me a better fighter/laborer.
 

Voulan

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Jul 18, 2011
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Heronblade said:
Voulan said:
Heronblade said:
Voulan said:
[
We've evolved as much as we'll ever need to, what's the need to have even more? The human body has been more than capable ever since our existence.
Correction, the human body has been sort of capable, with a boatload of help from technology, of surviving the challenges we have faced so far. A lot of our own have unnecessarily died in the process, and are continuing to die in dealing with the challenges we have yet to overcome.

I suppose you could be content with the bodycount, and just hope life doesn't throw us a bigger curveball than usual. I prefer to take the long view however. For instance, the odds of us ever getting off of this rock go up by several factors of ten if the right bodily modifications are available to those who need them.

Much the same holds true when dealing with problems such as AIDS, cancer, and Alzheimer's. Perhaps you should explain to some of the cancer patients out there about how their body is working just fine in spite of the fact that their own cellular structure is going rogue and painfully killing them.
I'm talking limb modifications, as I clearly said in the first post, not cancer research. In which case, what you mean there is medicinal progress, not technoligical modifications. And what on earth more "challenges yet to overcome" are you seeing? Unless you're meaning man-made disasters like war, which could involve technology itself, then I don't really see the necessity to have a camera in your eyes. We're becoming far too reliant on technology.

But seriously, giving myself mechanical hands just because my hands are somehow not good enough anymore (which they completely are) is a waste of time and money. But this is all hypothetical anyway.
You don't get it do you? Cybernetic augmentation is a direct result of biomedical research, the two are one and the same. The first and foremost reason for cybernetics is in terms of fixing medical problems such as blindness or muscular dystrophy. The fact that it can be used for so much more is just a bonus.

In addition, there are only two methods on the table to reliably cure/prevent cancer, heavy genetic modification, or cybernetic modification. There is no other prospective method that has a good chance of reliably solving our body's tendency to turn cannibal on us.

As for the rest, speaking as someone who tinkers often, my hands have never been good enough. Not nearly enough precision and too little grip among other things. I can indeed counter some of these problems if I have the perfect tool for the task at hand, but that approach requires multiple times my body mass in specialized equipment, much of which is awkward and slow to use. The right tool also never seems to be around when needed.

And as for my eyes, every couple of days I get up and jam bits of polymer onto them. I do this because I (for some incredibly weird reason) don't like wandering around in a mostly blind haze as nature apparently intended. I can also tell you that even with perfect vision, we are all missing out. There is an incredible world out there that we will never see for ourselves, simply because a low quality nonadjustable camera feed covering less than 3.5x10^-26%, or 0.0000000000000000000000000035% of the light spectrum was "good enough" for our evolutionary path.
That's getting creepily into the very territory Deus Ex explores as a central theme. The title is Latin for "god of the machine" which refers directly to the terrible endings of ancient Greek plays where a god played by an actor would be lowered onto the stage by a machine and would solve all the problems in one go; but if we take the term literally, as the game does, it refers to the almost worship-like view people have of technology. They wish to turn themselves into gods through machine implants, and view technology as a god-like entity capable of perfecting people. Wanting to be perfect and spurning the natural body is exactly that. It is hardly more worse than other animal bodies, but because people have this bizarre desire for constant progression and domination of nature (and the subversive self, and here the whole mind/body split debate comes in), being human is no longer good enough. Which in turn opens up a whole debate about the fear of devolution or being taken over by another species, and the body being seen as basic and instinctive, animal and driven by emotions, which is an extremely old fashioned view.

Anyway, this very debate is ongoing constantly. I still stand by the 'only when I am in desperate need of assistance' view; my daily grind hardly requires beyond-necessary vision to go to a supermarket or something. It's also a fear of identity, really. Are you human if you don't have human parts? Is being a human a bad thing? If my body is composed of parts created by corporations that can power off my body due to bad security or monetary issues, then who has the real right of ownership of myself? Where am I in this machine? Better to just stick with what you know to not have that kind of horrible confusion.
 

Advocate44

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May 7, 2009
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6, no question. As long as I survive the transition into something with more potential, I don't much care what happens to this sack of meat I'm stuck in now. I majored in BME for this kind of thing.
 

God'sFist

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May 8, 2012
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I would go full body swap but my brain stays untouched, I prefer my brain to an electronic one. But being able to just have super speed and strength as well that could come in handy.
 

The Ditz

Lord of the Never There
Dec 18, 2012
64
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If brain hacks a la Ghost in the Shell don't exist defenently option 3 heavy augmentation + option 5 partial mind conversion. I don't think I could choose 4, I'd probably miss my digestive and reproductive systems...

Although, while I've (unfortunately) never read any Lovecraft, maybe as option 6, I won't need or care for my oh so human joys... plus I'd bet I'd be far more resilient to hacks.
 

Raikas

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Sep 4, 2012
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I'd vote 6 - who doesn't want to be an abomination, right? But then as a double amputee I'm already somewhere between 2 and 3, so those lower choices aren't as interesting for me.

josak said:
the problem I have is the one well raised in Deus Ex what happens to those who cannot afford augmentation?
That's already an issue now - coverage for glasses or prosthetics varies hugely depending on your country (or your insurance plan). And even when it comes to more optional things; I've heard people make class-judgements on people with bad teeth based on the assumption that if they came from more well off families they'd have had them fixed as children.
 

frizzlebyte

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Oct 20, 2008
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I think I could go for Full Body Conversion, though that would depend on how much my new self would look like me. I suspect I might go totally bonkers if I looked in the mirror and saw some thing staring back at me.

But yeah, get a new robotic heart and replace these asthmatic lungs of mine? Sounds good to me.
 

The Event

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Aug 16, 2012
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My body may be cybernetic but my mind remains human.
So I guess that makes me a 4.

I want any body to look and feel human & be capable of all normal human activities and sensations. Something like a terminator but with an organic brain housed in the skull instead of a computer.
Though I'd also like my brain to be protected and repaired by nanotechnology to prevent it wearing out.
So maybe that's a 4.5
 

WereGentleman

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Oct 14, 2013
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Gotta go with #6. I doubt I would start off as an entity with galaxy spanning intelligence; it's more likely my perspective would change over the course of eternity as I continued to learn more and more about the universe, and whatever lies beyond it. I'm okay with that.
 

JagermanXcell

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Oct 1, 2012
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Zak757 said:
How far would you go? I'd say my "limit" is pictured right here.
If we're using MGR pics to make a point, my limit would definitely be


I other words a combination of # 2 and 3.

I like my body the way it is in terms of look so increasing my strength, durability, intelligence, and stamina genetically or via exoskeleton would be sweet. As for Major Augmentation, definitely my organs, keep em all invincible so I can die of old age like a badass.

And since I now have all the spare time and power in the world to do whatever (including but not limited to benching buildings to work up a good sweat), lets say screw my right arm make it cybernetic, train in kenjutsu and kendo at a Yagyu Shinkage-ryu school, so that I can sharpen my skills... dispense justice to those who deserve it such as... Outlaws, Deperados ect. ect.
 

Heronblade

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Apr 12, 2011
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Voulan said:
Heronblade said:
You don't get it do you? Cybernetic augmentation is a direct result of biomedical research, the two are one and the same. The first and foremost reason for cybernetics is in terms of fixing medical problems such as blindness or muscular dystrophy. The fact that it can be used for so much more is just a bonus.

In addition, there are only two methods on the table to reliably cure/prevent cancer, heavy genetic modification, or cybernetic modification. There is no other prospective method that has a good chance of reliably solving our body's tendency to turn cannibal on us.

As for the rest, speaking as someone who tinkers often, my hands have never been good enough. Not nearly enough precision and too little grip among other things. I can indeed counter some of these problems if I have the perfect tool for the task at hand, but that approach requires multiple times my body mass in specialized equipment, much of which is awkward and slow to use. The right tool also never seems to be around when needed.

And as for my eyes, every couple of days I get up and jam bits of polymer onto them. I do this because I (for some incredibly weird reason) don't like wandering around in a mostly blind haze as nature apparently intended. I can also tell you that even with perfect vision, we are all missing out. There is an incredible world out there that we will never see for ourselves, simply because a low quality nonadjustable camera feed covering less than 3.5x10^-26%, or 0.0000000000000000000000000035% of the light spectrum was "good enough" for our evolutionary path.
That's getting creepily into the very territory Deus Ex explores as a central theme. The title is Latin for "god of the machine" which refers directly to the terrible endings of ancient Greek plays where a god played by an actor would be lowered onto the stage by a machine and would solve all the problems in one go; but if we take the term literally, as the game does, it refers to the almost worship-like view people have of technology. They wish to turn themselves into gods through machine implants, and view technology as a god-like entity capable of perfecting people. Wanting to be perfect and spurning the natural body is exactly that. It is hardly more worse than other animal bodies, but because people have this bizarre desire for constant progression and domination of nature (and the subversive self, and here the whole mind/body split debate comes in), being human is no longer good enough. Which in turn opens up a whole debate about the fear of devolution or being taken over by another species, and the body being seen as basic and instinctive, animal and driven by emotions, which is an extremely old fashioned view.

Anyway, this very debate is ongoing constantly. I still stand by the 'only when I am in desperate need of assistance' view; my daily grind hardly requires beyond-necessary vision to go to a supermarket or something. It's also a fear of identity, really. Are you human if you don't have human parts? Is being a human a bad thing? If my body is composed of parts created by corporations that can power off my body due to bad security or monetary issues, then who has the real right of ownership of myself? Where am I in this machine? Better to just stick with what you know to not have that kind of horrible confusion.
A more accurate translation of the phrase deus ex machina is actually "god from an artifice", but that's rather beside the point.

Discounting the issues that are present in that fictional world but would not be present in the reasonably handled real life scenario (namely the drug dependencies and ability to hack people's minds en masse), the only significant problem explored by Deus Ex is ultimately social. The ability to go past normal human limitations will change human society, and there inevitably will be conflict over the issue, mostly in terms of ethical arguments between people like you and me. However, you know what? We'll adapt, and fairly quickly, as we have to every major upheaval to daily life humanity has lived through.

Concerning that opinion of human nature, the viewpoint that the human body is somehow precious or special compared to that of other animals is actually much older by far. It is also far less accurate. Base instinct plays a huge role in our day to day lives. From the fact that males I do not know have a hard time looking me in the eye to the tendency of our young to be barely controllable showoffs.

Bear in mind however, I do not advocate the use of such tech without quite stiff regulations. The average Joe does not need to be able to punch through walls or have a rocket launcher shoulder attachment. The potential problems with faulty/hackable tech must also be avoided. I do advocate adjustments that are not strictly necessary, but nonetheless can significantly improve life. Supporting/replacing my eyes for instance. Do I strictly need to do anything of the sort? No, while they are defective, the problems can be managed without too many issues. but on the other hand, doing so would be a major asset for my job, and would also improve my enjoyment of life. So, with that in mind, why not?

As for your questions:
Are you human if you don't have human parts?
-I define humanity in terms of one's mind, not this lump of meat supporting said mind, so my answer is yes, almost no matter what modifications are made. However, even going by a definition requiring that there be no mechanical parts whatsoever, an augmented human is still a sophont that deserves the same basic respect as any other person.
Is being a human a bad thing?
-no, but there's nothing wrong with choosing not to stick to the original human model either.
If my body is composed of parts created by corporations that can power off my body due to bad security or monetary issues, then who has the real right of ownership of myself?
-don't be dumb enough to let someone else own your body parts and you won't have to ask yourself that. Personally, I'd make the leasing of installed cybernetics illegal anyways (at least in terms of primary components, plug-n-play type modules that can be removed with no ill effects are a different matter)
Where am I in this machine?
-Where are you in your biological body?