Poll: Will you ACTUALLY be playing Dark Souls 2 easy mode? (if there is one)

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thesilentman

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Jun 14, 2012
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I will be playing Dark Souls II regardless of whether there's an easy mode or not. I just won't play on easy.

EDIT-

Reaper195 said:
If Dark Souls had an easy mode...that wouldn't make an average game easier to stand. As much as the difficulty made me rage in Dark Souls, I ended up telling the game to fuck off after I'd spent nearly seven hours on the game, and still had no real idea where I was, who I was, and what I was supposed to be doing. There was some mention of Bells during the opening scene, and an Eagle picking me up after I escaped from some prison. So...unless Dark Souls 2 is just generally better, Easy Mode it will be for me (Because fuck grinding through one area over and over again, using all my health potions against three enemies, refilling my health potion, and then having the enemies respawn. That's not difficult, that's fucking bad game design).
Define bad game design. I don't think that your problems are only with the gameplay; you have issues with the way that DS tells its story. The game isn't meant to be glossed over. Take your time and try again sometime later.
 

cojo965

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Jul 28, 2012
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FUCK NO! I fought tooth and nail to finish Dark Souls multiple times, there is no way I'm giving that up.
 

TheRussian

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May 8, 2011
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Where's the option if you don't like the franchise and wish for this endless discussion to join the ranks of topics about the Mass Effect 3 endings and Geek Girls?
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
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viranimus said:
You know, I am actually glad you framed it in such a way. Please understand me, taking the "cant we all just get along"-ish stance is not lost on me. I do in fact get the reasoning that there is an ideology of everyone enjoying equally. On some level there is merit to that.

However here is the problem. The more that I think about it, the more I find reason to accept that, Yes it in fact DOES adversely effect me. It robs me of any sense of satisfaction or accomplishment I could derive from the game knowing that those accomplishments, really arent because anyone can do it if they just dial it down to their level.
.
thats where this argument stops making sense if we accpet for a second that the inclusion of an easy mode does not in ANY way effect the original game

then THEY turn it down to easy...THEY have to turn it down to easy, you don't .Nothing affects you because [b/]people know the difference between playing on easy and playing on normal/hard[/b] should it ever come up in conversation, sure somone could lie about the difficulty setting they played on...as much as I could lie about finishing dark souls when in fact I didn't.....it comes across as really petty and shall I say whiney that you don't want other people having the option of an easy mode all because of your ego
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
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cojo965 said:
FUCK NO! I fought tooth and nail to finish Dark Souls multiple times, there is no way I'm giving that up.
this

does not make any sense....at all *sigh* seriously people
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
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Reaper195 said:
If Dark Souls had an easy mode...that wouldn't make an average game easier to stand. As much as the difficulty made me rage in Dark Souls, I ended up telling the game to fuck off after I'd spent nearly seven hours on the game, and still had no real idea where I was, who I was, and what I was supposed to be doing.
my problem with the game wa s the difficulty and the amount of time it would have taken to beat

BUT I think your being a bit unfair on the narrative...I barely even started the game If you pay attention (and mabye it helped I went through the opening twice) basically from what I can gather you are somone who is "cursed" and "undead" your a zombie basiacally who hasnt lost his/her mind (I forgot the phrase for that) undead get put into a prison "undead asylum" because obviously theres nothing else for them to do, the player I think is kind of the "chosen one" and ringing the bells I think determines the fate of the undead or saves them....overall I think your trying to save the undead and yourself
 
Sep 14, 2009
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viranimus said:
However here is the problem. The more that I think about it, the more I find reason to accept that, Yes it in fact DOES adversely effect me. It robs me of any sense of satisfaction or accomplishment I could derive from the game knowing that those accomplishments, really arent because anyone can do it if they just dial it down to their level.


In games nowadays, there is no incentive for the player to play on anything other than easy mode. Honestly If games that consistently presented players with challenges to overcome and not evolved into a rubbery safety coated blob of grey beating you over the helmeted head with the painfully obvious, walking you step by step guiding you every step of the way (even in lauded Sandbox games like Fallout for that matter) removing any possible danger posed by accidentally figuring something out without having to be told, If that type of game were a dime a dozen, absolutely, There would be no argument against allowing souls to try to expand its base by making it more accessible.

However, that is not the gaming landscape we live in. Souls specifically gained its notoriety BECAUSE of its punishing difficulty and the challenges it presented. Given that souls gained such note specifically BECAUSE it was a desired niche that had long been left unattended that it stepped in to sate. So yes, there is a world of difference between having an easy toggle switch and a bare minimum for entry. If someone else had to put forth a fraction of the effort that I did, to receive the same result, then it DOES in fact diminish the value of the effort I put forth and outright eliminates any possibility for sense of accomplishment and discourages me to ever bother trying harder. It is no less unreasonable than to try to expect people with Bachelors and Masters degrees to work as farm hands.

Ill finish this with a personalized example. In my first run through of Dark Souls, I heard a lot of clamor about people complaining about the early difficulty of Capra Demon. Now Souls is known for its "trial and error" approach to things like bosses. I can see where Capra would be a problem fending off multiple targets in a not only tight stairway area, but one that visibility is hindered by overgrowth. To me, in reading these mini fits people would throw about Capra brought massive joy and contentment to me, knowing that I put down Capra demon without first dying to it, all rather by accident, not expecting it to be behind the fog door. Without that commonly shared aggravation by having multiple people encounter the same difficulty, I would have never realized Capra was a problem for others, and I would not have found the satisfaction and sense of accomplishment from it that I did.

So that is why I have to take the hard unpopular stance. To remove a major contributing factor of what made a games popularity and leave those that made it popular BECAUSE of that fact with nothing in return to offset that loss, Or other alternatives to fill that void is not acceptable. To have a company do so leaves me with no choice to voice my contempt and dissatisfaction for such a decision by no longer supporting that product by refusing to purchase it, because they no longer produce what I wanted to play.
so to be blunt, you like swinging your e-penis around?

that's quite an arrogant attitude, you don't want someone else to enjoy the game because they don't have the time/reflex/ability to beat something on your difficulty, so they shouldn't at all.

that'd be like me playing *insert sport here* with some insane *how to shoot/score here* and then kicking everyone else off the field/court because they couldn't do it either, even though they were enjoying being out there, just couldn't quite do what I could. If the easy mode did not affect your individual game, in the slightest (separating easy/hard online) then I can't fathom how you are such a jerk that you wouldn't want others to be able to play at their pace.

In games nowadays, there is no incentive for the player to play on anything other than easy mode.
right that is why people never change difficulty sliders? most people i've seen in polls and i know in real life, hardly ever play on easy mode, if not to just learn the basics of the game then they crank it up.
 

NeutralDrow

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Mar 23, 2009
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Reaper195 said:
If Dark Souls had an easy mode...that wouldn't make an average game easier to stand. As much as the difficulty made me rage in Dark Souls, I ended up telling the game to fuck off after I'd spent nearly seven hours on the game, and still had no real idea where I was, who I was, and what I was supposed to be doing.
I sympathize entirely. I actually completed the game, but primarily out of sheer passive-aggression. Didn't help that, on balance of the fun vs. poorly-realized frustration scale, the game itself was only just fun enough to play.

The game does eventually give a definite yet very poorly-defined goal, so I ultimately concluded that I should join the Darkwraiths (after reading the wiki, because screw telling the player anything in the actual game), who I assumed would be the "Chaotic Evil" nihilists, and simply destroy everything in an official way. That way... hooray, there's (apparently) a whole lot of backstory and an intricately detailed world, that is completely screwed over by the abused and manipulated player character who has apparently been willed into existence out of nowhere and takes her revenge on a world that didn't involve her, gave her no reason to exist, and kept her in the dark.

Surprisingly enough, it didn't work that way. I killed the gods, destroyed the sun, kicked sand on the Fire, and ushered in the new Age of Darkness...and that's the good ending. Not even sarcastically, it's actually a Good Ending.

It's also the only time the story works, oddly enough. I became the true Lord of Dark, and I felt awesome.

And if I had gone through that whole thing completely clueless, only to find that the Clueless Ending is basically "your character sacrifices themselves to a thousand years of burning alive, ha ha ha," I would have punched something.
 

octafish

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Apr 23, 2010
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No...but then again I won't be playing Dark Souls 2 at all because it holds no interest for me. I shy away from most easy modes though, usually starting with one step up from normal.
 

viranimus

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Nov 20, 2009
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Vault101 said:
viranimus said:
You know, I am actually glad you framed it in such a way. Please understand me, taking the "cant we all just get along"-ish stance is not lost on me. I do in fact get the reasoning that there is an ideology of everyone enjoying equally. On some level there is merit to that.

However here is the problem. The more that I think about it, the more I find reason to accept that, Yes it in fact DOES adversely effect me. It robs me of any sense of satisfaction or accomplishment I could derive from the game knowing that those accomplishments, really arent because anyone can do it if they just dial it down to their level.
.
thats where this argument stops making sense if we accpet for a second that the inclusion of an easy mode does not in ANY way effect the original game

then THEY turn it down to easy...THEY have to turn it down to easy, you don't .Nothing affects you because [b/]people know the difference between playing on easy and playing on normal/hard[/b] should it ever come up in conversation, sure somone could lie about the difficulty setting they played on...as much as I could lie about finishing dark souls when in fact I didn't.....it comes across as really petty and shall I say whiney that you don't want other people having the option of an easy mode all because of your ego
I know I wrote a lot, but to cut to the quick, Ill point back to the point that show it makes complete sense.

If someone else had to put forth a fraction of the effort that I did, to receive the same result, then it DOES in fact diminish the value of the effort I put forth and outright eliminates any possibility for sense of accomplishment and discourages me to ever bother trying harder. It is no less unreasonable than to try to expect people with Bachelors and Masters degrees to work as farm hands.
Now... you are correct in one factor, it IS about ego. Its about personal pride, self satisfaction, desire to conquer a challenge, then find a greater one to put down. Im sorry, but that is simply wrong because it is NOT a bad thing. Everyone is NOT, nor ever has been equal. We are unique individuals with our own unique strengths and weaknesses. That is what makes us all human. It is also why we work together in groups to supplement each others strengths and weaknesses. But to pander and water something down to account for someones weaknesses only serves to prevent them from figuring out, developing and utilizing their own strengths.

But here... Understand, that a major part of the enjoyment derived from Souls titles, comes from the exhibition and tactical implementation of skill, timing, technique, strategy, etc. To nullify the need for such traits with easy mode, defeats the entire purpose of the games existence. You remove the difficulty all you have is Fable wrapped in a Japanese horror aesthetic.

I am sorry, but.... the notion of calling the desire to not have my effort reduced and diminished to appease others who simply lack the talent and perseverance to complete the game? That is whining that the difficulty is too hard and it should be neutered to accommodate those of lesser skills. When Virtually every other game on the market will dilute itself to accommodate the needs/wants/desires of those gamers, but we still have complaints that this one little niche oriented IP is unjustly difficult, Its just not enough to allow it to be, what it has always been. That is the very definition of petty whining.
 

NeutralDrow

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Vault101 said:
BUT I think your being a bit unfair on the narrative...I barely even started the game If you pay attention (and mabye it helped I went through the opening twice) basically from what I can gather you are somone who is "cursed" and "undead" your a zombie basiacally who hasnt lost his/her mind (I forgot the phrase for that) undead get put into a prison "undead asylum" because obviously theres nothing else for them to do, the player I think is kind of the "chosen one" and ringing the bells I think determines the fate of the undead or saves them....overall I think your trying to save the undead and yourself
The opening cutscene also says that all the dragons are dead and undead can't be killed. And yet, there are still a few dragons around (okay, wyverns, but still), and the only immortal undead character in the game is you (all the NPCs die permanently). I had to go to TV Tropes to figure out why there's an asylum at all, instead of just mass killings of undead. All the opening cutscene ultimately tells you is three or four people who you will eventually have to kill and why they're important in the lore.

There's also no reason given for why the knight in the beginning saves you, and he's basically just been told to ring a church bell somewhere, because it will "reveal the fate of the undead" (which the very first character you meet post-tutorial says is likely bullshit[footnote]
And he's right.
[/footnote]). Ultimately, all ringing those bells does is summon a plesiosaur. And then you wait until the very end of the game to understand anything he's saying, beyond "go here and do this."
 

NeutralDrow

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viranimus said:
Now... you are correct in one factor, it IS about ego. Its about personal pride, self satisfaction, desire to conquer a challenge, then find a greater one to put down. Im sorry, but that is simply wrong because it is NOT a bad thing. Everyone is NOT, nor ever has been equal. We are unique individuals with our own unique strengths and weaknesses. That is what makes us all human. It is also why we work together in groups to supplement each others strengths and weaknesses. But to pander and water something down to account for someones weaknesses only serves to prevent them from figuring out, developing and utilizing their own strengths.
Honestly, it sounds like you're describing an exclusionary group of thin-skinned wonks and simultaneously claiming they have a divine mission and the moral high ground, as though Dark Souls were an expression of a higher calling as opposed to entertainment.
 

TheOtter

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Feb 5, 2010
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My boyfriend is a huge DS nut and has played thousands of hours. He will not be playing any easy mode. I can barely get out of the first room - so I would. As soon as I got better I'd switch to "normal".
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
18,863
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viranimus said:
I know I wrote a lot, but to cut to the quick, Ill point back to the point that show it makes complete sense.

If someone else had to put forth a fraction of the effort that I did, to receive the same result, then it DOES in fact diminish the value of the effort I put forth and outright eliminates any possibility for sense of accomplishment and discourages me to ever bother trying harder. It is no less unreasonable than to try to expect people with Bachelors and Masters degrees to work as farm hands.

Now... you are correct in one factor, it IS about ego. Its about personal pride, self satisfaction, desire to conquer a challenge, then find a greater one to put down. Im sorry, but that is simply wrong because it is NOT a bad thing. Everyone is NOT, nor ever has been equal. We are unique individuals with our own unique strengths and weaknesses. That is what makes us all human. It is also why we work together in groups to supplement each others strengths and weaknesses. But to pander and water something down to account for someones weaknesses only serves to prevent them from figuring out, developing and utilizing their own strengths.

But here... Understand, that a major part of the enjoyment derived from Souls titles, comes from the exhibition and tactical implementation of skill, timing, technique, strategy, etc. To nullify the need for such traits with easy mode, defeats the entire purpose of the games existence. You remove the difficulty all you have is Fable wrapped in a Japanese horror aesthetic.

I am sorry, but.... the notion of calling the desire to not have my effort reduced and diminished to appease others who simply lack the talent and perseverance to complete the game? That is whining that the difficulty is too hard and it should be neutered to accommodate those of lesser skills. When Virtually every other game on the market will dilute itself to accommodate the needs/wants/desires of those gamers, but we still have complaints that this one little niche oriented IP is unjustly difficult, Its just not enough to allow it to be, what it has always been. That is the very definition of petty whining.
I'm still reading the same elitist BS here

I WOULD be against an easy mode if it [b/]in anyway detracted from the hard/normal mode of dark souls EDIT: on a technical level[/b] <-THAT right there is a whole other argument...but not what "I" am arguing...my hypothetical is if ti doesnt...so then why the hell not?

I mean it would baffle me why somone would pick up a game like mass effect or dragon age and cut through all the cutscenes and pay no mind to the story/dialouge.....but if they have the option to do that then its their loss and not my problem...
 

viranimus

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Nov 20, 2009
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NeutralDrow said:
viranimus said:
Now... you are correct in one factor, it IS about ego. Its about personal pride, self satisfaction, desire to conquer a challenge, then find a greater one to put down. Im sorry, but that is simply wrong because it is NOT a bad thing. Everyone is NOT, nor ever has been equal. We are unique individuals with our own unique strengths and weaknesses. That is what makes us all human. It is also why we work together in groups to supplement each others strengths and weaknesses. But to pander and water something down to account for someones weaknesses only serves to prevent them from figuring out, developing and utilizing their own strengths.
Honestly, it sounds like you're describing an exclusionary group of thin-skinned wonks and simultaneously claiming they have a divine mission and the moral high ground, as though Dark Souls were an expression of a higher calling as opposed to entertainment.
Yes, In a way I am. The group of "thin skinned wonks" who think they have divine right to be entitled to consume content despite lacking the needed prerequisites to complete it or hell even appreciate it. Its sort of the same thing as if that one kid in school that always said they wanted to be a doctor, were able to expect the requirements of the position to be changed, simply because they couldnt get a grip on the math courses required.

______________________________________________________________________________________

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a game being catered for its audience. In fact it happens all the time. The only thing that doesnt make sense in all of this is why exactly is it wrong for a game to be designed, not for everyone? Why are the people who think the game is too hard and want an easy mode for it, completely reasonable in their request, when if given what they want they will not be able to appreciate the enjoyment and quality of the game because they removed what generated it? Why out of the literally THOUSANDS of games that offer that variable difficulty made accessible for all level of ability and fit every other niche Souls does, must this one brütally difficult(not really) game, be watered down and nullified to be just exactly like everything else? Why do we as gamers seek not to elevate our pass time to greater heights and more complex challenges , but drag it down to the lowest common denominator with the rote and mundane?

And yet, we as its community will still have the audacity to try to place all the blame of the industry not taking risks, and being in the business of carbon copy cloning the same products endlessly. Perhaps if we didnt start brandishing pitchforks and torches when something comes along that isnt for everyone and deviates from the path, we might just see more variety.
 

viranimus

Thread killer
Nov 20, 2009
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Vault101 said:
I'm still reading the same elitist BS here

I WOULD be against an easy mode if it [b/]in anyway detracted from the hard/normal mode of dark souls [/b] <-THAT right there is a whole other argument...but not what "I" am arguing...my hypothetical is if ti doesnt...so then why the hell not?

I mean it would baffle me why somone would pick up a game like mass effect or dragon age and cut through all the cutscenes and pay no mind to the story/dialouge.....but if they have the option to do that then its their loss and not my problem...
Ok thats understandable. If you want to understand, then stop ignoring the fact that It most certainly DOES detract from all modes as if it does not exist. Your hypothetical is based on that incorrect assumption. If you chose to ignore the facts of a case, picking and choosing what you will consider as valid, how can you possibly come to an informed decision?

Im sorry, the problem isnt elitism here. The problem is detrimental tolerance
 

NeutralDrow

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Mar 23, 2009
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viranimus said:
NeutralDrow said:
viranimus said:
Now... you are correct in one factor, it IS about ego. Its about personal pride, self satisfaction, desire to conquer a challenge, then find a greater one to put down. Im sorry, but that is simply wrong because it is NOT a bad thing. Everyone is NOT, nor ever has been equal. We are unique individuals with our own unique strengths and weaknesses. That is what makes us all human. It is also why we work together in groups to supplement each others strengths and weaknesses. But to pander and water something down to account for someones weaknesses only serves to prevent them from figuring out, developing and utilizing their own strengths.
Honestly, it sounds like you're describing an exclusionary group of thin-skinned wonks and simultaneously claiming they have a divine mission and the moral high ground, as though Dark Souls were an expression of a higher calling as opposed to entertainment.
Yes, In a way I am. The group of "thin skinned wonks" who think they have divine right to be entitled to consume content despite lacking the needed prerequisites to complete it or hell even appreciate it. Its sort of the same thing as if that one kid in school that always said they wanted to be a doctor, were able to expect the requirements of the position to be changed, simply because they couldnt get a grip on the math courses required.
Your sarcasm would actually work if

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a game being catered for its audience. In fact it happens all the time. The only thing that doesnt make sense in all of this is why exactly is it wrong for a game to be designed, not for everyone?
wasn't pretty much opposite of everything you've said and the exact position of everyone in this thread actually advocating an easy mode. You're the one who's taking the "separate design" philosophy espoused by an "easy mode" option and claiming that by its mere existence, it will ruin the fabric of the game (like a microcosm of my country's politics). There's a difference between socratic method and just plain saying "NO U."
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
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viranimus said:
Ok thats understandable. If you want to understand, then stop ignoring the fact that It most certainly DOES detract from all modes as if it does not exist. Your hypothetical is based on that incorrect assumption. If you chose to ignore the facts of a case, picking and choosing what you will consider as valid, how can you possibly come to an informed decision?

Im sorry, the problem isnt elitism here. The problem is detrimental tolerance
I ment [b/]on a technical level[/b] in terms of the actual game mechanics...that is (which I had to go back and edit because it wasnt clear in the context of this argument)

with that in mind YOU ACTUALLY HAVE TO PHYSICSLLY CHANGE SETTINGS so there is NO confusion as to who is "leet" and who isn't

this bullshit is all in your head, I mean its not [i/]enough[/i] for you to have the satisisfaction of you beating it on hard/normal...oh no, as far as your concerned those other kids can;t play with your toys because you don;t get to feel as special

boo-fucking-hoo