Angry_squirrel said:
So in your opinion, the life of a species of equal intelligence to us is worth less, because it was born different? I suspect thought patterns like this are how racism started.
This line of "reasoning (used very loosely) really grinds my gears. It's not at all like racism. Let me get you a definition so you can understand what racism is: "Racism is generally defined as actions, practices, attitudes, or beliefs that reflect or support the racial worldview: the ideology that humans are divided into separate and exclusive biological entities called "races". This ideology entails the belief that members of a race share a set of characteristic traits, abilities, or qualities, that traits of personality, intellect, morality, and other cultural behavioral characteristics are inherited, and that this inheritance means that races can be ranked as innately superior or inferior to others."
If you want to call it "speciesism", sure, that is reasonable and true. I suggest you read this article, particularly the first paragraph: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speciesism
Calling me equivalent to a racist because I support my own species first is misinformed and insulting. Humans are born superior to any animal on the planet by a long shot. The hypothetical alien race scenario is interesting, but not very likely at this time, hence, not really worth arguing about. Races, however, are all almost the same. We have different skin pigments, and slightly different physical features, but our anatomy and organs are the same. A black man can do anything a white man can do, a white man can do whatever an Asian man can do, etc. A chimp cannot do what a human can do, hence they are worth less.
And there is your problem. I suspect you're someone who has either never owned a pet, or at least never grown attached to one. Not only that, but you've already said that you place virtually no value on animal life. It's really not all that surprising you'd save the stranger then. So I think it's not unreasonable to assume that you simply find the idea of having an attachment to a pet so unusual, that you're having trouble empathizing with the point of view of a pet owner? You're about as biased an one could possibly be.
And you aren't biased? I think you're just as biased, but on the other side of the stick. I wouldn't be happy to see the animal drown, but if it meant saving a human life, I feel that any decent human would choose to save the person.
That is just an opinion, and while I agree with the part I've highlighted, I disagree with the rest.
So, in your opinion, humans are inherently more important than animals. Why?
Most people would answer "because we're more intelligent" and I would agree with that. But why then, would a hypothetical alien species of equal intelligence to us, be less important? What exactly gives us more inherent worth than another species of equal intelligence, simply because we're born to a different body.
You could also argue that "murder is bad" is just an opinion. Does that make such an opinion invalid?
The list of why we are superior is more than one item long. Intelligence is important, but some humans are arguably dumber than animals. With our technology, we are also vastly faster, stronger, and control most of the planet. As for aliens, that's too hypothetical to answer. We have no idea what kind of life forms are out there and how much they differ from life here on earth.
I have a question for you related to this, would you eat a human? Would you condone raising and killing humans in a slaughterhouse for food? Assume you aren't a vegetarian, of course. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you wouldn't. So,
why? Extreme example, maybe, but hardly worse than your racism idea.
This is why I drew the parallel about someone of great value to the world, verses a close family member. Saving the close family member will cause much more suffering, but you save them anyway, because you love them.
Perhaps, but they are still both human. Either way, someone is mourning their loss and will be affected by it for years to come. Is your pet dying gonna send you into depression for years of your life? I hope not, since most dogs live less than 15 years and I hope you live longer than that.
If my pet died, my family and I would mourn him, in exactly the same way the stranger's family might mourn the stranger's death. Yes, it likely wouldn't be as bad for us as it would be for the strangers family, but it'd still be bad.
You might be sad for a few weeks, but you seemed pretty vehement that you'd save a human member of your family over the animal variants, so your grief wouldn't be on the same scale. I've seen many friends lose their pets, and one mother lose her son. The latter was far too horrible to be compared to the former.
Tell you what, in the quote below, I'm going to replace the word "human", with "white" and the word "animal" with, I don't know, "Asian".
Order of importance. I still believe that a fundamental part of being white is that first priority should be our own kind until such a time that it's proven that the whites cannot coexist peacefully with other whites. Regardless of the amount of attachment, that should be a secondary way to determine whom to save. The fact that anyone would place ANY Asian life over a white's bothers me immensely.
It sounds really quite disgusting when I put it like that, doesn't it?
I'll tell you what, 50 years ago, the quote above would have seemed normal. It's good we got past that way of thinking, isn't it?
I know it's an extreme example, but the principal remains the same: What you're saying is extremely prejudice.
Well yes, when you totally modify the meaning of my sentence, it seems like a racist viewpoint. And I'm sure I could modify your words to make it seem like you are one of those wackos who values animal life over human life.
Let me make it simple for you, humans are all more or less equal. Some are born weaker, smarter, etc, but it's not determined by race, but by fate and DNA. Animals are always born dumber and (if you count our technology, which you should) stronger and faster. We are superior. Blond hair, white skin, and blue eyes does not make you superior to all people with brown hair and brown skin, in fact, they are genetically stronger. This animals right movement is nothing like the racial equality movement, trying to tie the two together is inherently offensive, and trivializes the suffering of other races.
