Relationship Advice (long post)

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marioandsonic

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Nov 28, 2009
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Before I begin, I just want to say that I'm posting this here because I really have no idea where else I can turn to. Maybe I just feel like venting it out here because it would be cheaper than a therapist or whatever, but anyway, here we go.

First, the backstory:

Back in early 2008, I had started going to college. While I was there, my roommates were big players of World of Warcraft. I had always wanted to try and play WoW (mainly because of that South Park episode), so I joined in on their server. It was great fun to play, even though I only had my dad's hand-me-down laptop that could barely play the thing at 25 fps on the lowest settings.

Eventually, I reached level 70, and wanted to join a raiding guild. Well, the leader of the guild I was on said he was going to one, and he was happy to take me along. The new guild was fun to be in, but that's not what really was important here. The important thing is that the guild was where I met...her.

She was a very assertive woman. She was the kind that could be really nice one moment, but if you went against her at all, she was going to argue with you, and she wasn't afraid to pull any punches. Nonetheless, she was one of the most active and helpful members of our guild. She was even the one that guided me through my first heroic as a tank.

Later, after coming back to the dorm after classes on day, I found out she had left the guild. Apparently, one of the other guild members said something unflattering about her son. Like a mama bear protecting her cub, she pretty much pounced on the guy and ragequitted the guild for not kicking him. So, she sent me a whisper saying that if I wanted to stay in contact, I would have to add her to my WoW friends list. I didn't mind, of course, and this started what became the most ridiculous, crazy, and confusing relationship I had ever been with.

Over the next couple of months up until the release of Wrath of the Lich King, we stayed in close contact. Most of our talk was about WoW, but some of the talks got into more personal stuff. During this time, I developed a crush on her. However, not only did she already have a child, she was still married (even though she often expressed how much she hated the guy and wanted to leave him). And I was just a college kid, so I didn't think it would be a good idea to tell her. So, I kept my mouth shut about that.

By the time WotLK came out, I had to quit the game. Not only because I couldn't afford the $15/month fee at the time, but also because that crappy laptop gave out on me. So, I couldn't speak to her for a time.

In the spring of '09, my grandmother gave me $1000, which she promised to give to me each year while I was in college. One of the first things I bought were computer parts so I could build myself a decent gaming PC. So, one of the first things I did with that was renew my subscription. As I was signing on, I wondered if she was still there, or even if she remembered me.

Thankfully, she was very happy to see me back. We filled each other in on what we had gone through the last few months. For her, she finally moved out to live with her new boyfriend (even though she was still technically married). Admittedly, I was a bit disappointed she had a new boyfriend, but I was still supportive of the two. By Christmas of that year, she made the news that she was pregnant.

Unfortunately, this is where things started to go downhill. She and him began to fight, and it did get ugly a few times.

Then, one night, while we were questing, she sent me a whisper saying that she was starting to fall for me. My brain told me to stop this before things got crazy, but my heart (and a certain other part of my body) wanted me to go on. You can probably guess which choice I made. So, for the next couple of months, we flirted a bit behind her boyfriend's back.

Looking back on it, it was a really stupid and awful thing to do. I was a 21-year-old virgin with pretty much no dating experience, so the dumbass that is me thought this would be my best, and probably only, chance at a relationship.

Eventually, the fighting between the two came to a head soon after the baby was born. She couldn't stand him anymore, and moved back in with her parents with her two sons.

During the next few months, we tried to make a long-distance relationship work. We spoke to each other over the phone, texted, and Skyped (and yes, some of those Skype sessions were definitely NSFW). In the end, however, we figured it simply wouldn't work. She was in between jobs and raising her kids, and I was still a poor college student on the other side of the country. So, we decided to break it off on friendly terms. It was bittersweet, but we still didn't speak for a while because of it. That, and Cataclysm was new, and...neither of us liked Cata, so we both left WoW for a while. We only chatted maybe a couple times a month after that. During that time, she found another boyfriend to move in with.

Then, more than a year later, I rejoined WoW, and we started questing again (on a different server though, because she wanted to give role-playing a try). We even role-played as well on occasion.

This went on until Summer of '13, after Mists of Pandaria came out. She announced she was pregnant once again. Now you may be thinking "what, she started fighting with him, right?" Actually, no, they really didn't fight much, and they even got married.

But, even thought I hadn't really been with her in over 2 years, I still had feelings for her. I still blamed myself for what happened to her former lover (even thought she insisted I wasn't to blame, as the relationship was pretty much doomed at that point), and I didn't want that to happen again. So, in November of that year, I sent her an email saying I was going to take a break from her. She sent me a text later that night saying "Okay. Cool. Goodbye."

So, I spent a couple of weeks not talking to her, and was no longer a WoW subscriber. Then on Thanksgiving, I sent her a text wishing her a happy thanksgiving, and we talked a bit.

But then, the shit hit the fan. Two weeks before Christmas, she sent me a text saying it would be best if we didn't speak...permanently. What followed was probably one of the worst nights of my life. I practically begged her not to do this, but she said I started it by taking that hiatus from her. I pretty much had to cry myself to sleep that night, then, well, safe to say I didn't have a very merry Christmas that year, as I was depressed for weeks.

So yes, I did what I did because I thought it would prevent our friendship from falling apart. Instead, it did the exact freaking opposite. All I thought at the time was "Shoot me. Shoot me now!"

It's worth noting that I haven't mentioned this to pretty much anyone else. Not to other friends or family. I didn't think they would be very understanding, or would think I was the one in the wrong (which I wouldn't have denied, honestly).

Eventually, I did get a bit better and was able to move on. But then, earlier this year, I saw she had posted a WoW video on Youtube (I forgot I was still subscribed to her. Oops.) And all those memories came flooding back.

I thought more about our last conversations. Did I really hurt her that badly? Did I act insensitively to her feelings, and she just wasn't saying it? Or did she not really like me that much by the time I sent the email? Or by the time she was pregnant? Did she not really like me at all in the first place?!

At that point, I felt I had to send her one final message. So, I sent her a Youtube PM saying I was apologizing for anything I had done wrong to her, and that I just wanted closure from everything. Finally, I asked if she hated me for what I did.

I did get a reply back, but while I was hoping it would be a message of closure, it instead raised further questions.

Remember that ex-boyfriend I said earlier? Well, he apparently found out which realm her character was now on, and was constantly harassing her in the game. She said she didn't appreciate me telling him where she was.

So yes, she was blaming me for her ex-boyfriend finding out where she was.

But that made no sense. I haven't spoken to the guy since 2010. I didn't know where he was, or how to contact him. Earlier, even she couldn't find him, because he owed her child support. And even if I knew where the guy was, why would I tell him that? Despite everything that happened, I have nothing but the utmost respect for her. She was there during some of the darkest moments of my life. If it wasn't for her, there's a very real possibility I wouldn't be here to post this.

So why would I go and ruin all that? For revenge? Revenge for what, no longer being friends with me because of something stupid that I did? Look, I'm not going to claim Man of the Year. I've done some stupid and bad things in my life. But this would never be one of them.

So...I sent her another PM, saying I never told him that, and I never would.

I haven't gotten a response from that PM, and it's been over a month. (She probably has me on "Ignore" or something.)

So, that's where we are now.

I don't know what to do at this point. Should I try to contact her again? Ignore it, and move on? Punch myself in the face for being so stupid?


And that's pretty much all I have to say. You can look at this and think and post that I'm a monster that deserved what I got. And if you want to think that, go ahead. I just wanted to get all of this off of my chest.
 

buffbabybear

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Apr 24, 2014
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No one else seems to be replying, so I made an account with the explicit intention of helping you out of your predicament.

I'm going to start off by stating the obvious: you are not a monster. You did not instigate any of these reactions from this girl, nor did you bring this upon yourself by keeping up sporadic contact with this person. Maintaining contact is what friends do. You deciding to cut things off with her was just you being sensible and not wanting to encroach into another person's relationship. From my perspective, you can stop blaming yourself for this woman's misfortune. That seems to be what's afflicting you the most. So I suggest that you simply take a step back, read over what you have written, and cease being so critical of yourself!

Let's start with the facts: this woman has been in three separate relationships, and has (from my understanding) had three kids with each of her partners. Is your instability alarm going off yet? It is clear as day that she wasn't solely flirting with just you, as she started dating some other dude all the while she dated her husband. Here's a cold truth for you: you, likely out of inexperience, overemphasized the importance of your "relationship" with her. She was likely using you for an emotional rush: prolific cheaters have an addiction to that, so don't sweat it. Hence the whole R-Rated Skypeversations and internet relationships, etc.

Just to wrap things up, the very fact that she starts accusing you for some BS you hadn't done is enough to convince me she's off of her rocker. No sane person assumes these things, and she's likely super accusatory with her partners as well, which is probably the reason why her relationships fall apart.

Anyway, I think I've driven this point home. I think it's obvious that you dodged a bullet here. This girl would have brought you nothing but misery and sadness, and you should be happy that you did not become even more emotionally invested in her before this breakdown in relations took place.

My advice to you is to get outside, and go explore the world for a little bit. Get some perspective on things that truly matter, ways to improve yourself, ways to be pragmatic and move forward. Hopefully, you'll eventually come to the realization that an internet relationship is not the most pressing worry on your mind.

But if it is, know that I envy you.
 

DikkieDik

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Jun 14, 2010
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women and kids from other men. run for ur sanity man. u cant get the girl without the kids with it. Before u know it u will be paying for their lives as well. youre in college, find a nice girl make ur own if thats what u want and stay the HELL away from this one.
 

Rylot

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May 14, 2010
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buffbabybear said:
Pretty much this. You didn't do anything wrong. She's clearly got emotional issues that aren't your fault and you couldn't do anything about. You really did doge a bullet here. It isn't impossible to have a healthy long distance relationship even over the internet, but this wasn't gonna work out. Best to chalk it up to life experiences and find a girl who likes you, not an emotionally immature person who's just using you to fill an emotional void. Best of luck.
 

Callate

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Dec 5, 2008
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Honestly, my baseline reaction is: Gah!

...But that's a hindsight kind of reaction, hindsight after years of witnessing the drama of other people's relationships (and admittedly, having a fair amount of my own before realizing that there were people who deliberately injected drama into their interactions with others and it was okay to avoid them.)

I'll chime with the others that no, you're not a monster. And please, for the love of all that is good and holy, do not contact her again. I completely understand that receiving a lot of attention and affection from a member of the opposite sex can be both flattering and hard to give up, particularly if you aren't especially experienced in relationships. But the person you are describing here is a serial cheater with multiple children who seems to a) compulsively bring drama into her own life and b) has a hair-trigger temper, a long memory for perceived "slights", and little to no capacity for introspection.

I would gently suggest that if you're looking for a relationship, you find it somewhere other than WoW. Not saying there's anything wrong with WoW, or the people who play it, and yes, there have been stories of a few long-lasting romantic relationships that started there. But there are huge numbers of things that you only discover about someone by spending time with them around other people, talking about things other than a shared hobby.

Chalk this up to experience, be glad it wasn't any worse (as it definitely sounds like it could have been), and move on.
 

marioandsonic

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Nov 28, 2009
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...Wow, I'm surprised at the positive comments in this thread, lol. Thanks a lot, folks.

I haven't sent her a new message or anything. Like I said, I last sent her a PM about a month and a half ago, so the ball's in her court now anyway. If she really doesn't want to speak to me again, then...well, that's her decision.

It's a shame, because I really did genuinely have feelings for her. Still, as others have suggested, maybe that's because I have little to no relationship experience, so I saw her through rose-tinted glasses.

Anyway, thanks again for the encouraging responses.
 

buffbabybear

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Apr 24, 2014
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marioandsonic said:
...Wow, I'm surprised at the positive comments in this thread, lol. Thanks a lot, folks.

I haven't sent her a new message or anything. Like I said, I last sent her a PM about a month and a half ago, so the ball's in her court now anyway. If she really doesn't want to speak to me again, then...well, that's her decision.

It's a shame, because I really did genuinely have feelings for her. Still, as others have suggested, maybe that's because I have little to no relationship experience, so I saw her through rose-tinted glasses.

Anyway, thanks again for the encouraging responses.
Responding to her is certainly your prerogative, but I can almost guarantee that it will never work out the way you want it to.
 

endnuen

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Sep 20, 2010
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How many red flags do you need before you divert all power to main thrusters and speed the fuck away?
Trust me on this, forget about her, she is bad news and not healthy for you. Just delete every evidence you have of her ever existing and get on with your own life.
 

marioandsonic

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Nov 28, 2009
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Sorry to bump this again, but I just recently deleted most of the past evidence I had of her (text messages, emails, instant messaging). It was kinda sad in a way, but at the same time, it had to be done.

Going through it, I actually found a couple World of Warcraft RP stories we had wrote together. I'm surprised I was able to write that well, lol.

So yeah, pretty much everything is deleted now.

[sub][sub]I feel like keeping the nude pictures, though.[/sub][/sub]
 

Smooth Operator

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Oct 5, 2010
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Well you live and learn, eventually some really bad shit will go down with relationships especially when you are new to it but you get through things and have a valuable experience for the future.
And all the "what could I do different, what could have been, what was their impression of me,..." is very understandable for a mind going crazy with emotions but it is all completely nonsensical noise, "shit did not work between us" is the only relevant bottom line.
Also do not keep anything around, this was a messy one so do not keep those old band aids because they will make those wounds 10x worse in the long run.

In case you are still wondering, yes that person was an extremely bad choice of partner. I get that impulsive people are really exciting to be around with, but their charged personality is also poison to every relationship and the longer you keep it going the more dangerous things get.
 

Lilani

Sometimes known as CaitieLou
May 27, 2009
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Now, I'm only making a few guesses based on my own experiences. I don't know her or any of her intentions, so I could be wrong about this, but based on a couple of similar experiences of my own I sort of feel like I know what's going on with her.

I think one thing that is obvious here is you took your relationship a lot more seriously than she did, or at the very least she never seemed to be compelled to steer away from other relationships regardless of where your relationship was at any point in time. Now, I have a boyfriend, but I also play online games with friends I have known through these games for a long time. Recently, one of my friends and I decided to prank a raid by saying lovey-dovey and sometimes slightly sexual things in the alliance chat, acting like the most obnoxious kind of gaming couple. He started it, but I continued it with him until the end of the raid. But, then he kept wanting to do it again and again in other raids, and while I thought it was funny the first time I didn't really want to do it again. And then I felt like after that, he started paying a lot more attention to me than usual, and once after a group of us video-skyped during a raid, he sent me a message in skype exclusively to tell me how beautiful I was (it was his first time seeing me).

That was when it became very clear to me things weren't quite right there. He knew I had a boyfriend and specifically said once he had no intention of splitting us up, and I knew I had no intention of splitting up for him, it still just didn't feel right. Until that point I hadn't really been in such an awkward situation during a relationship before, but I've always felt that if something you're doing doesn't FEEL right, then it probably isn't right. So I finally just sat down and told him that, and he agreed to keep such compliments to himself from now on. I'm not going to pretend I know if he was being serious about having no intention of stealing me from my boyfriend or not, but as long as he keeps that stuff to himself I can at least say for certain I've made my case clear and I'm staying within bounds. And if he breaks his word and persists on, then I'll just have to tell him to keep away altogether.

So I feel like that might have been where her mind was. She's trying to be in relationships with other people, and you're trying to be in a relationship with her, which just puts her in the terrible position of either having to choose you (which up to this point she hasn't done, and doesn't seem to show an inclination to do in the near future), or choose another relationship while being friends with you (who doesn't seem to show an inclination to avoid flirting with somebody who's already in a relationship). So, she decided to remove the awkwardness of being friends with somebody who wants to be more than just friends, because maintaining such a relationship while in another dedicated relationship is a very uncomfortable situation to be in. I suppose she could have done what I did with my friend and ask you to not be flirty or hint at a relationship anymore, but given your history if that's really how she felt, then perhaps she didn't trust herself to be able to remain just friends with you or not be tempted.

Now again, this is all conjecture on my part. I could be totally misreading this. But regardless of whether or not it's true, the thing I'm absolutely certain of is you need to respect her wishes. Regardless of why, regardless of who's in the right or who did what wrong, she doesn't want to speak with you anymore and if you have any respect for her as a person then you should just leave her be and let her do what she believes is right. And as others have pointed out, with how much she seems to be in and out of relationships, it might be for the best.
 

marioandsonic

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Lilani said:
Now, I'm only making a few guesses based on my own experiences. I don't know her or any of her intentions, so I could be wrong about this, but based on a couple of similar experiences of my own I sort of feel like I know what's going on with her.

I think one thing that is obvious here is you took your relationship a lot more seriously than she did, or at the very least she never seemed to be compelled to steer away from other relationships regardless of where your relationship was at any point in time.
That does seem rather likely. Maybe it's because of the situation she was in, or maybe she just never really thought it would work out...I don't know.

Lilani said:
Now, I have a boyfriend, but I also play online games with friends I have known through these games for a long time. Recently, one of my friends and I decided to prank a raid by saying lovey-dovey and sometimes slightly sexual things in the alliance chat, acting like the most obnoxious kind of gaming couple. He started it, but I continued it with him until the end of the raid. But, then he kept wanting to do it again and again in other raids, and while I thought it was funny the first time I didn't really want to do it again. And then I felt like after that, he started paying a lot more attention to me than usual, and once after a group of us video-skyped during a raid, he sent me a message in skype exclusively to tell me how beautiful I was (it was his first time seeing me).

That was when it became very clear to me things weren't quite right there. He knew I had a boyfriend and specifically said once he had no intention of splitting us up, and I knew I had no intention of splitting up for him, it still just didn't feel right. Until that point I hadn't really been in such an awkward situation during a relationship before, but I've always felt that if something you're doing doesn't FEEL right, then it probably isn't right. So I finally just sat down and told him that, and he agreed to keep such compliments to himself from now on. I'm not going to pretend I know if he was being serious about having no intention of stealing me from my boyfriend or not, but as long as he keeps that stuff to himself I can at least say for certain I've made my case clear and I'm staying within bounds. And if he breaks his word and persists on, then I'll just have to tell him to keep away altogether.
That certainly would make any woman uncomfortable, and I'm sorry you went through that.

Of course, I can't really say anything bad about the guy (glass houses, and all that). My guess is that he was in the same boat as I was/am; He was engaging with flirtatious behavior with a girl he enjoyed being with, he got a bit too into it, and since gamers tend not to be very outgoing, this was one of the few chances he figured he was going to get to be in a relationship. Now, I don't know the guy, but that's my best guess.

Lilani said:
So I feel like that might have been where her mind was. She's trying to be in relationships with other people, and you're trying to be in a relationship with her, which just puts her in the terrible position of either having to choose you (which up to this point she hasn't done, and doesn't seem to show an inclination to do in the near future), or choose another relationship while being friends with you (who doesn't seem to show an inclination to avoid flirting with somebody who's already in a relationship). So, she decided to remove the awkwardness of being friends with somebody who wants to be more than just friends, because maintaining such a relationship while in another dedicated relationship is a very uncomfortable situation to be in. I suppose she could have done what I did with my friend and ask you to not be flirty or hint at a relationship anymore, but given your history if that's really how she felt, then perhaps she didn't trust herself to be able to remain just friends with you or not be tempted.
Again, that's all pretty likely. I'm sure it wasn't an easy thing for her either, and I hate to think I put her through so much unneeded stress because of the selfish desires I had.

When we chatted on Yahoo IM when she was with her first boyfriend, she kept saying about how much she didn't like the guy anymore and wanted to be with me. Did she really mean all that? Was it just the heat of the moment? Was it hormones, due to her being pregnant?

Only she knows for sure...

Lilani said:
Now again, this is all conjecture on my part. I could be totally misreading this. But regardless of whether or not it's true, the thing I'm absolutely certain of is you need to respect her wishes. Regardless of why, regardless of who's in the right or who did what wrong, she doesn't want to speak with you anymore and if you have any respect for her as a person then you should just leave her be and let her do what she believes is right. And as others have pointed out, with how much she seems to be in and out of relationships, it might be for the best.
As I stated before, I only sent her one more message back in March, simply stating I wasn't the one who revealed to her first boyfriend what WoW server she was on. I don't know if she believes the message or not (or even if she read it), but it's ultimately up to her if she wants to respond. I'm not sending her anything more at this point.

Honestly, I really hope she's happy with the guy she's with now. Considering he's with a woman that already has two kids from two past relationships, I'm sure he's doing a much better job than I ever could.

And finally: yes, I ultimately did delete everything. Even the nude pics.