Rogue One Discussion (POTENTIAL SPOILERS WITHIN)

[Johnny Novgorod]

I liked it overall, except for:

- Young orphaned farmer from a desert planet, again?
- Vader doing that silly pun.
- The mystery surrounding Cassian doesn't really pay off or come into play like you think it will.
- Beyond the two leads and the droid the other characters didn't have much going for them.
- The droid's Whedon-speak was very hit and miss.
- CGI Tarkin is ethically questionable.

 

[BaronVH]

Gonna step out there and say this was the best of the eight. The reason is that it is the one that is the Star WARS. The good guys have to do bad things to win. The good guys have to sacrifice their lives and way of life for the chance to win. This movie did not pull any punches while correcting a glaring flaw from a New Hope. For the casual movie goer is it perfect? No. It has computer generated main characters and the ending only works if you know how A New Hope begins. Is it perfect for me? He'll yes. Is it a one and a half star movie? Not even if it were reviewed by Jar Jar.

 

[Winnosh]

Watched it, loved it. Only had one major problem that took me out of the film. And that problem is that they made an entire movie who's plot is to explain away the flaw in the Death Star, and come up with some reason for why it was there.

I hate the idea of the flaw being put there by a rebel collaborator. First of all it's not really a flaw in the system. It's a coolent tunnel for Gigantic Space weapon. You can't have the damn thing completely insulated, the heat has to go somewhere or else the thing blows up. You bomb the reactor of anything, and it blows, that's not a flaw, it's a feature.

It seemed like they were trying to placate people who need an explination for everything, yet forget that it didn't need any explaining. It would be like doing a movie about why Stormtroopers are bad shots. But forgetting that Stormtroopers aren't bad shots, they just can't hit heroes who have plot armor firmly attached. Or who like in A New Hope, there were under orders not to hit in the first place.

 

[Scarim Coral]

I pretty much loved it despite some naysayers. However now it has been days I had seen it, there are a couple of plotholes/ question I have to raise-

Near the end of Attack of the Clones, the Sepertist had a hologram of the Death Star which I guess is the blueprint. Does that means the main character father as an archtitech is invalid? Ok I can assume he is still valid since he probably needed to finish/ polished it off. I mean the contructions took many years right since in Rebel (canon) a piece of it was being made on Genosis.

Why Leia was inside the flagship or rather why that Bladerunner was still inside it during the battle? Being a Princess, she was in a dangerous situation despite she can take cared of herself.

 

[bastardofmelbourne]

I hate the idea of the flaw being put there by a rebel collaborator. First of all it's not really a flaw in the system. It's a coolent tunnel for Gigantic Space weapon. You can't have the damn thing completely insulated, the heat has to go somewhere or else the thing blows up. You bomb the reactor of anything, and it blows, that's not a flaw, it's a feature.

I think it was more that if you bombed it, it would literally explode, as opposed to just "stops working." Like a nuclear reactor compared to a nuclear bomb; when reactors are damaged, they become super dangerous because of the extreme temperatures and the fallout, but they don't go off like a nuclear bomb. A damaged reactor is just a pile of highly radioactive material sitting there being radioactive. For nuclear materials to explode, you have to design a device specifically to make them explode. They don't just go "critical" and then make a mushroom cloud.

They actually refer to the weakness as a "fuse" once or twice, so I think it legitimately was just him putting some kind of Kyber-powered nuke into the reactor. Which begs the question: why not just make Kyber bombs if they're that powerful? Why is this moon-sized space station so inefficient?!?!

Near the end of Attack of the Clones, the Sepertist had a hologram of the Death Star which I guess is the blueprint. Does that means the main character father as an archtitech is invalid? Ok I can assume he is still valid since he probably needed to finish/ polished it off. I mean the contructions took many years right since in Rebel (canon) a piece of it was being made on Genosis.

Jyn's father was specifically an expert in Kyber crystals, which were used to power the Death Star superlaser and - in the new canon - also to power Jedi lightsabers.

So I think the station - which was an impressive feat of engineering in itself - was designed by the Geonosians as a kind of progression from the Trade Federation's doughnut-battlestations [http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/34/Lucrehulk_blockade.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20101029182146], and Jyn's dad was brought in to design the reactor and the superlaser, which are both even more impressive feats considering how much energy it takes to turn a planet into asteroids in less than a second.

Why Leia was inside the flagship or rather why that Bladerunner was still inside it during the battle? Being a Princess, she was in a dangerous situation despite she can take cared of herself.

That one really fucking bugged me and felt like one of the most forced parts of the ending. Bail Organa bails (heh) on Yavin IV earlier to go back to Alderaan, and specifically says that he's going to find someone trustworthy (his daughter).

But a few hours later at Scarif, Leia and her "diplomatic vessel" are attached to a Mon Calamari cruiser, with C-3PO and R2-D2 (last seen on Yavin IV) on board, ready to get jettisoned onto Tatooine. It doesn't make any sense; if the droids were on Yavin, then Leia and her ship should've been on Yavin. But if Leia was on Yavin, why did Bail go back to Alderaan? More importantly, why'd she decide to hitch a very-impromptu ride on a much larger ship going into a suicide mission? What combat role did she expect to play from inside her unarmed ambassador's ship while inside the hangar of an actual combat ship? Even if she was just being suicidally reckless, her mere presence there would ensure Imperial retaliation against Alderaan if they failed!

It would have made much more sense for Bail to be at the Battle of Scarif, die there (a better send-off for the character than being killed offscreen in an earlier film) but pass off the Death Star data to his daughter immediately beforehand, whether through an emergency channel or in the manner the film described (it would make way more sense for Leia to be there if Bail had hastily commandeered Alderaan's royal flagship or whatever).

Or they could have just had the Rebel with the plans jettison himself in an escape pod, then cut to the pod being picked up by the Tantive IV, then show Vader's Star Destroyer looming behind it. And then there'd be no need to have a weird CGI Carrie Fisher giving a cheesy line about "hope" for the thirtieth time.

 

[Dansen]

I liked it overall, except for:

- Young orphaned farmer from a desert planet, again?

Nope, shes a city kid. There is a flashback of her as a child on Corasant. Her father and mother are dressed in imperial uniforms and are eating dinner with other officers including Director Crenick(he appears to be of a lesser rank at the time). It seems to imply that Galen Erso and Crenick were friends at some point, as they can be seen laughing and smiling. Could have been more interesting if Crenick was someone who she knew personally as a family friend and then betrayed and murdered her family.

Re-watching the trailers, there is a ton of footage and lines cut out of the theatrical release that make things look different. Clearly an effect of the re shoots. There is a scene of rebel pilots being captured on jhda(not in the movie), in the movie there is the wreckage of an x-wing in the middle of the city with no explanation. Jyn can be see talking to Saw Guerrera(Forest Whitaker) encouraging him to take action/inspiring him(not in the movie). Cassian, Jyn and K2 are seen running through the Scariff base out of disguise(not in the movie). Jyn and Cassian can be seen running across the beaches, and Jyn is clearly holding the deaths star plans(not in the movie). Final cut piece is the tie fighter confronting Jyn on the relay tower, which didnt happen.


All these changes really make me want to see a director's/original cut of the movie, because it seems like it could be a massively different film.

 

[cathou]

Why Leia was inside the flagship or rather why that Bladerunner was still inside it during the battle? Being a Princess, she was in a dangerous situation despite she can take cared of herself.

there's an explanation for that in hte novel. i guess we will see it in an extended version/cut scene eventually. Bail Organa gave the order to the tantive IV to get to tatooine with Leia to seek obiwan. once the ship in orbit, it have a major engine failure. it cannot land back on Yavin, so they dock with Raddus's ship to repair. at this point they learn about the attack on Scarif, so Raddus take his ship to scarif with the tantive IV already on board, still trying to repair it.

That's for the ship. the only thing that is not clear is when and how Leia got on board

 

[Shoggoth2588]

I really liked Rouge One but then I don't see many movies in general. Anyway, for me I thought the most exciting bit was the use of a Hammerhead Cruiser in the battle over Scarif. I know I'm reading too much into this but I see it as being as big a show of intent for the Star Wars movie franchise as the introduction of Nick Fury was to the end of Iron Man: Does it guarantee that after the solo Han Solo, Obi-Wan Kanobi and, Boba Fett movies we'll get Old Republic movies? No, of course not but the fact that it's there shows that those ships existed and there's a very good chance that Revan, Malak, Bane, Exar-Kun, Ulic Qel-Droma, etc existed in the past and can thus be used in up-coming films!

I've got my fingers crossed that Star Wars is going to pull a Call of Duty: 3 studios working for 3 years to make sure that 3 sets of Star Wars movies launch year-after-year. That'll give us the main line, the character focused line and, the Legends line which keeps with the tradition of a new numbered Star Wars launching 3 years after the previous one. Nothing is impossible after all and honestly, I'd much rather see Star Wars: Fires over Malachor V than Boba Fett: A Star Wars Story.

 

[RedDeadFred]

I liked it quite a bit. I like that Disney had the balls to kill off everyone since doing some creative writing would probably have ended up feeling really contrived. There were a few characters who seemed wasted, but they were decent for the most part. As many have mentioned K2 is the standout.

I admit I was a tad mortified when Vader made the pun. I thought we were going in to Bond villain territory for a second. Then he has another scene which seemed more like he was straight out of a horror movie, so I'd say they more than made up for it.

CGI Tarkin fucked with me a bit at first, but I got used to him by his next scene. I honestly wonder how many people realized he was CGI. It was obvious to me and many others, but many of us knew he couldn't really be there.

I have to say, Rogue One has some of the best cinematography I've seen from this series. The shot of the Death Star blocking the sun was beautifully eerie.

 

[Kyrian007]

Why Leia was inside the flagship or rather why that Bladerunner was still inside it during the battle? Being a Princess, she was in a dangerous situation despite she can take cared of herself.

there's an explanation for that in hte novel. i guess we will see it in an extended version/cut scene eventually. Bail Organa gave the order to the tantive IV to get to tatooine with Leia to seek obiwan. once the ship in orbit, it have a major engine failure. it cannot land back on Yavin, so they dock with Raddus's ship to repair. at this point they learn about the attack on Scarif, so Raddus take his ship to scarif with the tantive IV already on board, still trying to repair it.

That's for the ship. the only thing that is not clear is when and how Leia got on board

The "why Leia there" complaint... I never thought that was a plot hole (I never do, I contend plot holes can't exist in works of fiction.) The solution to this one seems pretty straightforward to me. She was already there with Bail she was there the whole time, just off-camera. He already had her with him and was planning on having somebody trustworthy nearby if he needed them. Easy, "plot hole" solved. Another possible reason, Bail KNOWS who Leia is. And he knows who's very likely to be coming after the plans. Anyone he sends on this mission is in danger but Bail is hoping that if captured there's the least little possibility that Vader may sense Leia is force sensitive... maybe even sense that she has a connection to him. That may give Bail and the rebels time. While Vader is putting the pieces together, Vader has just one more reason to keep her captive instead of killing her (she knows where the rebel base is, she's a valuable hostage, and she may be my daughter.) Bail is sending someone with the BEST chance of survival if things go wrong and the BEST chance of convincing Kenobi to take up his general's title and help the rebellion. Its another reason Bail would have had Leia with him, he was planning to send her to Kenobi at some point anyway. There flat out just isn't a plot hole there at all.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

I dont read the comics, so going on just movies, snappy burns isnt Vader's thing. Its do what I say or die.

You have watched Star Wars right? Darth Vader may not bust a bon mot out every other sentence like a Joss Whedon villain but he's not above being a smartarse to people he simply has no respect or time for. Listen to his voice when he's choking the admiral at that meeting: he's got a big shit eating grin on his face. As for sassing Krennic, well, the dude drove to his house, woke him up and made him get dressed so he could whine and ***** about having his toys taken off him. Krennic's lucky this is pre-ESB Vader or else he'd have fed him his lightsaber and tossed his body into the lava flow.

 

[Bob_McMillan]

I liked it quite a bit. I like that Disney had the balls to kill off everyone since doing some creative writing would probably have ended up feeling really contrived.

They apparently had reshoots because Disney wanted them to kill off everyone, instead of the other way around like everyone assumed. That's why the shot of Jyn and Cassian running across the beach being fired upon by AT-ATs wasn't in the movie anymore.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

I liked it overall, except for:

- Young orphaned farmer from a desert planet, again?

Nope, shes a city kid. There is a flashback of her as a child on Corasant. Her father and mother are dressed in imperial uniforms and are eating dinner with other officers including Director Crenick(he appears to be of a lesser rank at the time). It seems to imply that Galen Erso and Crenick were friends at some point, as they can be seen laughing and smiling. Could have been more interesting if Crenick was someone who she knew personally as a family friend and then betrayed and murdered her family.

Whatever the Ersos did in that one flashback, they had long relocated and turned to farming, just as Luke was hidden under that guise. The beginning follows the same general guideline as episodes IV and VII: kid, farm, desert, massacre, alliance.

As one of the few people who liked Rogue One

 

[Casual Shinji]

Donnie Yen and his buddy were cool, but I think they were fucked over by reshoots because I can't seem to recall anything in the movie that explained why they were tagging along. I mean, you can assume its revenge, like everyone else in the movie. Jyn wants revenge for his father, Cassian for his family, and the two I guess are angry about Jedha getting blown to bits.

I highly suspect it was to appeal to the chinese movie going audience. Notice how none of the two had any bearing on the plot or characters whatsoever. Almost as if the movie was written without them in mind, until they were added at the last second. They only seemed to be there for the sake of being super badass... and that was it.

Also, the CGI. We all know what I'm talking about.

Spoiler

The CGI characters. They were of course horrible, but at the same time it was kind of impressive. Tarkin looked like a character from the BFG movie, and Leia looked like a Hot Toys action figure, but if you squinted, it would be totally believable. It makes you wonder, will we soon see movies doing this more and more?

In the end, could have been better, but to me, good enough.

Spoiler

The stupid thing is that they hired stand-in actors with facial structures that were very similar to those of Peter Cushing and Carrie Fisher to overlap the CG faces onto. When they could've easily taking those same actors and put them in a make-up chair to try and make them look as close as possible to the real thing. It would never be dead-on, but at least you wouldn't get distracted by the CG veneer. Also would've saved them, like, a couple of million bucks in visual effects.

OT: I feel I would've liked this movie a great deal if the actors weren't so freaking bland. The characters weren't very well written in general, but that's nothing a good dose of charisma can't fix. And all the actors in this movie combined accumulated about 0.4% of it. Nothing personal against the dude who plays Cassian, but he has the screen presence of an emaciated puppy. Same with the guy who played the defector. The girl was okay, but certainly not fit to carry the entire movie.

I know The Force Awakened is sort of viewed as a soulless copy, but the actors at least had some spunk to their performance. Never thought I'd praise Daisy Ridley, but yeah...

 

[McElroy]

It was much better than I would've expected. Most of the action was alright since y'know, they're all supposed to die by the end. Lots of silly things, but hey, it's a pleasantly silly movie for once. But dammit, use longer shots! Too many cuts! Still better than it was in TFA but FUCK that "style" anyway.

 

[BoogieManFL]

I think people over analyze movies these days. If you couldn't be entertained by Rogue One, I'd say either you're the problem, or it's not your genre of movies in which case you should already know.

And to people saying the CGI characters were horrible, I think you're just jaded and used to the incredible things that the movie industry can create. Tarkin, well, the man had an usual an unsettling appearance in reality. That adds to it. And to those complaining about how Leia looked I am surprised the level of analysis you were able to perform with 3 seconds of face time. If the character is to be used, it's either that or recast the character. And everyone complains about the recasting of characters just the same.

You're going to find flaws in anything, because everything is a matter of taste and perspective. Would I have done it all the same? Was it as good as it could have been? Not at all, but that doesn't mean I can't like the movie.