Roleplaying as a central game concept?

[Rykka]

Disclaimer: When I say "roleplaying" in this thread, I am referring to the acting out of a fictional character with other players in such a way as to pretend you are the character in question. Too often these days, especially in electronic gaming, does "Roleplaying game" simply mean anything with some stats and loot tables.


That said, in almost any MMO, you will find a pocket, if not entire servers full of roleplayers diligently trying to force good roleplay into game mechanics that were never designed for it, or have cursory roleplay additions at best. The most roleplay friendly MMO to date that I can think of in terms of actual game mechanics added via developers was Star Wars Galaxies, and that is sad indeed. The largest roleplaying community would likely be on the Neverwinter Nights persistent worlds, but even those, with all the tools given to the players, had to be manhandled into something that was borderline okay for text roleplaying. There was no chat-box emote system, and isn't one to this day, for instance.

That leads me to my question. With so many players interested in developing their own character stories through MMO settings, with clever roleplay friendly emotes, animations, items, clothing, and other fundamentals... why isn't there a game devoted to this market? It seems like it would be incredibly simple to make, since roleplayers largely create their own content. A sandbox world with the tools for people to 'really' forge their own paths. This question is posed toward people who actually roleplay, as it's moot if you don't, but would you play it? A game tailored to allowing people to really interact in a variety of story complimenting ways to truly allow players to craft their own varied epics.

I have seen and participated in some of the most moving, amazing plots and stories with players in games so RP unfriendly, it was and remains an impressive feat what they were able to create out of a simple love for the setting. Why hasn't anyone made a sandbox for them to play in yet? With so many people forcing their way in on unfriendly settings out of a love for roleplay, wouldn't it do well?


My question is two-fold, would you play it, and what kind of additions and functions would you want to be in it if you did?

 

[mintfresh]

I would play it, but I doubt it will ever be done satisfactually, I can't see how a game could have the level of depth and dedication to match the real roleplaying experience, without it being mainly text based (which wouldn't happen in this day and age). I have some great memories from my days of DnD, persuading a large troll that it would be fun to roll down a hill in order to avoid combat, coming back to said hill to be confronted by the Troll again...and thanked for showing it such fun, having my halfing rogue constantly trying to get it on with the groups female paladin (who was being RPd by a guy nonetheless). I don't see how a game could have the facility to allow this kind of depth, certainly not in NPCs (and without them you'd likely have a severe under-representation of certain races and classes).

Still it would be nice, and if it ever happens, I'm there.

 

[King Phar]

Yes i would buy it as soon as i heard about it, and it would have to have a hard system for game mechanics to do things like make a dude who never fought instead he would persuade his opponents not to fight then... shoot them in the back as they walked away. (effective yes, funny yes, nice nope)

 

[Jack Spencer Jr]

I wouldn't play it, I think if I say more than that I'll just make an asshole of myself, so I'll shut up now.

 

[broadband]

i would like,but it may be dificult, oh and another example of decent roleplay could be matrix online, i know that game was a total failure, but i play it, im a matrix fan

 

[John Galt]

In the many free 14-day trials I've bummed off EVE Online, I've noticed that it has a really good potential for role playing. You can create your own corporations, build your own stations and essentially do just about anything you could think of in a galaxy-spanning realm. Only problems being that you cannot personalize your ship, or get out of it for that matter. But I feel the game's mechanics are very conducive to RPin'.

 

[Sib]

by 'Roleplay' do you mean in a fictional setting of your own creation? because that would take immense work to model, create etc. that is beyond most people.

But if you want to roleplay 100% try Second Life coz that seems pretty much freeform and other things one would normally associate with a good roleplaying element

 

[Rykka]

I would play it, but I doubt it will ever be done satisfactually, I can't see how a game could have the level of depth and dedication to match the real roleplaying experience, without it being mainly text based (which wouldn't happen in this day and age). I have some great memories from my days of DnD, persuading a large troll that it would be fun to roll down a hill in order to avoid combat, coming back to said hill to be confronted by the Troll again...and thanked for showing it such fun, having my halfing rogue constantly trying to get it on with the groups female paladin (who was being RPd by a guy nonetheless). I don't see how a game could have the facility to allow this kind of depth, certainly not in NPCs (and without them you'd likely have a severe under-representation of certain races and classes).

Still it would be nice, and if it ever happens, I'm there.

Games will never, (At least not in our lifetime) be able to completely simulate and react to a users often off the wall thinking and ideas. Your convincing the ogre to roll down the hill for fun is a perfect example of this. 'But' what they can do is make a half decent stand alone game with the basic necessities, levels, currency system, things to wail on, etc, and fill it chock full of roleplay aids. I knew several people in the SWG universe who would do nothing but build civic buildings in the player made cities, and roleplay in them. It created hives of beautiful roleplay dynamics that were completely player controlled, aided by the simple but effective tools handed to them by the game. Here are some example of some elements that would lend to this player freedom, without requiring them to be able to code, script, etc.

-Distinct character customization in terms of appearance. Good examples of this are (Again) SWG, Pirates of the Burning Coast, Neverwinter Nights (With all the player additions.) Being able to truly craft a character image that is unique in a crowd is rewarding indeed.

-Distinct character customization in terms of wearables. Be they social clothing, armor, having a lot of varied choices in this realm adds further to the freedom of individuality that really helps these types of games out. It's hard to roleplay you are unique, when everyone of your level is doomed to wear the exact same thing. SWG, WoW, and NWN are good examples of how this can be bypassed. While WoW lacks the item customization of the other two games, it makes up for it in sheer number of items available. Player crafting can be a huge asset to this as well. I've seen people pay exorbinate amounts of real money for a rare item that looked cool, just for this social aspect. Nightsister Armbands had no stats, but would sell on E-Bay for 200 USD. People want to stand out.

-Roleplaying props. Books to flip through, mugs to drink from, computers to type on, tables to sit at (CHAIRS THAT ACTUALY WORK, for gods sake. Why do people keep filling up buildings with chairs no one can actualy sit in?), beds to sleep in, food to eat, puzzles to play with. Flowers, turkey legs, quills, wine glasses, dead rabbits, etc. From the obvious to the absurd, it really lends some credence to a scene where people have something to interact with instead of all just standing around staring at one another. Yes, most RP is done through text emotes, but why can't we have visual aids as well? Add a tankard and a sitable chair to a tavern and you have the first steps of 80% of adventures right there.

-Emotes and animations. Dancing, laughing, flexings, rude gestures, and more are added into many games already. And I'm grateful. But why not add more? WoW did a surprisingly good job of adding in varied emotes and accompanying sounds, as did SWG and a few other titles. But, if you really take into consideration the roleplay scenarios that often pop up there are many more that would be of great use. Examples include, wounded, dead, (roleplaying is oft fraught with danger, particularly between players.), captured, drunk, sneaking, praying, meditating, and many more. Add to that stances and poses. Why must the gallant hero and brooding villain stand and sit the same? Would it not paint the picture better if one stood with it's chest puffed out, stance proud, while the other hunched over, fists balled on the verge of violence?

-Player custom content. I bet many of you who've actually read this far are thinking "That would be a lot of work!" Granted, most games are, but there is another solution. Player involvement. It's been done, and well. Second Life is a great example, even though it lacks on the game play front. Pirates of the Burning Coast is an even better one, allowing players to submit sail, flag, and even ship designs to be approved of and added to the game. Many roleplayers are also artists, why not let them help you craft the world, by allowing them to show you how they see elements of it in their minds eye?


I could literally go on all day, and this post is already too long. To go back to the initial quote, no, I doubt you could script an ogre to allow you to trick it into rolling down a hill. But, you could allow players to be ogres, and the entire matter is resolved. More options, more solutions. More options, more solutions.

 

[Rykka]

by 'Roleplay' do you mean in a fictional setting of your own creation? because that would take immense work to model, create etc. that is beyond most people.

But if you want to roleplay 100% try Second Life coz that seems pretty much freeform and other things one would normally associate with a good roleplaying element

Second Life is a great system and setting for creating content, I play it quite often actually. Unfortunately, it completely lacks on the game play side of things and all attempts at creating XP systems, rewards, static environments, has all been rather mediocre. The RP is great, in the rare pockets where people are half way sensical, but roleplay as good as it is, is only part of the equation. (Large as it may be.) There needs to be a world behind it, goals and gains as well to keep it from simply being an over hyped chat room. It's this combination I've yet to really see, though I know it must be possible.

 

[Jack Spencer Jr]

Say, have you done much chat room roleplaying? Granted they lack the graphic interface you're talking about, but with decent descriptive skills, they really aren't necessary.

 

[Sib]

by 'Roleplay' do you mean in a fictional setting of your own creation? because that would take immense work to model, create etc. that is beyond most people.

But if you want to roleplay 100% try Second Life coz that seems pretty much freeform and other things one would normally associate with a good roleplaying element

Second Life is a great system and setting for creating content, I play it quite often actually. Unfortunately, it completely lacks on the game play side of things and all attempts at creating XP systems, rewards, static environments, has all been rather mediocre. The RP is great, in the rare pockets where people are half way sensical, but roleplay as good as it is, is only part of the equation. (Large as it may be.) There needs to be a world behind it, goals and gains as well to keep it from simply being an over hyped chat room. It's this combination I've yet to really see, though I know it must be possible.

i get what you mean now, out of the MMOs ive played SWG is by far the best for roleplay (i dont do it myself but my friends used to drag me in now and then while i still played it) and LoTRO was good in story but little to no user created content. I think that Pirates of the Burning Sea MMO thats out has some decent RP in it, if you like pirates....

 

[Sib]

by 'Roleplay' do you mean in a fictional setting of your own creation? because that would take immense work to model, create etc. that is beyond most people.

But if you want to roleplay 100% try Second Life coz that seems pretty much freeform and other things one would normally associate with a good roleplaying element

Second Life is a great system and setting for creating content, I play it quite often actually. Unfortunately, it completely lacks on the game play side of things and all attempts at creating XP systems, rewards, static environments, has all been rather mediocre. The RP is great, in the rare pockets where people are half way sensical, but roleplay as good as it is, is only part of the equation. (Large as it may be.) There needs to be a world behind it, goals and gains as well to keep it from simply being an over hyped chat room. It's this combination I've yet to really see, though I know it must be possible.

i get what you mean now, out of the MMOs ive played SWG is by far the best for roleplay (i dont do it myself but my friends used to drag me in now and then while i still played it) and LoTRO was good in story but little to no user created content. I think that Pirates of the Burning Sea MMO thats out has some decent RP in it, if you like pirates....

 

[J-Val]

We already have one of those. It's called SecondLife. Just watch out for the gambling and sex.

 

[Jack Spencer Jr]

Good lord! I just googled up this Second Life thing and I find it hideous. What bothers me is the buying and selling of virtual property in virtual money that can translate into real money. No. Thank. You.

 

[broadband]

so what you want is a mmo is a good number of elements that could make a easy roleplay, a good number of props, emotes, a good storyline

 

[Jack Spencer Jr]

I'm curious why it needs to be an MMO. Obviously it needs to be web-based and maybe have a general population area or something, but after that, it could have an area that is private for the group, once they meet, so they don't have to worry about jerks bothering them.

I dunno. Maybe I'm stupid, but what is the appeal of that, anyway?

 

[j0hnnycash]

Haha... Funny you bring that up.

http://www.adellion.com/

this game is trying to do just that. Only thing i wish is they would speed the production up its been way too long.

 

[dawn703]

I'd play it. But I don't know how well it would work as an MMO because other people would generally ruin the experience. Granted, games like what you're describing tend to have a small community base in the long run, and the initial blast of sex/fetish exploitation would quickly wear off. Kind of like in Sociolotron. Also, certain npc roles like barkeeper, store owner, etc, are roles that are sometimes filled by players but not always. If you designed it so NPCs covered all those roles, it would limit the PCs from playing them, but if you did it so the PCs had to fill those roles, there would be a deficiency. True roleplaying experiences are very hard to execute, even in table top games where a lot of people who want to play are more tied to the rules and systems than they are the fun of role playing. Frankly, if you really want to role play, you should just convince some of your theater friends that Dungeons and Dragons is cool and you'll get a pretty lively experience since teaching game mechanics to actors is usually pointless anyway. I say this as an actress, of course.