Should developers "listen to the fans"?
- Thread starter Zhukov
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Listen to their thoughts, yeah, but don't necessarily take them on board word for word. Look through their complaints and try to read between the lines, work out what the cause of those complaints is, rather than just taking their solution at face value. Because as much as their issues are legitimate, fans aren't game designers, so their solutions aren't likely to be particularly well thought out.
Yes and no.
Some suggestions could be acctually very good, to geniunely improve the game.
It's just that developers need to simply keep in mind that this is the vocal community, not the majority. And some of the stuff they say are REALLY stupid.
Developers should listen a little bit. If they take TOO much fan advice they will probably lose the vision of their game and it just goes nuts.
Some suggestions could be acctually very good, to geniunely improve the game.
It's just that developers need to simply keep in mind that this is the vocal community, not the majority. And some of the stuff they say are REALLY stupid.
Developers should listen a little bit. If they take TOO much fan advice they will probably lose the vision of their game and it just goes nuts.
I think they should consider each reasonable suggestion, but this doesn't mean they should use it. Fans present another perspective on what works and what doesn't, and can make pretty good suggestions about what could benefit the game series in the future. This is always useful, even if a particular desire or criticism is proven to be unsuitable.
However, fans are likely to have very different opinions, so it will be impossible to please everyone. The fans can be used by the game designers as a source of information and inspiration.
However, fans are likely to have very different opinions, so it will be impossible to please everyone. The fans can be used by the game designers as a source of information and inspiration.
Yes, since they pay the bills. But its up to the devs to figure out when its constructive as opposed to just fan service. Fan service would be such things as keeping characters alive, or bringing them back JUST due to popularity (The Boba Fett sin) but if something is lacking or is working but could be better, if a fan points it out, why ignore it?
Developers shouldn't listen to their fans but they should definitely keep their eyes open for things they can do better. I mean, if 99% of your fan-base is sitting around discussing how your game would be so much better if it had X instead of Y, and you were going to put Y in instead of X, you might want to carefully reconsider.
As for listening to everything? No. A thousand-million times no.
But you can't completely ignore the rest of the world either. If you don't believe me, just look at Final Fantasy XIV.
As for listening to everything? No. A thousand-million times no.
But you can't completely ignore the rest of the world either. If you don't believe me, just look at Final Fantasy XIV.
Depends. Listening to them? Yeah. But actually doing what they want? Probably not. I mean, it does depend. If you take a gamble on removing some prominent feature, or adding in some BS, then you should probably pay heed to the outrage. On the otherhand, I think developers really should make the game they envision, rather than doing things that are trendy.
Here's the basic problem, the whole of it. It's a slippery slope.
On one end, businesses need to know what they customer base want in order to sell their product. If it doesn't meet the demand, then it won't sell. That's the bottom line there. On the OTHER end, though, fans can be as blithering unintelligent as can be with things, and so their cries will give off a very confusing or - in fact - completely ass wrong message. That's the Unpleasable Fanbase and it exists EVERYWHERE.
So, what you have to do is remove the chaff and find the ones who seem to have some real brainpower to them. It shouldn't be too hard to find SOME manner of braintrust. I mean, you wouldn't go to No Mutants Allowed to ask about your next Fallout game, because they're idiots and they hate you. You would find people who can speak (or at least type) eloquently and convey a proper message.
So, developers should come to the Escapist, have a look around, and make some subtle inquiries.
On one end, businesses need to know what they customer base want in order to sell their product. If it doesn't meet the demand, then it won't sell. That's the bottom line there. On the OTHER end, though, fans can be as blithering unintelligent as can be with things, and so their cries will give off a very confusing or - in fact - completely ass wrong message. That's the Unpleasable Fanbase and it exists EVERYWHERE.
So, what you have to do is remove the chaff and find the ones who seem to have some real brainpower to them. It shouldn't be too hard to find SOME manner of braintrust. I mean, you wouldn't go to No Mutants Allowed to ask about your next Fallout game, because they're idiots and they hate you. You would find people who can speak (or at least type) eloquently and convey a proper message.
So, developers should come to the Escapist, have a look around, and make some subtle inquiries.
It depends on individual game and situation.
If its a sequel then the devs should take onboard what their fans want as they bought the original game so the dev should cater towards fans and the demographic who made the series a success. (OFC there sould be a difference between listening to some crazy fan ranting on some fan forum, to a large concensus of fans all saying the same thing)
However nowadays western devs have changed their business stategy when it comes to sequels. It seems to be that theyll make a great first game which builds up a cult following and make a more mainstream sequel to bring in higher sales. Since the fans are sure to buy the sequel, Publishers dont care about them but instead focus on new demographics.
Infact if I think about it, just about all the AAA industry is behaving in this way, they are so focussed on growth into new markets that they are totally oblivious to what theyre most loyal customers want. Eg Bioware / EA, Bethesda, NOA and Ninty as a whole with project Rainfall and ignoring core gamers, MS with Kinect, Capcom turning its back on their fans with Mega Man Legends 3.
However I think that fans can only take so much before theyve had enough and start looking elsewhere for the type of games they want to play. If smaller devs and indies have any business sense they ought to be catering to these demographs first and foremost. This is why doujin localisers like Carpe Fulgur (Recettear & Chantelise) are so successfull and Rockin Android (Cresent Pale Mist) is finally comming to steam as these games give the fans what they want. Considering what doujin is, which is games made by Japanese fans then its obvious these games would resonate with western Jap Fans, its just a shame that most doujin games will never see the light of day in the west since use other companies IPs.
If its a sequel then the devs should take onboard what their fans want as they bought the original game so the dev should cater towards fans and the demographic who made the series a success. (OFC there sould be a difference between listening to some crazy fan ranting on some fan forum, to a large concensus of fans all saying the same thing)
However nowadays western devs have changed their business stategy when it comes to sequels. It seems to be that theyll make a great first game which builds up a cult following and make a more mainstream sequel to bring in higher sales. Since the fans are sure to buy the sequel, Publishers dont care about them but instead focus on new demographics.
Infact if I think about it, just about all the AAA industry is behaving in this way, they are so focussed on growth into new markets that they are totally oblivious to what theyre most loyal customers want. Eg Bioware / EA, Bethesda, NOA and Ninty as a whole with project Rainfall and ignoring core gamers, MS with Kinect, Capcom turning its back on their fans with Mega Man Legends 3.
However I think that fans can only take so much before theyve had enough and start looking elsewhere for the type of games they want to play. If smaller devs and indies have any business sense they ought to be catering to these demographs first and foremost. This is why doujin localisers like Carpe Fulgur (Recettear & Chantelise) are so successfull and Rockin Android (Cresent Pale Mist) is finally comming to steam as these games give the fans what they want. Considering what doujin is, which is games made by Japanese fans then its obvious these games would resonate with western Jap Fans, its just a shame that most doujin games will never see the light of day in the west since use other companies IPs.
Yes and no.
Yes, because it's always good to try and satisfy the target audience of the games you're trying to sell.
No because most fans can't seem to figure out what they want in the first place, and many fans have conflicting interests. You can't please all of the people all of the time. Hell you can't please them some of the time!
Yes, because it's always good to try and satisfy the target audience of the games you're trying to sell.
No because most fans can't seem to figure out what they want in the first place, and many fans have conflicting interests. You can't please all of the people all of the time. Hell you can't please them some of the time!
so long as they are good ideas and not "include/take out this" because it would not fit with the rest of the series or stuff like that
and on the topic of patches and such a friend of mine playing MAG on the SVER faction complains about the constant nerfs the the faction gets due to winning through actual teamwork while the other sides are trying to use COD/Halo tactics ie. bunnyhopping,trying to be rambo, that kind of thing should be observed by mods before changes are made so the game doesnt get ruined by people who dont know how to play complaining about not being as good as they see on the commercials every game has learning curves you never see somebody picking
up super mario bros or ocarina of time and acing it first go and you cant make a tutorial for skills earned by having to think real time
though i have never played MAG so i dont know how much credibility is behind this
and on the topic of patches and such a friend of mine playing MAG on the SVER faction complains about the constant nerfs the the faction gets due to winning through actual teamwork while the other sides are trying to use COD/Halo tactics ie. bunnyhopping,trying to be rambo, that kind of thing should be observed by mods before changes are made so the game doesnt get ruined by people who dont know how to play complaining about not being as good as they see on the commercials every game has learning curves you never see somebody picking
up super mario bros or ocarina of time and acing it first go and you cant make a tutorial for skills earned by having to think real time
though i have never played MAG so i dont know how much credibility is behind this
Yes but that doesn?t mean they need to actually take the all the advice from fans. It sometimes takes someone pointing something out to notice the flaws in your own work, sometimes fans actually have good ideas and listening to fans could help developers priorities what needs improving and what to add. But at the end of the day it should be the developer making the final decision, deciding what should and should not be in the game and if somthing is "broken".
Fans of Mass Effect 1 were saying it's a good game, but needed to spend more time letting us play and less time making us melt down a dump truck load of completely useless items we'd picked up in between each mission. It also had somewhat clunky combat. Mass Effect 2 improving on both aspects doesn't mean it's a "Gears knock-off". It just means some people don't know the difference between real RPG elements and sitting on the pause screen going "Derp! Pressing the convert to omni gel button is fun! Playing make brain hurt!"madwarper said:
Listen and read individual feedback from fans? No, no way to do it. Would take to much time and most would just be people saying thanks or giving dumb ideas that only they would like for the game.
Should they make questions with multiple choice answers to decide smaller things that don't really affect the gameplay? Yes. Biowares fem Sheppard comes to mind. It's a good idea and you can customize your own anyway. It does not affect the gameplay or game in any way and it gives fans a little involvement in the development.
For things like these, yeah sure listen to the fans.
Should they make questions with multiple choice answers to decide smaller things that don't really affect the gameplay? Yes. Biowares fem Sheppard comes to mind. It's a good idea and you can customize your own anyway. It does not affect the gameplay or game in any way and it gives fans a little involvement in the development.
For things like these, yeah sure listen to the fans.
Not every game needs to be a genre bending, mainstream AAA hit that ignores the pleas of fans in order to push more copies just like not every game needs to be a fan service filled, niche title that won't expand the fan base.
Should developers listen to fans? Well the answer is yes, they should always listen to them Should they always do what the fans want? Probably not since you can bet that they'll often get lots of conflicting demands.
At the same time, however, how many franchises have been killed by developers or publishers ignoring fans. The new Call of Juarez is clearly saying something along the lines of "Hey old school CoJ fans, if you don't like CoD then SCREW YOU!" and even if people still like the old style of CoJ and CoD the developers basically still said "Well now you're stuck with a modern conflict based FPS so deal". Well, maybe there are less fans of westerns out there than there are of dark and gritty modern war shooters but why forsake your die hard fans? What, for money?
The problem is that all to often too many game publishers are only focused on the bottom line and they want a game that will sell to EVERYONE and they don't want the chump change of a niche market. Flight sims, RTSs, mech sims, space fighter sims, those all have strong fan bases and many would love a new game in their favorite franchise but many also know that they'd likely get a watered down piece of garbage that say "F**k of fans, we're going mainstream and you can't stop us. Convert or die."
So, yeah, listen to fans for niche market games and for big, mass market games don't even bother those people are usually so concerned with brand names and multiplayer that they'll buy about anything you spoon feed them.
Should developers listen to fans? Well the answer is yes, they should always listen to them Should they always do what the fans want? Probably not since you can bet that they'll often get lots of conflicting demands.
At the same time, however, how many franchises have been killed by developers or publishers ignoring fans. The new Call of Juarez is clearly saying something along the lines of "Hey old school CoJ fans, if you don't like CoD then SCREW YOU!" and even if people still like the old style of CoJ and CoD the developers basically still said "Well now you're stuck with a modern conflict based FPS so deal". Well, maybe there are less fans of westerns out there than there are of dark and gritty modern war shooters but why forsake your die hard fans? What, for money?
The problem is that all to often too many game publishers are only focused on the bottom line and they want a game that will sell to EVERYONE and they don't want the chump change of a niche market. Flight sims, RTSs, mech sims, space fighter sims, those all have strong fan bases and many would love a new game in their favorite franchise but many also know that they'd likely get a watered down piece of garbage that say "F**k of fans, we're going mainstream and you can't stop us. Convert or die."
So, yeah, listen to fans for niche market games and for big, mass market games don't even bother those people are usually so concerned with brand names and multiplayer that they'll buy about anything you spoon feed them.